PXG sues Taylor Made

[SteelPride]

Thanks SheriffBooth.

[ebrasmus21]

Ferguson, feel free to jump in here and help with the investigation.

I think Ferguson is still dedicated to the Phil investigation :)

 

That could be the case. Also, Ferg could still be compiling the evidence before dropping a bomb in this thread.

[azkaevolution]

i mean, to be fair, this wouldn't be the first time TM infringed on patents...*cough* Adams *cough*

[Jasonic]

Does anyone have a link to the complaint? I'd like to see who is handling this for PXG

 

I have the complaint - Loeb & Loeb out of Chicago are representing PXG, with Jennings, Strouss & Salmon as local counsel in Arizona. Case is 17-cv-03125-JJT in the District of Arizona. Sorry, I don't have a link, only a PDF which I can't upload here.

 

Interesting allegations in the opening paragraphs:

 

PXG INNOVATES THE 0311 IRONS

6. PXG, founded in September of 2014 by well-known business man,

philanthropist, and avid golfer Bob Parsons (“Parsons”), was born out of Parsons’

desire to make the world’s best golf equipment. Sparing no expense and with no cost

or time constraints, PXG engaged in the long process of researching various alloys,

exploring new technologies, and identifying unique properties that would make PXG

clubs unlike anything else. That effort innovated a new technology that PXG

implemented to create a revolutionary iron—one with an expanded sweet spot,

having an ultra-thin club face, and an elastic polymer material injected in the hollowbodied

club head. That iron is not only better-performing, but it sounds and feels

great. The golf club incorporating PXG’s technology is called the 0311 iron, and it

immediately achieved meteoric success among nonprofessional golfers and PGA and

LPGA Tour professionals. As PXG’s advertisements suggest: “Nobody makes golf

clubs the way we do. Period.”

 

7. As a result of Parsons’ passion and PXG’s innovation, PXG has

developed a global patent portfolio of 128 patents. PXG has also introduced a full

line of golf clubs that have forced and continue to force golfers to change the way

they think about the game, and PXG has quickly become a premium international

brand, with retailers and distributors around the world.

 

Jeez he really is full of himself. His head is filled with ego foam. How has he made golfers rethink the game? Meteoric success? How does he define that when every player that switched has gotten worse? Give me a break.

[PostandGhost]

Can we get a full WITB of all the attorneys involved?

[pinestreetgolf]

I'll respond to all who quoted me here. Of course its speculation. I have no idea. Maybe he has the dolphin tanks that write family guy scripts from south park writing lawsuits. I was looking at the situation and writing what I thought might be going on. I think I'm right (obviously) but nobody knows, including me.

 

The infringement claims sound like a process patent (how the foam is bonded) but could be a unique feature and not a process. Either way, its not the club itself, but how its put together. Am I right about the rest? I have no idea. I don't think its a co-incidence the PE deal closes Oct. 1 and the suit happened now. There is no way a huge firm puts together a lawsuit this big in the little time since those irons were released IMO. But this is just IMO. My opinion and a dollar will get you a cup of coffee. I do think, however, that calling Parsons a "moron" and railing against PXG is kinda dumb.

 

Without speculation, internet message boards would be newspapers.

 

EDIT

Here is how it will work -

 

PE Firm to Adidas - We didn't have this suit when we agreed to buy TM. We want out. We don't' officially take over until Oct 1, and this lawsuit has open-ended liability which is a reason we can break the deal.

Adidas - Oh Crap

Adidas to PXG - What will it take to settle this stupid thing so we can close the PE deal

PXG - It'll take XYZ

Adidas - Settle the stupid thing so we can get rid of Taylormade

 

Tons of lawsuits get filed right before PE deals close. Is it a co-incidence? I have no idea. It sure is funny timing though.

[BirdieBob]

https://www.scribd.com/document/358808739/PXG-vs-TaylorMade-Full-suit-filing

[ebrasmus21]

Can we get a full WITB of all the attorneys involved?

 

Now the important questions are being asked.

[Krt22]

https://www.scribd.c...ull-suit-filing

 

Wow what a joke. PXG patent is so broad I am honestly a little shocked it was granted. To those saying it was a process patent, this is clearly not that with most of the claims being that it is a hollow iron full of goo, just like many many many other irons currently on the market and many in the past.

 

Seems like parsons is simply patent trolling for the hell of it.

