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Hybrids - Old Greats vs Current Greats- Thoughts.


golvenlar
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Hey Guys,

I'm curious to hear from those who have gone way down the hybrid rabbit hole spanning the past 10 or so years.

 

While we know there is no "right" hybrid for anyone, other than the shaft /head combination which works best for him/her, I'm curious to know how the revered old workhorses like the Adams Idea Pro, A7, Ping G10,Titleist 909h for example stack up to the myriad of excellent hybrid choices out there today: Apex, M1, F7, 816h, T Wishon, Srixon h65, Epic, G400 and on and on.

 

What are the notable differences, if any, between today's hybrids and the old revered favorites? For those curious explorers who have regularly experimented with hybrids over the past 10 years, can the older giants still stand toe to toe with today's hybrids or has the technology(shaft and head) simply moved forward in ways that make the current crop of excellent hybrids better choices? Am particularly interested in hybrids designed for low to mid handicappers.

o' to have been able to buy them all and try them all!

Thanks for your thoughts.

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I can comment on Old Adams Idea Proto vs. Callaway Apex:

 

Very similar shapes and performance in regards to turf interaction and flight with the proper shaft. However, the Apex carries the day on forgiveness. Max distance from the Apex is also probably better overall. The Apex's distance loss of off center strikes is just phenomenal by comparison. Both perform great on clean strikes, and the Idea Proto "click" is maybe more desirable, but the modern tech in the Apex makes it the all around winner going away for me.

Callaway Epic Speed 9* / Atmos Black TS 6-S
Callaway XR16 14* / Fubuki AX75f-S

Callaway UW 19* / Fubuki AX75f-S

PXG Gen2 22* / Fuji Pro 73-S
Mizuno MP-20 HMB 4-P / Modus 120-S
Mizuno S18 52* 
Callaway Full Toe 58*

Odyssey Toulon Chicago

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I can comment on Old Adams Idea Proto vs. Callaway Apex:

 

Very similar shapes and performance in regards to turf interaction and flight with the proper shaft. However, the Apex carries the day on forgiveness. Max distance from the Apex is also probably better overall. The Apex's distance loss of off center strikes is just phenomenal by comparison. Both perform great on clean strikes, and the Idea Proto "click" is maybe more desirable, but the modern tech in the Apex makes it the all around winner going away for me.

Thanks for your thoughts on this. I knew there would be someone who had spanned the years. Super helpful. Have a 5 Apex on the way!

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I have played hybrids for the past 12-13 years. It started with the callaway ft’s. My favorite older hybrid is the Ping i20’s. Still have them and take them to the range. I love them but have to say they don’t compare well with my Titleist 816’s. The 816’s are longer on both dead center strikes and even more so on off center strikes. The newer hybrids are just more forgiving, easier to launch and better at holding greens.

Ping G410 plus Tour65 S
PING G410 3w Tour 75 S
PING G410 hybrids: 18*, 22* & 26* TENSEI PRO BLUE 80 GR S
[PING G410 irons: 6 - U Nippon MODUS³ Tour 105
PING Glide 3.0 Wedges: 54* SS, & 60* SS

Scott Cameron Fastback 2.0
Member of TeamJetSpeed - Dec 2013

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I have played hybrids for the past 12-13 years. It started with the callaway ft’s. My favorite older hybrid is the Ping i20’s. Still have them and take them to the range. I love them but have to say they don’t compare well with my Titleist 816’s. The 816’s are longer on both dead center strikes and even more so on off center strikes. The newer hybrids are just more forgiving, easier to launch and better at holding greens.

Thanks so much!

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I haven't found a modern club that can cut through rough like the old triangular burner rescues. One comes in for the 3 iron on a particular course. Club is plenty long, but I haven't seen a club since that gets through tough lies like the old triangle burners. Truly a "rescue" rather than a hybrid.

 

I'm not that well versed in current hybrids as I usually carry a 3 iron but I haven't seen one that approaches it from the "Rescue" angle the way those old taylormades did. For me those things made rough and fairway bunkers feel like fairway with those triangle soles. I'd love to see a modern version (or have someone post one if i haven't come across it).

G400 Max 9* Ventus Red 5X, SIM Ventus Red 6X 

Callaway Mavrik 4 (18*) - AW (46*) Project X 5.5

Vokey SM4 50* SM5 56*

Cameron Phantom 5S

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I can comment on Old Adams Idea Proto vs. Callaway Apex:

 

Very similar shapes and performance in regards to turf interaction and flight with the proper shaft. However, the Apex carries the day on forgiveness. Max distance from the Apex is also probably better overall. The Apex's distance loss of off center strikes is just phenomenal by comparison. Both perform great on clean strikes, and the Idea Proto "click" is maybe more desirable, but the modern tech in the Apex makes it the all around winner going away for me.

