Using the line on the ball to line up your putt...

[QEight]

> @buckeyefl said:

> > @QEight said:

> > I have not seen an increase in using the line.

> > You are talking about speed, but the effect on PoP is very small, I think. Biggest effect on PoP would be if people were moving and hitting the ball instead of not.

>

> You understand that by mulling over getting your like on the ball exactly right that you are not moving when you could and should bee, right?

 

15% (?) of players using line, but 60% just being slow overall.

[nsxguy]

> @"Mr. Bean" said:

> > @"sui generis" said:

> > > @Roadking2003 said:

> > > > @"P.E." said:

> > > > I am not sure how a rule not allowing a player to use an alignment mark really would be enforceable.

> > >

> > > They could prohibit balls with lines on them.

> >

> > Dear me, you test the boundaries for silliness regularly.

>

> I sure could not have put it better in words!!! Way to go, Sui!!

 

Not sure it's THAT silly. I mean it's not free relief from divots. LOL

 

Look at the new rules tripping up players early in the season. No caddies lining their guy (or girl) up when in their stance. Why ? Because that should be a player "skill".

 

Alignment aids while playing have been illegal for quite a while now.

 

Why should the players have a stripe on the ball to align themselves on a putt ?

 

Frankly, these green books are what annoys me. Maybe because *I* don't have one. LOL

 

But green reading is a skill, no ? Practicing on the course before the tournament and getting all the greens read correctly is a skill AND a real effort of time and patience. Shouldn't that be (more) rewarded over another player who can't be bothered ?

 

I have no problem with a player making his OWN notes/whatever before the tourney and using it in the tourney but all these green books showing every nook and cranny ? Let 'em do it themselves.

 

When do rangefinders become legal on Tour during the tournament ? LOL

 

 

[buckeyefl]

> @QEight said:

> > @buckeyefl said:

> > > @QEight said:

> > > I have not seen an increase in using the line.

> > > You are talking about speed, but the effect on PoP is very small, I think. Biggest effect on PoP would be if people were moving and hitting the ball instead of not.

> >

> > You understand that by mulling over getting your like on the ball exactly right that you are not moving when you could and should bee, right?

>

> 15% (?) of players using line, but 60% just being slow overall.

 

1% is too many. Slow play is a disease. Watching players adjust a line on the ball perfectly when they can't hit the same spot on the putter face twice in a round or are trying to knock in that 2 footer for a 10 shouldn't have to be tolerated. I suggest giving each group a taser to prevent such moments.

[P.E.]

> @jmkenn0 said:

> > @"P.E." said:

> > > @jmkenn0 said:

> > > A rule change I would like to see is you can't move the ball only set it down. So no rotation, if it moves remark/replace. Cause I agree watching people line up putts in this method makes me want to claw my eyes out.

> >

> > Is it more enjoyable to watch a 2 putt or worse from 4 feet because the player can't align the putter face to the target line?

>

> Frankly I'm not sure its an either/or proposition. The people I see doing it the most, ie lining up the ball/relining, are generally terrible putters that never make them anyway.

 

I agree with you that it is not an either/or proposition .

 

My point was that there are a large number of player behaviors that you or I may find annoying but probably shouldn't result a rule governing the behavior.

 

For example I don't appreciate players scratching around the tee of a par 3 looking for broken tees because it wastes time.

 

[Mr. Bean]

> @Noles said:

> It's not like this is a new thing. I did this in high school in the late 80's. Why now would it be something that needed to be addressed.

 

Well, maybe some of the Rules have changed since late 80's..? Could it be..?

[Lodestone]

What I think is silly is watching someone do the Furyk thing 20 or 30 times in a round of golf. I have no idea of the ruling bodies give 2 hoots about it, and I'm not expecting them to do anything about it in the rules. I'd like to see it abolished. I think BuckeyeFl's idea about the taser would be a darn good start.

The guy I played with did the alignment thing AFTER doing the "reading the green with my feet" think and the "holding two fingers up to the line " thing...it was brutal.

[SNIPERBBB]

 

 

> @Lodestone said:

>

> The guy I played with did the alignment thing AFTER doing the "reading the green with my feet" think and the "holding two fingers up to the line " thing...it was brutal.

 

Unless the guy is slower than molasses that isn't slow at all. I use aimpoint express and use the line, which works perfectly for that system. Sure beats walking around the hole reading the putt from angles. Then again Im averaging 30 or less putts a round so....

