For those that have applied the GG pivot

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  • thebogeyputtthebogeyputt NYC 78Members Posts: 78
    Joined:  #2222

    @RichieHunt said:

    @thebogeyputt said:

    What do you mean by the above? do you mean as you rotate and pivot in backswing, you feel like you are putting more pressure on your lead foot?
    Was hitting the ball so well when I incorporate a same feel (it almost feels like I am reverse pivoting). Not sure if this is the correct way or if I mastered the compensation move to hit the ball from that position.

    There's a video that GG posted on Instagram a while ago showing Johnny Ruiz on Swing Catalyst. Essentially (I don't know if I have the #'s quite correct), he starts off with 55% of his pressure on his left foot at address. Then at about P3, he's shifted the pressure to ~75% to his right foot. But at P4, as he extends his spine the pressure then gets to 50/50.

    Essentially, Johnny is making that 'surfing' move that many instructors like to talk about...he's just doing it prior to the transition and doing it by extending his spine.

    For me, I was getting too much pressure on my right foot. I was not on a pressure mat, but I would guess that I was more like 55% on my right foot at P1, 75% at P3 and 80% at p4.

    Now...that's if you're using the pivot where you 'create a ball' of space at the top of the swing. GG went over with me that you can move off the ball just fine and he teaches some players that move off the ball quite a bit in the backswing. For him, they either have to really extend the upper spine (i.e Jason Zuback or John Oda) or they need to 'surf' forward in transition and then rotate (i.e. 2000-Tiger Woods).

    If you're using GG's 'centered' style pivot, then you're making a smaller lateral movement and more or less just rotating.

    RH

    I'm more in the centered GG-style camp. I just thought it was weird how I hit the ball very square if I feel like I have more weight in my lead foot / lead side by p4. It almost feels like as I rotate in the backswing, I'm leaning towards the target a tad from p3 to p4. I thought for a stock model, GG wants more weight at the trail instep/heel by p4. Maybe feel isn't real?

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  • RichieHuntRichieHunt  3840Members Posts: 3,840
    Joined:  #2223

    @thebogeyputt said:

    I'm more in the centered GG-style camp. I just thought it was weird how I hit the ball very square if I feel like I have more weight in my lead foot / lead side by p4. It almost feels like as I rotate in the backswing, I'm leaning towards the target a tad from p3 to p4. I thought for a stock model, GG wants more weight at the trail instep/heel by p4. Maybe feel isn't real?

    Feel isn't real. Very difficult to put more pressure on your lead foot at p4 if you have straightened the right leg.

    RH

    Posted:
  • thebogeyputtthebogeyputt NYC 78Members Posts: 78
    Joined:  #2224

    @RichieHunt said:

    @thebogeyputt said:

    I'm more in the centered GG-style camp. I just thought it was weird how I hit the ball very square if I feel like I have more weight in my lead foot / lead side by p4. It almost feels like as I rotate in the backswing, I'm leaning towards the target a tad from p3 to p4. I thought for a stock model, GG wants more weight at the trail instep/heel by p4. Maybe feel isn't real?

    Feel isn't real. Very difficult to put more pressure on your lead foot at p4 if you have straightened the right leg.

    RH

    makes sense. do you know if GG is opposed to head moving off the ball from p1 to p3 and then going back to center by p4 through thoracic extension? I have the issue where my arms drift up from p2 to p4 and I think it's due to lack of turn.
    If I somehow focus on getting that turn early on (at the expense of head moving off original position), but bring head back to original position by p4 thru thoracic extension (with a combination of some early weight shift to lead side), then it should theoretically be OK?

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  • mocokidmocokid  2001Members Posts: 2,001
    Joined:  #2225

    @thebogeyputt said:

    @RichieHunt said:

    @thebogeyputt said:

    I'm more in the centered GG-style camp. I just thought it was weird how I hit the ball very square if I feel like I have more weight in my lead foot / lead side by p4. It almost feels like as I rotate in the backswing, I'm leaning towards the target a tad from p3 to p4. I thought for a stock model, GG wants more weight at the trail instep/heel by p4. Maybe feel isn't real?

