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[quote name='Bigmean' timestamp='1420931750' post='10723715']
Hmmmm. That is interesting, I have never heard of that....I don't swing hard, always played s shafts, I have a 92/93 mph 6 iron, which I think is right in the middle of stiff category.

I do have a late release with a lot of lag, so that speed all comes at the end through impact. I know my swing looks more unassuming speed wise than it really is at the ball from that.
[/quote]85mph is in middle of stiff imo 92/93 is pretty high, it's on upper end and x flex category

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Bigmean.... I used to hit these foshizzel drizzle shots you speak of..often with s300 and Px 6,0 flighted shafts.... I think Tamale is correct..Your probably overpowering a bit at times.. I play a px 6.5 or x100...haven't had my SS measured with an iron but with driver it averages out 115-118 played s300 for years as its most common off the rack.... The light bulb went off for me when taking my 1st lessons year before last... My coach called me up and said check your email.. I did and he had sent a video of my swing from the face on view.... He said look at the shaft when you start down... the club head was by my left ear and my hands were already almost to my waist... we videoed it more the next week and it was impossible to get my hands ahead of the ball at impact.. the shaft would kick so hard the clubhead was passing my hands before impact... what I had was higher swing speed plus a harsh transition with a full (at times past parallel ) backswing.. We have lessened the backswing and smoothed the transition out as of now but I still find better dispersion with a px 6.5 or x100... The flight path you describe is exactly what I remember... almost like the ball is trying to make a loop de loop but but not quite all the way...even farther I would be able to hear the ball "flutter" as it left the clubface...Im guessing the spin was off the charts...especially to make a ball fly the way it was.. You might demo a x100 and see what happens.... I bet you love it.. Im toying with shafts myself at the moment.. I love the 6.5 in the 6 7 8 9 irons but it is a bit low launching in the long irons..I can hit it fine but it feels like work if you know what I mean.. I haven't decided if ill go 6.0 in the 3 4 5 or soft step x2 in the 6.5..... another side effect if in fact the shafts you playing are too soft and you go to something harder, will be more distance... I picked up a full club going s300 to px 6.5 with the same club head...distance isn't he end goal but it ever hurts anything if its free and under control..

TM SIM max 10.8 Fuji Ventus red 6x 
Ping G410 15.5* Graphite Design ADDI 8x
Ping G410 21* ADDI 105x 
Ping Blueprint  3- PW   Modus 130X 
Artisan   53 59 s400
Cameron GSS 1.5 009. Sound slot,  tungsten weights. 


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[quote name='avguy' timestamp='1420876506' post='10720581']
Really like rotating two mb sets:[list]
[*]Callaway Razr X MBs
[*]Mizuno MP-69s
[/list]
I'm no low-HC player, but my game is merely a constant attempt to match the more solid ball striking from the range over to the course, [i]not just with these irons[/i]! The range play is fun, and the feedback and ability to shape shots with them is why I like each one.

With that, my misses in iron course play (4-5x/round) are usually hard pulls left, that don't feel punishing off the face. It's my tempo going whacko/nerves on approach shots. I am [b]not[/b] seeking equipment changes into GI irons for a correction, as the problem is between my ears, affecting my arms-hands-club.

As it seems, the earlier release/closing of the blade face I feel could now be slightly corrected with some of the newer (or older and extinct) mb designs. I am very intrigued with the Nike VP MBs which have weight in the toe to move the GG away from the heel. This is also coming into Cobra when Fly-Z Pros come out. Seems interesting that tour pros had input on this in both models (Tiger/Rickie).

[size=4][size=5]Do any of you MB players out there believe these two models will indeed be highly anti-left[/size]?[/size] I'm probably going to get the Vapor Pros as I like their Nippon shaft offering. Long live the MB/Blade playing crowd, from excellent to average in abilities! :glare:
[/quote]Thats a mechanics issue not club issue

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[quote name='myr79' timestamp='1420912997' post='10722277']
[quote name='Geohans' timestamp='1420898777' post='10721085']
Mid single digit. . . . MP-4s, and about to add a set of MP-64s-- just because Mizuno thinks the MP-15s are replacement for the 64s.

Not.

I went 32-67-68-69 before the 4s.

I enjoy the feel and added control that seems to disappear every time I try something like AP-2s. S55, on the other hand, could work well for me.
[/quote]Couldn't agree more. I've thought about picking up some 64's as well. The 15's are not even close, in any category. IMHO. I have tested the S55 ad nauseam and I always come away impressed, just can't pull the trigger...
[/quote]mp15 is a replacement for the mp59...idk why people think they are replacing 64....totally different category of irons....mp15 just uses the mp64 sole because it's very well designed and proven.....a 64 replacement will come next year I am sure

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[quote name='fr0sty' timestamp='1420932664' post='10723779']
[quote name='NRJyzr' timestamp='1420924827' post='10723199']
A comment on Mizuno blades....

It would seem they hit the ball fairly high. I have MS-11s, when I first got them, I noticed I was hitting them higher than the same numbered Vibration Matched Golden Ram iron, in spite of the MS-11s being almost a club stronger lofted (same as MP-29 lofts, I had my Rams set with FG-17 lofts).