[hlca]

The case name is Parsons Xtreme Golf LLC v. Taylor Made Golf Company Incorporated, Case No. 2:17-cv-03125-JJT, District of Arizona. Case is in front of J. John Tuchi. PXG is repped by Loeb & Loeb and Jennings, Strouss & Salmon, a local AZ firm. Complaint can be viewed here: https://drive.google.com/file/d/0BwPTkQBl4vz_bVlIZFBCWjlOVU0/view?usp=sharing

[Mtngolfer1]

This is one of those topics I tell my self "don't open it...Just stay away!" Then I lose my will click on it and see exactly what I was hoping to avoid. "A bunch of post bashing PXG (Parsons) for doing exactly what they (he) should do to protect proprietary technology, his company and brand. If PXG did not respond what do you folks think the result would be? Come on this is not about the price of equipment or personal opinions based on a few commercials it about protecting what PXG has developed and invested in.

 

If one takes the time to weed through the bashers, there is a plenty of quality information on the suit in this thread, fortunately there are those posting who have good information to share on the subject.. If you are a fan of PXG or not its worth taking the time to take advantage of the knowledge available on website and to get a better understanding of what's behind the filing of the law suit.

[xjohnx]

Is the cutaway pic in the front page article PXG vs TM? or is it two PXG models?

 

http://www.golfwrx.c...t-infringement/

 

The picture show two PXG irons...no P790 shown.

 

That's what I thought but that's very misleading. Even worse on Instagram. GolfWRX shared that photo with a photo of the PXG iron and the TM iron below them. Anybody that looks at that on instagram is going to immediately assume that's a fairly incriminating photo showing the two irons in question side by side.

[the bishop]

https://www.scribd.c...ull-suit-filing

 

Wow what a joke. PXG patent is so broad I am honestly a little shocked it was granted. To those saying it was a process patent, this is clearly not that with most of the claims being that it is a hollow iron full of goo, just like many many many other irons currently on the market and many in the past.

 

Seems like parsons is simply patent trolling for the hell of it.

Well it seems to me that the idea would be to cast the widest legal net possible to try and eliminate as much legal wiggle room as you can. I browsed the suit and agree with you that this is not about process, but design.

[rawdog]

I'll respond to all who quoted me here. Of course its speculation. I have no idea. Maybe he has the dolphin tanks that write family guy scripts from south park writing lawsuits. I was looking at the situation and writing what I thought might be going on. I think I'm right (obviously) but nobody knows, including me.

 

The infringement claims sound like a process patent (how the foam is bonded) but could be a unique feature and not a process. Either way, its not the club itself, but how its put together. Am I right about the rest? I have no idea. I don't think its a co-incidence the PE deal closes Oct. 1 and the suit happened now. There is no way a huge firm puts together a lawsuit this big in the little time since those irons were released IMO. But this is just IMO. My opinion and a dollar will get you a cup of coffee. I do think, however, that calling Parsons a "moron" and railing against PXG is kinda dumb.

 

Without speculation, internet message boards would be newspapers.

 

EDIT

Here is how it will work -

 

PE Firm to Adidas - We didn't have this suit when we agreed to buy TM. We want out. We don't' officially take over until Oct 1, and this lawsuit has open-ended liability which is a reason we can break the deal.

Adidas - Oh Crap

Adidas to PXG - What will it take to settle this stupid thing so we can close the PE deal

PXG - It'll take XYZ

Adidas - Settle the stupid thing so we can get rid of Taylormade

 

Tons of lawsuits get filed right before PE deals close. Is it a co-incidence? I have no idea. It sure is funny timing though.

 

Enough with logic, ok? I'd rather go back to mocking Mr. Parsons.

 

As a former M&A banker, I can back you up- the number of deals that are severely impacted by lawsuits is staggering... my bank account can attest to a lack of transaction bonuses :/

 

Oh, and here's a new photo you can scroll past. Oldie but a goodie I posted a few months back.

[Krt22]

The issue with really broad patents is they are very hard to defend. If the patent is so broad without any real specifics on what makes it novel it is not difficult to prove that there was no willful infringement

[eagle1997]

Interesting allegations in the opening paragraphs:

 

PXG INNOVATES THE 0311 IRONS

6. PXG, founded in September of 2014 by well-known business man,

philanthropist, and avid golfer Bob Parsons (“Parsons”), was born out of Parsons’

desire to make the world’s best golf equipment. Sparing no expense and with no cost

or time constraints, PXG engaged in the long process of researching various alloys,

exploring new technologies, and identifying unique properties that would make PXG

clubs unlike anything else. That effort innovated a new technology that PXG

implemented to create a revolutionary iron—one with an expanded sweet spot,

having an ultra-thin club face, and an elastic polymer material injected in the hollowbodied

club head. That iron is not only better-performing, but it sounds and feels

great. The golf club incorporating PXG’s technology is called the 0311 iron, and it

immediately achieved meteoric success among nonprofessional golfers and PGA and

LPGA Tour professionals. As PXG’s advertisements suggest: “Nobody makes golf

clubs the way we do. Period.”

 

7. As a result of Parsons’ passion and PXG’s innovation, PXG has

developed a global patent portfolio of 128 patents. PXG has also introduced a full

line of golf clubs that have forced and continue to force golfers to change the way

they think about the game, and PXG has quickly become a premium international

brand, with retailers and distributors around the world.