    Feel isn't real. Very difficult to put more pressure on your lead foot at p4 if you have straightened the right leg.

    RH

    makes sense. do you know if GG is opposed to head moving off the ball from p1 to p3 and then going back to center by p4 through thoracic extension? I have the issue where my arms drift up from p2 to p4 and I think it's due to lack of turn.
    If I somehow focus on getting that turn early on (at the expense of head moving off original position), but bring head back to original position by p4 thru thoracic extension (with a combination of some early weight shift to lead side), then it should theoretically be OK?

    does not want much head movement, I've seen his shade drill where ball is placed on the ground on the hip side of the shadow AND the head. He wants little movement off the shadow from where you start and the balls will keep you centered.

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  • mocokidmocokid  2001Members Posts: 2,001
    Joined:  #2226

    Has George 'authorized' any other people to teach his swing? I'm at a disadvantage being on the East coast, and I don't think he does video lessons any longer, help!

    Posted:
  • RichieHuntRichieHunt  3840Members Posts: 3,840
    Joined:  #2227

    @mocokid said:
    Has George 'authorized' any other people to teach his swing? I'm at a disadvantage being on the East coast, and I don't think he does video lessons any longer, help!

    Brandon Ray in South Carolina works with GG and is an instructor.

    RH

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  • RichieHuntRichieHunt  3840Members Posts: 3,840
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    I had a 1-hour lesson with GG on Friday at Westlake.

    Big issue for me was that in the past month I was struggling to get my hands deep enough at the top of the swing. I was still shallowing out the club, but not as much as I would like and it was all due to the issue of the hand path.

    That being said, I was playing quite well. In fact, the Sunday before I shot 68 at my home club, Orange Tree and had been scoring somewhere between 70-74 on some difficult tracks.

    I hadn’t gotten an online lesson from GG since September. I was planning to and then my swing was really turning the corner in November and that lasted all the way to March.

    Have you ever been playing well but had the feeling your good play was hanging by a thread?

    That’s what I was feeling.

    Anyway, GG mentioned that my swing was good because it was matching up well even though I was not doing what he prescribed. I tend to get too much secondary axis tilt at impact and GG responded that I had to get it in order to compensate for my hand path being too shallow.

    Going into the lesson, I knew it was some sort of rotational issue. That’s one of the basics you learn from MORAD. I had also contemplated it being a lack of left lateral bend issue. But, when I worked on LLB I didn’t get the hands in further.

    Well, I was right…there were rotational and LLB issues causing me to not get the hand path deeper into P4. I was also getting extension with BOTH knees in the backswing which was hurting the issue as well as some wrist-hinging issues.

    I was determined to take note of things that GG does that may be different from what I have heard other teachers teach in the ungodly amount of lessons I’ve taken over the years.

    The one big thing I came away with is that GG doesn’t teach feels. He doesn’t talk about them, he doesn’t say ‘you might feel this’ nor does he ask you ‘what’s that feel like?’ His teaching shows you what it will look like, give you checkpoints to make sure you’re doing it right and give you ways to troubleshoot potential future issues. I really think it’s a superior way to teach given feels are so subjective.

    In this lesson, he did a lot more demonstration and I would video it on my camera. I got about 8 different videos of him speaking and demonstration and a few videos of me actually rehearsing a drill. It’s great because you get a ton of information in just 1-hour and you now have that at your fingertips to reference.

    After we worked on the backswing stuff, we worked on some impact drills. He wanted to see if I could do them right first until he gave me the full scoop on what we were doing a drill on and how to practice it at home.

    I had the motion of the right leg in the downswing all wrong which explains a lot.

    Jake Leadbetter was there. So was Johnny Ruiz (he was the lesson after me). GG showed me how small changes in Johnny’s address position were negatively affecting his swing. He was still shallow as ****, but not quite as shallow as he is when he’s striking it well (for his standards). Just small differences in setup and it unwittingly changes his swing.

