High Handicap Bag Set-up Discussion

[rkillian]

Thanks. I tried to acknowledge that my game needs work and new club won't fix everything etc. to avoid so of that. That said I did get a lot out of the unsolicited advice and ultimately which way I am gonna go at the top of the bag for now. Just have to sell off at least one or 2 of the clubs first.

[gvogel]

You are presuming that the OP plays a game somewhat like yours. But as the OP is somewhat new to the game, he probably hits plenty of short game shots that are terrible - lays the sod over some, thins others, etc.

I proposed hitting a bucket of wedges all the time as a means of improving his ball-striking, and swing improvement. More confidence would come from hitting lots of easy shots, instead of trying to hit 6-irons, for example. Hone a great pitching swing. That could even carry over to his driver game, as it did for Payne Stewart.

[pinestreetgolf]

He also hits plenty of long-game shots that are terrible. Laying sod over your pitches usually doesn't put you OB or in the water, though, so not as important.

Hitting pitches to improve your driver doesn't make much sense to me, but who knows. Most people would get better at driver by, well, practicing driver. I don't see much advantage in hitting wedge shots for the OP. The vast, vast majority of strokes he loses come in the long game because they can lead to penalty strokes. The most he'll do is three putt, who cares. The most off the tee? Sky is the limit.

[rkillian]

@gvogel "I proposed hitting a bucket of wedges all the time as a means of improving his ball-striking, and swing improvement."
I sort of did this yesterday. I got a chance to go out and hit a bucket. The turn area was too wet so I was limited to the mat but still. I hit maybe half the bucket with my driver and 4 hybrid. Then I little bit of 8-PW. I spent the last 3rd of the bucket with my 52. Since it's been recommended that I put it back in the bag and I haven't really used it much. I hit it just fine practicing full swings and I guess about half swings too (shaft parallel with the ground) was able to hit repeatable shots. Again, off a mat though, so I have to try it on turf if possible soon.

[platgof]

Have fun, you will do just fine. Some suggest an iron only round that might be a great idea. Play nine that way to get your "groove on". LOL!! Make a list of the good and bad, and somewhere between, then work on that. When you see better results your confidence will grow and start to carry you along for the game.

[Thats two thus far Shooter]

Its not so much which irons or hybrids to take, it has everything to do with length and loft. (lie is more of a fitting decision). Keep in mind, Golf manufacturers could care less if you hit it straight, its just how FAR they try to sell you on. So that 5 iron you have, could have the length of a 4 iron, and the natural loft of a 3 iron. So when you say you cant hit a 5 iron, I would check the lofts there first- you may be hitting a 4 to everyone else.

Next is length. Its not rocket science- the further away from the ball you are the harder it is to be accurate. When you say you are a high handicapper and you hit an 8 iron 150, unless you are a pretty strong dude, you are probably hitting a 7 iron natural loft and length with that 8iron.

All i'm saying is that you should work off of a 5 iron being 37.75" in length then progressing 0.5" down the set and a hybrid being 40" in length, and a driver being 45" or less inches in length. Now if you're taller than 6'2" then ignore those lengths, but it DRIVES ME NUTS when manufacturers lengthen irons and woods the same time they claim you will gain yardage with their new clubs.

[mxskier]

I helped my friend build his first bag, all bought second hand/used/older models:

Driver - Rogue 10.5 --> learn to get off the tee with more loft

FW - Rogue 5 wood (18 degrees) --> no point in 3 wood here, just get something with more loft and shorter

Hybrid - Ping G 4 hybrid (22 degrees) --> again, same as above. Also, no need for 4 iron

Irons - AP1 5-W1 (23 to 48 degrees) --> I think there's something to having a 5 iron in the bag, especially if you're younger and can swing with some speed

Wedges - MD3 52/58 --> Since the PW is 43 and the set gap is 48, just go 52/58 to make it more simple.

Putter - went to a store and just tried a bunch and bought it. told him that I couldn't buy that for him online, that he had to find the one that looked right.

 

This is the ultimate starter set. Also applies to high handicappers. Possibly swap the 5i for 5h if you're older with a slower SS.

