David’s Love Letter To Brandel....

[stingerfade]

It was Claude Harmon not Butch who commented. Before criticizing people’s comments please get your facts straight ??

[cougarthesecond]

So when Butch's son Claude, who coaches Brooks Koepka, calls Brandel an actor he is spouting tripe? And after coaching Brooks Koepka, Claude Harmon has to prove to you his teachings are real?

 

[sheldonjhacker]

Brandel is such a little man. And further proof that God made more horses asses...than horses.

[tacklingdummy]

Leadbetter is a great swing coach, but surprised he is threatened by Chamblee's idle statement. Chamblee just basically said that golf instruction is evolving with social media because there is so much content on the golf swing on social media. However, I do not believe that is a threat to golf instruction. Chamblee has played the tour for 15 years, PGA tour event winner, and won 4 million in earnings, so he is very capable of teaching the golf swing. Many, many pros and former pros teach. Chamblee can be controversial at times and I don't agree with him all the time, but I respect his opinion more than golf commentators that don't even really play the game.

[bladehunter]

Well. In the abstract. Yes. I’d expect any person defending any point to do so with real content , not name calling or dismissive nonsense. That goes for Brandels delivery too. Which I already said. Just because he’s crass doesn’t make his points automatically wrong. I’m simply saying that IF he’s wrong , it shouldn’t be hard for “ legends “ to rebut him. With content. If they can’t , his point is proven.

 

 

[stingerfade]

What would Claude’s stable look like if he wasn’t Butch’s son? That’s also a legit question, brandel might be on tv but he benefitted from his father handing him the cream of the crop to teach.

[scotee]

Does anyone teach this position? Bent L arm? Fully cupped L wrist?

[cougarthesecond]

Do you think Butch may have passed along something of value to his son besides his client list? Something of value desired by top players? A lifetime of knowledge about the golf swing?

[EricWGolf]

Brandel Chamblee is the human embodiment of clickbait. He’s the commentator’s version of an internet troll. He knows exactly what he is doing, and it works. If his Q Score drops a little too much, then criticize Tiger, or Rory’s fitness routine, or instructors. Rinse and repeat at regular intervals to keep the clicks coming.

 

Don’t feed the troll.

 

Or do. Who cares. It’s an internet message board and 2020 is a dumpster fire.

[dmac4g]

Brandel did what he is paid to do. He got eyeballs and clicks on the story. Yes, Brandel is a douche canoe, but he is very good at getting eyeballs to the network with his crazy rants.

I don’t like Brandel, I don’t watch Brandel, but that doesn’t mean he is not good at what he does.....which unfortunately is being a Carnival Barker for Golf Channel.

[MattyO1984]

Being a Tour player is not a qualification when it comes to teaching the swing. How many commentators do you know that don’t play the game?

[cougarthesecond]

EricW, dmac, MattyO...Posts of the Year!...thank you!

[tacklingdummy]

Majority of PGA tour players know a ton about the golf swing. They didn't get to be world class players by not knowing about all facets of the game. I can't think of a high level pro that hasn't done some sort of instructional about the golf swing, short game, or putting.

In the past there was a lot on the Golf Channel. Only of late have they started to get former PGA tour players as analysts instead. Now there is a still few on Golf Channel, but they have toned down their criticism of PGA players and just let the former PGA tour player analysts critique the players because they don't play the game at a high level and have the experience and knowledge of tour players. Also, there still is a ton of golf writers that don't play the game at a high level because they are paid to be good entertaining writers.

[GeorgeHWB]

To say that Brandel Chamblee is not qualified to criticize teaching pros is ridiculous.

 

Also, there's a reason the term "Lead Poisoning" was coined by people associated with the PGA and LPGA with respect to David Leadbetter. The man is not beyond reproach.

[stingerfade]

Look at Lydia Ko

[Forged4ever]

Another opinion on Brandel’s comments....

Chamblee Out of Bounds

Cheers?

RP

[Forged4ever]

You think that that opinion is ridiculous, you should see some of my other sh*t, lol???

 

Stay well and thanks for responding?

 

My Best,

RP

[cougarthesecond]

"By belittling swing instructors as a group, and by extension PGA teaching professionals and PGAs worldwide, Chamblee cut a perfect promo for two instruction books he has authored. And remember, the former PGA Tour player-turned-broadcaster is neither a swing coach nor an instructor."

[Ghost of Snead]

Look at Faldo, Price and Els.

[mosesgolf]

Remeber when Bramble pretty much accused Tiger Woods of cheating at the Masters? Brambutt crossed a line there. Heck he crosses too many lines. I personally turn the channel when he starts Brambling.

[stingerfade]

I think he lost his way with the A swing well after those guys but hey I’m no brandel ?