 

thanks for posting actual info.

 

do lines like the above bolded sections typically make it into an official legal complaint? reads like a late-night infomercial to me.

 

i will say this: if it's just a marketing ploy, parsons has already succeeded.

[Krt22]

Yeah it is very interesting that the suit opens with basically a self promoting marketing blurb. Its like 45 pumping him self up on his margin of victory before making a completely unrelated address lol.

[moonshine]

Am I the only one that thinks it takes a complete tool to push a message on twitter about suing another company?

[eagle1997]

Is the cutaway pic in the front page article PXG vs TM? or is it two PXG models?

 

http://www.golfwrx.c...t-infringement/

 

The picture show two PXG irons...no P790 shown.

 

That's what I thought but that's very misleading. Even worse on Instagram. GolfWRX shared that photo with a photo of the PXG iron and the TM iron below them. Anybody that looks at that on instagram is going to immediately assume that's a fairly incriminating photo showing the two irons in question side by side.

 

so these are BOTH pxg irons? very misleading image, for sure.

 

[nicoy3k]

Why would a private equity firm make a 450 million investment and allow a competitor to bulldoze them in a way that limits their potential to get a return on their investment. If anything the private equity firm will be more motivated to crush this lawsuit in court. This is a non-issue.

 

Also, this will have zero impact on sales. The only people in the world that know or care about this lawsuit are in this thread.

[WHC888]

P790 cutaway,

[Deddie]

This is one of those topics I tell my self "don't open it...Just stay away!" Then I lose my will click on it and see exactly what I was hoping to avoid. "A bunch of post bashing PXG (Parsons) for doing exactly what they (he) should do to protect proprietary technology, his company and brand. If PXG did not respond what do you folks think the result would be? Come on this is not about the price of equipment or personal opinions based on a few commercials it about protecting what PXG has developed and invested in.

 

If one takes the time to week through the bashers, there is a plenty of quality information on the suit in this thread, fortunately there are those posting who have good information to share on the subject.. If you are a fan of PXG or not its worth taking the time to take advantage of the knowledge available on website and to get a better understanding of what's behind the filing of the law suit.

[BirdieBob]

Is the cutaway pic in the front page article PXG vs TM? or is it two PXG models?

 

http://www.golfwrx.c...t-infringement/

 

The picture show two PXG irons...no P790 shown.

 

That's what I thought but that's very misleading. Even worse on Instagram. GolfWRX shared that photo with a photo of the PXG iron and the TM iron below them. Anybody that looks at that on instagram is going to immediately assume that's a fairly incriminating photo showing the two irons in question side by side.

 

so these are BOTH pxg irons? very misleading image, for sure.

 

 

 

 

From PXG website:

 

 

 

 

 

NOTE: The TM P790 has a sole slot not depicted in any of these pictures.

 

 

[Deddie]

This is one of those topics I tell my self "don't open it...Just stay away!" Then I lose my will click on it and see exactly what I was hoping to avoid. "A bunch of post bashing PXG (Parsons) for doing exactly what they (he) should do to protect proprietary technology, his company and brand. If PXG did not respond what do you folks think the result would be? Come on this is not about the price of equipment or personal opinions based on a few commercials it about protecting what PXG has developed and invested in.

 

If one takes the time to week through the bashers, there is a plenty of quality information on the suit in this thread, fortunately there are those posting who have good information to share on the subject.. If you are a fan of PXG or not its worth taking the time to take advantage of the knowledge available on website and to get a better understanding of what's behind the filing of the law suit.

Because it is called envy. They are jealous of someone that is successful. These are what you call "socialist" if they can't make as much money as him then they want the gov't to take his money and give it to them. Taylormade clearly is in violation of the patents and knows this. This will be settled out of court, it will never make it to a judge, TRUST ME>

[Z1ggy16]

Not a lawyer, so somebody who IS one, please fill me (and everybody else in) but how does a "broad" patent work, such as when PXG might patent say "foam injection molding" inside of a club face? Does that mean NO other companies in the world are now allowed to put foam inside their irons? Or is it just the exact process by which it is done?

 

To me this is like a car company putting a patent on the idea of using a steering wheel. How could one company be allowed to put a strangle hold on a certain way of building something that could be done a million different ways?

 

Unless TM copied PXGs exact formula for the foam, the way it's sprayed in... down to every last detail, from my layman's point of view, I don't see how this holds up in court.

[the bishop]

Not a lawyer, so somebody who IS one, please fill me (and everybody else in) but how does a "broad" patent work, such as when PXG might patent say "foam injection molding" inside of a club face? Does that mean NO other companies in the world are now allowed to put foam inside their irons? Or is it just the exact process by which it is done?

