Utility iron; lowest playable loft for 100-105 SS

[remitoronto]

Hi,

I recently changed irons to P790 but the stronger loft of the 4i (21*) has made the gap with my G410 Crossover (3i, 20* loft) too narrow as expected at the top of the bag (10-15y at best... the 4i now flies about 190y while the Crossover 200-205). Crossover @39.25 length with Ping Tour85 and P790 standard with Modus 105 S.

 

So I’m thinking going with a stronger utility loft but wonder if will have the speed to launch a 16* or 17* 2 iron; do you guys have heard of minimal SS guideline to get a decent flight at these lofts ? In addition I would like to not increase club length of 39.25 as this is already my max for consistent strike/confidence

 

The 20* Crossover launches quite well (not much lower than the P790) and is a great club off tee or fairway for me. I would like to keep a utility/driving iron head and not go back to hybrid

Under my radar are Ping crossover along with GAPR Lo/U85/ U500 (and having recently moved back to France there are fewer spots to tests clubs over here)

 

My driver SS is 100-105mph, and I tend to be on the high launch/high spin side (hence the good mid flight with crossover)

 

I appreciate your help!

Thanks,

Remi

[Llortamaisey]

You really need to go test these clubs at a fitter. Swing speed is a big factor but there’s a whole lot that goes into it that you’re not considering like dynamic loft, how you deliver the club through impact, what type of CG the club has, and to a lesser degree shaft. Knowing that you are high launch/high spin helps, but doesn’t tell the whole story and ‘why’.

 

Having said all of that, and considering your situation in extreme generalities, I think you need to be in the high 90’s with the low degree utility and spinning somewhere between 3500k to 4000K to get a playable peak height and decent angle. This obviously could be very different based on additional info.

[phatchrisrules]

> @remitoronto said:

> Hi,

> I recently changed irons to P790 but the stronger loft of the 4i (21*) has made the gap with my G410 Crossover (3i, 20* loft) too narrow as expected at the top of the bag (10-15y at best... the 4i now flies about 190y while the Crossover 200-205). Crossover @39.25 length with Ping Tour85 and P790 standard with Modus 105 S.

>

> So I’m thinking going with a stronger utility loft but wonder if will have the speed to launch a 16* or 17* 2 iron; do you guys have heard of minimal SS guideline to get a decent flight at these lofts ? In addition I would like to not increase club length of 39.25 as this is already my max for consistent strike/confidence

>

> The 20* Crossover launches quite well (not much lower than the P790) and is a great club off tee or fairway for me. I would like to keep a utility/driving iron head and not go back to hybrid

> Under my radar are Ping crossover along with GAPR Lo/U85/ U500 (and having recently moved back to France there are fewer spots to tests clubs over here)

>

> My driver SS is 100-105mph, and I tend to be on the high launch/high spin side (hence the good mid flight with crossover)

>

> I appreciate your help!

> Thanks,

> Remi

 

Purely anecdotal but I am a similar driver swing speed to you and I find my limit for an iron is around 21* as well. Sure I can hit a 17* iron utility as I have in the past with say a Ping G700 4i (19*) or a P790 UDI or a Callaway X-Forged but it comes down to the actual performance benefits. For me I found that a 5 wood was significantly easier to hit well, it launched higher, and gave me the distance I was looking for. I have it gapped out now where I have about 15 yards or so of carry per club between my 24* 5i and my 18* 5 wood. I go ~180 for the 5i, ~195 for my 21* hybrid, and ~210-215 for the 5 wood. The iron and hybrid are good for pretty much hitting and sticking or hopping once or twice at most. The 5 wood is good for about 7-10 yards of roll on the fairways and seems to hold okay off of a tee into long par 3s with minimal run out even in the dead heat of July.

[remitoronto]

> @Llortamaisey said:

> You really need to go test these clubs at a fitter. Swing speed is a big factor but there’s a whole lot that goes into it that you’re not considering like dynamic loft, how you deliver the club through impact, what type of CG the club has, and to a lesser degree shaft. Knowing that you are high launch/high spin helps, but doesn’t tell the whole story and ‘why’.

