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Tipping shafts makes them play how much stiffer?


pierso2

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Exactly what the title says...if a driver shaft is tipped .5" how much stiffer would it play? Say 1 inch or 2 inches? I'm hoping to take a stiff shaft and make it a Stiff+ since my swing speed is between stiff and extra stiff.

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Shafts can differ a bit, jump, or stay flat sometimes when tipping...so a lot of times it just depends on the shaft. Some may not change at all for the first 1/2", some may jump.

A general rule of thumb is about 1/8" to 1 CPM.

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As already mentioned it can vary a lot based on both the original bend profile of the shaft and a persons swing characteristics, but a common over generalized rule of thumb that is used is 1/2" of tipping is about 1/3rd of a flex. However, that's not really all that accurate since tipping really only predominantly impacts the tip stiffness of the shaft and doesn't really impact the stiffness over the full bend profile like a true flex change would.

The reality is that the first 1/2" of tipping is rarely even noticeable from the standpoint of a change in feel. If you are looking for a particular feel from the shaft, trial and error will be the only way to find it. You might start with 3/4" or possibly even a full inch depending on how "soft" it feels to you untipped.

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Related to this, what has more impact on the spin rate? Choosing a stiffer flex or tipping the softer shaft? I know that results are different for different players regarding transition, tempo and when they release. But regarding most driver shafts parallel section is 3 inches, could it have more impact on spin tipping a stiff shaft, lets say 1,5" than choosing the same shaft (in the same weight) in x-stiff untipped? What would be the difference feel wise, could i get a softer playing shaft with less spin? Or is it not possible to compare?

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It's an interesting question. It is hard to generalize as an increase in flex does not necessarily mean a uniform increase in stiffness over the whole bend profile and also how much even the tip sections can increase with a change in flex can vary quite a bit between different shafts. However in most cases, I would expect going up in flex to have more impact for those players with the applicable swing characteristics. The tip section might be a bit more dominant in the influence but the entire shaft does contribute to the effect and I'm not sure if even 1.5" of tipping would get the tip section close to a tip section of the next higher flex - but could be wrong about that. Shafts are now available in such a wide range and variations of bend profiles, the need to tip a shaft to find a good fit is not nearly what it used to be and not as much hard core data has been collected (that I'm aware of) on the exact influence of tipping has on the bend profile.

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[quote name='Stuart G.' timestamp='1424778938' post='11016747']
It's an interesting question. It is hard to generalize as an increase in flex does not necessarily mean a uniform increase in stiffness over the whole bend profile and also how much even the tip sections can increase with a change in flex can vary quite a bit between different shafts. However in most cases, I would expect going up in flex to have more impact for those players with the applicable swing characteristics. The tip section might be a bit more dominant in the influence but the entire shaft does contribute to the effect and I'm not sure if even 1.5" of tipping would get the tip section close to a tip section of the next higher flex - but could be wrong about that. Shafts are now available in such a wide range and variations of bend profiles, the need to tip a shaft to find a good fit is not nearly what it used to be and not as much hard core data has been collected (that I'm aware of) on the exact influence of tipping has on the bend profile.
[/quote]

The reason I ask is because a buddy of mine has an elements chrome that he had installed in his 3 wood that he said he doesn't like. I was informed that it was tipped 1.25" and I'm wondering if that would be more of an X or a S+ when changed into a driver shaft. I know I'll need to extend it to get a driver length but I thought that because it was a stiff to start that tipping the shaft 1.25" would make it S+ but now I'm thinking it would turn more into X even after it is extended. UST's website says to tip it for a 3 wood you only need to remove 1". So it seems to me that right now it plays around an S+ in a 3 wood length. But if I brought it to a driver length, what area would it be in then?

