Ping G400 driver issues - big slices

[1Mordrid1]

You are getting a lot of bend in your lead arm on your takeaway, which has you bringing the club more vertical at the end of your back-swing creating an over-the-top move. That is causing an out-to-in swing path that is cutting across the ball and putting a lot of spin on it.

I would rehearse taking the club back low and wide while keeping the elbow on your lead arm a lot "less active". A slight bend is OK, but the more you allow that elbow to bend, the more likely you will be out of position when you start your downswing. Not only that, the timing of getting your elbow back to the right position right at impact would be very difficult. And if your elbow is not back into position at impact, then the face of the club is likely to be wide open at impact.

Try rehearsing and swinging with that lead arm a lot straighter. Try it with the face square at address at first. Because quite often, people that close the face of the club at address will compensate unintentionally, and try to swing along the face angle, creating another out-to-in swing flaw.

 

[bbarnard52]

I noticed that too. I didn't think I was bending it that much. So I was already planning on working on that in front of a mirror. So thanks for that suggestion.

I feel like I'm also letting my left knee bend too much as well.

[bbarnard52]

I'm going to work on some swing issues first but I may also do a shaft switch as well.

[596]

Here's a pic of my driver and 7 wood. They both swing just like the SFT models. I've had the driver like that for over 2 years. The 7 wood was added about 6 months ago. So I've hit them a lot with the lead tape . They work!

[Valtiel]

That is definitely a good idea. Thanks for posting the video btw, most people don't ever get that far in these threads, hah.

There is definitely a lot to work on there, but your saving grace is that you're pretty smooth and quiet with your lower body. If you were firing hard with the hips/legs from that way over extended, over the top position then it would be an nightmare. You my want to go from one extreme to the other to help find the middle ground you want by rehearsing a backswing that feels like it has no wrist hinge at all. As it stands right now, you're completely arms/hands/wrist driven and that is going to sap your power and consistency. If you felt like your left arm wasn't bending much when it is actually bending almost 90* then you're going to have to suffer through a lot of things that "feel wrong" since it seems like your sense is pretty off (no offense). I HIGHLY recommend starting very very slow to work out of this as attempting anything at full speed right away is likely going to get frustrating. One drill that I like is taking full swings where you feel like your hands/wrists literally do nothing. When you're properly coiling and uncoiling your body as the primary source of power, your hands and arms will largely be "along for the ride" so to speak instead of being in the driver seat.

Whatever you end up doing, the most important thing is that you sort out your transition and downswing. The below image highlights where the biggest problem is. The red line represents the shaft plane of your driver at address, you SHOULD be coming down on a similar angle and at or a little above the plane itself....but

You're miles over the top of it and incredibly steep. This is probably the most common "bad" position in golf, and it is slice city. For visual comparison, here is Rory in the same position on his downswing with the same line drawn where his driver shaft was at address.

Nothing much to add there! Perfection. This is what to strive for.

[bbarnard52]

No offense taken. Thanks for the pointers. I have been working in front of a mirror on keeping my left arm straight (almost locked but not quite), with wrists quieter and takeaway lower and more controlled by rotation than arms.

It rained today so no chance to go try it out.

If I understood what you were trying to say I should keep the wrists quiet and use the shoulder/torso rotation to strike the ball and leave the wrists/hands out of it for now?

[erock9174]

Front arm breaking down was the first thing I noticed in your swing video.

it can be tough to keep it Totally straight at the very top. But on the takeaway that’s an easy fix.

[erock9174]

Have you ever tried the towel drill ? Placing a towel under your right armpit and taking a swing. If it falls out at the top of your swing your coming over the top. Keep it there and that’s the sensation of saying connected with your arms and will allow you to come inside out to the ball.

 

 

[bbarnard52]

Nope, will try it.

[Valtiel]

That is kind of the idea, but more about the hips/lower body than the chest/torso, at least with regards to the downswing.

The basic idea is this; the lower body should start the downswing transition, but most golfers underutilize their lower body and rely too heavily on the hands and arms, which are both less powerful and less consistent. Your lower body is very quiet, which is not a bad thing, but it is being used a secondary source of power when it should be the primary source. You're trying to make up for this by folding your left arm and letting your right elbow fly in to the air to get the club in that exaggerated across the line top position while having a fairly shallow shoulder turn. The torso/shoulders should be the primary driving force in the backswing and the hips and lower body the primary source in the down swing, but you are using your hands and arms for both.

