Wedge shaft issues

 trumb1mj1 ·  
trumb1mj1trumb1mj1 Members  1400WRX Points: 103Posts: 1,400 Platinum Tees
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I play modus tour 120s shafts in my irons and through my wedges. I have no problems controlling trajectory in all my irons but once I get down to the PW-GW-SW-LW, I feel like my flight is way too high and a bit uncontrollable. It seems odd but I'm on the hunt for new shafts.



Can anyone make any recommendations? Also, if this seems like a different issue, please feel free to correct me.
Posted:
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  • ChipNRunChipNRun Members  2150WRX Points: 472Posts: 2,150 Platinum Tees
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    This would be an issue for a skilled fitter + Trackman data. Modus Tour 120S delivers a low-mid trajectory.



    You might consider ball position and a tune-up lesson before spending $$ on new shafts.
    Posted:
    What's In The Bag *...

    Driver: Calla XR16 Pro 10.5° (set open) / Fuji Evolution II TS Speeder 665 R-flex 63 gr.
    FWs: Tour Edge XRail 4W + 7W / GraphiteDesign G60 R-flex 60 gr.
    or Calla Alpha 815, set 16° + 20° / Fuji Motore Speeder 665 R-flex 62 gr.
    Hybrid: Cobra FlyZ 3H 19° + 4H 22° / Matrix VLCT Altus Lite flex 73 gr.
    Irons: Tour Edge CB Pro Tungsten 4i - PW** / KBS Tour 90 R-flex 101 gr.
           4i refitted with SteelFiber 780 HLS Hybrid shaft R Flex 75 gr.
    Wedge: Calla MD3 48°/8.SS + 54°/12.WS + MD.PM 60°/10  | KBS Tour R-flex 110 gr.  | Note: MD4 58°/8.C-grind may replace MD/PM
    Putter: Ping Sigma G Tyne (face-balanced) / 34" w. Ping Pistol PP60 grip (stock)
    Bag: Sun Mountain Three 5 stand bag
    Ball: Calla SuperHot - orange
    * Either 7W or 3H left out, depending on course and season.
    ** Wedges: 46°and 48°are competing for bag space.
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  • NessismNessism To measure is to know... Members  19372WRX Points: 1,452Posts: 19,372 Titanium Tees
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    If you can tolerate the weight try Dynamic Gold. If you hit those too high it's your swing.
    Posted:
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    Ping G410 irons w/Recoil 95S
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  • Howard_JonesHoward_Jones Members  10627WRX Points: 1,653Posts: 10,627 Titanium Tees
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    trumb1mj1 wrote:


    I play modus tour 120s shafts in my irons and through my wedges. I have no problems controlling trajectory in all my irons but once I get down to the PW-GW-SW-LW, I feel like my flight is way too high and a bit uncontrollable. It seems odd but I'm on the hunt for new shafts.



    Can anyone make any recommendations? Also, if this seems like a different issue, please feel free to correct me.




    Is weight, feel and dispersion good?

    - then Tweak lofts stronger



    The ball has no clue where loft comes from, so if we find a shaft that can reduce forward shaft bending and take down loft by 1* at impact, we could get to the exact same head position at impact, by bending lofts 1 stronger.



    Some even think...ahh but that takes down bounce by one when we bend it......but that happens if a shaft does it to, since loft and bounce is fixed forever, so if loft is 1 less at impact, Bounce will be 1 less at impact no matter how that happened.



    Then we have those who think that 1 stonger lofts mess up gapping with 2.5-3 yards more carry, but that will happen if we go by a shaft also, again no difference.



    Ball flight is a question of LOFT AT IMPACT, so tweak lofts stronger if its too high and shaft weight, feel and dispersion is good, it cost a few buck and get out and play again. if you feel they might be to light for wedge, try to add 5-7 grams lead tape on the shaft to see if that makes any difference for the better or not. if you combine both, a tad stronger loft and some grams added (on the underside, not visible for address), this might be all it takes. Try that before you pull shafts that works for irons.



    PS! when we go from Irons to wedges, the "classic" system is to go slightly softer, and wedges is often delivered with a higher Bottom of Bore to Ground compared to irons, and that makes them to play softer, and combined with a few extra SWP, "the sum of going softer" is just a bit to much for some.



