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Beginning my try at duplicating Hogan's Swing


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[quote name='Ben Hogan Swing Project' timestamp='1313011381' post='3471100']
[quote name='markponi' timestamp='1313007482' post='3470870']
I'm not even saying it doesn't happen and these guys are right, Hogan had a lot of different shots. I'm saying that hogan didn't do anything to make this happen. His hands were clamps. Could be the club weight and transition force uncups them. By no means did he uncup them using the top most muscles of the forearm. The video is probably accurate, but I can assure you that he didn't do that using those muscles in the upper forearm. If it uncups its because his core is changing directions, his pitchy elbow acts as a wall that the wrists, shaft and clubhead respond to. I've tried to replicate this but I can't control the club, not strong enough. His springs the mothereffing shi*t out of the shaft during transition. Bertrand puts approximately 0 spring into the shaft. Slicefixers students spring the shaft in a similar way but they just aren't as powerful as Ben...Martinez throws the club head behind him as his intent is toward the target but it isn't the same thing as hogan...but as we said before, who is...(by the way, I highly admire both methods!!!)

There is a great thread on here that talks about the arms coming over the top and the club. It's called the purpose of the downloop. I think it may have some merit and contributes to Hogan's unique transition.

Your swing in the first video you posted looks like Jerry Kelly's, not Hogan's. I am not saying this to discourage you, just to inform you. The shaft is steep on the takeaway and only shallows during transition. Hogan's pulling of the grip seems to do this. If you consciously close the club face with your hands/wrists/forearms at transition, you'll just close the clubhead and it probably won't look like hogan from a visual and a dynamic perspective. But...keep at it, I'm not a hater...hope you continue to post comments and video and improve.
[/quote]

I'll search for the downloop thread. No discouragement taken. I need as many trained eyes picking as many missed details as possible in order to get this swing right. Regarding my Take 1 swing, I know it's nowhere near Hogan. My goal is to get it super close by Take 100. Its been almost 2 weeks since the Take 1 post. I have no idea when Take 2 will be done. Jerry Kelly has a cooooool looking swing, but mine is also nowhere near him. i also like the Jerry Barber one too.

[media]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kdVVRFIzCbc[/media]


And my favorite part of your post is "springs the mothereffing shi*t out of the shaft" !!!!!!!LOLOLOL This outa be a permanent quote somewhere!!!! I may need your permission to make this part of my signature lol! Hey....one of my sub-goals could be for someone to see my swing and say "MAN...Did you see that guy!!!! He sprung the mothereffing shi*t out of the shaft!!" (boy, I hope my kids never read this.....I would never be able to explain the rough language)
[/quote]


Feel free to use it any time you want...just cite some dude named markponi who posts too much on the golfwrx hogan forum and acts like he's an expert. I only play one on TV

Springing the shaft is a critical component to all solid ball strikers. Hogan flexed the shaft so much, the ball didn't have a chance vs. the club shaft with that much mass/acceleration driving the arm/shaft/club unit.

Oh, and I hate Jerry Kelly's swing...but he's also a multimillionaire and I recently got a multi dollar raise.

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This week, I've put a lot of practice time into the Hogan address. I wasn't able to do the 100 reps per day that I wanted to because I've been wrapping up a cylinder head repalcement on my truck. It's running now.....finally! The address is not yet perfect, but real close. Neck and back pain is gone. Most notable part of the address right now is the amount of weight and pressure on the right toe/ball of right toe area. Also notice that Hogans left arm is commonly glued in more to the body. Will try to get a "Take 2" Address video up this weekend. Anxious to move to the next part of the swing. I'm looking forward to the waggle.

Tomorrows gonna be a day of golf heaven........going to the PGA Championship to see everyone except Tiger.

