Classic Swing

[N0rs3man]

I have read some on classic vs modern swing... Where can I learn how to change my modern swing which is really hard on my lower back to something more classic? One article claims the main difference with the classic swing is hip movement and less hip/shoulder separation. I really want to enjoy golf for a long time, as well as maintain my Club head speed... I am not sure if a classic swing will do this but from what I have read it will.

 

Where do I go about learning some drills for this? Youtube just seems to argue for or against classic/modern swing, not really instructional. I have ready 5 lessons a few times but seem to have this big hip/shoulder separation thats causing some lower back pain when I play alot.

[BrianMcG]

If you are looking for a swing that's easy on the back I would check out Jimmy Ballard. Therese a huge thread on the Ballard method that will give you plenty of reading and viewing videos.

[raggal62]

I always thought the typical classic swing with the big "reverse c" follow through put more strain on your back. Nicklaus, Couples, and a whole host of others suffered back issues throughout their careers.

[N0rs3man]

I dont know much about it, but im pretty sure Nicklaus is the founder of the modern swing. Everyone started copying his style because he hit it so far. I wonder if it was his style that allowed that or just his natural talent.

[wkuo3]

Not quite sure what you meant by the Classic and the Modern golf swing.

 

If you pracice and play this ame often enough, then no one could escape the potential injury to your body parts. I don't believe there is or was any golf swing that will free you from injury. The golf swing is, not a natural movement for human body. In order to generate maximum distance, your body will go under extreme stress for each and every shot you make.

The way to preserve your health is not the best way to generate maximum distance your body could give.

Think of it this way; each golf swing is not for the long drive contest in the final rounds. Use more body weight transfer then maximizing the X factor. Use gravity rather than torque. Most of all, take care of your physical well being by doing other exercise than just golfing.

 

[rwc356]

Golf Digest had a cover article in November 1982 titled "Use the Classic Swing" and compared the Bobby Jones style swing with the more modern Jerry Pate style. I save a PDF copy of the article because it made a lot of sense to me and the classic swing seemed to work pretty well with my swing skills learned in the 60's. Not sure if I can upload the PDF file of the article or maybe you can find it on the Web.

[BIG STU]

> @raggal62 said:

> I always thought the typical classic swing with the big "reverse c" follow through put more strain on your back. Nicklaus, Couples, and a whole host of others suffered back issues throughout their careers.

 

Absolutely correct. My old man in addition to being a club pro also had a degree in what is called Sports Management now. Back then he was called an Athletic Trainer. When I was coming up the reverse c was all the range. He cautioned me against it and explained to me why in time it would mess up one's back. You are correct about the greats from that era suffering back problems. The only player that used the reverse c that has not had back problems is Colin Montgomery. I think it is due to the fact his swing is not powerful but very smooth. Another thing my old man said about the golf swing was that it was one of the most unnatural things one could put their body through. Lexi Thompson is the one who scares me now knowing what I know. Sure she is a great athlete and is in great physical shape but the violence of her swing and the torque she puts on her lower back makes me shudder.

[Shallowface]

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/sport/golf/europeantour/3033216/NEC-Invitational-Montgomerie-out-with-back-pain.html

Even Monty had his share, but it hasn't seemed to be an issue in recent times.

Still it seems we hear a lot more about golfers being injured today than in the past, even with (because of?) all of the exercise programs they use.

 

 

[scomac2002]

Look up Julian Mellor and Positive Impact Golf on YouTube. This is supposed to be the easiest swing in golf and is designed to put the least amount of stress on your body.

 

After watching a slew of videos on this technique and comparing it to a series of videos shot in the 50's featuring Tommy Armour, I'm convinced that what Mellor is advocating is the closest thing yet to a classic swing as it has a great deal in common with Armour's movements.

[57Staff]

I would recommend either Bradley Hughes (bradleyhughesgolf.com) or Advanced Ball Striking for lessons on the classic swing. Bradley is working with Brenden Todd and Russel Knox. Both Bradley and John Erickson (ABS) are former touring pros from the 80's and 90's, playing in Europe, Australia, Canada, Japan, and Bradley did a stint on the US tour in the mid-90s.