    If thats the issue here, TIP TRIM of tapers by 3/8 to 4/8 so we "hard step by tip trim" is often used as a adjustment on new builds, and if we play "S flex" and the same model exist as X, we can also as a S flex player use X #8 iron shafts for wedge to lower flight when wanted. (X #8 will be a tad stronger than a tipped #9 S flex - ex DG S300 #9 tipped 3/8, vs DG X100 #8)



    So in MUDUS 120S that means you have a option to use 120X (plus 5 grams) as #8 irons for wedge, if new shafts is needed that would be a no brainer here. Since BBGM is higher on wedges and we go shorter from #9, those 5 grams "vaporize", and thats why its a good thing to start a few grams above irons in wedges.(we loose weight into wedges if we like it or not)



    From #9 to Lob Wedge we normally have minus 1.0" and a 120 grams shaft as 37.50"(#8 iron shaft) = 3.2 grams pr inch, and since BBGM is often 3/8 higher on wedges, we loose about 1.2 gram extra, so its like 0.6 grams left "extra shaft weight" on that Lob wedge vs your #9. Thats why its good to start a few grams above irons when we have that option.
    Posted:

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  • The Mad BomberThe Mad Bomber I seem to not like new things. Get off my lawn... Members  1098WRX Points: 202Posts: 1,098 Platinum Tees
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    trumb1mj1 wrote:


    I play modus tour 120s shafts in my irons and through my wedges. I have no problems controlling trajectory in all my irons but once I get down to the PW-GW-SW-LW, I feel like my flight is way too high and a bit uncontrollable. It seems odd but I'm on the hunt for new shafts.



    Can anyone make any recommendations? Also, if this seems like a different issue, please feel free to correct me.




    Is weight, feel and dispersion good?

    - then Tweak lofts stronger



    The ball has no clue where loft comes from, so if we find a shaft that can reduce forward shaft bending and take down loft by 1* at impact, we could get to the exact same head position at impact, by bending lofts 1 stronger.



    Some even think...ahh but that takes down bounce by one when we bend it......but that happens if a shaft does it to, since loft and bounce is fixed forever, so if loft is 1 less at impact, Bounce will be 1 less at impact no matter how that happened.



    Then we have those who think that 1 stonger lofts mess up gapping with 2.5-3 yards more carry, but that will happen if we go by a shaft also, again no difference.



    Ball flight is a question of LOFT AT IMPACT, so tweak lofts stronger if its too high and shaft weight, feel and dispersion is good, it cost a few buck and get out and play again. if you feel they might be to light for wedge, try to add 5-7 grams lead tape on the shaft to see if that makes any difference for the better or not. if you combine both, a tad stronger loft and some grams added (on the underside, not visible for address), this might be all it takes. Try that before you pull shafts that works for irons.



    PS! when we go from Irons to wedges, the "classic" system is to go slightly softer, and wedges is often delivered with a higher Bottom of Bore to Ground compared to irons, and that makes them to play softer, and combined with a few extra SWP, "the sum of going softer" is just a bit to much for some.



    If thats the issue here, TIP TRIM of tapers by 3/8 to 4/8 so we "hard step by tip trim" is often used as a adjustment on new builds, and if we play "S flex" and the same model exist as X, we can also as a S flex player use X #8 iron shafts for wedge to lower flight when wanted. (X #8 will be a tad stronger than a tipped #9 S flex - ex DG S300 #9 tipped 3/8, vs DG X100 #8)



    So in MUDUS 120S that means you have a option to use 120X (plus 5 grams) as #8 irons for wedge, if new shafts is needed that would be a no brainer here. Since BBGM is higher on wedges and we go shorter from #9, those 5 grams "vaporize", and thats why its a good thing to start a few grams above irons in wedges.(we loose weight into wedges if we like it or not)



    From #9 to Lob Wedge we normally have minus 1.0" and a 120 grams shaft as 37.50"(#8 iron shaft) = 3.2 grams pr inch, and since BBGM is often 3/8 higher on wedges, we loose about 1.2 gram extra, so its like 0.6 grams left "extra shaft weight" on that Lob wedge vs your #9. Thats why its good to start a few grams above irons when we have that option.




    What a great post!
    Posted:
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  • Howard_JonesHoward_Jones Members  10627WRX Points: 1,653Posts: 10,627 Titanium Tees
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    i forgot to mention something important and thats FEEL



    If we use a shaft that bends less to take down ball flight, thats over all, a STIFFER shaft = stronger feel of flex

    If we use STATIC LOFTS to take ball flight down, we KEEP the feel we have, and fix the ball flight issue.



    So by tweaking loft stronger, we tweak ball flight as we want it, and if 120X is a better option because of those extra grams higher start weight, you can use the shafts you have, and add the difference to simulate those X120 as "weight", not as feel of flex, that will still be the same....



    Combining lead tape and loft tweak is not only the fastest and cheapest, its also often the "best feeling" wedges the shorter we get to the pin, and add a gram or 3 on the heads while you are at it, try it off if you never did.
    Posted:

    PLEASE DO NOT SEND ME PMs ON CLUB TECH ISSUES - ASK PUBLIC IN THE FORUM.

    Unless you are a former Customer or someone i already have a PM dialog with, i want reply to tech questions on PMs.

