What are the Cons for a Low Bounce, Wide Sole Wedge

[ThinkingPlus]

One comment I have heard is less versatile, but I am not exactly sure what that means. Presumably some types of shots are more difficult/impossible. Maybe the wedge doesn't work well for some turf/sand conditions? Are full shots more or less difficult? I guess I have have never seen the full rundown of shortcomings. As always I appreciate your responses. Thanks.

[DFS PFD]

Only thing that immediately stands out to me would be, with low bounce and wide sole any digging or "chunked" shots would be exacerbated by the greater resistance to move through the turf given the larger surface area. I may be wrong about that, but that seems to me why low bounce options typically have thinner soles for less resistance once entering the turf.

[hammergolf]

There are no cons. Wide sole/low bounce is the best of both worlds. The wide sole protects the wedge from from digging, and the low bounce makes it useful on a variety of lies. In my opinoin there are not enough wedges with low bounce/wide sole options. With a wider sole the "effective" bounce is higher because of its resistance to digging. I had a MacGregor MT dw 60 forged wedge with a wide sole, 8 degrees of bounce, and a heel/toe grind that was AMAZING. I wore it out and have not been able to find another one.

[Valtiel]

The biggest downside to that type of wedge and the thing that usually receives the "less versatile" label is that the leading edge gets up off the ground very quickly once you start to manipulate face angle. "Versatility" can be a vague buzzword but it usually refers to your ability to manipulate the club head to perform different shots, and a wide sole with its high "effective" bounce gets extremely high very quickly when you do this. Great for soft bunkers, bad for any tighter conditions. Those tight, harder conditions are where the trouble can lie in general as well if you are a steeper swinger. The wide sole will want to skip off a firmer surface much more than a narrow one, which is fine if you're pretty shallow, but someone with a steeper swing would likely find that troublesome.

Wide soles are excellent in softer conditions though, bunker or grass, and generally can benefit a wide range of player there. I personally love the the wide sole/low bounce combo but I still wouldn't use it in baked conditions or hard bunkers.

[danstanford]

Funny, I have had much better luck with higher bounce and a narrower sole despite the fact that the wider sole looks so inviting to me. I think the wider sole can only have so much bounce angle or it will be unusable which is why low bounce and wide sole go together IMO.

[ThinkingPlus]

Having the leading edge raise quickly as the face is opened would be a big.downside for sure. Presumably there aren't grind options to mitigate that effect in wide sole wedges like is done with narrower sole wedges.

[Dinosaur]

Coincidentally, I have been looking into these types of wedges and the one that stands out (to me) is Cleveland Smart Sole S and C. These are considered by many as one trick ponies that are not conducive to shots around the green that require opening the face, change in stance e.t.c. in that they are designed to get the ball up quickly and easily by swinging straight through. Most of the time I am able to pull off these "delicate" shots with varying degree of skill. (not always of course).

I have another motive however. With my upcoming purchase of the new Hogan Icon irons 4-PW, I have to give up a couple of clubs to make room. My thought is that by having only one utility club ergo the Cleveland Wedge, I will have everything I need. The only drawback might be, I would no longer have an "A" wedge which I have found myself frequently using. Or, I could retain the 52 deg "A" wedge and remove a hybrid and hoping that the newly acquired 4 iron would take its place. We shall see.

 

[Valtiel]

Not as often/commonly, no. I had Joe Kwok add a little heel relief to my low bounce K-grind though for this reason.

Its tricky though, once you start smoothing off edges like that in the name of versatility you begin to lose, in this case, little bits of that automatic bunker performance. That back edge, especially on the heel, is what makes wedges like this so easy out of soft sand. Just open up the face and thump it almost anywhere behind the ball at a halfway decent angle and that ball is getting up and out effortlessly. Start taking away that edge though and what you gain in versatility around the greens, you lose in that forgiveness in the sand since the effective bounce has decreased in that area. That is why there are so many grind options and variations to choose from.

[ThinkingPlus]

Makes sense.