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Adams MB2 GW
Callaway Mac Daddy Forged 60
Toulon Garage Atlanta Black Pearl
Ping 4 Series Tour Edition White/ Bridgestone 2014 Tour Bag

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Taylormade 2016 M1 10.5 Whiteboard Flowerband 7x
16 Taylormade M1 5 wood AD-TP 7s
Ping Anser 20 stock stiff
Taylormade 2016 M2 Tour XP105 stiff
Cleveland RTX 2.0 52 deg raw
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For the 3wd, that extra 1/4" is actually fairly trivial. However, the problem is that your thinking of flex as a 1 dimensional quantity and it really isn't. You can't really equate a change to just the tip section to an increase in stiffness throughout the entire length of the shaft (which is about what a change in flex is). What you have is a shaft where most of it is still really still a stiff and only a part has been made more stiff. How this translated to feel is going to be dependent on your swing and your particular sensitivities to the loading/unloading of the shaft. For most who have a sensitivity to the feel it will certainly feel different than either a stiff or an x-stiff but some people will try it and say it still feels more like a stiff than an x-stiff, others may find it feels more like an x-stiff and others will say it feels like a completely different shaft and not close to either.

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You have to take into account the OEM trimming specs as well. Example, I play a good amount of OBAN shafts and usually tip them 1-1.5". I personally notice no difference in flex, only ball flight. I trim all my fairways 1.5" (Drivers 1" and Hybrids 1") and it brings the ball flight down for me to what I want. Per their instructions:

Standard Performance: 0"
Stiffer Performance: .5"
Tour Performance: 1.0"
Max Tipping: 2.7"

So as you can see, me trimming 1.5" isn't much compared to the 2.7" max.

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[quote name='Stuart G.' timestamp='1424791364' post='11017599']
For the 3wd, that extra 1/4" is actually fairly trivial. However, the problem is that your thinking of flex as a 1 dimensional quantity and it really isn't. You can't really equate a change to just the tip section to an increase in stiffness throughout the entire length of the shaft (which is about what a change in flex is). What you have is a shaft where most of it is still really still a stiff and only a part has been made more stiff. How this translated to feel is going to be dependent on your swing and your particular sensitivities to the loading/unloading of the shaft. For most who have a sensitivity to the feel it will certainly feel different than either a stiff or an x-stiff but some people will try it and say it still feels more like a stiff than an x-stiff, others may find it feels more like an x-stiff and others will say it feels like a completely different shaft and not close to either.
[/quote]

So it'll be a lower launching stiff is what you're saying? Making it more of a low flight as opposed to the original mid-flight that it started as?

Option 1
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Callaway Big Bertha 816 Alpha 16 AD-DI 8x black
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Adams MB2 GW
Callaway Mac Daddy Forged 60
Toulon Garage Atlanta Black Pearl
Ping 4 Series Tour Edition White/ Bridgestone 2014 Tour Bag

Option 2
Taylormade 2016 M1 10.5 Whiteboard Flowerband 7x
16 Taylormade M1 5 wood AD-TP 7s
Ping Anser 20 stock stiff
Taylormade 2016 M2 Tour XP105 stiff
Cleveland RTX 2.0 52 deg raw
Titleist Vokey Prototype 58 T Grind
Carbon Ringo Raw Whisky

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Yes. Still mostly a stiff with a very slight increase in tip stiffness. For a half inch tipping, It might lower the flight a little if you have a late enough release and fast enough swing speed. Might show up on an LM but not sure it would generally be enough to notice visually for most players.

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  • 5 years later...

I want to take a reg flex driver shaft and turn it into a stiff plus 4 wood shaft. Would an 1.5 suffice or at least get me close. The shaft is a great shaft but seeing it is a reg flex I have no use for it as I hit x stiff but don’t mind going to a stiffer stiff flex in my fairway wood. Any thoughtS????

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No that cant be done, we cant make a R flex to become as stiff as its S flex brother of the same model, thats only possible on shafts made as MULTIFLEX and they are marked R/S and have a very long tip section. IF we use butt CPM as measurement, we count 10 CPM as 1 full flex, and most graphite shafts only respond with 1 CPM for each 2/8" of tip trim, so 1.5" tip trim is about half a flex only, but we alter the profile and feel and we might end up with a very different animal all depending on that shafts EI profile.