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this is the first time i have heard this buzzy term "springing the shaft".
i guess you mean the bend in the shaft during the downswing.
i think you are looking at photos and videos and being misled.
the apparent bend is due to the shutter speed and travel of the camera.
movie camera shutter speeds are about 1/50 sec.
the shutter also travels across the "gate", so its not one instant image, its a progressive capture of the image.
the fact that nearly every image will show the shaft as blurred means its a slow shutter speed.
during 1/50th of a second the clubhead has moved a lot more than the hands thus it is blurred.
with the invention of the focal plane shutter in 35mm still cameras, faster shutter speeds than 1/500th of a second became available.
this type of shutter is a slit that travels across the film so again it is a progressive capture of the image, not instantaneous.
the clubhead lag you see is due to the camera shutter.
[attachment=839282:swing12.jpg]
in this pic for example the shutter has travelled from the top down to the bottom, capturing the hands before the clubhead.
thus the clubhead has moved quite a lot more forward than where it really should be.
you will see opposite results when the shutter travels from the bottom to the top.

you only have to take a 4 iron with a stiff shaft and try bending it over a table edge to see how much force is required to get even one inch of bend at the head.
i cannot imagine any swing applying that much force.

the next ridiculous buzzword i want to address is the "compressing the ball" nonsense.
later..........................

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[quote name='Pinsplitter59' timestamp='1313275352' post='3482165']
this is the first time i have heard this buzzy term "springing the shaft".
i guess you mean the bend in the shaft during the downswing.
i think you are looking at photos and videos and being misled.
the apparent bend is due to the shutter speed and travel of the camera.
movie camera shutter speeds are about 1/50 sec.
the shutter also travels across the "gate", so its not one instant image, its a progressive capture of the image.
the fact that nearly every image will show the shaft as blurred means its a slow shutter speed.
during 1/50th of a second the clubhead has moved a lot more than the hands thus it is blurred.
with the invention of the focal plane shutter in 35mm still cameras, faster shutter speeds than 1/500th of a second became available.
this type of shutter is a slit that travels across the film so again it is a progressive capture of the image, not instantaneous.
the clubhead lag you see is due to the camera shutter.
[attachment=839282:swing12.jpg]
in this pic for example the shutter has travelled from the top down to the bottom, capturing the hands before the clubhead.
thus the clubhead has moved quite a lot more forward than where it really should be.
you will see opposite results when the shutter travels from the bottom to the top.

you only have to take a 4 iron with a stiff shaft and try bending it over a table edge to see how much force is required to get even one inch of bend at the head.
i cannot imagine any swing applying that much force.

the next ridiculous buzzword i want to address is the "compressing the ball" nonsense.
later..........................
[/quote]

Wow.......your camera knowledge, vocabulary, and theory appear to be extensive, so I will not debate what you have stated. I completely agree with the camera specs, and that what we see in the above image is not club lag.

When you get a chance, please acquire the following items and record a few swings.
- One golf club (preferably a Driver) with a senior shaft.
- One Casio High Speed camera capable of capturing at 120, 240, 480, or 1000 frames per second.
- One Golfer with clubhead speed of 90-100mph

If the above is not possible, search youtube for HIgh Speed golf swings and pay close attention to what the shaft is doing while in transition, and while making contact with the ground. I am unsure what the technical term is regarding the "bending of the shaft", but I now call this "springing the mothereffing shi*t out of the shaft".

Terms of use: All rights of this fine quote go to markponi.

Clubhead Lag is defined as "leaving the clubhead behind." Its when the hands are ahead of the clubhead. If the hands get to the ball first, the clubhead will be "lagging behind." If the shaft happens to get "the mothereffing shi*t sprung out of it", then the following formula is created:

Clubhead lag + "springing the mothereffing shi*t out of the shaft" = Ball getting the mothereffing shi*t slapped out of it.

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perception is a funny thing isn't it.
there is a lot of talk everywhere about lag and late release for more power.
fact is if you keep your body rotating ahead of your arms you simply cannot swing the clubhead ahead of your hands.
see the pic of Mike Dunaway with Ben Hogan.
MD follows Mike Austins theory of unwinding the right arm and uncocking the wrists as early as possible from the top of the swing.
but as you see there really no difference in clubhead lag.
[attachment=839299:Ben_Hogan_Mike_Dunaway.jpg]
the clubhead has to almost catch up the hands at impact of course.
Hogan described hitting with his right hand or using his right forefinger as his trigger finger.
for long irons Nicklaus said he liked to "sweep" the ball.
all these different feelings and i really wonder if they are actually any different at all in reality.