[Tanner25]

Forget what club should be in or out (5 wood vs 4 hybrid), what type of club you use is important. You like your driver, change irons. The hybrid iron sets have new releases. HB Turbo Launcher, Cobra, T-Rails and Wilson - Launch Pad. If $ is an issue, the HB Launcher previous version would work.

 

 

[citizenfore]

4wd and 7wd is a good option instead of the 3wd and then hybrids. I agree with other posts above as well about using lower lofted clubs (like a pw) around the greens. Work on the good old bump and run. Lessons as you mentioned when you can fit them in. Maybe consider dropping down to 6-7 clubs for a bit too. Learn those clubs really well, then slowly add if/when needed. I often do not play with a full set of 14 and my scores have actually gotten better the last two years I feel partially because of it. It’s forcing me to learn more course management and golf shots.

[rkillian]

Yeah, my 5 iron is more or less the length and loft of a "traditional" 4 iron. As the set works down into the shorter irons, My 8 iron is pretty close to a traditional length 8 but at 35 degrees of loft. So somewhat strongly lofted but not by too much compared to most and certainly not strong compared to a lot the game improvement sets out there. I'm in my late 20's and would probably consider myself relatively strong but the stronger loft helps with that distance I'm sure. I think a big problem with my 5 iron is the lack of use it sees. It has only seen used it a few times on course and as a result I never use it much on the range either. I think practice will fix that over some time.

[rkillian]

This is pretty similar to what I plan to do:

My driver is a XR Speed set at 11*

My RBZ 3 wood (16.5) is currently out and I'll add a 5 wood around 18-19* that is at 42" length when I can.

My current TA1 3 hybrid is out and the 4 hybrid is still in the bag at 22* until I can get one with a stiff shaft that fits me better

Tommy Armour TA1 Irons 5 (24*) - PW (45*)

Tommy Armour 52* wedge is back in. I know on paper that gap between this and my PW looks pretty big but I haven't run into issues yet I am pretty comfortable with a repeatable half swing on my PW and 52 and with my local course as short as it is, I don't really find myself needing full swing yardage from anything below a pitching wedge that often. My handicap/avg. score is more often than not a result of a couple blow up holes a round.

Cleveland 56* is currently there but I plan on replacing with a 58.

Than putter. I like the idea of 12 clubs. It should cover everything I should need and allow me to focus on ball striking and course management.

[rkillian]

I would like to find a 7 wood to hit and just see how it goes. The 4 hybrid I last demo'ed quickly worked our really well. And to my eye I just seem to like a hybrid at address better than a wood. That may have something to do with the shorter length. The last couple rounds I have used my PW much more around the green. I should also arrange a small set to play the local par 3 course with.

[jmkorting]

Very interesting post you made. Being a fellow high handicapper (20 handicapper here) and a tinkerer, I can understand wanting to find the best bag set up that helps you produce lower scores and make golf fun. I know for me personally golf can sometimes not be so fun when struggling to be what I would think is decent on the course. Not going out there and just hacking it around. To me that isn’t fun.

Many comments with great suggestions and I will probably duplicate a few with my responses below. But here are my 2 cents.Suggestions

1.     Gapping session – If you are willing to spend $50 on a round you should go to a local place that has a launch monitor and spend $50 and an hour or so and hit your clubs and understand what you actually hit them yardage wise. This will let you know where you have leaks in your bag, tell you what you are hitting each club, and if any clubs are going about the same distance. This is crucial I have found to helping to lower scores. Guess work on the course is just not wise and leads to trouble. Also go by carry distance not total distance.

2.     Lessons – Many have suggested this, and it is wise advice. Lessons are the 1st thing you can do to understand your swing and what faults you have. They also provide you help with fixing them. Now the question is are you the type of person who is going to benefit from lessons. What I mean by that is does your life allow you to practice, practice, practice. If you are a high handicapper, it may take awhile for you to break your bad habits and fix your swing. Are you dedicated enough to do this? Do you have the time to dedicate to doing this? Can you afford multiple lessons? Some people don’t have the dedication, time, or funds to go down the lesson route. So lessons are excellent, but ask yourself are you the type of person who will benefit from them.

