Stock M2 Driver Shaft ( Fujikura Pro 60 ). Why is this not such a good shaft?

[rgk5]

Some TM drivers are 1.25" and others are 1.5" in bore depth. I cannot remember which are which depth.

[Stuart_G]

Bore depth isn't the question (all the TM adapters have a bore depth of around 1-1/4" or 1-3/8" if memory serves me). It's BBTG - which is "Bottom of Bore To Ground". The distance from the tip of the shaft (not the tip of the adapter) to the point on the ground from where the playing length is measured. That's the distance that (among other things) will determine what the playing length will be for a certain cut shaft length. Most TM heads have had their BBTG of 1.75" since the start of the adjustable hossels but they have had a few models that were as long as 2". It also can have some impact on the way the shaft plays. e.g. take the same shaft in a head with a 2" BBTG and then put it into a head with a 1.5" BBTG and it's results in roughly the equivalent change that tipping the shaft 1/2" would accomplish (in addition to the half inch shorter playing length).

[rgk5]

I understand all that but I still am puzzled why you are seemingly so concerned about 1/4"? Will that seriously impact the playability of a club for you? If you are, I would measure the BBTG of each head and play the one that better suits your shaft length preference.

[Stuart_G]

While I do appreciate your efforts, based on the info provided so far, we still don't know anything about the BBTG (the different stock length doesn't tell us anything about the BBTG), whether it's the same, has a 1/4" difference or 1/2" difference as suggested by someone else.

 

However, personally, I'm not concerned about the BBTG - but someone else in the thread seemed to be and I thought you were offering to help clear it up. If that's not the case, that's fine, don't worry about it. I'm really not trying to pester you about it, I just wanted to be clear about the info you were providing. The last clarification was simply because when I asked about BBTG, you came back with bore depth info (which is completely different) so wasn't sure if you understood or not what I was really asking.

[rgk5]

While I do appreciate your efforts, based on the info provided so far, we still don't know anything about the BBTG (the different stock length doesn't tell us anything about the BBTG), whether it's the same, has a 1/4" difference or 1/2" difference as suggested by someone else.

 

However, personally, I'm not concerned about the BBTG - but someone else in the thread seemed to be and I thought you were offering to help clear it up. If that's not the case, that's fine, don't worry about it. I'm really not trying to pester you about it, I just wanted to be clear about the info you were providing. The last clarification was simply because when I asked about BBTG, you came back with bore depth info (which is completely different) so wasn't sure if you understood or not what I was really asking.

 

I'll check it tomorrow as I'm at work from 3-8.

[Stuart_G]

Thanks, I really do appreciate it and no rush from my standpoint. While it's not any major point of concern to me, I do admit a certain level of curiosity to see if they have or have not deviated from their standard design practices or not. It's also not bad info to have since a lot of people ask questions about the BBTG of various heads (e.g. buying used shaft pulls and wanting to see if they will be able to get their desired playing length) and it's nice to be able to help them out.

[Ed Settle]

Thanks, I really do appreciate it and no rush from my standpoint. While it's not any major point of concern to me, I do admit a certain level of curiosity to see if they have or have not deviated from their standard design practices or not. It's also not bad info to have since a lot of people ask questions about the BBTG of various heads (e.g. buying used shaft pulls and wanting to see if they will be able to get their desired playing length) and it's nice to be able to help them out.

 

I appreciate all the effort also. My concern and it may not mean squat, if the depth of the bore changed was it on purpose for different cg or because of the speed slot and internal design of the head?

 

Am I crazy or is it something that helps in performance.

 

[wobgon]

Thanks, I really do appreciate it and no rush from my standpoint. While it's not any major point of concern to me, I do admit a certain level of curiosity to see if they have or have not deviated from their standard design practices or not. It's also not bad info to have since a lot of people ask questions about the BBTG of various heads (e.g. buying used shaft pulls and wanting to see if they will be able to get their desired playing length) and it's nice to be able to help them out.