>

> Having said all of that, and considering your situation in extreme generalities, I think you need to be in the high 90’s with the low degree utility and spinning somewhere between 3500k to 4000K to get a playable peak height and decent angle. This obviously could be very different based on additional info.

 

Thanks. Indeed speed is one big but one factor; I will try to test these and report. I suspect I am a little lower than high 90s with a club 39inch long and of relevant weight Thanks again

[Lefty96]

While it may not have anything to do with your swing, I am also a high launch/spin player with a swing speed similar to yours (105-110). I’m gaming an 18* srixon u85 and absolutely love it.

[remitoronto]

> @phatchrisrules said:

> > @remitoronto said:

> > Hi,

> > I recently changed irons to P790 but the stronger loft of the 4i (21*) has made the gap with my G410 Crossover (3i, 20* loft) too narrow as expected at the top of the bag (10-15y at best... the 4i now flies about 190y while the Crossover 200-205). Crossover @39.25 length with Ping Tour85 and P790 standard with Modus 105 S.

> >

> > So I’m thinking going with a stronger utility loft but wonder if will have the speed to launch a 16* or 17* 2 iron; do you guys have heard of minimal SS guideline to get a decent flight at these lofts ? In addition I would like to not increase club length of 39.25 as this is already my max for consistent strike/confidence

> >

> > The 20* Crossover launches quite well (not much lower than the P790) and is a great club off tee or fairway for me. I would like to keep a utility/driving iron head and not go back to hybrid

> > Under my radar are Ping crossover along with GAPR Lo/U85/ U500 (and having recently moved back to France there are fewer spots to tests clubs over here)

> >

> > My driver SS is 100-105mph, and I tend to be on the high launch/high spin side (hence the good mid flight with crossover)

> >

> > I appreciate your help!

> > Thanks,

> > Remi

>

> Purely anecdotal but I am a similar driver swing speed to you and I find my limit for an iron is around 21* as well. Sure I can hit a 17* iron utility as I have in the past with say a Ping G700 4i (19*) or a P790 UDI or a Callaway X-Forged but it comes down to the actual performance benefits. For me I found that a 5 wood was significantly easier to hit well, it launched higher, and gave me the distance I was looking for. I have it gapped out now where I have about 15 yards or so of carry per club between my 24* 5i and my 18* 5 wood. I go ~180 for the 5i, ~195 for my 21* hybrid, and ~210-215 for the 5 wood. The iron and hybrid are good for pretty much hitting and sticking or hopping once or twice at most. The 5 wood is good for about 7-10 yards of roll on the fairways and seems to hold okay off of a tee into long par 3s with minimal run out even in the dead heat of July.

 

Thanks phatchrisrules.It is true that some additional roll isn’t bad in most cases at that distance (at least for my ability). I have never tried 5 woods to be honest; I need to figure out if I can maintain the same reliability/dispersion with a short wood as with a long iron.

Out of curiosity at what length do you play the 5W ? Thanks

[Poolparty]

Speed shouldn't be a big issue here IMO. Back when I was under 100 w a driver I tested a UDI 1 iron and had no issue with launch or carry. I never thought about gaming it, but I could have

[Titleist_PT23]

Could you also just get the current Crossover bent 1.5-2 degrees strong? This would probably push your carry gap to 15-20 yards and it would keep the shaft lenght/swingweight the same.

 

Without knowing anything else, I would also guess you are near the cutoff point for whether the 17 degree model will work. It may also depend on whether this is a tee shot only club.

 

Edit:. I know Ping would bend the original G Crossover 1.5 degrees strong. I am not sure if they have a limit for the G410 Crossover. This will also increase the offset but the lower lofted model has a bit more offset anyways.

[Howard_Jones]

> @agolf1 said:

> Could you also just get the current Crossover bent 1.5-2 degrees strong? This would probably push your carry gap to 15-20 yards and it would keep the shaft lenght/swingweight the same.