So that R flex can be R+ as the most, so if the model is known for you, start from S of use a different shaft.

Its NO standards for how strong R or S flex is, thats not what those letters is telling us, they can only be used for compare within its own model and weight series.

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Okay, confused a bit. Read above and club builders saying it wont make it play stiffer, only change ball flight.
And, that's awesome for you guys chiming in! Would love to understand better why it does affect flex, or 10 CPM. Is it because of how your company designs shafts, or is this true of most OEMs? Thanks!

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On 8/11/2020 at 6:19 PM, Trying4Better said:

Okay, confused a bit. Read above and club builders saying it wont make it play stiffer, only change ball flight.
And, that's awesome for you guys chiming in! Would love to understand better why it does affect flex, or 10 CPM. Is it because of how your company designs shafts, or is this true of most OEMs? Thanks!

it does not sound right, so i would love to here the explanation too.

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To understand butt CPM judgement, we have 3 scenarios to be made
Scenario 1 - Tip trimming vs butt trimming 1.0 inch
Scenario 2 - The above compared to flex charts like RIFLE FCM or Kaufman L.A.R.S.X
Scenario 3 - Tip trim 1.0” on a S flex vs butt trim 1.0” on a X flex of the same model

SCENARIO 1
A player has a 46.00” uncut shaft and lets for the sake of example say it measure 250 CPM with a 205 grams weight and a 5.0” clamp. The player intends to cut the shaft 1.0” inch shorter and he got 2 options. The first option is 1.0” from the butt, the second option is 1.0” from the tip. The question is. How large will the difference to flex be if we tip trim vs butt trim 1.0 inch? The answer is, probably 4 CPM or 1 CPM stronger for each 2/8” of tip trim instead of butt trim. (a actual example comes below)

SCENARIO 2
If we look at different flex charts out there we will see that there is a progression to CPM vs play length, that progression will vary depending on what chart we look at, or more correct, what shaft MODEL we look at, since each shaft model has a flex progression rate of its own.

If we for the sake of example use RIFLEs FCM system who is the most known and the origin of Butt CPM measurement, and where 10 CPM equals to 1 full flex,(FCM 5.0 to FCM 6.0) that chart has a progression rate of 8.5 CPM per inch, who means if we have a shaft that’s 46.00 who measure 250 CPM, and now cut it 1 inch shorter, it has to measure 258.5 CPM to be the same flex as it was. But ONLY if we measure with the same SW value. For IRONS we can use 14 grams head weight added per inch shorter as average, for woods we are at about 10 grams per inch.(1 SWP as grams vary with play length) SWP to CPM follows each other in a 1:1 relationship

If a shaft actually goes 1 full flex stiffer by 1.0” tip trim (10 CPM), measured using the same tip weight, our shaft that started as 250 CPM, must return this value:

250 Start CPM
+ 8.5 CPM from going 1 inch shorter just to be the same flex.(the FCM chart)
+ 6.0 CPM from losing 1 inch / 6 SWP since we use the same head weight/tip weight
+ 10  CPM to gain 1 full flex so change FCM 5.0 to FCM 6.0 or 1 full flex.
Summary  274.5 CPM or a gain of 24.5 CPM on our CPM reader.

That means our return value has to go up with minimum 8.5 (CPM slope per inch) + 6 (lost SWP when using the same tip weight) or 14.5 CPM just to remain the same flex as it was, so unless we see a return value of 264.5 or higher, we actually went softer, not stronger.

Adam C, another profile here has a video on you tube where his measured numbers from uncut to 1 inch shorter by tip trim is 285 vs 299 = 14 CPM….but we need 14.5 just to be on RIFLEs FCM slope. If we used Kaufmans charts with a progression of 7.3 CPM per inch, we get (299 - 7.3 - 6) = 285.7 so net flex gain was only 0.7 CPM from 1.0 tip trim. FCM 5.0 became FCM 5.1

The same shaft Butt cut 1 inch was 285 vs 293 CPM, so we go SOFTER by butt trim, and in his case the NET difference between 1.0” inch butt trim and 1.0” inch tip trim was 6 CPM. (This will vary, even on the same shaft model, but the expected average difference is 4 CPM or 1 CPM for each 2/8” tip trim vs butt trim.