  • trumb1mj1trumb1mj1 Members  1400WRX Points: 103Posts: 1,400 Platinum Tees
    Joined:  edited Feb 18, 2019 #7
    Really good stuff
    On -, @Howard Jones

    trumb1mj1 wrote:


    I play modus tour 120s shafts in my irons and through my wedges. I have no problems controlling trajectory in all my irons but once I get down to the PW-GW-SW-LW, I feel like my flight is way too high and a bit uncontrollable. It seems odd but I'm on the hunt for new shafts.



    Can anyone make any recommendations? Also, if this seems like a different issue, please feel free to correct me.




    Is weight, feel and dispersion good?

    - then Tweak lofts stronger



    The ball has no clue where loft comes from, so if we find a shaft that can reduce forward shaft bending and take down loft by 1* at impact, we could get to the exact same head position at impact, by bending lofts 1 stronger.



    Some even think...ahh but that takes down bounce by one when we bend it......but that happens if a shaft does it to, since loft and bounce is fixed forever, so if loft is 1 less at impact, Bounce will be 1 less at impact no matter how that happened.



    Then we have those who think that 1 stonger lofts mess up gapping with 2.5-3 yards more carry, but that will happen if we go by a shaft also, again no difference.



    Ball flight is a question of LOFT AT IMPACT, so tweak lofts stronger if its too high and shaft weight, feel and dispersion is good, it cost a few buck and get out and play again. if you feel they might be to light for wedge, try to add 5-7 grams lead tape on the shaft to see if that makes any difference for the better or not. if you combine both, a tad stronger loft and some grams added (on the underside, not visible for address), this might be all it takes. Try that before you pull shafts that works for irons.



    PS! when we go from Irons to wedges, the "classic" system is to go slightly softer, and wedges is often delivered with a higher Bottom of Bore to Ground compared to irons, and that makes them to play softer, and combined with a few extra SWP, "the sum of going softer" is just a bit to much for some.



    If thats the issue here, TIP TRIM of tapers by 3/8 to 4/8 so we "hard step by tip trim" is often used as a adjustment on new builds, and if we play "S flex" and the same model exist as X, we can also as a S flex player use X #8 iron shafts for wedge to lower flight when wanted. (X #8 will be a tad stronger than a tipped #9 S flex - ex DG S300 #9 tipped 3/8, vs DG X100 #8)



    So in MUDUS 120S that means you have a option to use 120X (plus 5 grams) as #8 irons for wedge, if new shafts is needed that would be a no brainer here. Since BBGM is higher on wedges and we go shorter from #9, those 5 grams "vaporize", and thats why its a good thing to start a few grams above irons in wedges.(we loose weight into wedges if we like it or not)



    From #9 to Lob Wedge we normally have minus 1.0" and a 120 grams shaft as 37.50"(#8 iron shaft) = 3.2 grams pr inch, and since BBGM is often 3/8 higher on wedges, we loose about 1.2 gram extra, so its like 0.6 grams left "extra shaft weight" on that Lob wedge vs your #9. Thats why its good to start a few grams above irons when we have that option.




    Really good stuff Howard! Here's what I've tried so far:



    1) Straight 120s which I mentioned

    2) Tip trimming (as much a** possible with taper tips) and this removed much of the great feel I have in my irons

    3) Modus 125 wedge shaft which didn't lower my flight nor did it feel right



    I guess all of the above is pointing to what you were driving at--it's not really the shaft causing the flight issues. I think it's probably technique at this point.



    While I have your attention Howard... If you were starting completely fresh with my wedges and knew the Nippon N.S. Pro Modus 3 Tour 120 stiff was a perfect fit for me, which route would you go?



    a) Nippon N.S. Pro Modus 3 Tour 120 stiff wedge shaft

    b) Nippon N.S. Pro Modus 3 Tour 120 xs 8i shaft

    c) Modus 115 wedge shaft



    Just curious is all. Thanks!
    Posted:
    Post edited by Unknown User on
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  • lutomrSClutomrSC Members  330WRX Points: 79Posts: 330 Greens
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    I'll just throw this in here. I have been toying around with Modus shafts. I've always played KBS tour 130x hardstepped in my irons 4-PW. However I put a modus3 wedge 125X into my 56 and couldn't be happier. To me the ball flight is flatter than S400, and the dispersion left to right is significantly better. They aren't cheap brand new (approx $40) but mine has since paid for itself, as I holed out for eagle in a tournament yesterday and won 2/3rds of the skins money!
    Posted:
  • trumb1mj1trumb1mj1 Members  1400WRX Points: 103Posts: 1,400 Platinum Tees
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    lutomrSC wrote:


    I'll just throw this in here. I have been toying around with Modus shafts. I've always played KBS tour 130x hardstepped in my irons 4-PW. However I put a modus3 wedge 125X into my 56 and couldn't be happier. To me the ball flight is flatter than S400, and the dispersion left to right is significantly better. They aren't cheap brand new (approx $40) but mine has since paid for itself, as I holed out for eagle in a tournament yesterday and won 2/3rds of the skins money!




