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Are vintage iron shaft lengths shorter than modern lengths?


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Just got my first vintage iron set, Wilson Bullet Backs, 1969 model. I'm new to vintage...

I notice the iron lengths are clearly shorter than my modern iron lengths. They're about an inch shorter per club. Is that normal, or does my set just have shorter irons perhaps?

Thanks guys,

Hit em good

Driver: Ping G25

4w & 7w: Ping G25

23° Hybrid: Ping G25

5i - pw: Mizuno MP64

54° & 58°: Cleveland RTX 4 raw

Putter: The Wilson 8802 (vintage model)

Ball:  Titleist Pro V1x
Bag: Original Jones Golf Bag (green)

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Compare loft and length with loft and length, the difference is much smaller then.

For example; what's the length of the 32 degree loft (or closest) of your 1969 set and what's the length of the 32 degree loft of your modern set?

My guess is one might be a 5 iron and one might be a 7 iron and lengths will be pretty much the same.

It's not all about the score.

https://www.youtube.com/c/ClassicGolfClubs

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Hit em Good, congratulations on your bullet backs!

I agree 100% with Jiggered, you need to compare loft with loft and ignore the number on the sole.

If you do want to compare your set to the spec in 1969 then the 1970 catalogue in Kaplan gives the standard 7 iron length at between 36.25" and 36.75".

Please also note standard 7 iron loft was 39 Deg! That is probably a PW in today's sets!

Your 4 iron at 27 Deg is probably a closer comparison to a modern game improvement 7 iron both in loft and, as pointed out by Jiggered, in shaft length.

I am an inherent sceptic and personally believe manufacturers have simply swapped the numbers on the sole to convince people that "technology" is gaining them distance and so to sell that "technology".

Every set, vintage or modern, has a club for a set distance, the number is irrelevant. What technology can't reproduce is the feel of your bullet backs.

Enjoy!

 

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I agree with all of the posters here who are saying to compare lofts - we all know that lofts have been jacked up over time in a marketing effort to help manufacturers sell their irons on increased distance.That being said, YES I think that iron shafts have increased in length, and probably started doing so around the time that lofts started to get jacked up. I played Mizuno MX-23s for years. Got them in 2004 I think, which was likely before most manufacturers were really jacking lofts up.

I upgraded to Mizuno JPX 825 Pros in 2014. They were 1-2* stronger in loft (i.e. NOT a full club) and the shafts (I went from S300 to X100) were 1/2" longer.

So if the OP says that his 50-year-old clubs are a full inch shorter, I believe him.

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Titleist TSR3 10*: LA Golf Olyss 65S

Titleist TSi2 16.5*: Aldila Rogue Silver 125 70S

Titleist TSR3 19*:  LA Golf Ozik Black Tie 105S

Titleist TSi2 22*: Aldila Tour Blue 105TX

Grindworks PR-202 6-PW: Nippon Modus3 120X

Edel SMS 48*V / 60*T:  Nippon Modus 125 Wedge 

Grindworks Barrett 52* / 56*: Nippon Modus 125 Wedge 

Scotty Cameron 2014 Select Fastback

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I don't know when clubs moved longer than this, but in the 50s and early 60s, 5 irons were found at 37" long. There's some variation, of course, but it's generally the number I've seen. At some point, that migrated to the 37.5" 5 iron seen in the 70s, maybe late 70s?

The lofts are definitely weak. It's not definitive, but I've seen something in the past that suggested the late 60s Wilson Staffs were a 24* 3 iron to a 52* PW. The 2 iron was either 21* or 20*, with the 1 iron being 18* if the 2i was 21*, or 17* if the 2i was 20*. This same specs list I'd seen showed the SW at 58*. Of course, there's room to play.

I play my 1980 Golden Rams at 20-52 for 2-PW. Even for a guy accustomed to a 50* PW, it took a little adjustment, but loft is what's important. The number on the sole is just that, a number. If I hit my 32* club 175 yds, why should I feel good about it if it says "7" on the sole, but feel badly about it because it says "5" on the sole? Same damm club.

I did find it funny sometimes hitting a 6 iron on a shortish uphill par 3, when the wind was up. And I really got a laugh when I was playing golf league, and the look on the face of the guy who was shocked when I told him I'd hit 9 iron on the 123 yd par 3. LOL

Heck, if you bought some of Tad Moore's Hickory irons, you might find yourself playing a 36* 5 iron. LOL

The Ever Changing Bag!  A lot of mixing and matching
Driver: TM 300 Mini 11.5*, 43.5", Phenom NL 60X -or- Cobra SpeedZone, ProtoPype 80S, 43.5"

Fwy woods: King LTD 3/4, Rogue Black 75X -or- TM Stage 2 Tour 3w, NV105 X -or- TEE E8 Beta 12*, Rogue Silver 70X
Hybrid:  Cobra King Tec 2h, MMT 80 S -or- TEE CBX 17*, HZRDUS 85 6.0