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[quote name='Pinsplitter59' timestamp='1313282571' post='3482470']
perception is a funny thing isn't it.
there is a lot of talk everywhere about lag and late release for more power.
fact is if you keep your body rotating ahead of your arms you simply cannot swing the clubhead ahead of your hands.
see the pic of Mike Dunaway with Ben Hogan.
MD follows Mike Austins theory of unwinding the right arm and uncocking the wrists as early as possible from the top of the swing.
but as you see there really no difference in clubhead lag.
[attachment=839299:Ben_Hogan_Mike_Dunaway.jpg]
the clubhead has to almost catch up the hands at impact of course.
Hogan described hitting with his right hand or using his right forefinger as his trigger finger.
for long irons Nicklaus said he liked to "sweep" the ball.
all these different feelings and i really wonder if they are actually any different at all in reality.
[/quote]

+1. Get the body moving first and fast enough, and there is no way to get the clubhead to fast to the ball. Even with 4 right hands...=)

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Good luck. I am glad I am 6'2 with long arms, so I never have the delusion of trying to copy Hogan. Its an awesome swing, just not for me.

TM SLDR 460 set to 10.5° 70g Aldila VS Proto 44"
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Odyssey White Ice #7 37" counter balanced and a SpryEvo TeCu insert
WS FG Tour(2014) or ProV1x

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[quote name='Pinsplitter59' timestamp='1313282571' post='3482470']
perception is a funny thing isn't it.
there is a lot of talk everywhere about lag and late release for more power.
fact is if you keep your body rotating ahead of your arms you simply cannot swing the clubhead ahead of your hands.
see the pic of Mike Dunaway with Ben Hogan.
MD follows Mike Austins theory of unwinding the right arm and uncocking the wrists as early as possible from the top of the swing.
but as you see there really no difference in clubhead lag.
[attachment=839299:Ben_Hogan_Mike_Dunaway.jpg]
the clubhead has to almost catch up the hands at impact of course.
Hogan described hitting with his right hand or using his right forefinger as his trigger finger.
for long irons Nicklaus said he liked to "sweep" the ball.
all these different feelings and i really wonder if they are actually any different at all in reality.
[/quote]

That's wrong, and I'm tired of it bec it fooled me for so long a few months back. You will just either make the clubhead get online with the left arm earlier or later. That depends on your pivot turn and left wrist condition, and ball position. So if what you're saying is true, how come the clubhead always gets in line with left arm somewhere when your hands reach in the vicinity of left leg. As I said, just earlier or later..unless you don't turn your body and just move your left arm/hand directly targetwards without rotating/rolling your left wrist like a hammer.

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I am satisfied with where I am with the address at this point. It is not perfect, but close enough for now. Something I've learned regarding matching Hogans moves, is that I must compare ALL camera angles. I thought I had the DTL view of the address pretty much mastered, then when I took a looked at it from FO or R(rear) or LFS(left front side), they were all very off. So i practiced all views till they were close. Still needs some tweeking which I will do over next few weeks.

Now, moving on to the waggle. I finally found a few videos with a semi-clear view of the waggle, from all angles. Man. I wish I had Hogan vids with today's quality; would make this project sooooo much easier.

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[quote name='JOEGOLFWRX' timestamp='1313607315' post='3496415']
you might want to allow more than a week for this bit, lol.
[/quote]

Lol.....I know what you mean Joe. But actually, "walking into the ball" and the "waggle/address" aren't too bad. It's the "transition from the top" that's gonna give me a headache; whew......there's all kinds of physics/trigonometry/physiology happening there!

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well i reckon "waking in to the ball" and the "waggle/address" is a substantial part of his shot making, which is the major part of him.

so each example you can find are deliberately and relevantly different, then there is the question about what is it are they deliberately different to, what is the models base, how did this have to fluctuate to a pain ridden body, from week to week and decade to decade. and every illusions caused by the viewing angle of static photos become exponentially more prevalent in motion, motions which are subtle including the hidden re-grips, other motions plain hidden by lost frames, and cloaking clothes. and don't forget he said a good golf swing is high maintenance.

and he hasnt even taken the club back, lol.

its quite the task you've taken on, ...at least you get to study a cool swing.

[media]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=E1LM7h5hXIY[/media]

imo as long as you avoid the delusions and the deluded, your method is as good as any.