By keeping your hands and arms quiet, you will be forced to rotate your shoulders and torso more to get the club to the top. Now you may be limited by flexibility here which could shorten your swing, but don't mistake short for "weak". You're already utilizing the weaker set of body parts for most of your swing, so even if your entire motion changed to something much shorter and compact, you would still likely gain power by utilizing the big muscles more.

Now you're obviously a bit older, so there will be some limiting physical factors here, but working towards keeping your hands and arms quiet and connected more to your chest rotation and then leading the downswing with your lower body turning as opposed to throwing your hands down from the top will at WORST get you on a better plane and increase your consistency.

[bbarnard52]

Yes, I understand. In practicing in front of the mirror, I already see a limit on my back swing due to limits on my rotation. With the swing in the videos I can see the club head in my peripheral vision because of the arm fold getting the club so far back.

The two things I'm trying to work on are straighter left arm and taking the club head back lower. When I go out tomorrow, I plan to try and hit the ball by just uncoiling and letting the club come back around.

I understand what you are saying about the larger muscles because I was a pretty fair tennis player in my day and shoulder turn and rotation was important for that as well.

Again, thanks for the advice and help.

[bbarnard52]

A bit of redux on this. I made some swing path changes and have been able to straighten things out enough to go back to the G400 Max from the SFT. In the meantime, I had an opportunity to go by Edwin Watts and try out the Titleist TS3. They ended up modifying the TS3 for a bit more draw bias, the Tensei Blue stock shaft and put the swing weight up to D6. With that setup I generally hit the ball pretty straight. In addition, I also felt I could work the ball a bit more and generally got better feedback on when I pushed it or created a bit of a small hook. I did not buy the TS3 (yet), but did resolve to order some additional weights for the Ping to see if increasing the swing weights helped.

In addition, because I had some shaft issues with the G400 Max (tip separation), I ended up playing my R9 again. The difference was frankly amazing. From the moment I hit it, I was hitting it straighter than I ever had with either Ping. I of course didn't have quite the distance with the R9 but being in the fairway and feeling confident I could hit it straight was a good feeling.

The weights for the Ping came yesterday and the replacement shaft is due Monday so we'll see how it goes. I'm a bit torn at this point, so any thoughts from those here would be welcome.

[kthomas]

I have days where my ball striking with pretty much every club is amazing, nice straight and high ball flight, but then I go to the driver and it's slice city.

It's 100% caused by swing mechanics. There's no driver that's going to cure a big slice, and the Ping G400 max is one of the most forgiving drivers out there.

If I have a day where I'm slicing it good, it's usually caused by a couple of things. One is overswing and/or sped up tempo, or playing it too far off my front foot. It generally happens when I'm not warmed up enough. By changing those few things, I can get my slice under control. If not, the 3 wood comes out of the bag.

You can swing every club damn near perfectly but the driver. Happens to me as well. That ~$500-600 you would spend on a new driver would be much better spent on lessons.

[PhilsFanDrew]

I just think you need to stop tinkering with equipment and just focus on improving your path and club face. Save the money and use it for the range, course, and a lesson or two. I think you are going to be much closer to finding your fix doing that than you will experimenting like a mad scientist with hardware.

[Tiptx1122]

If you like your TM R9 460 but lacked the distance why not try the new SIM or SIM MAX. Just saying as I heard nothing but positive things about the PING G400

[bbarnard52]

I may just do that. I too had heard nothing but positive things about the G400 which is why I went with it. I think some of the issue may be either the swing weight (the R9 is D4 while the Ping is D3), the shaft torque (the shaft in the R9 is around 3.5 while the Ping is between 4-5), or the shape of the face. The R9 is more traditional shape, as is the TS3. The Ping is more elongated heel to toe. I played the R9 again yesterday and only had one bad drive and that was a pulled hook not a slice. In two rounds I've only had 2 bad slices with the R9.

I even hit two shots on the range with my wife's Callaway XR Speed driver with a 4.5 HZRDUS shaft but traditional shaped head and they both went straight.

[SwingMan]

Face is probably open at impact.

Try closing the face as you're almost at the top by having the palm of your trail hand like it's holding a tray.

Or it could be a weak grip.