[Lodestone]

> @SNIPERBBB said:

>

>

> > @Lodestone said:

> >

> > The guy I played with did the alignment thing AFTER doing the "reading the green with my feet" think and the "holding two fingers up to the line " thing...it was brutal.

>

> Unless the guy is slower than molasses that isn't slow at all. I use aimpoint express and use the line, which works perfectly for that system. Sure beats walking around the hole reading the putt from angles. Then again Im averaging 30 or less putts a round so....

 

Oh, well, he did all of that after walking around the ball reading the putt from all angles.

[Noles]

> @"Mr. Bean" said:

> > @Noles said:

> > It's not like this is a new thing. I did this in high school in the late 80's. Why now would it be something that needed to be addressed.

>

> Well, maybe some of the Rules have changed since late 80's..? Could it be..?

 

That doesn't answer the question.

[rsh0308]

I use the pre-printed logo line "Z-Star XV" to line up my putts. I can walk my course in < 3 hours playing with a buddy. Make reads while others are making theirs, put my ball down before or right after the guy before me putts. It's not the using of the line that slows people down. It's them being slow.

[SheriffBooth]

IMO, the line on the ball is not the problem, the slow player is the problem. It's entirely possible to play fast and use a line while putting. Golf courses needed to start doing a better job of holding customers accountable, players need to start doing a better of job of holding their playing partners accountable, and slow players need to be more self-aware. High schools and colleges need to do a better job of squeezing slow play out of their young teams. Pro tours need to enact harsher penalties for slow rounds. The Rules of Golf, or the lack of Rules, are not creating slow play.

[Sawgrass]

Everyone's time-saving ideas only include eliminating things they don't wish to do anyway.

[Lodestone]

> @rsh0308 said:

> I use the pre-printed logo line "Z-Star XV" to line up my putts. I can walk my course in < 3 hours playing with a buddy. Make reads while others are making theirs, put my ball down before or right after the guy before me putts. It's not the using of the line that slows people down. It's them being slow.

 

I agree with your point. Just wondering though if you've made it part of your pre-putt routine to keep the ball marked, take your address, step back behind the ball and adjust the line, and take your address again, and then, if acceptable, step away again, remove the mark, and re-address the ball for the third time.

 

 

[Lodestone]

> @Sawgrass said:

> Everyone's time-saving ideas only include eliminating things they don't wish to do anyway.

 

 

yes, but one reason we may not wish to do them is that they take too long. We all could take longer to read putts, with our eyes, our feet, from several angles, then do the Furyk maneuver to make as sure as possible we are aligned correctly etc. etc. The reason some of those things fall into the category of things we don't wish to do anyway is that we've made a conscious decision that all of that stuff would slow us down too much.

 

 

[SugarPenguin]

> @Lodestone said:

> > @antip said:

> > > @DaveLeeNC said:

> > > > @"sui generis" said:

> > > > > @Roadking2003 said:

> > > > > > @"P.E." said:

> > > > > > I am not sure how a rule not allowing a player to use an alignment mark really would be enforceable.

> > > > >

> > > > > They could prohibit balls with lines on them.

> > > >

> > > > Dear me, you test the boundaries for silliness regularly.

> > >

> > > That rule would seem to me to provide a real advantage to ball manufacturers (past and present) such as Taylormade or Bridgestone vs. (for example) Nike. Or at least it would require the latter to come up with a long model name.

> > >

> > > dave

> >

> > I've just patented my new ball's name. "Theballthatnevermissesifyoualignitcorrectly", hmm, gonna be a squeeze in the 2.64 inch circumference of the ball.

>

> Would it be possible to make the rule read something like "using a marking on the ball to indicate the line of play is allowed, however repositioning it after taking one's address is prohibited"?

 

Sounds good to me.

I use a line on my ball but dont always follow it. I line it up read the putt and then if its not straight I know to hit the ball left or right of the line (so would conform to the above rule).

[Sawgrass]

> @Lodestone said:

> > @Sawgrass said:

> > Everyone's time-saving ideas only include eliminating things they don't wish to do anyway.

>

>

> yes, but one reason we may not wish to do them is that they take too long. We all could take longer to read putts, with our eyes, our feet, from several angles, then do the Furyk maneuver to make as sure as possible we are aligned correctly etc. etc. The reason some of those things fall into the category of things we don't wish to do anyway is that we've made a conscious decision that all of that stuff would slow us down too much.

>

>

 

I suspect that at its core, the main reason you don't use a line on your ball to set up for a putt is that you don't believe it helps you.

 

Hey, I don't use it either. But I'm not going to advocate that another player shouldn't do what helps him/her. I only advocate that they keep up with designated pace of play requirements.