The fabled MP-33s hit the ball higher for me. The MP-32s hit the ball even higher yet.

It's one of the reasons I've got a love/hate with that set.

For those with trajectory issues, one must pay attention to this aspect. If you're a low ball hitter, you're in good shape. :)
[/quote]

Partially agree...The MP32s launch the ball quite high, but being blades they can be flighted any way you want really...
[/quote]

Yes, they can be flighted lower, but the point is they naturally fly higher. It's not what can you do with them, but what do they do "normally" with no extra effort in any particular direction.

The Ever Changing Bag!  A lot of mixing and matching
Driver:  Cobra Fly-Z+, Xcaliber 7.5 TS, 44", King LTD, HZRDUS 75 6.5, 44.25"
3w:  Cobra King LTD, Aldila Tour Blue 85 S, 42.5"; Stage 2 Tour, SO Fiber Tour Trac 100 X, 42.5"
Hybrid:  TaylorMade Stage 2 Tour, NV105 S or DGS400

Irons grab bag:  Mizuno MP-37, DGS300; Golden Ram TW276, NV105; Golden Ram TW282, Precision 6.5; Ram TG-898, Super Peening Blue X; 1980 Golden Rams, Dynamic S; MacGregor Muirfield, Dynamic S; Wilson Staff 78 Tour Blades, Dynamic S
GW:  Dynacraft Dual Millled 52*, DGS400
SW:  Ram Watson Scoring System 55*, DGX 7i shaft; Ram TG-898, DGS400; Ram TG-898, NV105 S; Wilson Staff PMP 58*, DGS300; Ram 1982 Commemorative Nickel 58*, Dynamic S; Ram TW282, DGS; Ram TW276, DGS
LW:  Maltby Design 60* mid sole, DGS400; Maltby Design 60* mid sole, NV105 S
Putter:  Snake Eyes Viper Tour Sv1, 34.25"; Yes! Nicky, 34"
Balls: Wilson Staff Duo Professional or 50 Elite, TP5

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[quote name='dunn' timestamp='1420942388' post='10724617']
[quote name='myr79' timestamp='1420912997' post='10722277']
[quote name='Geohans' timestamp='1420898777' post='10721085']
Mid single digit. . . . MP-4s, and about to add a set of MP-64s-- just because Mizuno thinks the MP-15s are replacement for the 64s.

Not.

I went 32-67-68-69 before the 4s.

I enjoy the feel and added control that seems to disappear every time I try something like AP-2s. S55, on the other hand, could work well for me.
[/quote]Couldn't agree more. I've thought about picking up some 64's as well. The 15's are not even close, in any category. IMHO. I have tested the S55 ad nauseam and I always come away impressed, just can't pull the trigger...
[/quote]mp15 is a replacement for the mp59...idk why people think they are replacing 64....totally different category of irons....mp15 just uses the mp64 sole because it's very well designed and proven.....a 64 replacement will come next year I am sure
[/quote]Point taken. I didn't get along with the 59's either. Just not for me. Look forward to seeing the 64 replacement.

Cobra F9 8*
ST190TS 15*
P790 3i
P7TW 4-PW
TM MG2 56*
PM grind 19 60*
Handsome Too
Pro V1 (at the moment)

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Played a set of 690mb's for two years, dropped the HCP to 5 and bought a set of 712mb's. Played these the last two years and will stay with them for foreseeable future.

Titleist 915D2 PX Hzrdous Yellow 63G Stiff
Titleist 915F15 Diamanna Stiff
Titleist 915H 19 Aldila Rouge Stiff
712 CB/MB PX 6.0 (4-PW)
Cold Forged Vokey Wedges (52,56,60) S200
Richards RT-1 Tour Hand Stamped 1of1

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I'll give a nod to the Tommy Armour 986 Tour Blades. I brought my set to the TMAG R11 irons rollout in Dallas and everyone wanted to hit them. Then they found out that they were shafted with DG Tour X7 shafts. Pure joy when you button them. But punishment if you miss.

 

They made me realize how much offset is in the modern forgings. Only Miura Straight Necks and some models of Mizuno come close.

 

post-664-0-68311200-1351358332_thumb.jpg

post-664-0-68426200-1351358270_thumb.jpg

post-664-0-91135600-1351358248_thumb.jpg

 

If you want some interesting cast blades, find a set of Cleveland 485 Tour Edition BeCu blades. One of the few cast blades that I liked.

 

Bad castings? Goldwin NP-57 blades. Felt horrible.

Mizuno ST200G 9° / Aldila Synergy Black Proto 75-TX   
TC Callaway XHot 3DEEP 13° / Project X-10A2 (The Dog's BALLS!)

TC Callaway X2Hot 5DEEP 18.5° / Project X-10A2 (The Dog's BALLS Part Deux)

Mizuno CLK 20° Hybrid / Project X-HA1

Raw Mizuno MP-63 5-PW / Tour Issue Dynamic Gold X7 

Titleist Vokey SM6 50°F /  Tour Issue Dynamic Gold X7
Titleist Vokey SM5 Black 54°M&60°M / Tour Issue Dynamic Gold X7
Mizuno M-Craft I Blue Ion 365g

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Whats up blade users. College golfer, 2 hadicap, and play Cobra Amp Cell Pro blades. I know Cobra isnt your first thought when you think of a great blade, but these irons feel so good to me and I love the look of a blade. I have Project X 6.5 shafts and Multi-compound grips installed in these irons.