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[quote name='JOEGOLFWRX' timestamp='1313619364' post='3497083']
well i reckon "waking in to the ball" and the "waggle/address" is a substantial part of his shot making, which is the major part of him.

so each example you can find are deliberately and relevantly different, then there is the question about what is it are they deliberately different to, what is the models base, how did this have to fluctuate to a pain ridden body, from week to week and decade to decade. and every illusions caused by the viewing angle of static photos become exponentially more prevalent in motion, motions which are subtle including the hidden re-grips, other motions plain hidden by lost frames, and cloaking clothes. and don't forget he said a good golf swing is high maintenance.

and he hasnt even taken the club back, lol.

its quite the task you've taken on, ...at least you get to study a cool swing.

imo as long as you avoid the delusions and the deluded, your method is as good as any.
[/quote]

Yaaahh, I do see what you mean lol. I remember an earlier post on page 1 of this thread where I was asked if I am working towards the [i]"Pre-secret good Hogan (1942-1946), post-secret/pre-accident Hogan ('46-'49), Post-accident to last win ('50-'59), or old man Hogan ('60's +) as his swing evolved over those time periods, IMO. Even some sub-genre's in there, IMO, like when his left knee was really messed up and he had to swing off of his right leg (around 1970-71 to who knows when)." [/i]I do agree that all of them have their differences, but they all have the basic Hogan brand stamped into them, from the waggle, to the head being a little turned to the right at address, to the takeaway, to the transition with right arm dropping under the left during the downswing, to the elbow cutting into his side, to the impact where his head float in one spot till the right shoulder brought it through, to the high follow thru and finish.

My method is as basic and simple as can be. Break the video down from all angles. Practice each and every move in a mirror and camera until I have an understanding of what they should look like, then transfer this look into a personal feeling. This is the most important part of the project. Practicing the waggle and playing it back 1,000 times till I am close, then understanding what the muscles in my arms, feet, back, shoulders, quads, etc feel like while I am doing it. It all becomes muscle memory.

Same concept as giving an 8 year old kid a Michael Jackson or Elvis DVD. After watching is for a few days or weeks, they can jump up and do most of the moves. spot on. No training class, no book, no understanding of what Jackson or Elvis' "intentions" were. Nobody told them what the 5 fundamentals were of moving like Elvis. They just saw it and moved as he did.

Same concept as an actor playing a major role, having to duplicate the person to make it believable enough for the audience. Think of any movie you saw where the actor was so convincing that when you left, you commented on how believable they were, from even the smallest details. There are also MANY actors that screwed it all up too, only mastering one particular part of the persons persona; they were spot-on for a minute or two, then lost mental focus and became themselves for a few moments, which just ruined everything.

All my golfing career, I have been told of the "golf bible" written by Hogan. I have never read his 5 Fundemantals book. Once I get as close as I can to his movements, I will purchase the book and read it in detail. I want to see just how much the book matches the muscular movements I have put together.

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A dance move only requires balancing your body. A golf swing needs dynamic balance because of the weight of the club-matching dance moves is a million times easier than matching swings. Read Five Fundamentals man it will help you.
There is so much force involved in swinging a golf club and it sure isn't as easy as a child copying a dance move.

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[quote name='Ben Hogan Swing Project' timestamp='1313616771' post='3496989']
[quote name='JOEGOLFWRX' timestamp='1313607315' post='3496415']
you might want to allow more than a week for this bit, lol.
[/quote]

Lol.....I know what you mean Joe. But actually, "walking into the ball" and the "waggle/address" aren't too bad. It's the "transition from the top" that's gonna give me a headache; whew......there's all kinds of physics/trigonometry/physiology happening there!
[/quote]

Isn't the transition and DS the easiest?.. Lol Ain't that right Joe? As Joe said, waggle is a MAJOR part, and where is that, still setup/address? Lol Yeah, swing haven't started yet...lol as far as I recall, all Hogan said about transition/DS is turn your hips while forgetting your arms/hands to start DS, and then give it all you've got after that...lol easy peasy...lol

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[quote name='JOEGOLFWRX' timestamp='1313619364' post='3497083']
well i reckon "waking in to the ball" and the "waggle/address" is a substantial part of his shot making, which is the major part of him.

so each example you can find are deliberately and relevantly different, then there is the question about what is it are they deliberately different to, what is the models base, how did this have to fluctuate to a pain ridden body, from week to week and decade to decade. and every illusions caused by the viewing angle of static photos become exponentially more prevalent in motion, motions which are subtle including the hidden re-grips, other motions plain hidden by lost frames, and cloaking clothes. and don't forget he said a good golf swing is high maintenance.

and he hasnt even taken the club back, lol.

its quite the task you've taken on, ...at least you get to study a cool swing.