    And BTW, Johnny hits it really pure. Long and straight. 120-123-ish with club speed and pretty straight. I saw him hit a few small cuts but most didn’t waver much.

    I talked to him about his game and getting to the next level. For Web.com players it’s more about shots from 160-200 yards. I did see that Johnny hits his irons quite high. That’s not necessarily a bad thing, but it can be problematic sometimes. Johnny felt like that is where he struggled from. I don’t think he had a lot of confidence in his short game around the green either, so you combine the two and it means too many bogeys when you should e coming away with at least par.

    Driving wise…I can’t imagine him not being effective off the tee with how he hits it. That’s only if his strategy is really poor and he’s either laying-up too much or taking too aggressive of a line with the driver.

    As far as striking the ball goes, I haven’t miss much of a step since the lesson. A few times I’ll have some difficulty processing the new backswing tilts, but for the most part really good. In fact, I eagled the 8th hole at Wood Ranch on Sunday as I almost aced my tee shot.

    I haven’t really deep dived into working more on it since I just got back from LA. But, I’m really looking forward to it.

    RH

    Posted:
  • mocokidmocokid  2001Members Posts: 2,001
    Joined:  #2229

    @RichieHunt said:

    @mocokid said:
    Has George 'authorized' any other people to teach his swing? I'm at a disadvantage being on the East coast, and I don't think he does video lessons any longer, help!

    Brandon Ray in South Carolina works with GG and is an instructor.

    RH

    Any of GG's teachers do video lessons? I'm in NJ.

    Posted:
  • RichieHuntRichieHunt  3840Members Posts: 3,840
    Joined:  #2230

    @mocokid said:

    @RichieHunt said:

    @mocokid said:
    Has George 'authorized' any other people to teach his swing? I'm at a disadvantage being on the East coast, and I don't think he does video lessons any longer, help!

    Brandon Ray in South Carolina works with GG and is an instructor.

    RH

    Any of GG's teachers do video lessons? I'm in NJ.

    GG charges $200 for a video lesson.

    I'm think Jake Gilmer and Jake Leadbetter do them for a cheaper rate. I would also check out Brandon Ray.

    Personally, I wouldn't bother with video lessons if you don't have the posture and address positions close to what he prescribes.

    RH

    Posted:
  • cleatiscleatis  85Members Posts: 85
    Joined:  #2231

    @mocokid said:
    Has George 'authorized' any other people to teach his swing? I'm at a disadvantage being on the East coast, and I don't think he does video lessons any longer, help!

    Nick Bova, now at Hamilton Farm. Good Player.

    Posted:
  • LeftDaddyLeftDaddy  816Members Posts: 816
    Joined:  #2232

    I’ve been fooling around with the GG swing for a few months now and was absolutely terrible with it. Made no sense to me (even though I’m convinced GG is a genius and my swing could be helped by him a lot). Anyway, I toyed with it a little yesterday and it clicked. It seems so easy / effortless when I get it right. Really all I changed was the weird deep hands and over-the-line club position. But I’ve struggled for so long with getting under the plane and with a late hip turn, and this hand position at the top seems to set me up as a cure for both of those faults. I’m going to keep playing with it. Could cure several of my ills.

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  • Redjeep83Redjeep83  5545Members Posts: 5,545
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    @RichieHunt said:

    @diablocrusher said:
    Waynde Defranceso just post a video on YouTube comparing Matthew wolff’s swing with an old player from the 30s & 40s, Jimmy Bruen. Pretty amazing how similar the swings are, especially considering how unique we think wolff’s swing is.

    When i first saw Wolff's swing I thought of Jimmy Bruen. But when I look at it more in detail...yes, the backswings are fairly similar. Downswings are very different though. I would say that Wolff's swing more resembles Gay Brewer's.

    RH

    I tried something like wollfs swing over the weekend, getting shaft was across the line. When you have he clubhead across the line so far like that, it basically gives it momentum to get behind you and really shallow on the downswing. To me it felt almost like when people try the steep to shallow loop in how it throws the clubhead behind you on downswing. It got me too shallow on downswing and I was having a problem hitting a fade and not hooking my driver.