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Those cobras are sweet. I am in the group that likes old hogans and macs as much as new stuff as well. It is all good.


Interesting Dunn and blade hunter. That 6 iron speed is just what I know from the booth at pga super store. My 6 is my 180 club stock but I will/can step on it up to 190 over a smooth 5 if short is a safe miss if I don't get it. I thought that speed was about upper normal, or stiff all day. I am tempted to get lessons this summer. I haven't had a real lesson since I was 15, except for a 3 lesson stint where I traded some work with a "pro" that hurt me more than helped and that soured me on lessons about 7 years ago. I will have a buddy video at the range and check it out for sure now. My balls don't roll out(which is good) so the spin is there for sure. Loop de loop is exactly what I am talking about, and I could never make sense of how it could happen from a path and face perspective, it seems impossible to make the ball do that, and the fall back is not slight, it is aggressive, but again, back to the target so I never gave it more thought other than the wonder of the physics behind the how. Thanks guys!

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Biggie, another thought.... it could be optical illusion. You're expecting the ball to do X, and when it does something else, it might appear to curve to the naked eye.

Not saying I think it's what's happening here, but it may be worth consideration. <shrug>

The Ever Changing Bag!  A lot of mixing and matching
Driver:  Cobra Fly-Z+, Xcaliber 7.5 TS, 44", King LTD, HZRDUS 75 6.5, 44.25"
3w:  Cobra King LTD, Aldila Tour Blue 85 S, 42.5"; Stage 2 Tour, SO Fiber Tour Trac 100 X, 42.5"
Hybrid:  TaylorMade Stage 2 Tour, NV105 S or DGS400

Irons grab bag:  Mizuno MP-37, DGS300; Golden Ram TW276, NV105; Golden Ram TW282, Precision 6.5; Ram TG-898, Super Peening Blue X; 1980 Golden Rams, Dynamic S; MacGregor Muirfield, Dynamic S; Wilson Staff 78 Tour Blades, Dynamic S
GW:  Dynacraft Dual Millled 52*, DGS400
SW:  Ram Watson Scoring System 55*, DGX 7i shaft; Ram TG-898, DGS400; Ram TG-898, NV105 S; Wilson Staff PMP 58*, DGS300; Ram 1982 Commemorative Nickel 58*, Dynamic S; Ram TW282, DGS; Ram TW276, DGS
LW:  Maltby Design 60* mid sole, DGS400; Maltby Design 60* mid sole, NV105 S
Putter:  Snake Eyes Viper Tour Sv1, 34.25"; Yes! Nicky, 34"
Balls: Wilson Staff Duo Professional or 50 Elite, TP5

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My name is Bernard and I use blades........

I'm a delusional narcissistic poseur, who has no grasp of reality and suffers from a messiah complex........or so some have inferred

Actually, I'm 51 picked up the game at 25, left it for 10 years and came back to it with passion 3 years ago . Score low to mid 80's.

Currently game Rac TP MB's, I love them. Have Ram Tour Grinds & Mac 1025M's as back ups and I'm looking to acquire some more "classics".

Golf suffers from a greater cultural miss-conception that technology can fix everything. It can do a lot....up to a point. There's a bell curve to it though. At some point, tech will detract. See the fate of pro tennis over the last 35 years. Borg & Mac with wood racquets were way more interesting than the power serve game that came in with composites. Tennis courts are empty today.Tech killed a great sport. In golf we have aerospace engineering, Trackman and composites, yet scoring averages do not really move down, Why? Maybe it's because the secret is really in the dirt and one has to dig to get it. But that attitude does not really add to quarterly earnings does it?

So I play blades to get to the secret faster. A golf swing is "felt" more than anything else. MB's add clairvoyance, they add control, they also throw in a dose of humility, they help keep it real. It was said that Hogan never read a yardage marker. I always think of that when I see some one checkng their iphone to confirm they are 68 yards away.

I love the journey, I love the stroll I take with a bag over my back, I hope to do it often and for a long time.

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Blade player here for pretty much ever. Played "those irons not to be mentioned in this thread" for a little bit when I was younger (Lynx Parallax ... if they were good enough for Freddie...), but quickly returned to blades.

Irons used throughout the years:
Hogan Radials (first clubs I ever played, "4" shaft)
Lynx Parallax (stiff, the "irons in a style not to be mentioned")
Taylor Made ICW 5 (stiff, the first "combo" set I can ever remember on the market)
Cleveland TA1 irons (played 2000 until 2014, see below for the beloved original driving iron pic)
Mizuno MP-4 (bought this last September)
Callaway Apex MB (my wife's favorite topic of mocking me for an inability to win the lotto, but could win clubs)

Playing currently to a 3.0 'cap (up from 2.0 in October) thanks to being a massively inconsistent yo-yo player right now. I am sure things will even out soon enough ... provided I don't post another amazing back to back rounds of 68-86. Just love the feel and the ability to make the ball do what I want that a blade and very little offset gives.