 

To me this is like a car company putting a patent on the idea of using a steering wheel. How could one company be allowed to put a strangle hold on a certain way of building something that could be done a million different ways?

 

Unless TM copied PXGs exact formula for the foam, the way it's sprayed in... down to every last detail, from my layman's point of view, I don't see how this holds up in court.

Laymen like us are why lawyers were invented - to make the complicated even more so.

[pinestreetgolf]

Why would a private equity firm make a 450 million investment and allow a competitor to bulldoze them in a way that limits their potential to get a return on their investment. If anything the private equity firm will be more motivated to crush this lawsuit in court. This is a non-issue.

 

Also, this will have zero impact on sales. The only people in the world that know or care about this lawsuit are in this thread.

 

The private equity firm doesn't own TM yet. The deal hasn't closed. They might not think its worth 425m anymore. A company that has been sued is worth less than a company that has not been sued, even if the suit is meritless. Further, we have no idea how much they may require to reserve against the suit, or if they are even insured. Three main reasons why the PE firm would care about the suit:

 

1. Because they have no idea how long it will last. PE firms exist to boost short-term value and then sell on (like flipping a house). The company is not salable with an open-ended liability lawsuit on its books.

 

2. Because they have approximately two weeks to decide if they can win the lawsuit or not, because October 1 is the closing day for the PE deal. That isn't very much time.

 

3. The Epic crushed them, and they are looking for an excuse to get out.

 

Regardless of the pictures posted in a GolfWRX thread, this is likely an extremely complex issue that will require consultations with engineers outside of the firm. Buying a company that has this arrow pointed at them isn't great unless you think the company is an unbelievable bargain anyways.

 

Just speculation, but as rawdog said lawsuits go hand in hand with PE closings. Typically the selling entity has to just get rid of all of them, to the point where they allow for it in their calculation of purchase price. Or I could be way off base, and this has nothing to do with anything. But its odd that everyone thinks a guy who has had as much success as Parsons isn't intelligent.

[eagle1997]

two of the more interesting things from the complaint (to me):

 

Collectively, these P790 Product depictions reveal an iron-type golf club head with a hollow body portion having a face portion, a toe portion, a top portion, a sole portion, a back portion, and an interior cavity partially or entirely filled with an elastic polymer material TaylorMade calls a “Speedfoam.”

 

PXG demands a jury trial on all issues that are triable by a jury.

[ebrasmus21]

two of the more interesting things from the complaint (to me):

 

Collectively, these P790 Product depictions reveal an iron-type golf club head with a hollow body portion having a face portion, a toe portion, a top portion, a sole portion, a back portion, and an interior cavity partially or entirely filled with an elastic polymer material TaylorMade calls a “Speedfoam.”

 

PXG demands a jury trial on all issues that are triable by a jury.

 

Is requesting a jury trial common in a situation such as this?

[SwingMan]

Does anyone have a link to the complaint? I'd like to see who is handling this for PXG

 

I have the complaint - Loeb & Loeb out of Chicago are representing PXG, with Jennings, Strouss & Salmon as local counsel in Arizona. Case is 17-cv-03125-JJT in the District of Arizona. Sorry, I don't have a link, only a PDF which I can't upload here.

 

Interesting allegations in the opening paragraphs:

 

PXG INNOVATES THE 0311 IRONS

6. PXG, founded in September of 2014 by well-known business man,

philanthropist, and avid golfer Bob Parsons ("Parsons"), was born out of Parsons'

desire to make the world's best golf equipment. Sparing no expense and with no cost

or time constraints, PXG engaged in the long process of researching various alloys,

exploring new technologies, and identifying unique properties that would make PXG

clubs unlike anything else. That effort innovated a new technology that PXG

implemented to create a revolutionary iron—one with an expanded sweet spot,

having an ultra-thin club face, and an elastic polymer material injected in the hollowbodied

club head. That iron is not only better-performing, but it sounds and feels

great. The golf club incorporating PXG's technology is called the 0311 iron, and it

immediately achieved meteoric success among nonprofessional golfers and PGA and

LPGA Tour professionals. As PXG's advertisements suggest: "Nobody makes golf

clubs the way we do. Period."

 

7. As a result of Parsons' passion and PXG's innovation, PXG has

developed a global patent portfolio of 128 patents. PXG has also introduced a full

line of golf clubs that have forced and continue to force golfers to change the way

they think about the game, and PXG has quickly become a premium international

brand, with retailers and distributors around the world.

 

Jeez he really is full of himself. His head is filled with ego foam. How has he made golfers rethink the game? Meteoric success? How does he define that when every player that switched has gotten worse? Give me a break.

 

Yes, Parsons reminds me of someone who now resides in Mar-a-Lago. Ego Extraordinaire or Sir LookAtMe.