>

> Without knowing anything else, I would also guess you are near the cutoff point for whether the 17 degree model will work. It may also depend on whether this is a tee shot only club.

>

> Edit:. I know Ping would bend the original G Crossover 1.5 degrees strong. I am not sure if they have a limit for the G410 Crossover. This will also increase the offset but the lower lofted model has a bit more offset anyways.

 

Just bend it stronger....

https://forums.golfwrx.com/discussion/1468250/question-about-bending-ping-crossover/p1

[remitoronto]

> @"Howard Jones" said:

> > @agolf1 said:

> > Could you also just get the current Crossover bent 1.5-2 degrees strong? This would probably push your carry gap to 15-20 yards and it would keep the shaft lenght/swingweight the same.

> >

> > Without knowing anything else, I would also guess you are near the cutoff point for whether the 17 degree model will work. It may also depend on whether this is a tee shot only club.

> >

> > Edit:. I know Ping would bend the original G Crossover 1.5 degrees strong. I am not sure if they have a limit for the G410 Crossover. This will also increase the offset but the lower lofted model has a bit more offset anyways.

>

> Just bend it stronger....

 

Yes I’ll do this first . Thanks again !

[phatchrisrules]

> @remitoronto said:

> > @phatchrisrules said:

> > > @remitoronto said:

> > > Hi,

> > > I recently changed irons to P790 but the stronger loft of the 4i (21*) has made the gap with my G410 Crossover (3i, 20* loft) too narrow as expected at the top of the bag (10-15y at best... the 4i now flies about 190y while the Crossover 200-205). Crossover @39.25 length with Ping Tour85 and P790 standard with Modus 105 S.

> > >

> > > So I’m thinking going with a stronger utility loft but wonder if will have the speed to launch a 16* or 17* 2 iron; do you guys have heard of minimal SS guideline to get a decent flight at these lofts ? In addition I would like to not increase club length of 39.25 as this is already my max for consistent strike/confidence

> > >

> > > The 20* Crossover launches quite well (not much lower than the P790) and is a great club off tee or fairway for me. I would like to keep a utility/driving iron head and not go back to hybrid

> > > Under my radar are Ping crossover along with GAPR Lo/U85/ U500 (and having recently moved back to France there are fewer spots to tests clubs over here)

> > >

> > > My driver SS is 100-105mph, and I tend to be on the high launch/high spin side (hence the good mid flight with crossover)

> > >

> > > I appreciate your help!

> > > Thanks,

> > > Remi

> >

> > Purely anecdotal but I am a similar driver swing speed to you and I find my limit for an iron is around 21* as well. Sure I can hit a 17* iron utility as I have in the past with say a Ping G700 4i (19*) or a P790 UDI or a Callaway X-Forged but it comes down to the actual performance benefits. For me I found that a 5 wood was significantly easier to hit well, it launched higher, and gave me the distance I was looking for. I have it gapped out now where I have about 15 yards or so of carry per club between my 24* 5i and my 18* 5 wood. I go ~180 for the 5i, ~195 for my 21* hybrid, and ~210-215 for the 5 wood. The iron and hybrid are good for pretty much hitting and sticking or hopping once or twice at most. The 5 wood is good for about 7-10 yards of roll on the fairways and seems to hold okay off of a tee into long par 3s with minimal run out even in the dead heat of July.

>

> Thanks phatchrisrules.It is true that some additional roll isn’t bad in most cases at that distance (at least for my ability). I have never tried 5 woods to be honest; I need to figure out if I can maintain the same reliability/dispersion with a short wood as with a long iron.

> Out of curiosity at what length do you play the 5W ? Thanks

 

My 5 wood is 42.5" long.

[Bryanw99]

I have a 716 tmb 2 iron with a OG RIP iron shaft in it. Smash it. High launch when I need it and that lovely tiger stinger at times. All in all very consistent for me personally. Driver ss for reference is about 104