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Hogan Apex Blades They are just so nice... There is so much good stuff out there and I am looking at AP2's.. Any feedback on AP2's is much appreciated. I am considering 710's or 712's as I have not heard great things about the 714's... Then I see the Titleist MB's and they are soooo pretty!!!! Anyway, started with blades and , find it hard to switch...

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[quote name='dunn' timestamp='1420942388' post='10724617']
[quote name='myr79' timestamp='1420912997' post='10722277']
[quote name='Geohans' timestamp='1420898777' post='10721085']
Mid single digit. . . . MP-4s, and about to add a set of MP-64s-- just because Mizuno thinks the MP-15s are replacement for the 64s.

Not.

I went 32-67-68-69 before the 4s.

I enjoy the feel and added control that seems to disappear every time I try something like AP-2s. S55, on the other hand, could work well for me.
[/quote]Couldn't agree more. I've thought about picking up some 64's as well. The 15's are not even close, in any category. IMHO. I have tested the S55 ad nauseam and I always come away impressed, just can't pull the trigger...
[/quote]mp15 is a replacement for the mp59...idk why people think they are replacing 64....totally different category of irons....mp15 just uses the mp64 sole because it's very well designed and proven.....a 64 replacement will come next year I am sure
[/quote]

I hope you are right, but this is not the story at the moment. 64s have been discontinued, they are in the "signature" line for leftover sets, and Mizuno reps and customer service are saying there's no replacement. It has not been the pattern historically that a model is terminated and no replacement announced.

Perhaps there will be a blending of the 4 and the 64, an updated 32 or something.

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Bernard, welcome, and that seems to be the consensus shared those 80s golfers not totally brainwashed by marketing. It is neither right, nor wrong, but is just one of many acceptable a paths as good as any to get to where you are going. This thread was started so you could actually make a post like you did, as an 80s golfer, and not only not get flamed, but have people that have done the same themselves and feel the same way. I still contend at golf under 85, the only club that is wrong is the one you are not mentally comfortable with, the rest of the way to par is 100% your responsibility.

Gaucho, pretty funny on winning the apex and your wife's take. Also, you made me feel better with your 68-86 rounds, I am almost guaranteed one or two 78-86 back to back rounds this summer so it is a misery loves company nice that even you guys shattering par blow up once a blue moon :).

And I know you were having fun, but you can say "CBs" here, or talk some on tangent like the mizuno 64 stuff above. I think it is healthy for any thread to get on good asides. I also think a lot of blade first guys also have a set of cbs, and I also think eventually it would be interesting to know what cbs the blade enthusiasts do like as alternate sets. But this thread is to be a safe haven to say things like Nard did and be safe from any kind of debate that would normally ensure a post like that. Not here. Here that post gets likes, not conflict.

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My first set of clubs I bought when I decided to start playing at the young age of 28 was a used set of Apex pc 2-E with Apex 4 shafts.....the closest I got to cavity backs are the Cobra Greg Norman signature cavity backs that are smaller than most true blades.

I figured that if I could learn to find the sweet spot on those Apex irons, I could hit anything.

My current stable of weapons:
The aforementioned Cobra' 1-PW
1999 Apex 3-LW
2 sets of Taylormade MB's 3-pw and 5-pw(with the red weight)
macgregor Jack Nicklaus Muirfield 4-PW

Not enough space to list the myriad of blades I have played since that first set of PC's but they certainly make it hard to look at thick top lines and offset hosels

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[quote name='Bigmean' timestamp='1420980107' post='10726139']
Bernard, welcome, and that seems to be the consensus shared those 80s golfers not totally brainwashed by marketing. It is neither right, nor wrong, but is just one of many acceptable a paths as good as any to get to where you are going. This thread was started so you could actually make a post like you did, as an 80s golfer, and not only not get flamed, but have people that have done the same themselves and feel the same way. I still contend at golf under 85, the only club that is wrong is the one you are not mentally comfortable with, the rest of the way to par is 100% your responsibility.

Gaucho, pretty funny on winning the apex and your wife's take. Also, you made me feel better with your 68-86 rounds, I am almost guaranteed one or two 78-86 back to back rounds this summer so it is a misery loves company nice that even you guys shattering par blow up once a blue moon :).

And I know you were having fun, but you can say "CBs" here, or talk some on tangent like the mizuno 64 stuff above. I think it is healthy for any thread to get on good asides. I also think a lot of blade first guys also have a set of cbs, and I also think eventually it would be interesting to know what cbs the blade enthusiasts do like as alternate sets. But this thread is to be a safe haven to say things like Nard did and be safe from any kind of debate that would normally ensure a post like that. Not here. Here that post gets likes, not conflict.
[/quote]