    Are you referring to the iron shaft (Modus 3 125 pro) or the wedge specific shaft? There is one thing that Nippon has way wrong--the naming! It is sure confusing trying to explain which wedge you're talking about...
    Posted:
  • lutomrSClutomrSC Members  330WRX Points: 79Posts: 330 Greens
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    trumb1mj1 wrote:

    lutomrSC wrote:


    I'll just throw this in here. I have been toying around with Modus shafts. I've always played KBS tour 130x hardstepped in my irons 4-PW. However I put a modus3 wedge 125X into my 56 and couldn't be happier. To me the ball flight is flatter than S400, and the dispersion left to right is significantly better. They aren't cheap brand new (approx $40) but mine has since paid for itself, as I holed out for eagle in a tournament yesterday and won 2/3rds of the skins money!




    Are you referring to the iron shaft (Modus 3 125 pro) or the wedge specific shaft? There is one thing that Nippon has way wrong--the naming! It is sure confusing trying to explain which wedge you're talking about...




    The specific wedge shafts. Not a modus 3 125 iron shaft. The 125 wedge shaft is 133gram. It will be marked 125 WEDGE on the shaft
    Posted:
  • trumb1mj1trumb1mj1 Members  1400WRX Points: 103Posts: 1,400 Platinum Tees
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    lutomrSC wrote:

    trumb1mj1 wrote:

    lutomrSC wrote:


    I'll just throw this in here. I have been toying around with Modus shafts. I've always played KBS tour 130x hardstepped in my irons 4-PW. However I put a modus3 wedge 125X into my 56 and couldn't be happier. To me the ball flight is flatter than S400, and the dispersion left to right is significantly better. They aren't cheap brand new (approx $40) but mine has since paid for itself, as I holed out for eagle in a tournament yesterday and won 2/3rds of the skins money!




    Are you referring to the iron shaft (Modus 3 125 pro) or the wedge specific shaft? There is one thing that Nippon has way wrong--the naming! It is sure confusing trying to explain which wedge you're talking about...




    The specific wedge shafts. Not a modus 3 125 iron shaft. The 125 wedge shaft is 133gram. It will be marked 125 WEDGE on the shaft




    Gotcha. I tried that shaft in my GW and it felt too heavy/stiff for me. I like to play mid trajectory draws with my wedges and that shaft just went high and right for me--couldn't get it to fall left with minimum effort. I'm not a bomber by any means but I'm between 155-160 ball speed with my driver (skytrak measured).
    Posted:
  • SAM_PGASAM_PGA PGA Professional Knoxville, TNMembers  689WRX Points: 166Posts: 689 Golden Tee
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    Howard is always a wealth of expertise and knowledge and his insight to shaft/wedge dynamics is spot on.



    Adding my 2 cents to use a placeholder too...



    I've dabbled with alot of wedge specific shafts... S400 TI, Modus 125, 125 Wedge, 115 Wedge, and so on. Every time I try something it gives me a different feel and is good for some aspect of the wedge game; almost every shaft has its strengths and weaknesses in different areas. However I've always reverted back to the Modus 120X iron shaft because of the feel and consistency through out the set. I've "tricked" my feel into a heavier shaft by wrapping about 6 grams of lead tape around the shaft right under the grip. It looks like a silver shaft label if you don't look closely enough.
    Posted:



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  • otwotw Doug Ferreri Members  348WRX Points: 113Posts: 348 Greens
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    Exactly what I did with the Modus !20s thru the complete set. They become approx 106 grams when cut to size. once I added 8 grams to each shaft dispersion was greatly improved.
    Posted:
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  • Z1ggy16Z1ggy16 Members  9315WRX Points: 1,469Posts: 9,315 Titanium Tees
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    If you can.... try to hit these problem shots on a launch monitor. Also, I highly recommend you learn to hit 50-75% knockdown shots with your PW-LW which will (obviously) lower your peak height by a lot.



    If I had a flag middle green at 100 yards... I used to pump up a cloud hunting LW to that pin. Often times I'd catch it a little skinny but if I did get it clean, it would rip forward and I'd be left with a 25 footer. Now, same flag, I take a PW or maybe a GW and hit an smooth and controlled partial shot that at most will fly 40 feet high (versus my 110 foot high sky ball with the L wedge) and will stop very fast, but never suck back away from the pin.