    Posted:
  • mocokidmocokid  2001Members Posts: 2,001
    Joined:  edited May 29, 2019 2:59pm #2234

    @cleatis said:

    @mocokid said:
    Has George 'authorized' any other people to teach his swing? I'm at a disadvantage being on the East coast, and I don't think he does video lessons any longer, help!

    Nick Bova, now at Hamilton Farm. Good Player.

    Saw Nick at HF for lesson, excellent! lot of attention paid to a big turn backswing "in the barrel" style, with lots of "lift" using my thighs to create lift and turn back rather than dragging arms and using upper body only. Also P 5.5 plate of spaghetti, then push off.

    Posted:
  • hurley999shurley999s  264Members Posts: 264
    Joined:  #2235

    @mocokid said:

    @cleatis said:

    @mocokid said:
    Has George 'authorized' any other people to teach his swing? I'm at a disadvantage being on the East coast, and I don't think he does video lessons any longer, help!

    Nick Bova, now at Hamilton Farm. Good Player.

    Saw Nick at HF for lesson, excellent! lot of attention paid to a big turn backswing "in the barrel" style, with lots of "lift" using my thighs to create lift and turn back rather than dragging arms and using upper body only. Also P 5.5 plate of spaghetti, then push off.

    Can you elaborate? Ie, feel is keeping the right wrist flexed like holding a plate? Or is the emphasis on spaghetti meaning keeping the arms passive here (so as to not pull the handle)?

    Posted:
  • mocokidmocokid  2001Members Posts: 2,001
    Joined:  #2236

    @hurley999s said:

    @mocokid said:

    @cleatis said:

    @mocokid said:
    Has George 'authorized' any other people to teach his swing? I'm at a disadvantage being on the East coast, and I don't think he does video lessons any longer, help!

    Nick Bova, now at Hamilton Farm. Good Player.

    Saw Nick at HF for lesson, excellent! lot of attention paid to a big turn backswing "in the barrel" style, with lots of "lift" using my thighs to create lift and turn back rather than dragging arms and using upper body only. Also P 5.5 plate of spaghetti, then push off.

    Can you elaborate? Ie, feel is keeping the right wrist flexed like holding a plate? Or is the emphasis on spaghetti meaning keeping the arms passive here (so as to not pull the handle)?

    the drill is to hold a plate between your hands at address, make the swing down to p5.5. At that point the plate is upright ________ and could hold 'spaghetti'. Back of left hand facing skyward. Right arm and leg are external. This is a shallowing move and a bit of an over exaggeration, to emphasize shallowing. By p6, the plate is dumped on the floor ( plate is back to vertical, address position ) as you push up and rotate to impact. I think there is video of this or similar drill on the old GG swing tips utube site. Richie Hunt or others may be able to elaborate on this as well, as this was my first lesson.

    Posted:
  • hurley999shurley999s  264Members Posts: 264
    Joined:  #2237

    Cool thanks so much - that’s what I thought but the spaghetti part made me second guess. Good stuff - I know about the feel of feeling like a waiter after transition with the right (trail) wrist holding a tray, but the way you explained goes to a more detailed visual - drill with plate vertical at setup, then flat coming down, and getting dumped at impact. Will be helpful to integrate this into practice drills. Much appreciated.

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  • RoffeRoffe  18Members Posts: 18
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    Russell is pretty close to GG here? This move helped me a LOT

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  • RichieHuntRichieHunt  3840Members Posts: 3,840
    Joined:  #2239

    Just an update.

    It’s been 3-weeks since my last lesson with GG. I tend to think that there are a few stages a golfer goes thru when making alterations to their swing.

    1) Having confidence in knowing what you need to do

    2) Understanding what all of your tendencies are to do ‘wrong’ when you attempt to make those alterations in your swing.

    3) Get enough reps in to fully ingrain the alterations in your swing.