Sorry, i haven't been back to this thread till now.......Yes.....Same shaft in both heads.......M2 is about 1/2 inch shorter than M1........I have both here....Any questions, let me know.

[wobgon]

The M2 is around 5gr lighter that a M1 for head weight. The same fitting shafts are use in the TMfitting cart but the end result is M1 playing length is 45" and M2 is 45.5".

This was info given at the M2 launch event per Dr. Bennie

Dr. Bennie was wrong.......Same shaft, the M1 is actually longer.

[rgk5]

I measured both heads and shafts today. The shafts are identical in length. Both have 1.5" bore depth. The M2's BBTG is 1/4" larger which accounts for the length difference, i.e. the crown to sole height is 1/4" greater

 

As I said earlier this should not be factor for 98% of golfers. I'm done. You fellas can debate the merits of each length.

[wobgon]

I measured both heads and shafts today. The shafts are identical in length. Both have 1.5" bore depth. The M2's BBTG is 1/4" larger which accounts for the length difference, i.e. the crown to sole height is 1/4" greater

 

As I said earlier this should not be factor for 98% of golfers. I'm done. You fellas can debate the merits of each length.

That may all be true, but the bottom line is, when both heads have the same shaft, the M1 is 1/2 inch longer........Not saying it is a factor, just saying it is a fact.

[rgk5]

I measured both heads and shafts today. The shafts are identical in length. Both have 1.5" bore depth. The M2's BBTG is 1/4" larger which accounts for the length difference, i.e. the crown to sole height is 1/4" greater

 

As I said earlier this should not be factor for 98% of golfers. I'm done. You fellas can debate the merits of each length.

That may all be true, but the bottom line is, when both heads have the same shaft, the M1 is 1/2 inch longer........Not saying it is a factor, just saying it is a fact.

 

All our M2s are 1/4" longer than the M1s measured on our Pro Shop fixed to bench ruler. This allows for the club to be "locked" in position.

[rgk5]

To add, all the clubs we have in stock are Fuji Pros except for a couple of M1s. The Kuro Kage M1s are the same length as the Fuji Pro models. In toal we have 33 M1s and 18 M2s in stock.

[wobgon]

It doesn't matter how many shafts or what shafts.........1. Put shaft A in M1. and measure.

2 Put shaft A..Same shaft in M2 and measure.

3. Compare results....You will find that the M1 is aprox. 1/2 inch longer than M2.

[rgk5]

It doesn't matter how many shafts or what shafts.........1. Put shaft A in M1. and measure.

2 Put shaft A..Same shaft in M2 and measure.

3. Compare results....You will find that the M1 is aprox. 1/2 inch longer than M2.

 

I did exactly that and the M2s we have are longer. It was the same for the Fuji Pro. Kuro Kage or Rogue Silver. We have 51 drivers combining both models. How many do you have?

[wobgon]

It doesn't matter how many shafts or what shafts.........1. Put shaft A in M1. and measure.

2 Put shaft A..Same shaft in M2 and measure.

3. Compare results....You will find that the M1 is aprox. 1/2 inch longer than M2.

 

I did exactly that and the M2s we have are longer. It was the same for the Fuji Pro. Kuro Kage or Rogue Silver. We have 51 drivers combining both models. How many do you have?

I have two of each head and three shafts.......What difference could that possibly make? All that is needed is one shaft, it could be a steel shaft, and one of each head. Why would you even test it with more than one shaft.....It could not possibly change the out come.

[rgk5]

It did not change the outcome which is exactly my point. I measured and what I saw was verified by two of our Pro Shop personnel. I'm done fencing with you.

[wobgon]

Golf clubs are crazy......I have now tested these heads with one shaft, using three different types of measurement.....Two ,the M1 was longer....One the M2 was longer.

[Stuart_G]

That's interesting. Care to be more specific about the "different types of measurement"?