    FWIW I use Modus 120 in my irons, too... and I have found the modus wedge shafts to be great. Modus 115 if you like something with a little more give or modus 125 if you prefer a little heavier feel.
    Posted:
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  • Howard_JonesHoward_Jones Members  10627WRX Points: 1,653Posts: 10,627 Titanium Tees
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    trumb1mj1 wrote:


    Really good stuff
    On -, @Howard Jones

    trumb1mj1 wrote:


    I play modus tour 120s shafts in my irons and through my wedges. I have no problems controlling trajectory in all my irons but once I get down to the PW-GW-SW-LW, I feel like my flight is way too high and a bit uncontrollable. It seems odd but I'm on the hunt for new shafts.



    Can anyone make any recommendations? Also, if this seems like a different issue, please feel free to correct me.




    Is weight, feel and dispersion good?

    - then Tweak lofts stronger



    The ball has no clue where loft comes from, so if we find a shaft that can reduce forward shaft bending and take down loft by 1* at impact, we could get to the exact same head position at impact, by bending lofts 1 stronger.



    Some even think...ahh but that takes down bounce by one when we bend it......but that happens if a shaft does it to, since loft and bounce is fixed forever, so if loft is 1 less at impact, Bounce will be 1 less at impact no matter how that happened.



    Then we have those who think that 1 stonger lofts mess up gapping with 2.5-3 yards more carry, but that will happen if we go by a shaft also, again no difference.



    Ball flight is a question of LOFT AT IMPACT, so tweak lofts stronger if its too high and shaft weight, feel and dispersion is good, it cost a few buck and get out and play again. if you feel they might be to light for wedge, try to add 5-7 grams lead tape on the shaft to see if that makes any difference for the better or not. if you combine both, a tad stronger loft and some grams added (on the underside, not visible for address), this might be all it takes. Try that before you pull shafts that works for irons.



    PS! when we go from Irons to wedges, the "classic" system is to go slightly softer, and wedges is often delivered with a higher Bottom of Bore to Ground compared to irons, and that makes them to play softer, and combined with a few extra SWP, "the sum of going softer" is just a bit to much for some.



    If thats the issue here, TIP TRIM of tapers by 3/8 to 4/8 so we "hard step by tip trim" is often used as a adjustment on new builds, and if we play "S flex" and the same model exist as X, we can also as a S flex player use X #8 iron shafts for wedge to lower flight when wanted. (X #8 will be a tad stronger than a tipped #9 S flex - ex DG S300 #9 tipped 3/8, vs DG X100 #8)



    So in MUDUS 120S that means you have a option to use 120X (plus 5 grams) as #8 irons for wedge, if new shafts is needed that would be a no brainer here. Since BBGM is higher on wedges and we go shorter from #9, those 5 grams "vaporize", and thats why its a good thing to start a few grams above irons in wedges.(we loose weight into wedges if we like it or not)



    From #9 to Lob Wedge we normally have minus 1.0" and a 120 grams shaft as 37.50"(#8 iron shaft) = 3.2 grams pr inch, and since BBGM is often 3/8 higher on wedges, we loose about 1.2 gram extra, so its like 0.6 grams left "extra shaft weight" on that Lob wedge vs your #9. Thats why its good to start a few grams above irons when we have that option.




    Really good stuff Howard! Here's what I've tried so far:



    1) Straight 120s which I mentioned

    2) Tip trimming (as much a** possible with taper tips) and this removed much of the great feel I have in my irons

    3) Modus 125 wedge shaft which didn't lower my flight nor did it feel right



    I guess all of the above is pointing to what you were driving at--it's not really the shaft causing the flight issues. I think it's probably technique at this point.



    While I have your attention Howard... If you were starting completely fresh with my wedges and knew the Nippon N.S. Pro Modus 3 Tour 120 stiff was a perfect fit for me, which route would you go?



    a) Nippon N.S. Pro Modus 3 Tour 120 stiff wedge shaft

    b) Nippon N.S. Pro Modus 3 Tour 120 xs 8i shaft

    c) Modus 115 wedge shaft



    Just curious is all. Thanks!




    Im a big fan of the X #8 iron shaft route, it seems to work very good for most shaft models on the marked, and since FEEL is a important part of it all, i will also suggest the X #8 for that reason. Even if its actually a stiffer shaft it does not really feel like that, only a bit different so compared to a tipped #9 or PW shaft, i would say feel is way better when we go X #8



    if i was strong enough to use X100 #8 iron shafts for wedge i would, even as a R flex player, so dont forget that DG is still the most used shaft for wedge, and for good reasons, PRICE is only one of them, so what about trying a DG X100 #8 shaft for wedge here? if it fails it want be as expensive as a failed Modus if you dont like them.



    i use modified TT Tour Concept IRON S #8 shafts i my own wedges (not the wedge model but IRON shafts) so im using the same #8 wedge Spinner myself going up 1 flex but down to a #8, and only a few of them ive heard off who tried that did not like it.
    Posted:

    PLEASE DO NOT SEND ME PMs ON CLUB TECH ISSUES - ASK PUBLIC IN THE FORUM.