    I think I am pretty much on to #3 at this point. GG and I worked a lot on the side and forward tilts along with turning my pelvis and shoulders in the backswing. The main tendencies I have when it comes to doing it ‘wrong’ is that I tend to get out of my tilt, usually around p3.5. Then some other tendencies (as far as the backswing goes) is to stop turning my pelvis and shoulders.

    This drill has helped me out quite a bit.

    I put the stick in the ground about 2 balls outside the target line. The shallower I make the stick, the more difficult it is to avoid hitting the stick with the club. I won’t allow the stick to get any lower than bisecting the middle of my right shoulder because then I would be swinging too flat.

    This not only helps prevent me from taking the club too far outside, but it serves as a good reference for me to understand how to tilt and turn the shoulders.

    Now I have moved onto the downswing work that GG and I went thru in our lesson. GG had me do impact drills where I would address the ball in the same position I would want to be at impact and then take about a ½ swing and try to get back to that impact position.

    Typically, I’m not a fan of swing drills where you don’t make a full swing. But the impact drill (I’m sure YouTube has a video of it somewhere) allows me to really feel what I need to do in transition despite it being only a ½ swing.

    The big part for me is that I had the femur movement in the downswing incorrect and GG clarified this up for me. And now it’s much easier to execute.

    And the results have been very good, but that was not until I noticed that I have the tendency to get out of my tilts too early in transition which is what the impact drill made loud and clear was a problem.

    But now the low point control is far better. I can actually take a dollar sized divot with a 7-iron and still hit it flush. And I started to see more power. For example, on Sunday I played Orange Tree and hit, by far, my longest drive on #8. It went so long that I decided to pace it off from the front right greenside bunker to use as a reference…then I got home on Google Earth and measured it at about 325 yards.

    I’m really starting to see it make a difference on my shorter irons and wedges. Typically I have a big yardage gap from my 8-iron to my 9-iron. But now I hit the 9-iron and wedges much further. So much so that it gave me problems this past weekend as I air-mailed a few greens.

    I’ll be interested in how this goes this weekend as we’re off to play World Woods.

    RH

    Posted:
  • Z1ggy16Z1ggy16  8163Members Posts: 8,163
    Joined:  #2240

    @mocokid said:

    @cleatis said:

    @mocokid said:
    Has George 'authorized' any other people to teach his swing? I'm at a disadvantage being on the East coast, and I don't think he does video lessons any longer, help!

    Nick Bova, now at Hamilton Farm. Good Player.

    Saw Nick at HF for lesson, excellent! lot of attention paid to a big turn backswing "in the barrel" style, with lots of "lift" using my thighs to create lift and turn back rather than dragging arms and using upper body only. Also P 5.5 plate of spaghetti, then push off.

    Nick is a really great teacher, anybody within like 150 miles of Hamilton Farm should consider seeing him if they are into the GG "method".

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  • TuguTugu  84Members Posts: 84
    Joined:  #2241

    >

    The big part for me is that I had the femur movement in the downswing incorrect and GG clarified this up for me. And now it’s much easier to execute.

    And the results have been very good, but that was not until I noticed that I have the tendency to get out of my tilts too early in transition which is what the impact drill made loud and clear was a problem.

    Rh

    Could you comment in greater detail on the femur movement GG prescribes? Might there be a video regarding this?

    Thank you

    Posted:
  • joliver233joliver233  353Members Posts: 353
    Joined:  edited May 30, 2019 7:22pm #2242

    For those wondering about other teachers like GG, I have done one online and one in-person lesson with Andrew Perez in La Quinta/Palm Desert. I found him because he was on a couple of GG's videos and started following him. He has helped my swing a lot, and he teaches the same principles. His IG handle is apswingtips if anyone is interested in giving him a follow to find out.

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  • mocokidmocokid  2001Members Posts: 2,001
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    @Z1ggy16 said:

    @mocokid said:

    @cleatis said:

    @mocokid said:
    Has George 'authorized' any other people to teach his swing? I'm at a disadvantage being on the East coast, and I don't think he does video lessons any longer, help!