If the X profile was identical, and equally stiffer “all over” The X flex model would have started as 295 (vs 285), and with 1.0” inch BUTT trim changed to 203, a gain of 8, while the needed gain to stay in flex was 14.5, so it became 6.5 CPM softer from 1.0” butt trim (FCM 6.0 became FCM 5.35)

SCENARIO 3
The THIRD scenario Tip trim a S flex 1.0” vs butt trim a X flex 1.0”. if we stick to Adam C and his example (and a simulated case of a 10 CPM stronger “X” flex), we saw that the S will move from 285 to 299 by trip trim, and the “X” who starts from 295 will go to 303 with 1 inch butt trim, so not even in that scenario will the butt CPM isolated become the same, the X will still be 4 CPM stronger

So, if the question is, “can we tip trim a S flex to become like its stronger X flex model”, the answer is absolutely NOT, that’s only possible on “multi-flex models” where the tip section is long enough to make the needed tip trim who would be in the area of 2.0 to 2.5 inch depending on EI profile.

We might get butt CPM close depending on what EI profile that shafts has (Scenario 3), but the X flex model will still be stronger in the mid-section and tip-section, so navigating by butt CPM alone is not a good idea, since it’s all about FEEL and how the altered profile works. Some models even become higher launching when we tip trim them, the opposite of the expected, so my advice is simple, if S flex feels to loose, go X flex, and if that feels to strong, let a qualified club maker judge the EI profile before as decision of tip trimming the S flex models is done, we might need to look at another shaft model to get what we want.

Summary
Scenario 1 – 1.0” inch tip trim vs 1.0” butt trim, expect the difference to be 4-6 CPM, or 1 CPM for each 2/8”.

Scenario 2 – 1.0” inch tip trim WANT make the shaft much stronger compared to the needed slope on a flex chart when going shorter, we can hardly keep the needed progression needed.
(See the link to Russ Ryden and full EI profile)

Scenario 3 – 1.0” tip trim on “S” vs 1.0” butt trim on X get butt CPM closer and from 10 down to about 4 CPM on butt in our example, so X will still be stronger not only at butt, but overall.

For more info about Butt CPM as flex compare, FCM charts, also for NON FCM shafts, follow this link:

https://forums.golfwrx.com/discussion/1816864/cpm-and-flex-matching-what-chart-to-use-fcm-what-is-flex-slope

Russ Ryden example of a S flex, S flex tipped 1.0  and untipped X flex
https://www.golfshaftreviews.info/technical-stuff/tipping-golf-shaft/

Hireko Golf and Jeff Summitt uses a average of 5 CPM stronger for each inch tip trim on woods.
https://www.hirekogolf.com/clubmaking-201-altering-the-recommended-tip-trimming

ADAM C example of butt vs tip trim on the same shaft used in the examples above.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Juw6aCNlgDE&t=653s

End note with attention to @Fujikura Golf
Your text on your web page sounds misleading, I have no idea how those 10 CPM is measured,  and like all 3 scenarios explained show, we CANT actually gain enough flex strength to make S become X with only 1.0” tip trim, and the return value using the same tip weight would actually need to move butt CPM 24.5 before the claim of “10 CPM stronger” becomes correct.

Since ALL shaft profile respond a bit different depending on EI profiles, we only have a general guideline of what we can expect, and all 3 scenarios is now explained the way we should judge them.

If Fujikura actually means that S flex can be altered to the same shaft model as X flex by a tip trim of 1.0” inch, I look forward to the explanation of the scenario we talk about (1-2 OR 3), and how the measurements is done who shows that, both as EI profiles and butt CPM measurements of at least 2 of your shaft models. Until you can provide that, I expect the text to be based on a single shaft, and misunderstandings about how shaft flex compares shall be done, and I know that’s a bald statement, but ive shown off the 3 scenarios we can use, so its up to you to explain yours.