Bigmean...you right on with the thought that us 80s and 90s players are the ones holding on to the MB... a lot of the younger guys have certainly been brainwashed into following the forgiveness trail.... One of my nephews is a prime example.. 17 years old a +2 handicap and he plays ap2s which is fine...played a practice round with him last year before the state tournament and noticed him eyeing my irons on a par 3... I asked if he wanted to hit one... he replied "well im not sure if I want to hit one of those hand stingers" to which I belted out a good laugh . I said just hit one.. The hole called for a 6 iron for him so I handed him my 6 ...he proceeds to flush one over the back fringe... then another then another...turns and looks at me and says " I can hardly feel the ball leaving the clubface" Isaid "that's why I laughed, you have obviously never hit a mizuno MB if you think they are "hand stingers" compared to what your hitting..... So the rest of the round the conversation is based on "why has my dad and my coach told me to stay away from MB irons my whole life?" I tiptoed around that answer as not to get his dad on my case, but told him "your old enough to pick what you want but may have to wait until you can buy your own set if your dad wont agree"...Hes still playing the ap2 but has plans for a mp4 mp64 combo set next.. dad says he has to wait till the face of the ap2s are toast...which for him happens once a year or so... My point is a +2 cap kid being afraid of an MB is ludicrous... Im not saying he SHOULD play them..but he shouldn't lack the confidence to try them if he wants to ... But that's where a lot of these kids are... tricked by the marketing machines to buy the over priced trampoline faced irons when most of them hit the high ball with ease and actually would benefit from and iron with a higher COG...

TM SIM max 10.8 Fuji Ventus red 6x 
Ping G410 15.5* Graphite Design ADDI 8x
Ping G410 21* ADDI 105x 
Ping Blueprint  3- PW   Modus 130X 
Artisan   53 59 s400
Cameron GSS 1.5 009. Sound slot,  tungsten weights. 


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[quote name='bladehunter' timestamp='1420988846' post='10726537']
Bigmean...you right on with the thought that us 80s and 90s players are the ones holding on to the MB...
[/quote]

Ironically, while I'm old enough to be one of those guys, having turned 51 in October, I'm actually not. My first full season playing golf was 1999. As I learned the game, I was in the same boat as the kiddies, learning about Ti vs stainless steel drivers in the 230-275cc range, and a lot of variations on the CBs.

It's only after I got curious about "what came before" that I started investigating, which led me to where I am now.

I did the same with persimmon drivers. Lot of marketing BS in that arena, as well. LOL

The Ever Changing Bag!  A lot of mixing and matching
Driver:  Cobra Fly-Z+, Xcaliber 7.5 TS, 44", King LTD, HZRDUS 75 6.5, 44.25"
3w:  Cobra King LTD, Aldila Tour Blue 85 S, 42.5"; Stage 2 Tour, SO Fiber Tour Trac 100 X, 42.5"
Hybrid:  TaylorMade Stage 2 Tour, NV105 S or DGS400

Irons grab bag:  Mizuno MP-37, DGS300; Golden Ram TW276, NV105; Golden Ram TW282, Precision 6.5; Ram TG-898, Super Peening Blue X; 1980 Golden Rams, Dynamic S; MacGregor Muirfield, Dynamic S; Wilson Staff 78 Tour Blades, Dynamic S
GW:  Dynacraft Dual Millled 52*, DGS400
SW:  Ram Watson Scoring System 55*, DGX 7i shaft; Ram TG-898, DGS400; Ram TG-898, NV105 S; Wilson Staff PMP 58*, DGS300; Ram 1982 Commemorative Nickel 58*, Dynamic S; Ram TW282, DGS; Ram TW276, DGS
LW:  Maltby Design 60* mid sole, DGS400; Maltby Design 60* mid sole, NV105 S
Putter:  Snake Eyes Viper Tour Sv1, 34.25"; Yes! Nicky, 34"
Balls: Wilson Staff Duo Professional or 50 Elite, TP5

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That is true now that you mention it. I could go to a course and shoot 88 with my mp14s in the 90s and no one would think twice, bag boys didn't look twice at them etc. Now if I shoot an 88 with any of my sets I would be ridiculed by about anyone. After one of my rounds with the fourteen fh1000, the bag boy made a comment like "holy crap man, these are butter knives" which thank god the scorecard that day left in the cart had a 78 on it, which was one of my first subconscience thoughts after he said it, I had to think for a split second to remember what I shot knowing if he saw an 83 he would think I was some wannabe, which is really sad in itself. Also what is funny is that the fh1000 are far from butter knives, they look like pings next to my other sets, but he literally never sees traditional clubs anymore and acted like it was persimmon in the bag.

That story about your nephew is very telling as to what has happened from 80s/90s and the 2000s. My good friend can't break 90, but is right there. He is good enough to do it, but has blow ups and a mental number barrier I think. He hits my mizunos better than his GI TM whatever's at the range, I told him they were his for 6 months as an experiment, but he had to stick with them, but his bad shots make him think he can't game them, when in reality his bad shots are just as bad with his clubs but he doesn't feel it the same. I also watch him hit them better, but he still tells me he can't play them. What is funny is the thing he likes most about them and always says is how he doesn't feel the ground, he is so used to bouncing his clubs into the ball or after that he really isn't feeling what a proper strike is, he feels ball ground or ground ball, but never isolates the ball and where on the club.

I think it is disingenuous for major oem marketing to determine someone on the verge of breaking 90 can't use that feel to get better and just needs it to go as far as possible on and endless cycle of bad shots. He is cheap, I think I may bet him $100 if he uses my mizzys for 3 months and nothing else when we play and practice this summer that he will break 90, if he doesn't I pay, if he does, we are even and he learned something. I like the idea of the experiment.