    Unless you are a former Customer or someone i already have a PM dialog with, i want reply to tech questions on PMs.

  • SAM_PGASAM_PGA PGA Professional Knoxville, TNMembers  689WRX Points: 166Posts: 689 Golden Tee
    Joined:  #16




    Im a big fan of the X #8 iron shaft route, it seems to work very good for most shaft models on the marked, and since FEEL is a important part of it all, i will also suggest the X #8 for that reason. Even if its actually a stiffer shaft it does not really feel like that, only a bit different so compared to a tipped #9 or PW shaft, i would say feel is way better when we go X #8



    if i was strong enough to use X100 #8 iron shafts for wedge i would, even as a R flex player, so dont forget that DG is still the most used shaft for wedge, and for good reasons, PRICE is only one of them, so what about trying a DG X100 #8 shaft for wedge here? if it fails it want be as expensive as a failed Modus if you dont like them.



    i use modified TT Tour Concept IRON S #8 shafts i my own wedges (not the wedge model but IRON shafts) so im using the same #8 wedge Spinner myself going up 1 flex but down to a #8, and only a few of them ive heard off who tried that did not like it.




    Howard... out of curiosity with the 8i wedge shaft as you mentioned. TTDG used the 37" raw length shaft for both the 9i and wedges, so to use an 8i shaft would be soft stepping once correct? With Nippon Modus shafts, they actually use specific 9i and PW shafts, of 37.5" and 37". Would it be safe to assume that for somebody that plays Modus shafts, that you would use the 9i shaft at 37.5" raw and NOT the 8i shaft which is 38" raw?



    Thanks for your insight!!!!
    Posted:



    TS3 9.5º - UST LinQ Purple 6X     TS3 16.5º - UST LinQ Purple 7X     818 H2 21º - Recoil Proto Hybrid 85F5
    T200 #4-5 (1º Weak) & T100 #6-9 - AMT Tour White S300 HS1


    SM8 Raw     46.10F   50.12F @ 51º   56.12D   60.08M @ 61º - AMT Tour White S400      

     
    Special Select Newport 2 - 34"


  • Howard_JonesHoward_Jones Members  10627WRX Points: 1,653Posts: 10,627 Titanium Tees
    Joined:  edited Feb 23, 2019 #17
    sampga1976 wrote:



    Im a big fan of the X #8 iron shaft route, it seems to work very good for most shaft models on the marked, and since FEEL is a important part of it all, i will also suggest the X #8 for that reason. Even if its actually a stiffer shaft it does not really feel like that, only a bit different so compared to a tipped #9 or PW shaft, i would say feel is way better when we go X #8



    if i was strong enough to use X100 #8 iron shafts for wedge i would, even as a R flex player, so dont forget that DG is still the most used shaft for wedge, and for good reasons, PRICE is only one of them, so what about trying a DG X100 #8 shaft for wedge here? if it fails it want be as expensive as a failed Modus if you dont like them.



    i use modified TT Tour Concept IRON S #8 shafts i my own wedges (not the wedge model but IRON shafts) so im using the same #8 wedge Spinner myself going up 1 flex but down to a #8, and only a few of them ive heard off who tried that did not like it.




    Howard... out of curiosity with the 8i wedge shaft as you mentioned. TTDG used the 37" raw length shaft for both the 9i and wedges, so to use an 8i shaft would be soft stepping once correct? With Nippon Modus shafts, they actually use specific 9i and PW shafts, of 37.5" and 37". Would it be safe to assume that for somebody that plays Modus shafts, that you would use the 9i shaft at 37.5" raw and NOT the 8i shaft which is 38" raw?



    Thanks for your insight!!!!




    I never used Nippons so its not a shaft i know first hand, so if we wanted to make sure, we should have seen a profile compare who included flex slope.



    TT used to make a 36.50" PW shaft, but the DG profile becomes very stout and stiff that short, so its out of production years ago.