    Nick Bova, now at Hamilton Farm. Good Player.

    Saw Nick at HF for lesson, excellent! lot of attention paid to a big turn backswing "in the barrel" style, with lots of "lift" using my thighs to create lift and turn back rather than dragging arms and using upper body only. Also P 5.5 plate of spaghetti, then push off.

    Nick is a really great teacher, anybody within like 150 miles of Hamilton Farm should consider seeing him if they are into the GG "method".

    Wish I knew earlier, he was at Anchor nearer to me......

    Posted:
  • phillyspecialphillyspecial  503Members Posts: 503
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    When is GGs new site going to go live? The pre-enroll has teased for nearly 3 mos now.

    Posted:
  • medicimedici  34Members Posts: 34
    Joined:  #2245

    @phillyspecial said:
    When is GGs new site going to go live? The pre-enroll has teased for nearly 3 mos now.

    End of July dude.

    Posted:
  • medicimedici  34Members Posts: 34
    Joined:  #2246

    I'm trying to work on this now -

    But doing it in my swing my arms just pull down constant.

    Posted:
  • medicimedici  34Members Posts: 34
    Joined:  #2247

    @mocokid said:

    @cleatis said:

    @mocokid said:
    Has George 'authorized' any other people to teach his swing? I'm at a disadvantage being on the East coast, and I don't think he does video lessons any longer, help!

    Nick Bova, now at Hamilton Farm. Good Player.

    Saw Nick at HF for lesson, excellent! lot of attention paid to a big turn backswing "in the barrel" style, with lots of "lift" using my thighs to create lift and turn back rather than dragging arms and using upper body only. Also P 5.5 plate of spaghetti, then push off.

    Can you elaborate what you mean by in the barrel?
    thanks

    Posted:
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  • medicimedici  34Members Posts: 34
    Joined:  edited Jul 20, 2019 3:53pm #2248

    Me now.. -

    I get stuck so am trying the ceiling drill to do more like this....practice swing below.

    Find it SO hard to make the club shallow using the pivot unless I manually manipulate it
    .

    Any help welcomed

    Posted:
  • joliver233joliver233  353Members Posts: 353
    Joined:  #2249

    @medici said:
    Me now.. -

    I get stuck so am trying the ceiling drill to do more like this....practice swing below.

    Find it SO hard to make the club shallow using the pivot unless I manually manipulate it
    .

    Any help welcomed

    I saw a video on his Instagram (I think—possibly his YouTube channel) awhile back where he was helping a kid who pulled on the handle and told him that he should think about using his hands to push the handle out and away from his body to prevent pulling. He was having trouble leaving his hands up too. So he said either leave your hands up or if you struggle and still want to pull, try pushing out away from the body instead.

    Posted:
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    D: 9* G400 LST w/Oban Kiyoshi Purple 05/X
    3W: 14.5* Cobra F8+ w/Even Flow Blue X
    Irons: 716 AP2 3-PW w/KBS C-Taper S+
    Wedges: 50* SM6; 54* S-Grind, 58* X-Grind MD4 w/DG s400
    Putter: Spider Tour Black
    Ball: Srixon Z-Star XV
  • mocokidmocokid  2001Members Posts: 2,001
    Joined:  #2250

    @medici said:

    @mocokid said:

    @cleatis said:

    @mocokid said:
    Has George 'authorized' any other people to teach his swing? I'm at a disadvantage being on the East coast, and I don't think he does video lessons any longer, help!

    Nick Bova, now at Hamilton Farm. Good Player.

    Saw Nick at HF for lesson, excellent! lot of attention paid to a big turn backswing "in the barrel" style, with lots of "lift" using my thighs to create lift and turn back rather than dragging arms and using upper body only. Also P 5.5 plate of spaghetti, then push off.

    Can you elaborate what you mean by in the barrel?
    thanks

    Look for gankas shadow drill, no lateral move to right going back.

    Posted:
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