3.     Course Management – This is the easiest way to start to drop your scores. Many golfers are seduced by hitting the ball as hard and as far as they can. Based on one’s skill level this can be good, but for many this is a bad idea. Understanding your clubs and the distances they go is key to this. See gapping session above. In understanding your clubs coupled with checking one’s ego on the course you can drop your scores quickly. Put yourself in positions in which you are hitting clubs that you know you can hit a certain number. Don’t go flag hunting on every hole. Keep it simple and put yourself in fairways and at distances in which you are hitting full shots on. Then either hit the center of the green (depending on pin position and what is around the green) or short of green in a spot you are chipping onto the green. Not half 7 irons or punch 8’s or what have you. Based on your skill level this is not advantageous for you. If you have a club, you know you can hit solidly every time and it goes a certain yardage each time then put yourself in spots that you are hitting this club. Again, back to understanding your yardages.

4.     Chipping and putting – This is the next spot I would say is best to work on. Work on this more than anything else. Becoming a good chipper and able to lag putt to within 5-6 feet or less will help to reduce your scores with the quickness. From experience I started to focus on this more over the last quarter of this past season and it was amazing how much lower my scores got. Reduced my triples and blow up holes by just putting myself in positions I was able to chip on to the green and lag putt to a close distance.

5.     Stick with club’s that work – As I write this, I find myself laughing as this is where my tinkering is a hindrance. Find clubs that work for the courses you play, if you don’t play links courses then don’t go getting clubs that are more suited for these types of courses. Stick with clubs that will help you with the courses you normally play. Once you find a bag set up that works for the courses you play at then stick to that set up. Don’t go tinkering just for the sake of tinkering. It can be costly and only lead you right back to where you started.

That is about all I have. Below is my bag set up. It is an odd bag to say the least, but it is what works for me and gives me confidence on the course. I also know my yardages for each of these clubs so I am able to pull a club and know what I will get out of it.

TM Original One Mini 11.5* (Upright setting) 43.5 inches

G410 SFT 3 wood 17* 42.5 inches

G410 SFT 7 wood 21* 41.5 inches

G410 SFT 9 wood 25* 40.5 inches

G410 5H 27.5* 39 inches

G410 6H 31* 38.5 inches

Callaway Big Berth 8H 35* 38 inches

Pinemeadow 9H 40* 37.5 inches

Pinemeadow PW 45* 37 inches

Cleveland Smart Sole 3C 42* 36 inches

Smithworks cast milled wedge 60* 35 inches

Odessey Stroke Labe 2ball Fang 3* loft 35 inches

 

[rkillian]

Definitely some repeated but good advice here. I plan on doing a lot of those things to improve. If I had to pay $50 a round I would almost never get out haha. I am lucky in that I can walk 9 at my local course on a weekday for under $15. It's by far nothing fancy and it's on the short side as I described but it works for me. Right now I can work on recommendations 5, 3, and 4 pretty much in that order haha. This winter it would great if I could get some time on a launch monitor for a gapping session.

[jmkorting]

@rkillian Those are what I am working on at the moment as well. I have a sure set chipping aid (for chipping), a putt out (for putting), and the planemate coming in January for my swing. Lessons planned after I get the planemate. Mainly to help me work with the it. I know I could do it on my own, but I am the type of person who needs to be held accountable and I think this will do that for me. As for my bag set up I am thinking is pretty much done. Being a tinkerer lead me down some unconventional roads, and unfortunately right back to the G410 hybrids and away from the big bertha's (a tinkering mistake I made). But, I will say my tinkering lead me to a golf shaft (Nventix Nunchuk) that works for me and my swing. It isn't for everyone mind you, but for my faults it works for me and has helped kill my slice drastically. I just need to get 2 more of their hybrid shafts and we are all set. Good luck in getting your bag set up and also with the work you are putting in this winter. Hopefully your weather if better then what is going on here in Michigan.

[MKPAPA]

Only thing I want to see in a Hi-Capper's bag are tasty brews.

[rkillian]

Little bit of an update. I played a soggy 9 holes the other day and tied my personal best of 42 on the front 9 of my local course. Made it 8 holes with 1 ball before slicing it into the water on number 9. Should have tee'd off with a hybrid or iron... Or just not tried to kill the ball but you live and learn. I used the set-up that I said I would go with here. Driver, 4 Hybrid 5-PW, 52, 56, Putter.