[media]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=E1LM7h5hXIY[/media]

imo as long as you avoid the delusions and the deluded, your method is as good as any.
[/quote]

But Joe that's the problem, to pinpoint which ones are the delusions and deluded..heck, I spent around first 4 years of my golding lifelistening to it/them...I even thought it's Hogan that's deluding us...lol

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yeah he definitely mislead, lol, ..but without lying imo, i'd say he found the whole thing hilarious, lol.

@BHSP,
its hard to explain the potential pitfalls i think even pure mimicry could throw up. the best i can think of is its like that billion dollar satellite that was meant to stay close to earth and useful for decades, but it ended up just heading off on its own in a straight line for all eternity, lol, the reason was some of the team were programing in metric centimeters and some were using imperial inches, lmao. i reckon pure mimicry will require plenty of rinse repeats, not just x number of weeks.

why don't you choose post accident ? then when your wife starts hitting you with the saucepan down the line it wont effect the project, lol.

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[quote name='grahler' timestamp='1313634130' post='3497708']
A dance move only requires balancing your body. A golf swing needs dynamic balance because of the weight of the club-matching dance moves is a million times easier than matching swings. Read Five Fundamentals man it will help you.
There is so much force involved in swinging a golf club and it sure isn't as easy as a child copying a dance move.
[/quote]

Lol, I have coworkers that are stunned that I haven't read the book yet. One guy actually brought his into the office and slammed it on my desk. He said "BHP" (that's what he call's me now) "how the heck are you going to duplicate the swing and you haven't even read the instruction manual??? What the hell???? You are going at this all wrong. Take the book and keep it as a gift." My response was "thanks for the kind offer, but I kindly wish to submit into evidence the many, many statements from a gazillion Hoganites around the globe saying that they have read the book and they understand what it says in context, but their swing is nowhere near that of Hogan."

So my theory is that if gazillions have depended on reading the book or the magazines to understand/discover the secret move, or secret thought, or secret whatever, and no one has seemed to have accomplished this, then I must take a different approach. I don't want to become person number gazillion-one.

And I proudly state that I have put together many projects without ever reading any portion of the instruction manual. My wife can attest to that lol. May have taken me a couple of cylinder heads to realize that if I crank down the rocker arm bolts too tight, the hydraulic lifters will get smashed lol.

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[quote name='JOEGOLFWRX' timestamp='1313663457' post='3498336']
yeah he definitely mislead, lol, ..but without lying imo, i'd say he found the whole thing hilarious, lol.

@BHSP,
its hard to explain the potential pitfalls i think even pure mimicry could throw up. the best i can think of is its like that billion dollar satellite that was meant to stay close to earth and useful for decades, but it ended up just heading off on its own in a straight line for all eternity, lol, the reason was some of the team were programing in metric centimeters and some were using imperial inches, lmao. i reckon pure mimicry will require plenty of rinse repeats, not just x number of weeks.

why don't you choose post accident ? then when your wife starts hitting you with the saucepan down the line it wont effect the project, lol.
[/quote]

LOLOLOLOLOLOL!!!! My wife got a kick out of that one.!!!!!!

Actually, If I had to pick the optimal swing to do, it would be "elder" Hogan, in the yellow "Mr. Rogers" sweater. Just based on age and flexibility, me trying to duplicate the movements of a 25-30 year old might be difficult. But whatever Hogan swing we look at, there's his signature all over it.

[media]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tzECwED22UE[/media]

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[quote name='Ben Hogan Swing Project' timestamp='1313680834' post='3498944']
[quote name='JOEGOLFWRX' timestamp='1313663457' post='3498336']
yeah he definitely mislead, lol, ..but without lying imo, i'd say he found the whole thing hilarious, lol.

@BHSP,
its hard to explain the potential pitfalls i think even pure mimicry could throw up. the best i can think of is its like that billion dollar satellite that was meant to stay close to earth and useful for decades, but it ended up just heading off on its own in a straight line for all eternity, lol, the reason was some of the team were programing in metric centimeters and some were using imperial inches, lmao. i reckon pure mimicry will require plenty of rinse repeats, not just x number of weeks.

why don't you choose post accident ? then when your wife starts hitting you with the saucepan down the line it wont effect the project, lol.
[/quote]

LOLOLOLOLOLOL!!!! My wife got a kick out of that one.!!!!!!

