How to make a backswing like Hogan

[tylerdurden]

Setup the same as Hogan. Grip is key, right hand has to be on top/weak enough. Let right side relax, with right shoulder internally rotated slightly and right elbow facing away from target which is natural with the weak right hand grip.

 

Takeaway is key. Push club back with the left side against a relaxed right side. Keep club face facing ball and low. This gets right hand more on top of grip, which get's right elbow relatively high. This also pushes right elbow up, away from and away from target line.

 

As this all happening, you go from a relaxed right side to adding tension by gradually externally rotating right shoulder to get right elbow close to left elbow.

[Ben Hogan Swing Project]

Hey Tyler!! Glad to see you're still around. I thought you had been banished or something. How's the swing going? I haven't seen any recent swing vids of yours. What kind of Hogan stuff you workin on right now? I'm assuming the backswing because of the thread title??

[tylerdurden]

Nope not kicked off yet lol.

Swings going well. When I look back at all my old swings now I see a ton of problems. So I'm working on eliminating them 1 by 1. It's a long list so it's been a project but I think it'll fall in to place soon. My grip, ball position, arms in the backswing, and pivot were all suspect. Some aspects were good but I had some issues with each one that was kind of undermining everything I was trying to do.

I go to see slicefixer in a few weeks too so that should be awesome. I'll get some swing videos posted before I go.

[tylerdurden]

In terms of Hogan stuff I'm working on now, it's as follows:

1- Right hand grip - mine was too under the club, so I couldn't make the same backswing as Hogan because if I did then the club would be super shut. So I got the grip weaker and more on top so I can mirror Hogan's movements more. Thanks to TEConner for pointing out my grip sucked.

2- Arms in backswing. See my original post, that basically sums it up. My problems were my right elbow was too close to body and too low. Hogan's gets away from body as stays high late into BS. I'm really excited about this change/

3- Pivot - I lower too much in takeaway, and my back gets kind of hunched over away from the target at the top of my swing. This ties into this stuff above as well. But Hogan's back was more convex at top of backswing. Lower back had arc, upper back pretty vertical (both from face on view), so I'm trying to mirror that.

4- Ball position - Almost forgot this one. Mine was getting way too forward, past left heal with driver. Hogan is always inside left heal. So I'm moving it back.


I think/hope all this stuff is connected. I've been able to get leverage through impact which used to be impossible for me, but that doesn't mean the rest of my swing can be sloppy. I mean I still hit it wild even with leverage if I swing bad.

[Ben Hogan Swing Project]

Good stuff. Would be cool to see before and after Slicefxr vid.

[tylerdurden]

Yeah for sure. At this point I hope Slice can help my head more than my swing. My swing is such a moving target because my ideas are always changing. I hope he can weed out a bunch of the garbage in my head. Hopefully he doesn;t kick me out for asking a million questions.

[Ben Hogan Swing Project]

[quote name='tylerdurden' timestamp='1350574671' post='5811651']
Yeah for sure. At this point I hope Slice can help my head more than my swing. My swing is such a moving target because my ideas are always changing. I hope he can weed out a bunch of the garbage in my head. Hopefully he doesn;t kick me out for asking a million questions.
[/quote]

Limit those to 10 questions Sir so Slice doesn't ban you lol. By the way, does he have wrinkly skin and grey hair and play persimmons and blades and call you Sonny?

Man you sure make your swing sound bad. Don't you play from the tips and shoot in the 70's?? Sounds like a dream to me. The only thing I know about tips is everybodys always tryin to give them to me. The only thing I know about the 70's is when I wore bellbottoms and a superfly collar to school.

[Stryker]

Is it really so wrong to have the right elbow close to the body? Dufner hit's it fine and his swing has been compared to Hogan's quite a bit.

[media=]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kSG6kaiP6nQ[/media]

[TeeAce]

[quote name='Stryker' timestamp='1350575364' post='5811723']
Is it really so wrong to have the right elbow close to the body? Dufner hit's it fine and his swing has been compared to Hogan's quite a bit.


[/quote]

Would say Dufners BSW is quite much Hogan, but through the impact not at all.

But I also like player to keep the right elbow close to the body. Also put lot of attention how it rotates. Would say on piece takeaway has ruined many players.

[hoganfan924]

[quote name='tylerdurden' timestamp='1350574671' post='5811651']
Yeah for sure. At this point I hope Slice can help my head more than my swing. My swing is such a moving target because my ideas are always changing. I hope he can weed out a bunch of the garbage in my head. Hopefully he doesn;t kick me out for asking a million questions.
[/quote]

He'll simplify things for you and get you to focus on the "essential few" instead of the "insignificant many." You already have a good swing but you let too many unfiltered ideas pass through your brain which short circuits things, IMO.

[dairic]

[quote name='tylerdurden' timestamp='1350573565' post='5811555']
2- Arms in backswing. See my original post, that basically sums it up. My problems were my right elbow was too close to body and too low. Hogan's gets away from body as stays high late into BS. I'm really excited about this change/
[/quote]

I implemented what you're trying to do a while back with great results. To me it feels like a steep shoulder turn with a deep hip turn.