[Lodestone]

> @Sawgrass said:

> > @Lodestone said:

> > > @Sawgrass said:

> > > Everyone's time-saving ideas only include eliminating things they don't wish to do anyway.

> >

> >

> > yes, but one reason we may not wish to do them is that they take too long. We all could take longer to read putts, with our eyes, our feet, from several angles, then do the Furyk maneuver to make as sure as possible we are aligned correctly etc. etc. The reason some of those things fall into the category of things we don't wish to do anyway is that we've made a conscious decision that all of that stuff would slow us down too much.

> >

> >

>

> I suspect that at its core, the main reason you don't use a line on your ball to set up for a putt is that you don't believe it helps you.

>

> Hey, I don't use it either. But I'm not going to advocate that another player shouldn't do what helps him/her. I only advocate that they keep up with designated pace of play requirements.

 

You are essentially correct. I tried it and found that I didn't trust it unless I backed off, checked it and adjusted it if needed. If I did all of that so I could feel I could trust the line, yes, it helped. It just took too damn long.

But in essence, I agree with those who say there is no inherent problem with the line, or even what I've come to call "The Furyk Maneuver", if they could do that and maintain a reasonable pace.

From my small sample size, and from my gut, I suspect that anyone who is willing to make that part of the pre-putt routine, is unlikely to be someone who plays at a decent pace. At least not a pace that I want to be subjected to.

I hope it doesn't become too popular at the club level.

[bigred90gt]

> @Lodestone said:

> > @rsh0308 said:

> > I use the pre-printed logo line "Z-Star XV" to line up my putts. I can walk my course in < 3 hours playing with a buddy. Make reads while others are making theirs, put my ball down before or right after the guy before me putts. It's not the using of the line that slows people down. It's them being slow.

>

> I agree with your point. Just wondering though if you've made it part of your pre-putt routine to keep the ball marked, take your address, step back behind the ball and adjust the line, and take your address again, and then, if acceptable, step away again, remove the mark, and re-address the ball for the third time.

>

>

 

That's not a product of using the line on the ball, that is a product of being inconsiderate and slow. I use the line on my ball, I stand behind my mark, pick out a spot about a foot in front of the ball where I want it to start, replace the ball with the line on that spot, address and putt. No backing off, no practice strokes, no wasted time.

 

To be honest, I've played thousands of rounds of golf over the last 20 or so years I've played, and played most of my rounds for the first 10 as a single being paired with random guys in multiple parts of the country and most of the public tracks in the greater Houston area, and the only person I have ever seen do that was Jim Furyk. It is not exactly a plague hindering pace on the course on a regular basis.

[2bGood]

> @Roadking2003 said:

> > @"P.E." said:

> > I am not sure how a rule not allowing a player to use an alignment mark really would be enforceable.

>

> They could prohibit balls with lines on them.

 

Or any straight Line of text?

 

[2bGood]

> @buckeyefl said:

> > @QEight said:

> > I have not seen an increase in using the line.

> > You are talking about speed, but the effect on PoP is very small, I think. Biggest effect on PoP would be if people were moving and hitting the ball instead of not.

>

> You understand that by mulling over getting your like on the ball exactly right that you are not moving when you could and should bee, right?

 

I can line up a putt faster with a line than without one. To actually line up my line it typically takes maximum of two placement -of a rough setting, a look behind the ball and an adjustment. I take no practice strokes and typically read my putt while others are putting etc. and if not anyones line it won't be unusual to have my putt lined up while a ball is rolling towards the hole. I am so fast that I have had to learn to putt while people are still talking as they don't anticipate that I will be hitting the ball so quickly.

 

I am a 'fast' player typically play in 3.5 hours walking, playing by the rules etc. I tend to think things like the line on the ball has nothing to do with pace. Pace comes from an attitude of playing with good pace. When you have that, you easily get around as fast the group in front will let you.

[Mr. Bean]

> @2bGood said:

> > @buckeyefl said:

> > > @QEight said:

> > > I have not seen an increase in using the line.

> > > You are talking about speed, but the effect on PoP is very small, I think. Biggest effect on PoP would be if people were moving and hitting the ball instead of not.

> >

> > You understand that by mulling over getting your like on the ball exactly right that you are not moving when you could and should bee, right?

>

> I can line up a putt faster with a line than without one.

 

And I can line up a putt faster without a line on the ball than you can with your line on your ball.

 

So what?

[BlackDiamondPar5]

I'd rather that people not mark unless in someone's way and just putt.