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[quote name='bladehunter' timestamp='1420940767' post='10724473']
Bigmean.... I used to hit these foshizzel drizzle shots you speak of..often with s300 and Px 6,0 flighted shafts.... I think Tamale is correct..Your probably overpowering a bit at times.. I play a px 6.5 or x100...haven't had my SS measured with an iron but with driver it averages out 115-118 played s300 for years as its most common off the rack.... The light bulb went off for me when taking my 1st lessons year before last... My coach called me up and said check your email.. I did and he had sent a video of my swing from the face on view.... He said look at the shaft when you start down... the club head was by my left ear and my hands were already almost to my waist... we videoed it more the next week and it was impossible to get my hands ahead of the ball at impact.. the shaft would kick so hard the clubhead was passing my hands before impact... what I had was higher swing speed plus a harsh transition with a full (at times past parallel ) backswing.. We have lessened the backswing and smoothed the transition out as of now but I still find better dispersion with a px 6.5 or x100... The flight path you describe is exactly what I remember... almost like the ball is trying to make a loop de loop but but not quite all the way...even farther I would be able to hear the ball "flutter" as it left the clubface...Im guessing the spin was off the charts...especially to make a ball fly the way it was.. You might demo a x100 and see what happens.... I bet you love it.. Im toying with shafts myself at the moment.. I love the 6.5 in the 6 7 8 9 irons but it is a bit low launching in the long irons..I can hit it fine but it feels like work if you know what I mean.. I haven't decided if ill go 6.0 in the 3 4 5 or soft step x2 in the 6.5..... another side effect if in fact the shafts you playing are too soft and you go to something harder, will be more distance... I picked up a full club going s300 to px 6.5 with the same club head...distance isn't he end goal but it ever hurts anything if its free and under control..
[/quote]
You should give the DG Pro shaft a try.
A little higher ballflight in the long irons, but in no way ballooning. Stiffer in the shorter irons, and mid irons, but to me the apex is similar overall.
I have 2 sets, and am considering another.

Cobra ZL Encore 8.5 Matrix 6Q3
TEE CB4 tour 15 RIP 70 Sigma
Titleist 909h 19 Voodoo
Mizuno Mp-53 4-pw DG progressive shafts
Odyssey Black ProType 10 Sm 4.5 TP ball
Mizuno raw haze 50, 56 Scratch 60

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[quote name='dunn' timestamp='1420942113' post='10724593']
[quote name='avguy' timestamp='1420876506' post='10720581']
Really like rotating two mb sets:[list]
[*]Callaway Razr X MBs
[*]Mizuno MP-69s
[/list]
I'm no low-HC player, but my game is merely a constant attempt to match the more solid ball striking from the range over to the course, [i]not just with these irons[/i]! The range play is fun, and the feedback and ability to shape shots with them is why I like each one.

With that, my misses in iron course play (4-5x/round) are usually hard pulls left, that don't feel punishing off the face. It's my tempo going whacko/nerves on approach shots. I am [b]not[/b] seeking equipment changes into GI irons for a correction, as the problem is between my ears, affecting my arms-hands-club.

As it seems, the earlier release/closing of the blade face I feel could now be slightly corrected with some of the newer (or older and extinct) mb designs. I am very intrigued with the Nike VP MBs which have weight in the toe to move the GG away from the heel. This is also coming into Cobra when Fly-Z Pros come out. Seems interesting that tour pros had input on this in both models (Tiger/Rickie).

[size=5]Do any of you MB players out there believe these two models will indeed be highly anti-left[/size]? I'm probably going to get the Vapor Pros as I like their Nippon shaft offering. Long live the MB/Blade playing crowd, from excellent to average in abilities! :glare:
[/quote]Thats a mechanics issue not club issue
[/quote]


Dunn; aha, I admit as much in the post, realize [i]I am[/i] the culprit, not the club style (cool) . (Guess my longer diatribe post on here I wanted to do shoulda stayed....)

Anyways, I am just trying to chime in on the threads to see feedback on the new [color=#00ff00]Nike VP[/color] muscle with more wt. in the toe, and somebody had mentioned it was present in much older OEM models even in the '80's blades or so. The new [color=#daa520]Fly-Z Pros[/color] coming out have tungsten in the toe with input from Fowler.

[color=#008080]Does anybody have experience of contrast between the design mention (toe wt. bias) and the more common muscle where the CG is closer to heel due to normal hosel? Just curious if there is indeed an anti-left bias, [i]no cause[/i] is wondered about...[/color]

Also, the Callies & Mizzies have minuscule to minor offset, accordingly. So, [i]that is not[/i] my once in awhile left pull issue. Last time I used high offset irons (2007) was when I gave up having to aim right on all those shots - kinda uncomfortable!

I hit a few of the Vapor Pros off a fitting cart in a Mat( :no2: ) bay last week, and was generally pleased despite being mostly down for the count last several weeks to injury which happens more often as one gets North of 50.