It’s of highly importance that you do so, since the words from a official webside of a shaft manufacturer “counts” and might considered correct and valid for all shafts, but the reader dont understand the context and might think this is simple and “strait forward” like the text gives the impression of, but shaft measurements and judgement is not strait forward like that.

 

Edited by Howard_Jones
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For some reason i could not post the photo of Russ Rydens measurements, it seems like a BLOCK for photos no matter what photo, but i dont have the time now to write a mail to [email protected] the error message suggest, so if any of the MODERATORS see this, the forum seems blocked for photo upload and should be fixed.

 

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On 8/11/2020 at 5:43 PM, Fujikura Golf said:

1" tipping is one full flex in our products, so 10 CPM stiffer. Hope this helps.

 i made some comments to your statement (quoted below), and i think your statement needs a deeper explanation from you, it does not match with my knowledge about wood shafts, and those EI profiles ive seen of Fujikura models tells the same story, we cant make a S flex to become like its X flex brother by 1.0" tip trim. Ive been on your webpage too and looked at tip trim instructions and find the same info there, you say we can tip trim the S flex 1.0" inch to get X flex.

Ive done my best to explain shafts and shaft measurements in general on this forum for 10 years now, and wrote a reply to all this im quoting below here, so i hope Fujikura Golf will get back and explain how you measure this, and in what scenario you claim 1.0" inch tip trim moves the shaft 1 full flex or 10 CPM.

 

On 8/18/2020 at 9:48 AM, Howard_Jones said:

To understand butt CPM judgement, we have 3 scenarios to be made
Scenario 1 - Tip trimming vs butt trimming 1.0 inch
Scenario 2 - The above compared to flex charts like RIFLE FCM or Kaufman L.A.R.S.X
Scenario 3 - Tip trim 1.0” on a S flex vs butt trim 1.0” on a X flex of the same model

SCENARIO 1
A player has a 46.00” uncut shaft and lets for the sake of example say it measure 250 CPM with a 205 grams weight and a 5.0” clamp. The player intends to cut the shaft 1.0” inch shorter and he got 2 options. The first option is 1.0” from the butt, the second option is 1.0” from the tip. The question is. How large will the difference to flex be if we tip trim vs butt trim 1.0 inch? The answer is, probably 4 CPM or 1 CPM stronger for each 2/8” of tip trim instead of butt trim. (a actual example comes below)

SCENARIO 2
If we look at different flex charts out there we will see that there is a progression to CPM vs play length, that progression will vary depending on what chart we look at, or more correct, what shaft MODEL we look at, since each shaft model has a flex progression rate of its own.

If we for the sake of example use RIFLEs FCM system who is the most known and the origin of Butt CPM measurement, and where 10 CPM equals to 1 full flex,(FCM 5.0 to FCM 6.0) that chart has a progression rate of 8.5 CPM per inch, who means if we have a shaft that’s 46.00 who measure 250 CPM, and now cut it 1 inch shorter, it has to measure 258.5 CPM to be the same flex as it was. But ONLY if we measure with the same SW value. For IRONS we can use 14 grams head weight added per inch shorter as average, for woods we are at about 10 grams per inch.(1 SWP as grams vary with play length) SWP to CPM follows each other in a 1:1 relationship

If a shaft actually goes 1 full flex stiffer by 1.0” tip trim (10 CPM), measured using the same tip weight, our shaft that started as 250 CPM, must return this value:

250 Start CPM
+ 8.5 CPM from going 1 inch shorter just to be the same flex.(the FCM chart)
+ 6.0 CPM from losing 1 inch / 6 SWP since we use the same head weight/tip weight
+ 10  CPM to gain 1 full flex so change FCM 5.0 to FCM 6.0 or 1 full flex.
Summary  274.5 CPM or a gain of 24.5 CPM on our CPM reader.