[bladehunter]

It’s kind of funny. Why is instruction above questioning ? It’s easy to see who the instructors are in this thread. They ignore points made , and continue the party line of “ Brandel is only a tour pro .... he has no idea on the swing “. Pretty weak sauce. Why not address the points made instead of attack the method of delivery for those points ?

[EricWGolf]

Instruction is not, and should not be, above questioning.

Over just the last few years, I’ve seen genuine debate about various teaching methods (consider, for example, The Golfing Machine or Stack and Tilt) and instructors (e.g., David Ledbetter w/ Ko and Wie.) However, that is not what Chamblee is doing. Chamblee - someone with no history, experience, students, or track record of any kind with actual instruction - is making blanket statements about an entire generation of teachers who have produced scores of the best players the game has ever seen . . . without a single shred of verifiable evidence. Just his opinion. Antecdotal evidence at best. And that’s why the comments about his background as only a tour pro are relevant.

 

To express opinions that should be seriously considered, a person should have some measure of proven expertise in a subject. (Producing several Tour level students would be one way of doing that.) Chamblee has not demonstrated that he has the necessary expertise for his opinions to be taken seriously.

 

[hurley999s]

I normally don’t pay much attention to BC so don’t have enough to have an opinion on him...but I can see why he gets a lot of heat.That said I took his original piece to be a dig at all the stuff that started popping up 10-20 years ago - X factor, hold the lag, set up with butt sticking way out, head down. And my interpretation is that many of the top 50 coaches he referenced were/do advocate many of these things, and now with things like Trackman, Boditrack, high speed cameras, Gears (and guys like AMG), that many of these old theories have been debunked and instead of reading a “tip” in Golf digest, now something gets put out there and can be supported/refuted pretty quickly online with evidence to back it up.

For me, I agree with this if that was the intent because I know the pros at my clubs learned from all of those X factor/hold the lag/stick your butt out teachers and that’s what they teach. I really like my pros and I’m not going to debate them or say they’re wrong because it’s not my profession and it is theirs, but I do know that current technology has shown all of those old methods to be flat out wrong, and I think really damaging to many people’s swings and preventing them from improving.

So overall I think the PGA is at a crossroads here when it comes to their approach to instruction and they need to really get on board with technology. Their approach reminds me of some outdated HR handbook or meeting template I’d come across at work.

Im not too familiar with the really big name guys like Butch and Leadbetter teach/taught, but I don’t think they’re the target of BC here. I see it as the next group of guys after them like Haney and Foley. (Caveat: I’m not a historian of instruction so I could be way off base with this example - just figuring Butch and DL have been teaching for a long time).

I see it like there were the “old school swings” - Snead, Hogan, Nicklaus - free flowing and rhythmic. Then the newer “restricted” swings starting about 20 years ago (incidentally when guys like Koepka were learning), and now there’s a move away from restricted back to a more fluid swing. Gankas himself has even said many of the things he teaches aren’t new, guys like Snead were doing it 60 years ago.

[MattyO1984]

Ha, you think that they write those pieces by themselves? Also they are not teaching people how to play the game, they are telling us how they play the game in those articles, what works for them. No wonder the average handicap has never changed over the years.

[bladehunter]

I just don’t get that. In what other arena does a person have to carry a certification to have an opinion or to point out the mountain of modern swing players plagued by the exact same injuries.

and by the by. A lot of modern swing coaches who are well respected carry zero certifications. And I’m one who is fine with that. Even though my favorite instructor is a pga master. A rarity.

I find the irony of that requirement hilarious in this Day of YouTube teaching stars.

[MattyO1984]

I completely agree that everyone is entitled to an opinion but the level of respect that opinion receives has to be based on something.

 

If it’s an opinion being delivered by someone like Butch’s boy, Leadbetter or Cameron McCormick on the golf swing, then I am going to respect and more likely agree with an opinion of theirs as opposed to Brandel. Yes, they have all been part of the game their entire lives it would seem but for the majority of that time, Brandel has spent that time either playing or sitting on his backside talking about it. Coaches and genuine coaches are out on the range, out on the course. I would not and do not completely dismiss Brandel but for me, when it comes to opinions on the swing and teaching the same, his opinions carry less weight.

 

Oh and just for certainty, the opinion of a YouTube teaching star is going to be as low. I’d rather listen to the guys on the Instruction Forum and not someone who wants to become YouTube famous.

[bladehunter]

Right. You can undervalue an opinion because of the sender no doubt. But. They aren’t undervaluing it. They are completely devaluing it. As in not meeting the claims head on. Just attacking the sender. That to me shows that he hit a very sensitive nerve. And therefore ups the value of that opinion.

[Ghost of Snead]

Jack - what exactly is the "modern swing" and who makes up this mountain of "modern swing" players with injuries ?

[tacklingdummy]

Golf instructors are doing the exact same. They are instructing students how they play the game and what they have learned about the golf swing through playing and practicing. Same difference.