BAG ONE:                                                                                                                     BAG TWO:
-Titleist 917 D2                                                                                          -Cobra F9 Tour Length 
3- Mizuno MP ti                                                                                             5 -Mizuno MP ti
-Titleist 915 H1 18, Titleist 816  H1 21                                                      -TM 2.0 SF 18 & 21
I - Titleist T100/MR KK TiNi 105                                                                   I - TM P760/Recoils F4
W- Mizuno 52, Vokey SM6 58                                                                     - Mizuno 53, Cally 58
P- Bellum Winmore Midi  787                                                                       -Guerin TS Black 370

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[quote name='Bigmean' timestamp='1420994371' post='10726895']
That is true now that you mention it. I could go to a course and shoot 88 with my mp14s in the 90s and no one would think twice, bag boys didn't look twice at them etc. Now if I shoot an 88 with any of my sets I would be ridiculed by about anyone. After one of my rounds with the fourteen fh1000, the bag boy made a comment like "holy crap man, these are butter knives" which thank god the scorecard that day left in the cart had a 78 on it, which was one of my first subconscience thoughts after he said it, I had to think for a split second to remember what I shot knowing if he saw an 83 he would think I was some wannabe, which is really sad in itself. Also what is funny is that the fh1000 are far from butter knives, they look like pings next to my other sets, but he literally never sees traditional clubs anymore and acted like it was persimmon in the bag.

That story about your nephew is very telling as to what has happened from 80s/90s and the 2000s. My good friend can't break 90, but is right there. He is good enough to do it, but has blow ups and a mental number barrier I think. He hits my mizunos better than his GI TM whatever's at the range, I told him they were his for 6 months as an experiment, but he had to stick with them, but his bad shots make him think he can't game them, when in reality his bad shots are just as bad with his clubs but he doesn't feel it the same. I also watch him hit them better, but he still tells me he can't play them. What is funny is the thing he likes most about them and always says is how he doesn't feel the ground, he is so used to bouncing his clubs into the ball or after that he really isn't feeling what a proper strike is, he feels ball ground or ground ball, but never isolates the ball and where on the club.

I think it is disingenuous for major oem marketing to determine someone on the verge of breaking 90 can't use that feel to get better and just needs it to go as far as possible on and endless cycle of bad shots. He is cheap, I think I may bet him $100 if he uses my mizzys for 3 months and nothing else when we play and practice this summer that he will break 90, if he doesn't I pay, if he does, we are even and he learned something. I like the idea of the experiment.
[/quote]

Mr Faldo would back you up:

From his book 'Faldo - In Search Of Perfection' published in 1996:

"With my golf equipment, it is more complicated, as I can only use clubs and balls that suit my game. At various times I have played with Wilson, Spalding and MacGregor clubs; now I use Mizuno. Usually the deals have been put in place before I have a set that I am completely happy with."

"In 1986, after a couple of years out of the limelight and a previous club deal having gone by the board, Karsten Solheim's Ping company was looking to get me interested in playing with their clubs. A set was sent over in the summer of that year and I tried them out in the European Open at Sunningdale - and went round in 62. After the way I had played, John Simpson from IMG came down eager to make the deal, but I don't know what he must have thought when I said, 'I'm sorry, John, these just won't do, the ball goes too straight !'

"I have always been a worker of the ball: I like to shape it left to right or right to left, never straight. The Ping's are fine clubs, but I just couldn't manoeuvre the ball in the way I wanted. Ping's are the frontrunners in perimeter weighted clubs, in which a much higher percentage of the weight is located at the heel and toe of the clubhead, giving a much wider 'sweetspot' than a traditional blade and are more forgiving to the handicap golfer. Their hooks and slices don't go as wide, but it was that very concept that made them unsuitable for me."

"I would advise any youngster aspiring to be a great player to learn the game using blades rather than the 'game-improvement' type clubs. That is the only way to develop a quality strike to see him or her through to the very top. Some of the top players now play with hollow-backed clubs, but learnt their trade with the blade. It is a bit like learning to drive with a gear shift before moving onto automatic transmission."

Callaway Big Bertha Alpha Fubuki ZT Stiff
Callaway XR Speed 3W Project X HZRDUS T800 65 Stiff
Wilson Staff FG Tour M3 21* Hybrid Aldila RIP Stiff
Cobra King CB/MB Flow 4-6, 7-PW C-Taper Stiff
Wilson Staff PMP wedges 50/54/58 KBS Hi-Rev 2.0
Radius Classic 8

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I play forged musclebacks for a couple different reasons. For one i havent found a cast game improvement iron that i could consistently hit well. They just seem too big for me. And two i want the feedback that my mbs give where i know exactly where i hit the ball on the face without even having to look at the club. Im a hard headed sort in that i dont like to take shortcuts very often. If im gonna be good at something i wanna do it the hardest way possible. I dont drive automatic vehicles and i dont smoke e-cigs. I want the real thing&#4322820;

Ping G400 10.5,3W,5W (Eye 2 1,3,5)
Ping Eye 2+no+ 3-SW, BeCu+ LW
Ping 30th Anniversary Anser, Pat Pend. Anser 2
Titleist Pro V1

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I've had a number of sets of my Adams MB2s since they were released and have tried and owned a number of CBs along with them. I have never hit anything better than the MB2s, but every once in a while I shoot that 80 score or just have a bad day with ball striking and my first thought is I'm not good enough or swing consistently to keep these in play. I switch to the CBs and they fine, but never feel the same. I watch what the best players in the area use and I don't see a lot of blades in the bag, but they are all younger. I've been chasing that white ball for over 40 years. Reading through this thread makes me realize my blade choice is right for me. I saw the comment about the "butter knives" and it made me think back to the bag boy who came to clean my first set of MB2s, they were raw and look great to me with all the rust. He goes to clean the set and says "Oh those are pretty old, I don't think I can clean those" Just made me laugh…..