That means our return value has to go up with minimum 8.5 (CPM slope per inch) + 6 (lost SWP when using the same tip weight) or 14.5 CPM just to remain the same flex as it was, so unless we see a return value of 264.5 or higher, we actually went softer, not stronger.

Adam C, another profile here has a video on you tube where his measured numbers from uncut to 1 inch shorter by tip trim is 285 vs 299 = 14 CPM….but we need 14.5 just to be on RIFLEs FCM slope. If we used Kaufmans charts with a progression of 7.3 CPM per inch, we get (299 - 7.3 - 6) = 285.7 so net flex gain was only 0.7 CPM from 1.0 tip trim. FCM 5.0 became FCM 5.1

The same shaft Butt cut 1 inch was 285 vs 293 CPM, so we go SOFTER by butt trim, and in his case the NET difference between 1.0” inch butt trim and 1.0” inch tip trim was 6 CPM. (This will vary, even on the same shaft model, but the expected average difference is 4 CPM or 1 CPM for each 2/8” tip trim vs butt trim.

If the X profile was identical, and equally stiffer “all over” The X flex model would have started as 295 (vs 285), and with 1.0” inch BUTT trim changed to 203, a gain of 8, while the needed gain to stay in flex was 14.5, so it became 6.5 CPM softer from 1.0” butt trim (FCM 6.0 became FCM 5.35)

SCENARIO 3
The THIRD scenario Tip trim a S flex 1.0” vs butt trim a X flex 1.0”. if we stick to Adam C and his example (and a simulated case of a 10 CPM stronger “X” flex), we saw that the S will move from 285 to 299 by trip trim, and the “X” who starts from 295 will go to 303 with 1 inch butt trim, so not even in that scenario will the butt CPM isolated become the same, the X will still be 4 CPM stronger

So, if the question is, “can we tip trim a S flex to become like its stronger X flex model”, the answer is absolutely NOT, that’s only possible on “multi-flex models” where the tip section is long enough to make the needed tip trim who would be in the area of 2.0 to 2.5 inch depending on EI profile.

We might get butt CPM close depending on what EI profile that shafts has (Scenario 3), but the X flex model will still be stronger in the mid-section and tip-section, so navigating by butt CPM alone is not a good idea, since it’s all about FEEL and how the altered profile works. Some models even become higher launching when we tip trim them, the opposite of the expected, so my advice is simple, if S flex feels to loose, go X flex, and if that feels to strong, let a qualified club maker judge the EI profile before as decision of tip trimming the S flex models is done, we might need to look at another shaft model to get what we want.

Summary
Scenario 1 – 1.0” inch tip trim vs 1.0” butt trim, expect the difference to be 4-6 CPM, or 1 CPM for each 2/8”.

Scenario 2 – 1.0” inch tip trim WANT make the shaft much stronger compared to the needed slope on a flex chart when going shorter, we can hardly keep the needed progression needed.
(See the link to Russ Ryden and full EI profile)

Scenario 3 – 1.0” tip trim on “S” vs 1.0” butt trim on X get butt CPM closer and from 10 down to about 4 CPM on butt in our example, so X will still be stronger not only at butt, but overall.

For more info about Butt CPM as flex compare, FCM charts, also for NON FCM shafts, follow this link:

https://forums.golfwrx.com/discussion/1816864/cpm-and-flex-matching-what-chart-to-use-fcm-what-is-flex-slope

Russ Ryden example of a S flex, S flex tipped 1.0  and untipped X flex
https://www.golfshaftreviews.info/technical-stuff/tipping-golf-shaft/

Hireko Golf and Jeff Summitt uses a average of 5 CPM stronger for each inch tip trim on woods.
https://www.hirekogolf.com/clubmaking-201-altering-the-recommended-tip-trimming

ADAM C example of butt vs tip trim on the same shaft used in the examples above.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Juw6aCNlgDE&t=653s

End note with attention to @Fujikura Golf
Your text on your web page sounds misleading, I have no idea how those 10 CPM is measured,  and like all 3 scenarios explained show, we CANT actually gain enough flex strength to make S become X with only 1.0” tip trim, and the return value using the same tip weight would actually need to move butt CPM 24.5 before the claim of “10 CPM stronger” becomes correct.