[AMATEUR_GOLFER79]

M1 retail length 45.25

 

M2 retail length 45.75

 

I had the M1 and sold it and got the M2. Had to specify .75 short to get it at 45.0.... It's on the TM site

[JimboSlice83]

Can we get back to the original question...

[Ri_Redneck]

LMFAO!!

 

BT

[Nremedio]

FYI kuro kage silver tini 60 is a 67g shaft while the fujikara pro 60 is a 59g shaft. M2 head is also lighter about 4-5g than the M1. The difference is noticeable with a light head and heavier shaft.

[platgof]

My M2 measures 44 1/4" long. Oh yeah, I forgot, I cut it 1 1/2." I am happy with the stock shaft after cutting it. I did very well today and shot my lowest round.

[Benkross]

I understand all that but I still am puzzled why you are seemingly so concerned about 1/4"? Will that seriously impact the playability of a club for you? If you are, I would measure the BBTG of each head and play the one that better suits your shaft length preference.

i find it impacts my ability to find the center of the face. Tiny differences are huge when it comes to smash factor

[WidespreadPanic]

There is so much wrong information being thrown around in here it is crazy. Stock length of M1 is 45.5. Stock length of M2 is 45.75. I don't know about switching shafts and all that business though. Carry on with that.

[Sweet-Lou]

I just tried out the Fujikura Pro 60 / M2 combination for the first time, and thought I'd throw in my two cents.

 

If you have a quick tempo, or transition from backswing to downswing quickly...the Fuji Pro 60 is going to feel way too whipey and out of control. You'll spend your swing energy trying to time it instead of swing it.

If you have a slower or smoother swing, Fuji Pro 60's higher torque (4.2 in the Pro 60 i think?) is going to help you feel like you are activating the shaft's kick in your downswing. Which could be the key to distance and control for you.

[deadsolid...shank]

OP does the Fujikura Pro 60 work for you? That is all you need to know. No one else`s stats or opinions are relevant, however its necessary for you to form you own!

 

With the money you have (moving from M1 to M2) you would be better to get fitted rather than stabbing in the dark and asking on here.

 

Giving the M1 to my father. I play it in the most rearward setting anyways. I figure the lighter I can get it the better.

 

The reason for the thread question is, that I got it from sports authority for 299 (25% off) but it didnt come with a shaft option.... Will try to call them tomorrow and figure out if i can change it to a different shaft. The hzrdus shaft seems very appealing. If i cant get it with the hzrdus shaft, then there's really no point in ordering it for 100 bucks off, if I cant get the $300 shaft I want.

 

If you want one, you'll be able to pick up a HZRDUS shaft for real close to $100 off the bay or BST. Then you'll have both for the original price.

 

EDIT: FWIW, the Fuji worked better for me than the HZRDUS, you never know how you'll end up.

[Rickster384]

I've got the 1st Gen M1 430 with the Fujikura Pro 60 in it. I love it. I'm a college player and I snapped my Adila Rogue Xstiff at the kick point so my Coach lead me to this as a replacement shaft. My swing speed goes from 106mph-110mph. I have a slow backswing with an explosive downswing. It loads perfect. The feedback is great. I could hit shots blindfolded and tell you how I hit my ball. I think my launch angle is a bit too high though. I don't wanna mess with the adapter because I don't want to lose the 2 degrees upright because I'm 6ft2 with a stocky build. I hit it about 10-20yds further than my back up driver. Overall, great shaft but not perfect. 9/10

[Typhoon92]

Rickster, I feel the same way. I swapped a wrx member my Ping LST for the M1 with that shaft and I love it. It's neck and neck with the ad di6 stiff but a bit higher flight. My swing speed and transition are the exact same as yours as well.

 

I had tried a Rogue I/O silver stiff and hated that.

I think u and I could be kicked off of wrx for liking a stock shaft!!