Driver...TM M6- Mortore X F1-65S
TM....Sim Max Ti 3 Wood w/Hulk-70 gram-s
TM..Stage 2 w/Speeder HB-80-S
MP20  MPs w/$-Tapper 120-S 4PW
Mizuno T20 52*, 58* PM Grind
Scotty Cameron Big Sur Pro Platinum 
Ping Crazy-E lite 
Pro v1

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[quote name='Pepperturbo' timestamp='1420834258' post='10717307']
Low single digit and been playing blades for years. My blades of choice are custom MacGregor 1025MB's that find their way into my bag when my ball striking gets stinky. A new set of irons looks to be just around the corner, but I am not sure they will be pure blades though. Don't tell anyone, but aging has it's disadvantages. :)
[/quote]

I can't imagine wrx with Pepp not playing blades!!!!

Driver: Ping G25
16.5° fairway:  Ping G25
23° hybrid:  Ping G25

5i - 9i:  Mizuno MP64
Wedges:  Vokey SM7 46.10  Vokey SM4 54.14 / 58.09
Putter: The Wilson 8802 (vintage model)
Ball: Titleist Pro v1x / Pro v1
Bag: Original Jones Golf Bag (green)

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My name is Sébastien D'Amour. I play to a 2 handicap. I have just found my first set of left handed blades a couple of months ago that I could demo and get fitted.

I play blades because I love a really thin topline and very little offset. The narrower sole also cuts well into the grass. I also love the distance control of the heads. Coming from a set of mc I had issues with hotspots.

Cheers,

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[quote name='Bigmean' timestamp='1420980107' post='10726139']
Bernard, welcome, and that seems to be the consensus shared those 80s golfers not totally brainwashed by marketing. It is neither right, nor wrong, but is just one of many acceptable a paths as good as any to get to where you are going. This thread was started so you could actually make a post like you did, as an 80s golfer, and not only not get flamed, but have people that have done the same themselves and feel the same way. I still contend at golf under 85, the only club that is wrong is the one you are not mentally comfortable with, the rest of the way to par is 100% your responsibility.

Gaucho, pretty funny on winning the apex and your wife's take. Also, you made me feel better with your 68-86 rounds, I am almost guaranteed one or two 78-86 back to back rounds this summer so it is a misery loves company nice that even you guys shattering par blow up once a blue moon :).

And I know you were having fun, but you can say "CBs" here, or talk some on tangent like the mizuno 64 stuff above. I think it is healthy for any thread to get on good asides. I also think a lot of blade first guys also have a set of cbs, and I also think eventually it would be interesting to know what cbs the blade enthusiasts do like as alternate sets. But this thread is to be a safe haven to say things like Nard did and be safe from any kind of debate that would normally ensure a post like that. Not here. Here that post gets likes, not conflict.
[/quote]

Big - Oh yeah, the blow ups are usually epic. Sometimes it is just a day where nothing works and sometimes it is just a ton of bad luck. Definitely not the club... it is me and I know it. Mine are mental (shoot 74 in high school one day, shoot 45 on tourney day (+9), then shoot 88 in a junior tourney) and I don't really think it has gone away. I would love to try another tournament to see if I grew out of it (probably not), so I think it will be a SCGA "one day tournament" and nothing expensive. :)

Case in point: I played Pinehurst #7 and #2 in 2012 and had "one of those days" on both. Played #7 and hit a total of 2 GIR's (both on the front 9) on my way to a ... 90 ... which was lower than the record setting temp (107). Probably didn't help that we played it at 7200 yards (we moved up a set after the warning it is the hardest course at Pinehurst and plays 200 yards longer than the card, and the tees were ALL back with the golds but the par 3's). Next morning, it was on to #2 and another hot day (105 degrees). I spent the front 9 hitting 6/7 fairways and 0/9 greens to shoot 45. Talk about frustration at it's greatest... I never even had a sniff at hitting a green. 109 yard wedge and I blew it over the back... one of those days. At the turn I decided to just go for it and stop worrying about the greens. 6/7 fairways again, but I hit 5 greens on my way to a 39 including a birdie on #18. 3 days later I played the course near my worksite in Rocky Mount and shot 73. I am ready to get my game back in order and play #7 and #2 again ... but if I won the lottery I would stay and play 2, 4, 7, 8, and 9.

On the plus side, even when you have a massive blow up you are still doing it with blades. :)

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[quote name='Gauchograd99' timestamp='1421016046' post='10728685']
On the plus side, even when you have a massive blow up you are still doing it with blades. :)
[/quote]

Love it.

TM M5 10.5°
TEE XCG4 3w 15°
Cobra BioCell 3h
Titleist AP3 4-GW

Bstone J15 52°

Cally MD3 58° Tour Grind
Bettinardi Queen Bee #5

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