[mocokid]

I'm using the George Gankas method, working well, but find an instructor who knows it, it makes a big difference.

[HoldenCornfield]

> @57Staff said:

> I would recommend either Bradley Hughes (bradleyhughesgolf.com) or Advanced Ball Striking for lessons on the classic swing. Bradley is working with Brenden Todd and Russel Knox. Both Bradley and John Erickson (ABS) are former touring pros from the 80's and 90's, playing in Europe, Australia, Canada, Japan, and Bradley did a stint on the US tour in the mid-90s.

 

^This. John Erickson is the best, in my mind, but I guess it all depends on how the student receives the message. I like a technical, analytical explanation of how things work.

 

He defines the classic swing as "Hitting" as in the way a baseball hitter swings the bat. And the classic hitting was driven by the heavier, flatter gear of the time. This method does not typically work very well with the long, light, and upright modern gear. That's why John is a big advocate of the classic gear that we all love on this forum. Jim Furyk is a classic hitter (ignore the backswing funkiness). Hitting is driven by a body pivot and a tight right elbow that drives the club through impact. See positions #3 and #4:

 

He defines the modern swing as "Swinging" where you swing or fling the clubhead at the ball and release the hands and arms down and out. Phil Mickelson is a classic swinger (#1 in the pic, not sure who is #2 (Els?) but he looks like a hitter).

 

Swinging produces more speed, whereas hitting produces a more repeatable and accurate game.

 

Here's a link to a thread on hitting vs swinging: [http://www.advancedballstriking.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=211&t=19](http://www.advancedballstriking.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=211&t=19 "http://www.advancedballstriking.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=211&t=19")

 

Here's a book that I found to be a very interesting and informative, in a unique way, on the Hogan method. Your mileage may vary:

[https://www.amazon.com/Crouching-Tiger-Hidden-Hogan-Automatic/dp/1537365436/ref=sr_1_10?keywords=hidden+tiger&qid=1559565253&rnid=2941120011&s=books&sr=1-10](https://www.amazon.com/Crouching-Tiger-Hidden-Hogan-Automatic/dp/1537365436/ref=sr_1_10?keywords=hidden+tiger&qid=1559565253&rnid=2941120011&s=books&sr=1-10 "https://www.amazon.com/Crouching-Tiger-Hidden-Hogan-Automatic/dp/1537365436/ref=sr_1_10?keywords=hidden+tiger&qid=1559565253&rnid=2941120011&s=books&sr=1-10")

 

I personally have found hitting to be much, much easier on the back since I adopted it about 6 years ago. And my ball striking improved immensely, although this could be just from the fact that I latched onto one particular swing method and focused on it for the first time in my golf life.

 

Its also what has driven my interest and passion for vintage golf clubs. I actually believe that for me, vintage clubs allow me to play my best golf due to them being shorter, heavier, and flatter. And I mean that quite sincerely. Sometimes someone who hasn't played with me before will comment something like, "Wow, if you're shooting that well with old clubs there's no telling how well you would do with new ones."

And I'll simply say, "Actually, I _can_ tell you how I would do with new clubs -- about 5-10 strokes higher."

 

I have dabbled more in the last 6-9 months with a modern driver and an iron set from the 1980's but I can tell you that my best score in that time period (warning - passive brag straight ahead!) was a 76 with early 1950's MacGregor M75 (wingback) irons and persimmon woods.

 

[JoePete]

Interesting question and contrast. I think anything swing wise, you have to put Hogan's 5 Lessons in the library. I'd take Hogan's swing in any era, but I think a lot of the fundamentals of the classic swing are embodied in it. While there can be debate as to what constitutes classic vs modern, Hogan was the ideal for decades. A lot of Hogan's fundamentals are exhibited in swings today, but I think a difference is how much the equipment has led to a power game. Turn the clock back 40 years, and we were playing balata, persimmon, and steel shafts and hitting the ball shorter (but the courses played shorter). What we have been able to do with drivers, thanks to titanium, and improvements in the ball have made a huge difference. So I have an easier time pointing to a classic swing prototype than a modern one. I generally view the modern swing as less about timing and more about power and connectedness. Basically, we turn completely around the spine, and then drive off the ground, uncoiling into the ball. Yes, I think the modern swing puts a lot of stress on the body, not only the spine but also the knees, particularly left knee (for righties). The older swing, it was OK for the arms to separate from the upper body a little. It wasn't this core power move as much as timing. The classic metaphor was like cracking a whip, well timed actions, with an efficient transfer of power.