Actually, If I had to pick the optimal swing to do, it would be "elder" Hogan, in the yellow "Mr. Rogers" sweater. Just based on age and flexibility, me trying to duplicate the movements of a 25-30 year old might be difficult. But whatever Hogan swing we look at, there's his signature all over it.

[media]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tzECwED22UE[/media]
[/quote]

Mr. Hogan was around 73 years old in that video and hadn't practiced regularly for about 5 years.

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Today's highlights:

1. We packed my 18 year old sons life into a bunch of brown boxes to ship him off to college. We are on the highway heading to the dorm and I have one of my "moments." I am holding the steering wheel with left hand at about the 8 oclock position, and right hand at about the 4 oclock position. I start thinking about the swing and realize that the steering wheel feels just like holding a club! I looked over at my wife and smiled real big. She said "what?" I smiled even bigger. She said "what!" I just chuckled and kept smiling and said, "oh, nothing."

Even though I didn't tell her about my golf "moment," she still gave me that same look that she did when I was puffing on the golf tee in the living room.

2. Once we got everything unpacked, we took a tour of the campus. We passed a university sports bar where you have to swipe a university proximity card to enter the facility. We go in and I see the usual barstools and bar area and flat screens on the wall locked on ESPN. Because i was so intrigued by what was on the tv, I didn't notice when Kim (my wife) called my name. She reached over and slapped me on the arm and said "wake up Hogan!" She pointed to an area direct behind me and said "I don't know why I'm showing you this......" I turned around and THERE WAS ON OF THEM THAR GOLF SWING BOOTHS, THE SAME KIND THAT ARE IN THE PGA SUPERSTORE AND GOLFSMITH.!!!!!!! My kids were there as well as my mom and dad. Kim said "ohhh boy.....never should have told him about this. We're never gonna leave now." I went immediately into the booth. There was a golf bag with a full set of clubs. I grabbed a 4i and got right into Hogan mode. Spent about 30 minutes in there workin on the swing. Everybody was pissed because I wouldn't leave. Man, that thing was COOOOOOOL!! I gotta find out what it would take to set one up in my basement.

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[quote name='grahler' timestamp='1313732115' post='3501381']
It sounds like you are going for pure aesthetic Hogan regardless of ballflight by watching his movements on video.
You're right never mind what he said in any of his books that couldn't help understand him :russian_roulette:

[/quote]

The book would probably help in understanding his method, but I want to gain an understand by actually carrying out the movement I see him doing. I am not sure if my method will help or hurt. I read another post last nite from a guy that is wanting to understand the Hogan "starting down/transition" theory. He said he finally got his hips to move like Hogans on the downswing, and his ball striking improved a great deal, but when he looked back at the book, Hogan said something about the hips start the downswing. Since he was making his move happen using his left foot, he said that he couldn't be right because Hogan said the hips were the way to go, so he tried focusing more on the hip "because Hogan said to"; his swing went to crap shortly thereafter. Said he was back to the drawing board to "gain more understanding on the Hogan hip move."

What the heck???? If his hips started to look like that of Hogan, even if he was mentally thinking of his left foot, why toss it out because the "instruction manual" said otherwise?

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[quote name='Ben Hogan Swing Project' timestamp='1313754676' post='3501604']
[quote name='grahler' timestamp='1313732115' post='3501381']
It sounds like you are going for pure aesthetic Hogan regardless of ballflight by watching his movements on video.
You're right never mind what he said in any of his books that couldn't help understand him :russian_roulette:

[/quote]

The book would probably help in understanding his method, but I want to gain an understand by actually carrying out the movement I see him doing. I am not sure if my method will help or hurt. I read another post last nite from a guy that is wanting to understand the Hogan "starting down/transition" theory. He said he finally got his hips to move like Hogans on the downswing, and his ball striking improved a great deal, but when he looked back at the book, Hogan said something about the hips start the downswing. Since he was making his move happen using his left foot, he said that he couldn't be right because Hogan said the hips were the way to go, so he tried focusing more on the hip "because Hogan said to"; his swing went to crap shortly thereafter. Said he was back to the drawing board to "gain more understanding on the Hogan hip move."