    If Nippon is "equal" where the PW shaft is so stiff that some dont want it, then we can say the #8 is the way to go, but if the profile dont go that stiff for PW we could just use the #9 shaft as X flex. In the end its the difference we seek, in DGs case from a 37.00" S300 to a 37.50" X100. (one full flex up, then SS1)



    Look into this tread, ive did a search in it for NIPPON and there was several, i suggest you contact one of them and hear how it worked. (im not able to make that link with NIPPONs sorted out, so you have to use search when you get there)



    http://www.golfwrx.com/forums/topic/621030-my-tiger-stepped-wedge-experiment/

    .
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  • SAM_PGASAM_PGA PGA Professional Knoxville, TNMembers  689WRX Points: 166Posts: 689 Golden Tee
    Joined:  #18

    sampga1976 wrote:



    Im a big fan of the X #8 iron shaft route, it seems to work very good for most shaft models on the marked, and since FEEL is a important part of it all, i will also suggest the X #8 for that reason. Even if its actually a stiffer shaft it does not really feel like that, only a bit different so compared to a tipped #9 or PW shaft, i would say feel is way better when we go X #8



    if i was strong enough to use X100 #8 iron shafts for wedge i would, even as a R flex player, so dont forget that DG is still the most used shaft for wedge, and for good reasons, PRICE is only one of them, so what about trying a DG X100 #8 shaft for wedge here? if it fails it want be as expensive as a failed Modus if you dont like them.



    i use modified TT Tour Concept IRON S #8 shafts i my own wedges (not the wedge model but IRON shafts) so im using the same #8 wedge Spinner myself going up 1 flex but down to a #8, and only a few of them ive heard off who tried that did not like it.




    Howard... out of curiosity with the 8i wedge shaft as you mentioned. TTDG used the 37" raw length shaft for both the 9i and wedges, so to use an 8i shaft would be soft stepping once correct? With Nippon Modus shafts, they actually use specific 9i and PW shafts, of 37.5" and 37". Would it be safe to assume that for somebody that plays Modus shafts, that you would use the 9i shaft at 37.5" raw and NOT the 8i shaft which is 38" raw?



    Thanks for your insight!!!!




    I never used Nippons so its not a shaft i know first hand, so if we wanted to make sure, we should have seen a profile compare who included flex slope.



    TT used to make a 36.50" PW shaft, but the DG profile becomes very stout and stiff that short, so its out of production years ago.

    If Nippon is "equal" where the PW shaft is so stiff that some dont want it, then we can say the #8 is the way to go, but if the profile dont go that stiff for PW we could just use the #9 shaft as X flex. In the end its the difference we seek, in DGs case from a 37.00" S300 to a 37.50" X100. (one full flex up, then SS1)



    Look into this tread, ive did a search in it for NIPPON and there was several, i suggest you contact one of them and hear how it worked. (im not able to make that link with NIPPONs sorted out, so you have to use search when you get there)



    http://www.golfwrx.c...dge-experiment/

    .




    If I come across a Modus 120TX 9i shaft I'll try it out. The X to TX is a gain in 6 grams and increase in mid/butt stiffness. I'm not looking for the "magic bullet" like alot of traditional GolfWRXrs do. Feel and consistency is the most important aspect to the wedge game for me.
    Posted:



    TS3 9.5º - UST LinQ Purple 6X     TS3 16.5º - UST LinQ Purple 7X     818 H2 21º - Recoil Proto Hybrid 85F5
    T200 #4-5 (1º Weak) & T100 #6-9 - AMT Tour White S300 HS1


    SM8 Raw     46.10F   50.12F @ 51º   56.12D   60.08M @ 61º - AMT Tour White S400      

     
    Special Select Newport 2 - 34"


  • trumb1mj1trumb1mj1 Members  1400WRX Points: 103Posts: 1,400 Platinum Tees
    Joined:  #19
    Since I've been at this soooo long I actually had an 8i X100 laying around the house from a failed RTX CB experiment. I pulled my 50* rtx 2.0 blade head and popped this shaft in. The feel is amazing on full and partial shots! I'm also seeing tighter dispersion than I'm used to and eliminated that high right "floater". I'm very encouraged with the results and plan to move my 56 and 60 to this shaft.
    Posted:
  • Howard_JonesHoward_Jones Members  10627WRX Points: 1,653Posts: 10,627 Titanium Tees
    Joined:  #20
    trumb1mj1 wrote:


    Since I've been at this soooo long I actually had an 8i X100 laying around the house from a failed RTX CB experiment. I pulled my 50* rtx 2.0 blade head and popped this shaft in. The feel is amazing on full and partial shots! I'm also seeing tighter dispersion than I'm used to and eliminated that high right "floater". I'm very encouraged with the results and plan to move my 56 and 60 to this shaft.




    i dont understand why we dont see more of that shaft on the Tour, its a "better" wedge shaft than S400 ever was, both flight and feel, and those 2 grams as difference can be fixed with a small piece of lead tape on the shaft if wanted. IMO the absolute best wedge shaft ever made, and miles better than the DGS / wedge flex series who has to short butt section for wedge use because more than half the grip is over the steps when we use DGS for wedge.
    Posted:

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  • trumb1mj1trumb1mj1 Members  1400WRX Points: 103Posts: 1,400 Platinum Tees
    Joined:  #21

    I went with X100 8 iron shafts in all of my wedges and the experiment didn't go well. I liked the feel initially but had a hard time controlling my flight and a hard time turning the ball over. I decided to go in a different direction and went softer. I had some old "wedge flex" shafts laying around from a version before the current cleveland wedge flex. They have a much longer tip section (maybe an extra inch?) than the current wedge flex. Anyway, this softer shaft gives me way more control amazingly. I can flight the ball better and I can hit little draws on command.