[quote name='tylerdurden' timestamp='1350573565' post='5811555']
4- Ball position - Almost forgot this one. Mine was getting way too forward, past left heal with driver. Hogan is always inside left heal. So I'm moving it back.
[/quote]

I've struggled with this also. It depends which club I'm using. If I play with an old persimmon driver I basically set up the ball like Hogan did and this seems to work just fine. With a modern driver I move the ball up in my stance a bit to get a positive AOA, but I still haven't settled on something that feels 100% right with modern clubs.

[tylerdurden]

Stryker - I don't think it's wrong, it's just that what I was doing was wrong. My elbow wasn't just close, it got very behind at the top, like Matt Kutcher. Obviously that works for him, but I'm not trying to swing the club like that at all. Dufner is close but he keeps it more in front much better than I did. But he still isn't as good as I want to be through impact IMO.

HF924 - Thanks for compliment. I agree I have too much stuff passing through my head relatively unfiltered. To be honest I do it on purpose because I think it's part of the learning procress. To some degree. By that I mean take everything in, test it and think about it. And then relfect on what works and what doesn't. I used to believe my own ideas on the golf swing. Now I have very little confidence in any of my theories/beliefs because I have a track record of bad ideas. Anyway, the problem with the learning process I've been using is I've left out a teacher. I haven't had much success finding anyone local so I get to go see the boss himself.

Anyway, I remember you said something to that effect a while ago - something like, in golf you always learn and you look back at your old self and realize how stupid you were. 100% true for me. Lol keep in mind im the idiot who claimed to have Hogan's secret.

[Ben Hogan Swing Project]

[quote name='tylerdurden' timestamp='1350573565' post='5811555']
In terms of Hogan stuff I'm working on now, it's as follows:

1- Right hand grip - mine was too under the club, so I couldn't make the same backswing as Hogan because if I did then the club would be super shut. So I got the grip weaker and more on top so I can mirror Hogan's movements more. Thanks to TEConner for pointing out my grip sucked.

2- Arms in backswing. See my original post, that basically sums it up. My problems were my right elbow was too close to body and too low. Hogan's gets away from body as stays high late into BS. I'm really excited about this change/

3- Pivot - I lower too much in takeaway, and my back gets kind of hunched over away from the target at the top of my swing. This ties into this stuff above as well. But Hogan's back was more convex at top of backswing. Lower back had arc, upper back pretty vertical (both from face on view), so I'm trying to mirror that.

4- Ball position - Almost forgot this one. Mine was getting way too forward, past left heal with driver. Hogan is always inside left heal. So I'm moving it back.


I think/hope all this stuff is connected. I've been able to get leverage through impact which used to be impossible for me, but that doesn't mean the rest of my swing can be sloppy. I mean I still hit it wild even with leverage if I swing bad.
[/quote]

Sounds like you're after a lot of Hogan stuff here. I remember seeing one of your front-on iron swings a few months ago. It was a night time vid. I think it had a bunch of bright lights in the background or something. I had my Hogan decoder glasses on and I said to myself "Man! From this view, Tyler's soooooooooooooooo close. That's basically a Hogan swing. Wow!"

Now of course that was the front view; the DTL view has to have that Hogan impact absolute of open hips/glued right elbow/left forearm peeking thru.

[TeeAce]

TD, what about simple idea that you all the time try to twist your right arm so that the right elbow points toward the target line? So you ext. rotate it and let the right elbow fold to your side and keep it that way.

[hoganfan924]

[quote name='tylerdurden' timestamp='1350584928' post='5812605']
Stryker - I don't think it's wrong, it's just that what I was doing was wrong. My elbow wasn't just close, it got very behind at the top, like Matt Kutcher. Obviously that works for him, but I'm not trying to swing the club like that at all. Dufner is close but he keeps it more in front much better than I did. But he still isn't as good as I want to be through impact IMO.

HF924 - Thanks for compliment. I agree I have too much stuff passing through my head relatively unfiltered. To be honest I do it on purpose because I think it's part of the learning procress. To some degree. By that I mean take everything in, test it and think about it. And then relfect on what works and what doesn't. I used to believe my own ideas on the golf swing. Now I have very little confidence in any of my theories/beliefs because I have a track record of bad ideas. Anyway, the problem with the learning process I've been using is I've left out a teacher. I haven't had much success finding anyone local so I get to go see the boss himself.

Anyway, I remember you said something to that effect a while ago - something like, in golf you always learn and you look back at your old self and realize how stupid you were. 100% true for me. Lol keep in mind im the idiot who claimed to have Hogan's secret.
[/quote]

Complete confidence and trust in what you're doing is extremely beneficial in being able to PLAY the game effectively. Too many ideas and uncertainty raises doubts and erodes confidence, even when you have a pretty good swing. For an elite player, this is perhaps the most important reason in having a coach you trust. Look at the tour pros that coach hop. Guys with supreme talent that often fall apart when the chips are down.

[willard1523]

Thanks Tyler, I never thought about the right elbow that way before. I think you're on to something.

[Jobu]

if the angle of right elbow folding at the top of the backswing is equal to the elbow plane at impact, you can turn into the swing as fast as you want.

[tylerdurden]

How would you measure such a thing?

[tembolo1284]

So what's the status on this tyler?