What the heck???? If his hips started to look like that of Hogan, even if he was mentally thinking of his left foot, why toss it out because the "instruction manual" said otherwise?
[/quote]

And my other theory is that if I duplicate the aesthetic Hogan, with no ball on the ground, my work is done. Placing a ball there is just something that will happen to be on the ground getting in the way of the aesthetic move. My law of "duplication" says the ball would have to fly the same way his does if I match his movement.

And don't pull the trigger too soon lol.......you're gonna miss the first guy that was able to swing it just like the master lol!!

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  • Our picks

    • 2024 Texas Children's Houston Open - Discussion and links to Photos
      Please put any questions or Comments here
       
       
       
      General Albums
       
      2024 Texas Children's Houston Open - Monday #1
      2024 Texas Children's Houston Open - Monday #2
      2024 Texas Children's Houston Open - Tuesday #1
      2024 Texas Children's Houston Open - Tuesday #2
      2024 Texas Children's Houston Open - Tuesday #3
       
       
       
       
      WITB Albums
       
      Thorbjorn Olesen - WITB - 2024 Texas Children's Houston Open
      Ben Silverman - WITB - 2024 Texas Children's Houston Open
      Jesse Droemer - SoTX PGA Section POY - WITB - 2024 Texas Children's Houston Open
      David Lipsky - WITB - 2024 Texas Children's Houston Open
      Martin Trainer - WITB - 2024 Texas Children's Houston Open
      Zac Blair - WITB - 2024 Texas Children's Houston Open
      Jacob Bridgeman - WITB - 2024 Texas Children's Houston Open
      Trace Crowe - WITB - 2024 Texas Children's Houston Open
      Jimmy Walker - WITB - 2024 Texas Children's Houston Open
      Daniel Berger - WITB(very mini) - 2024 Texas Children's Houston Open
      Chesson Hadley - WITB - 2024 Texas Children's Houston Open
      Callum McNeill - WITB - 2024 Texas Children's Houston Open
      Rhein Gibson - WITB - 2024 Texas Children's Houston Open
      Patrick Fishburn - WITB - 2024 Texas Children's Houston Open
      Peter Malnati - WITB - 2024 Texas Children's Houston Open
      Raul Pereda - WITB - 2024 Texas Children's Houston Open
      Gary Woodland WITB (New driver, iron shafts) – 2024 Texas Children's Houston Open
      Padraig Harrington WITB – 2024 Texas Children's Houston Open
       
       
       
       
      Pullout Albums
       
      Tom Hoge's custom Cameron - 2024 Texas Children's Houston Open
      Cameron putter - 2024 Texas Children's Houston Open
      Piretti putters - 2024 Texas Children's Houston Open
      Ping putter - 2024 Texas Children's Houston Open
      Kevin Dougherty's custom Cameron putter - 2024 Texas Children's Houston Open
      Bettinardi putter - 2024 Texas Children's Houston Open
      Cameron putter - 2024 Texas Children's Houston Open
      Erik Barnes testing an all-black Axis1 putter – 2024 Texas Children's Houston Open
      Tony Finau's new driver shaft – 2024 Texas Children's Houston Open
       
       
       
       
       
      • 7 replies
    • 2024 Valspar Championship WITB Photos (Thanks to bvmagic)- Discussion & Links to Photos
      This weeks WITB Pics are from member bvmagic (Brian). Brian's first event for WRX was in 2008 at Bayhill while in college. Thanks so much bv.
       
      Please put your comments or question on this thread. Links to all the threads are below...
       
       
       
       
        • Like
      • 31 replies
    • 2024 Arnold Palmer Invitational - Discussion and Links to Photos
      Please put any questions or comments here
       
       
       
      General Albums
       
      2024 Arnold Palmer Invitational - Monday #1
      2024 Arnold Palmer Invitational - Monday #2
      2024 Arnold Palmer Invitational - Monday #3
       
       
       
       
      WITB Albums
       
      Matt (LFG) Every - WITB - 2024 Arnold Palmer Invitational
      Sahith Theegala - WITB - 2024 Arnold Palmer Invitational
       
       
       
       
       
      Pullout Albums
       
      New Cameron putters (and new "LD" grip) - 2024 Arnold Palmer Invitational
      New Bettinardi MB & CB irons - 2024 Arnold Palmer Invitational
      Custom Bettinardi API putter cover - 2024 Arnold Palmer Invitational
      Custom Swag API covers - 2024 Arnold Palmer Invitational
      New Golf Pride Reverse Taper grips - 2024 Arnold Palmer Invitational
       