[ChipNRun]

@Valtiel captures the basic situation: "The biggest downside to that type of wedge and the thing that usually receives the "less versatile" label is that the leading edge gets up off the ground very quickly once you start to manipulate face angle."
For a player who prefers basic square-face shots, a wide sole wedge will work fine. My 54*/12 SW is wide sole - but not low bounce. I use it for bunker shots and a variety of distances. I can open it up or close it down a couple of degrees, but it's not one I use for creative shots. Many specialty wedge makers (wedges not part of an iron set) offer a Standard sole for PW and GW, and get into more varied sole/bounce offerings in SW and LW.
I have 48* wedge with a Standard sole. Also, I have a 58*/8 with a C-grind... lots of heel and toe relief. If I need creative shot, this is the one I use.
I will end with long-term advice from club designer Ralph Maltby: Find your ideal bounce and grind, and go the other way on at least one wedge. If you have mainly high bounce wedges, get one that has lower bounce to gain some versatility.Note: this is Ralph who started GolfWorks... not Roger who announces on TV.
And... get fitted for wedges especially. If the demo days open up, get there early and hit different bounce wedges to see what it's all about.

[auggiewest]

56 W Grind and 60 C grind allows versatility for me.

[Kaiser00]

I was comparing my 56 low bounce 8 Deg vs my 56 12 Deg bounce and found the low bounce wedge better in the flattened down rough which you sometimes get around some greens.

[golfing_penguin]

Home-made Nike toe-swoop. That looks absolutely awesome that does

[the bishop]

As a fellow south Texan I can't see a combination like that working out too well here. What Valtiel mentioned about ease of bunker play is logical and if that's all you wanted it for I guess that would be fine. But chipping off the bermuda surrounds in the green complexes would be problematic, IMO. Closely mown bermuda is as unforgiving as it gets. You can chip effectively off of it but you absolutely have to know where the bottom is and it's where the bounce of the club shows its worth. Lowering the bounce and effectively moving the "bottom" closer to the leading edge takes situations where the margin of error is already slim and all but eliminates it.

[ThinkingPlus]

Interesting. I seem to be just the opposite. I went much lower in bounce once I moved to this area. The low bounce makes full shots from the firm turf/hard pan doable. Around the greens I generally don't bother trying to use much bounce unless I get a fluffy bermuda lie where the ball sits down a bit. I could not get any slide using the bounce for the into grain tight lie shots with even 10 - 12 degrees of bounce. It just peeled up the bermuda and stopped the club.

[Valtiel]

Similar, yeah! Although much less extreme overall.

[Ray Jackson]

I've just moved to Texas (close to Dallas) and I am having trouble with my low bounce 60* MG wedge off the hard fairway, everything coming out low and hot, and then its useless in the Bermuda, everything coming out low and soft.

Think i'm going to have to go 12* bounce or more in my high loft wedge and then get better with partial shots off the fairway with my 55*.

The 60* is a waste of time in the fine dry sand as well.

[teedub21]

I have a Ping Glide 2.0 56 degree ES with 8 degrees of bounce. Every time I put a different wedge in my bag the Ping knocks it back out. For my game it is such an easy wedge to hit. It has a decently wide sole with lowish bounce.

[b.mattay]

Hard to open the face much off tight-ish lies

[BiggErn]

Off tight-ish lies opening the face shouldn’t be a first resort. A good ball striker can hit any wedge with any sole/grind from virtually any lie. The ATV grinds are the best of all worlds. Even some of the “dummy” wedges offer a lot of versatility. Seems many in this thread are forming opinions based on the opposite of what reality is.

[b.mattay]

Not really, I can hit flop shots off the putting green with a high bounce, narrow sole wedge. If you open up a K grind/Callaway W-Grind etc. all the way off that lie, the leading edge is in the equator of the ball. Not saying that is a shot that comes up a lot, just making a point about geometry.

[Buzzkill]

Just got a Cobra 60, 4 degree wide low for winter play here. Used it first time today and it requires solid chipping skills for sure!

[LCP]

I love my Ping Wide Sole 60 with the Lob Combo Grind. It's not exactly low bounce, but it's a wide sole high bounce wedge that's been ground down some and with heel and toe relief, as well as more leading edge relief. The drawback is open face more than about 5 degrees still needs quite a bit of fluff under the ball to make sure the edge still gets under the ball. Even delofting it and playing the ball back on tight lies that wide sole still helps with contact. Think about how the wide sole of a hybrid works so much better in the wet than no sole of a long iron.