    Softer === lower for me... Can you explain that

    On -, @Howard Jones ? Thanks
    Posted:
  • Howard_JonesHoward_Jones Members  10627WRX Points: 1,653Posts: 10,627 Titanium Tees
    Joined:  #22

    On -, @trumb1mj1 said:

    I went with X100 8 iron shafts in all of my wedges and the experiment didn't go well. I liked the feel initially but had a hard time controlling my flight and a hard time turning the ball over. I decided to go in a different direction and went softer. I had some old "wedge flex" shafts laying around from a version before the current cleveland wedge flex. They have a much longer tip section (maybe an extra inch?) than the current wedge flex. Anyway, this softer shaft gives me way more control amazingly. I can flight the ball better and I can hit little draws on command.

    Softer === lower for me... Can you explain that

    On -, @Howard Jones ? Thanks

    it made a difference for how you delivered the club head to the ball, thats the answer, and thats what feel of flex does, but we never knows how it will work before we have tried it, but since softer "should" mean more shaft bending and by that higher, its NOT shaft bending that made that difference, but AOA and where your hands ended at impact, more forward, de-lofting the club if flight came down.

    Posted:

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  • mogc60mogc60 Members  1016WRX Points: 486Posts: 1,016 Platinum Tees
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    Howard is so on the mark with this one. I love the info that Howard and Stuart G and others provide on shaft and club fitting. Especially in weight and flight topics.

    Posted:

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  • Howard_JonesHoward_Jones Members  10627WRX Points: 1,653Posts: 10,627 Titanium Tees
    Joined:  edited May 29, 2019 #24

    On -, @mogc60 said:

    Howard is so on the mark with this one. I love the info that Howard and Stuart G and others provide on shaft and club fitting. Especially in weight and flight topics.

    But this is not rocket science at all, its simple stuff.
    ..Launch angle is a question of Loft at impact, or whats called Dynamic loft, so when we use the terms and condition all else equal", Higher launch = it was higher dynamic loft, and lower launch, = it was lower dynamic loft.

    a ROBOT who does the same no matter how it feels, since he dont feel, is the only one who ALWAYS will see the direction of change we "read in the book", so for a Robot, softer is always higher launch, and RIFLE FCM will have a APEX (top height of flight) of 1 feet higher for each CPM softer, so when we go SS1 or 4 CPM softer, this shafts will in the hands of Iron Byron have a APEX of 4 feets + from what ever it was.

    Now we add the HUMAN FACTOR...we feel, we compensate, but how we respond to a change of club specs is not always like Iron Byron. Total weight, Balance and Feel of flex both from load and impact makes a human to adjust something in the way he swing the club, and that changes the delivery of the club head to the ball = different ball flight.

    A robot will never see a club speed change from a change of flex or profile, while a human can, since feel of flex is a trigger for how much power the player use and when, while a robot feels nothing, so noting will change.

    A stiffer profile can speed up the players tempo, but if we go "over and beyond", the player will overload or overplay, impact suffer, and we loose distance, so sometime we can use a softer feel to slow down the players use of power, who might improve his impact so much he hit it way longer on average.

    I also think those softer Cleveland shafts had a lower shaft weight than X100 #8....and both contributed to a change of swing who gave lower dynamic loft or less loft at impact,even if the shaft might have bended more forward than X100 , #8, the compensation made in his swing. was simply larger then what flex pulled the other way,

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  • cpeckcpeck North new jerseyMembers  632WRX Points: 290Handicap: leftyPosts: 632 Golden Tee
    Joined:  #25

    i switched to kbs 130x in my wedges. it stopped the lengthy roll outs where it’s a struggle to one putt. since the switch sitting a lot closer hitting to the pin instead of trying to keep it 10 yards max away from flag to plan for roll out. has helped with scoring for sure. shots are a **** of a lot straighter as well with anything past 1/2 swing that used to cut left for me. the transition to a heavier wedge shaft was not a difficult task actually feel better.

    play a older set of kbs x flex in my
    mp68s not sure of the weight but i think they are 120’s

    Posted:
  • trumb1mj1trumb1mj1 Members  1400WRX Points: 103Posts: 1,400 Platinum Tees
    Joined:  #26

    I was after a firmer shaft to lower my flight but I was going in the wrong direction. Softer for me means more trajectory control, effortless shot shaping and way more spin.

    Posted:

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