Since ALL shaft profile respond a bit different depending on EI profiles, we only have a general guideline of what we can expect, and all 3 scenarios is now explained the way we should judge them.

If Fujikura actually means that S flex can be altered to the same shaft model as X flex by a tip trim of 1.0” inch, I look forward to the explanation of the scenario we talk about (1-2 OR 3), and how the measurements is done who shows that, both as EI profiles and butt CPM measurements of at least 2 of your shaft models. Until you can provide that, I expect the text to be based on a single shaft, and misunderstandings about how shaft flex compares shall be done, and I know that’s a bald statement, but ive shown off the 3 scenarios we can use, so its up to you to explain yours.

It’s of highly importance that you do so, since the words from a official webside of a shaft manufacturer “counts” and might considered correct and valid for all shafts, but the reader dont understand the context and might think this is simple and “strait forward” like the text gives the impression of, but shaft measurements and judgement is not strait forward like that.

 

 

Edited by Howard_Jones

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  • 2 weeks later...

@Howard_Jones - Thank you for sharing your knowledge here, we're happy to expand and also to help inform from our side of things as well. 

In some cases 1” might be 10 CPM’s stiffer (Usually 6 to 8 cpm’s) than the blank but you are always comparing this to the X which is stiffer in the handle and tip. In some scenarios you are correct, but there are other things we must consider. There are numerous variables that affect CPM (tip, butt and mid flex / balance point / swing weight).  One of the biggest factors in stiffening due to tip trim is geometry change.  For example, something most may not realize is the OD’s (outer diameter) in every location (except the tip parallel) along the length of the shaft get a little larger thus creating added stiffness. Butt trimming does the opposite. Additionally, inner diameters based on the design intent can vary and be smaller/larger throughout the length of the shaft as well, therefore having an effect on the stiffness.

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7 hours ago, Fujikura Golf said:

@Howard_Jones - Thank you for sharing your knowledge here, we're happy to expand and also to help inform from our side of things as well. 

In some cases 1” might be 10 CPM’s stiffer (Usually 6 to 8 cpm’s) than the blank but you are always comparing this to the X which is stiffer in the handle and tip. In some scenarios you are correct, but there are other things we must consider. There are numerous variables that affect CPM (tip, butt and mid flex / balance point / swing weight).  One of the biggest factors in stiffening due to tip trim is geometry change.  For example, something most may not realize is the OD’s (outer diameter) in every location (except the tip parallel) along the length of the shaft get a little larger thus creating added stiffness. Butt trimming does the opposite. Additionally, inner diameters based on the design intent can vary and be smaller/larger throughout the length of the shaft as well, therefore having an effect on the stiffness.


Whats the scenario of the 3 im listing is this claim valid for? (1.2 or 3)
"In some cases 1” might be 10 CPM’s stiffer (Usually 6 to 8 cpm’s) than the blank"

Are you saying that if starting point  (blank) was 300 CPM, and you cut 1 inch from the tip, you will see the return values 306 to 308, but it might be 310? 


".....but you are always comparing this to the X "
Is the blank cut down to the same NET CUT length by 1.0" BUTT Trim, or is that value you use from this X flex shaft as UNCUT and by that 1.0 Inch longer?


"For example, something most may not realize is the OD’s (outer diameter) in every location (except the tip parallel) along the length of the shaft get a little larger thus creating added stiffness. Butt trimming does the opposite. Additionally, inner diameters based on the design intent can vary and be smaller/larger throughout the length of the shaft as well, therefore having an effect on the stiffness."

Thats what i describe the effect of in Scenario 3 above here

Edited by Howard_Jones

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