[Edward_Majorwin]

> @BlackDiamondPar5 said:

> I'd rather that people not mark unless in someone's way and just putt.

 

Yep there should be a rule that you can't mark your ball unless it's in someone's way. Drives me crazy when peeps gotta take 20 seconds lining up their balls for 4 foot putts (this is coming from someone who doesn't line up the ball, totally biased response)

[2bGood]

> @"Mr. Bean" said:

> > @2bGood said:

> > > @buckeyefl said:

> > > > @QEight said:

> > > > I have not seen an increase in using the line.

> > > > You are talking about speed, but the effect on PoP is very small, I think. Biggest effect on PoP would be if people were moving and hitting the ball instead of not.

> > >

> > > You understand that by mulling over getting your like on the ball exactly right that you are not moving when you could and should bee, right?

> >

> > I can line up a putt faster with a line than without one.

>

> And I can line up a putt faster without a line on the ball than you can with your line on your ball.

>

> So what?

But I make my putts.

 

[buckeyefl]

> @2bGood said:

> > @buckeyefl said:

> > > @QEight said:

> > > I have not seen an increase in using the line.

> > > You are talking about speed, but the effect on PoP is very small, I think. Biggest effect on PoP would be if people were moving and hitting the ball instead of not.

> >

> > You understand that by mulling over getting your like on the ball exactly right that you are not moving when you could and should bee, right?

>

> I can line up a putt faster with a line than without one. To actually line up my line it typically takes maximum of two placement -of a rough setting, a look behind the ball and an adjustment. I take no practice strokes and typically read my putt while others are putting etc. and if not anyones line it won't be unusual to have my putt lined up while a ball is rolling towards the hole. I am so fast that I have had to learn to putt while people are still talking as they don't anticipate that I will be hitting the ball so quickly.

>

> I am a 'fast' player typically play in 3.5 hours walking, playing by the rules etc. I tend to think things like the line on the ball has nothing to do with pace. Pace comes from an attitude of playing with good pace. When you have that, you easily get around as fast the group in front will let you.

 

This isn't about you.

[Mr. Bean]

> @2bGood said:

> > @"Mr. Bean" said:

> > > @2bGood said:

> > > > @buckeyefl said:

> > > > > @QEight said:

> > > > > I have not seen an increase in using the line.

> > > > > You are talking about speed, but the effect on PoP is very small, I think. Biggest effect on PoP would be if people were moving and hitting the ball instead of not.

> > > >

> > > > You understand that by mulling over getting your like on the ball exactly right that you are not moving when you could and should bee, right?

> > >

> > > I can line up a putt faster with a line than without one.

> >

> > And I can line up a putt faster without a line on the ball than you can with your line on your ball.

> >

> > So what?

> But I make my putts.

>

 

That was a good one!! :lol:

[Lodestone]

> @2bGood said:

> > @"Mr. Bean" said:

> > > @2bGood said:

> > > > @buckeyefl said:

> > > > > @QEight said:

> > > > > I have not seen an increase in using the line.

> > > > > You are talking about speed, but the effect on PoP is very small, I think. Biggest effect on PoP would be if people were moving and hitting the ball instead of not.

> > > >

> > > > You understand that by mulling over getting your like on the ball exactly right that you are not moving when you could and should bee, right?

> > >

> > > I can line up a putt faster with a line than without one.

> >

> > And I can line up a putt faster without a line on the ball than you can with your line on your ball.

> >

> > So what?

> But I make my putts.

>

So do I...eventually...

 

[SNIPERBBB]

> @Edward_Majorwin said:

> > @BlackDiamondPar5 said:

> > I'd rather that people not mark unless in someone's way and just putt.

>

> Yep there should be a rule that you can't mark your ball unless it's in someone's way. Drives me crazy when peeps gotta take 20 seconds lining up their balls for 4 foot putts (this is coming from someone who doesn't line up the ball, totally biased response)

And everyone makes those 4 footers 100% of the time /sarcasm

[bladehunter]

id love to see sightlines banned on putters too. I mean let’s get real. That’s a huge crutch and time waster.

[North Butte]

So the justification is, "If they think it helps them putt".

 

What if a guy wanted to dance around the green like Ty Webb saying, "na na na na na na na" before every putt, because he thinks it helps. Am I supposed to just stand there and approve of that too?

 

There's someone, somewhere who can convince them that any stupid thing they see on TV or in a YouTube video will help them play better golf. The test is not, "Do they think it helps?". The test is, "Is it reasonable to ask everyone else on the course to wait while they do it?".