Some of my take-aways from the round:

I didn't put a lot of pressure on myself as the course was pretty wet and I didn't expect to score well. I should never tee off on 1 with a driver unless I have hit some range balls first. I should I tried to make sure I was much more aware of my lie and how that would effect my shot. I think that helped.Man I don't know why I left my 52 out of the bag. I was always thinking about it in terms of full swing yardage and how I rarely found myself needing it. But holy cow, it was a lot easier to hit partial shots from anything inside of 100 yards with than my 56. I didn't end up in the sand so for the first time I didn't use my 56 at all. Ego got in the way of my best score. If I didn't try to crush a drive off the 9th would have achieved my personal best. 9 has a pretty wide fairway and pretty forgiving rough. It can trick someone like me into really going after it when you don't have to. Even a shorter than average tee show with a hybrid would have meant a 7 or 8 iron into the green.Additional Update. Sold my hybrids and 3 wood. After trying a few more hybrids yesterday I settled on a used Rogue 4 hybrid with a stiff shaft. It worked out great on the launch monitor. So my bag is currently:

D - XR Speed 11*

4H - Rogue 21*

Irons are 5(24*) - PW(45*)

GW 52*

SW 56*

Putter

 

So I think for now I am all set. I will add a wood or maybe a hybrid that splits the gap between Driver and 4H at some point. And I may pick up a cheap and/or used 58 some time later. Some one on here had brought up the idea of using just a 54 as my only wedge and that doesn't sound too crazy to me either. But agian, for now everything is staying put. I will try to remember to come back to this with updates when I have them.

[platgof]

Sounds like your game is just fine. Congrats on the comeback. I just play for fun anymore. I don't get paid to play, so i try to enjoy it. I played with an older gentleman one day, and he was a player, sneaky good. He was always down the middle just short of me, then he would be on or near the green. When he chipped, it was always close enough for a one putt, he kicked my butt severely. If you slice the ball, your hands are ahead of the ball too much and leave the club face wide open. Let the club face have a chance to get into impact correctly. When someone tries to smash a drive, this is usually what happens.

[rkillian]

Thanks! Yeah I don’t do anything all that competitively anymore and certainly not golf haha. Though I suppose I’m competitive with myself in ways; always want to do something well. That older gentleman sounds kind of like a buddy of mine.

[rkillian]

Sort of refreshing my thread here with a semi-relevant update. So far the rouge 4 hybrid with a stiff flex shaft seems to be a good move for me. I haven’t gotten it out on the course as much as I’d like yet but the little I have and the little bit on the range has been good. The shorter length shaft compared to my old 3 hybrid is much easier to control as is the stiffer shaft for my swing speed is much better. A well struck shot seems to be going between 215-225 depending on roll at the range. My course has been very wet so the little I’ve hit it there has been 200-210. Either way, those are good numbers for me. Still currently in no hurry to fill the gap between my driver and hybrid but will try things out when I can. This includes 5 woods, 4 woods, and even maybe some higher lofted drivers, even though I already play mine adjusted up to 11 degrees. I’ve managed to figure out that on my home course, the smart play only requires a driver on 3 holes on the front and 5 on the back. Playing that way has helped me keep my last few scores low despite conditions.

May the bottom of the bag, my 52 wedge while on paper a large gap from my 45 degree pitching wedge is actually working out great since I put it back in the bag. I have found that it gets much more use and I am better with it than my 56 for anything inside 80 yards. A smooth swing with the 52 is currently going 115 and I can get 120 if I swing a bit harder (something I only have tried in the range). Still on the look out for a cheap/decent/used 58. Considering something like a sure-out style wedge even.

 

I am still having a hard time with my 5 iron so I think it’s coming out of the bag. A well struck shot between my 5 and 6 does not seem to have a large overall distance gap. And since I hit my 6 better than my 5 more often than not it probably averages the same distance. There is a 0.75” difference in shaft length and a 3 degree loft gap. There should probably be more of a distance gap than I’m getting. I’m thinking of having my 6 bent a degree strong to even the gap between 4H - 6i - 7i a bit more of I pull the 5i out. With my goal primarily be to go out there, have fun, and stay under 100 I don’t thing that puts me in a worse position. And honestly I think I’m a close to breaking 90 if I can just get through a round without a blow-up hole.