Ball mark in front of ball off the green

[denkea]

I think I know the answer but can't find the rule.

If I hit a shot that falls short of the green by a few yards but is very puttable and there is a ball mark directly in front of my ball I know I cannot fix the ball mark. But what if the ball mark is made by another of your playing group after your ball comes to rest. Can that one be fixed?

I believe it can be.

[davep043]

8.1d(1)/1 – Examples Where Player Is Allowed to Restore Conditions Altered by the Actions of Another Person or Outside Influence

Examples of when restoration is allowed include when:

A player’s line of play is worsened by a pitch-mark in the general area that was made by a ball played by someone else after the player’s ball came to rest.

[2bGood]

Yes it can. You are entitled to the lie you had when your ball landed. A pitch mark that occurs after your ball comes to rest can be fixed. The most common example is a player hitting after you making a ball mark in your line.

[Newby]

Yes. Rule 8.1d

[jacob7071]

I have a similar question - just curious. Say my shot creates a pitch mark on the fringe, then my opponent/FC hits his shot to the fringe. Can I fix the pitch mark if it's not on my line?

[davep043]

Fix your own pitch mark to improve/alter the other guy's line of play?

[jacob7071]

Yes - if he wants it of course. I wouldn't alter his line against his wishes. My thought is, if I don't fix it for they guy in my group, why fix it at all? Seems arbitrary to let the guys behind me have a smooth surface but not the guys in my own group.

[rogolf]

If you repair it when he requests it, he would get the penalty just as if he did it himself. If you go to repair it without him asking, he should stop you from doing it.

[davep043]

 

You should check Rule 8.3. Essentially you are not allowed to alter conditions that could affect another players ball or next stroke. But in caring for the course, you SHOULD repair the mark once it no longer has any effect on the other player.

The general rule is that you play the course as you find it. That pitch mark was there when the other player hit his shot, so it remains un-repaired while he plays. But it is always a good thing to take care of the golf course, when allowed by the Rules.

 

[antip]

If you are fixing it only because you wish to help that player in your group, you get the general penalty. If you ask him if he wants it fixed and he agrees and you do it, you both get the general penalty. This is Rule 8.3.

If you are fixing it because you wish to care for the course and to help that other player, there is no penalty. This is the Rule 8.3 Exception.

[jacob7071]

My reasoning for fixing it would be to care for the course. The reason for fixing it before he plays is, if the guys playing behind me get a smooth surface, why can't the guys playing with me get that same surface? Seemed arbitrary to me for this one guy to have to deal with a bump I created. But Davep's explanation makes sense too. And it's good to know, if he asks me to fix it, I should probably wait until after he's played.

[davep043]

This is probably analogous to replacing a divot, or filling the hole with sand. You do that to care for the course, and to minimize the chance of that divot hole affecting the players behind you, yet you aren't allowed to repair it for the purpose of "helping" a player in your group.

[denkea]

Thanks guys. Appreciate the direction to the correct rule

[2bGood]

On this topic my understanding is if someone in your group creates a ball mark off the green after your ball had comes to rest you also get to fix that.

[antip]

yet you aren't allowed to repair it for the purpose of "helping" a player in your group.

The current rule is more nuanced than that. This statement is correct if your only reason to repair is to help a player in your group. If you have the additional objective of caring for the course, you are permitted to repair it.

I am not expressing any opinion here on what anyone 'should' do or what I think the rule 'should' say, I'm noting what the Rule 8.3 says. It is an issue that confuses many, it is an issue many think should not be there, but it is what it is.

[antip]

Yes, Rule 8.1d(1).

[Newby]

Try post #4