[gsea33]

Check out Jimmy Ballard. Don't know if u would call it classic but definitely no back problems.

[BrianMcG]

> @HoldenCornfield said:

> > @57Staff said:

> > I would recommend either Bradley Hughes (bradleyhughesgolf.com) or Advanced Ball Striking for lessons on the classic swing. Bradley is working with Brenden Todd and Russel Knox. Both Bradley and John Erickson (ABS) are former touring pros from the 80's and 90's, playing in Europe, Australia, Canada, Japan, and Bradley did a stint on the US tour in the mid-90s.

>

> ^This. John Erickson is the best, in my mind, but I guess it all depends on how the student receives the message. I like a technical, analytical explanation of how things work.

>

> He defines the classic swing as "Hitting" as in the way a baseball hitter swings the bat. And the classic hitting was driven by the heavier, flatter gear of the time. This method does not typically work very well with the long, light, and upright modern gear. That's why John is a big advocate of the classic gear that we all love on this forum. Jim Furyk is a classic hitter (ignore the backswing funkiness). Hitting is driven by a body pivot and a tight right elbow that drives the club through impact. See positions #3 and #4:

>

>

> He defines the modern swing as "Swinging" where you swing or fling the clubhead at the ball and release the hands and arms down and out. Phil Mickelson is a classic swinger (#1 in the pic, not sure who is #2 (Els?) but he looks like a hitter).

>

>

> Swinging produces more speed, whereas hitting produces a more repeatable and accurate game.

>

> Here's a link to a thread on hitting vs swinging: [http://www.advancedballstriking.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=211&t=19](http://www.advancedballstriking.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=211&t=19 "http://www.advancedballstriking.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=211&t=19")

>

> Here's a book that I found to be a very interesting and informative, in a unique way, on the Hogan method. Your mileage may vary:

> [https://www.amazon.com/Crouching-Tiger-Hidden-Hogan-Automatic/dp/1537365436/ref=sr_1_10?keywords=hidden+tiger&qid=1559565253&rnid=2941120011&s=books&sr=1-10](https://www.amazon.com/Crouching-Tiger-Hidden-Hogan-Automatic/dp/1537365436/ref=sr_1_10?keywords=hidden+tiger&qid=1559565253&rnid=2941120011&s=books&sr=1-10 "https://www.amazon.com/Crouching-Tiger-Hidden-Hogan-Automatic/dp/1537365436/ref=sr_1_10?keywords=hidden+tiger&qid=1559565253&rnid=2941120011&s=books&sr=1-10")

>

> I personally have found hitting to be much, much easier on the back since I adopted it about 6 years ago. And my ball striking improved immensely, although this could be just from the fact that I latched onto one particular swing method and focused on it for the first time in my golf life.

>

> Its also what has driven my interest and passion for vintage golf clubs. I actually believe that for me, vintage clubs allow me to play my best golf due to them being shorter, heavier, and flatter. And I mean that quite sincerely. Sometimes someone who hasn't played with me before will comment something like, "Wow, if you're shooting that well with old clubs there's no telling how well you would do with new ones."

> And I'll simply say, "Actually, I _can_ tell you how I would do with new clubs -- about 5-10 strokes higher."

>

> I have dabbled more in the last 6-9 months with a modern driver and an iron set from the 1980's but I can tell you that my best score in that time period (warning - passive brag straight ahead!) was a 76 with early 1950's MacGregor M75 (wingback) irons and persimmon woods.

>

 

#2 is Henrick Stenson