       
       
       
       
       
       
        • Like
      • 15 replies
    • 2024 Cognizant Classic - Discussion and Links to Photos
      Please put any questions or comments here
       
       
       
       
      General Albums
       
      2024 Cognizant Classic - Monday #1
      2024 Cognizant Classic - Monday #2
      2024 Cognizant Classic - Monday #3
      2024 Cognizant Classic - Monday #4
       
       
       
      WITB Albums
       
      Brandt Snedeker - WITB - 2024 Cognizant Classic
      Max Greyserman - WITB - 2024 Cognizant Classic
      Eric Cole - WITB - 2024 Cognizant Classic
      Carl Yuan - WITb - 2024 Cognizant Classic
      Russell Henley - WITB - 2024 Cognizant Classic
      Justin Sun - WITB - 2024 Cognizant Classic
      Alex Noren - WITB - 2024 Cognizant Classic
      Shane Lowry - WITB - 2024 Cognizant Classic
      Taylor Montgomery - WITB - 2024 Cognizant Classic
      Jake Knapp (KnappTime_ltd) - WITB - - 2024 Cognizant Classic
       
       
       
      Pullout Albums
       
      New Super Stoke Pistol Lock 1.0 & 2.0 grips - 2024 Cognizant Classic
      LA Golf new insert putter - 2024 Cognizant Classic
      New Garsen Quad Tour 15 grip - 2024 Cognizant Classic
      New Swag covers - 2024 Cognizant Classic
      Jacob Bridgeman's custom Cameron putter - 2024 Cognizant Classic
      Bud Cauley's custom Cameron putters - 2024 Cognizant Classic
      Ryo Hisatsune's custom Cameron putter - 2024 Cognizant Classic
      Chris Kirk - new black Callaway Apex CB irons and a few Odyssey putters - 2024 Cognizant Classic
      Alejandro Tosti's custom Cameron putter - 2024 Cognizant Classic
       
       
       
       
       
       
       
       
      • 2 replies
    • 2024 Genesis Invitational - Discussion and Links to Photos
      Please put any questions or comments here
       
       
       
      General Albums
       
      2024 Genesis Invitational - Monday #1
      2024 Genesis Invitational - Monday #2
      2024 Genesis Invitational - Tuesday #1
      2024 Genesis Invitational - Tuesday #2
      2024 Genesis Invitational - Tuesday #3
      2024 Genesis Invitational - Tuesday #4
       
       
       
       
      WITB Albums
       
      Rory McIlroy - WITB - 2024 Genesis Invitational
      Sepp Straka - WITB - 2024 Genesis Invitational
      Patrick Rodgers - WITB - 2024 Genesis Invitational
      Brendon Todd - WITB - 2024 Genesis Invitational
      Denny McCarthy - WITB - 2024 Genesis Invitational
      Corey Conners - WITB - 2024 Genesis Invitational
      Chase Johnson - WITB - 2024 Genesis Invitational
      Tiger Woods - WITB - 2024 Genesis Invitational
      Tommy Fleetwood - WITB - 2024 Genesis Invitational
      Matt Fitzpatrick - WITB - 2024 Genesis Invitational
      Si Woo Kim - WITB - 2024 Genesis Invitational
      Viktor Hovland - WITB - 2024 Genesis Invitational
      Wyndham Clark - WITB - 2024 Genesis Invitational
      Cam Davis - WITB - 2024 Genesis Invitational
      Nick Taylor - WITB - 2024 Genesis Invitational
      Ben Baller WITB update (New putter, driver, hybrid and shafts) – 2024 Genesis Invitational
       
       
       
       
       
      Pullout Albums
       
      New Vortex Golf rangefinder - 2024 Genesis Invitational
      New Fujikura Ventus shaft - 2024 Genesis Invitational
      Tiger Woods & TaylorMade "Sun Day Red" apparel launch event, product photos – 2024 Genesis Invitational
      Tiger Woods Sun Day Red golf shoes - 2024 Genesis Invitational
      Aretera shafts - 2024 Genesis Invitational
      New Toulon putters - 2024 Genesis Invitational
      Tiger Woods' new white "Sun Day Red" golf shoe prototypes – 2024 Genesis Invitational
       
       
       
       
       
      • 22 replies

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