2 iron:  Arias D-23, Modus3 120 S; Mizuno MP-20 HMB, NS Pro 950 R

Irons grab bag:  1-PW Golden Ram TW276, NV105 S; 1-PW Golden Ram TW282, RIP Tour 115 R; 2-PW Golden Ram Vibration Matched, NS Pro 950WF S; testing: Arias D-23 5i w/Modus 120 S
Wedges:  Dynacraft Dual Millled 52*, SteelFiber i125 S -or- Scratch 8620 DD 53*, SteelFiber i125 S; Cobra Snakebite 56* -or- Wilson Staff PMP 58*, Dynamic S -or- Ram TW282 SW -or- Ram TW276 SW
Putter:  Snake Eyes Viper Tour Sv1, 34" -or- Cleveland Huntington Beach #1, 34.5" -or- Golden Ram TW Custom, 34" -or- Rife Bimini, 34" -or- Maxfli TM-2, 35"
Balls: Chrome Soft, Kirkland Signature 3pc (v3), Wilson Triad

Grip preference: various GripMaster leather options or Star Grip Sidewinders of assorted colors

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The Bullet Backs ranged from a 21 degree 2 Iron through a 51 degree PW (Source: Kaplan Book 1970 catalog page).

Lengths were 38.5 or 39 on the 2 iron through 35.25 or 35.75 on the PW. Apparently both lengths were readily available as "standard."

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"You think we play the same stuff you do?"

                                             --Rory McIlroy 

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Thanks for chiming in, Shallow. I thought about tagging you, but didn't want to bother you.

The Ever Changing Bag!  A lot of mixing and matching
Driver: TM 300 Mini 11.5*, 43.5", Phenom NL 60X -or- Cobra SpeedZone, ProtoPype 80S, 43.5"

Fwy woods: King LTD 3/4, Rogue Black 75X -or- TM Stage 2 Tour 3w, NV105 X -or- TEE E8 Beta 12*, Rogue Silver 70X
Hybrid:  Cobra King Tec 2h, MMT 80 S -or- TEE CBX 17*, HZRDUS 85 6.0

2 iron:  Arias D-23, Modus3 120 S; Mizuno MP-20 HMB, NS Pro 950 R

Irons grab bag:  1-PW Golden Ram TW276, NV105 S; 1-PW Golden Ram TW282, RIP Tour 115 R; 2-PW Golden Ram Vibration Matched, NS Pro 950WF S; testing: Arias D-23 5i w/Modus 120 S
Wedges:  Dynacraft Dual Millled 52*, SteelFiber i125 S -or- Scratch 8620 DD 53*, SteelFiber i125 S; Cobra Snakebite 56* -or- Wilson Staff PMP 58*, Dynamic S -or- Ram TW282 SW -or- Ram TW276 SW
Putter:  Snake Eyes Viper Tour Sv1, 34" -or- Cleveland Huntington Beach #1, 34.5" -or- Golden Ram TW Custom, 34" -or- Rife Bimini, 34" -or- Maxfli TM-2, 35"
Balls: Chrome Soft, Kirkland Signature 3pc (v3), Wilson Triad

Grip preference: various GripMaster leather options or Star Grip Sidewinders of assorted colors

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OP here,

Thanks for all the insight on this, fellas. You guys are super helpful.

Our driving range opened back up today, so I'm going to take the vintage set and hit them for the first time. Looking forward to it!!!

Hit em good

Driver: Ping G25

4w & 7w: Ping G25

23° Hybrid: Ping G25

5i - pw: Mizuno MP64

54° & 58°: Cleveland RTX 4 raw

Putter: The Wilson 8802 (vintage model)

Ball:  Titleist Pro V1x
Bag: Original Jones Golf Bag (green)

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  • 2 weeks later...

Clubs changed radically after WWII. driver brassie spoon cleek was the standard set until the 60'sq. Tour pros and most amateurs played flat back blades. Swing weight arrived in the late 40's. When the Hawk broke his MacGregor driver, he used his brassie off the tee for almost a year. I can't remember any pro who used a driver longer than 44 inches.

MacGregor specs for 1961 Toney Pemna TP 1W shaft propel1 rosewood finish

woods length loft lie d3 swingweight must predominate

driver 43 10 53 face large black fibre aluminum center pin 11/16 on driver,1/2

brassie 423/4 13 53 7 scoring lines on driver spaced to face design

spoon 42 151/2 54 5 scoring lines on fairway woods

cleek 411/2 181/2 541/2 whipping 23/4" pitched linen twine

grip black fineline 10" with gold fill 4 aluminum face screws

Irons MT1 381/2 2 iron FC4000 ceramic face heavy shot blast spray epoxy scoring diamond border lines fill red propel 1 shaft .355 tip grip fineline101/2 d3 swingweight must predominate

CHARLEY PENNA

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