 

THIS!

 

I will add that, in terms of distance, the Apex are light years longer.

 

My Adams Idea Pro 20° @ 40.00" carried approximately 217-218.

 

My Apex Hybrid 20° @ 39.50" carries 230+.

 

And for comparisons sake .... My Apex Hybrid 23° @ 38.75" carries 217-218.

 

General rule of thumb (for me) ... The Apex Hybrids carry one, true, full club longer than the Adams Idea Pro.

 

I do miss that simple, sweet, click of the Adams Idea Pro when ball and club face first meet. BUT not enough to chose over my Apex Hybrids!!

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I haven't found a modern club that can cut through rough like the old triangular burner rescues. One comes in for the 3 iron on a particular course. Club is plenty long, but I haven't seen a club since that gets through tough lies like the old triangle burners. Truly a "rescue" rather than a hybrid.

 

I'm not that well versed in current hybrids as I usually carry a 3 iron but I haven't seen one that approaches it from the "Rescue" angle the way those old taylormades did. For me those things made rough and fairway bunkers feel like fairway with those triangle soles. I'd love to see a modern version (or have someone post one if i haven't come across it).

Thanks. Looking at them now.
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I can comment on Old Adams Idea Proto vs. Callaway Apex:

 

Very similar shapes and performance in regards to turf interaction and flight with the proper shaft. However, the Apex carries the day on forgiveness. Max distance from the Apex is also probably better overall. The Apex's distance loss of off center strikes is just phenomenal by comparison. Both perform great on clean strikes, and the Idea Proto "click" is maybe more desirable, but the modern tech in the Apex makes it the all around winner going away for me.

 

THIS!

 

I will add that, in terms of distance, the Apex are light years longer.

 

My Adams Idea Pro 20° @ 40.00" carried approximately 217-218.

 

My Apex Hybrid 20° @ 39.50" carries 230+.

 

And for comparisons sake .... My Apex Hybrid 23° @ 38.75" carries 217-218.

 

General rule of thumb (for me) ... The Apex Hybrids carry one, true, full club longer than the Adams Idea Pro.

 

I do miss that simple, sweet, click of the Adams Idea Pro when ball and club face first meet. BUT not enough to chose over my Apex Hybrids!!

Thanks!
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I love my Ansers (2012). They set up well to my eye and feel great. They hit the ball lower than some, but I have learned to play the trajectory. I like some of the newer offerings as well, like the G or G400, but I just can't make the move. Some of it is the gapping. New hybs are longer than mine, so to get the right gap I get a loft that hits higher than I want. I'll stick with mine........

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I love my Ansers (2012). They set up well to my eye and feel great. They hit the ball lower than some, but I have learned to play the trajectory. I like some of the newer offerings as well, like the G or G400, but I just can't make the move. Some of it is the gapping. New hybs are longer than mine, so to get the right gap I get a loft that hits higher than I want. I'll stick with mine........

Thx !
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I have played hybrids for the past 12-13 years. It started with the callaway ft’s. My favorite older hybrid is the Ping i20’s. Still have them and take them to the range. I love them but have to say they don’t compare well with my Titleist 816’s. The 816’s are longer on both dead center strikes and even more so on off center strikes. The newer hybrids are just more forgiving, easier to launch and better at holding greens.

thx!
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I'm definitely for the old school hybrids. I have two that I don't think anything new can possibly beat out. The Adams Super LS, and Adams XTD ti. Both of these are extremely long. The feel is super solid off of both, with the edge to the XTD ti. Can't see replacing them anytime soon. To go even older, my son inherited my really old Nickent 4 dx. He absolutely bombs this thing. I think I could easily put this one back in the rotation as well.

Titleist 917D3 9.5
Titleist 917F2 13.5d
Titleist 818H2 17d. hybrid
Mltizuno JPX-850 forged 4-pw
Scratch 8620 53d..
Odyssey white hot tour #2

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07 Rescue TP is my all time favorite

Taylormade Sim2 9° (set to 7°) - Fujikura Pro 53k X  -  Taylormade 300 Mini 11.5° (set to 9.5°) - Rip Alpha 60x

Ping G410 LST 9° (set to 8°) - Tensi Raw Orange 60x  -  Callaway Tour Epic Flash ♦♦♦ 8° (set to 6°) - WhiteBoard 73x

Cobra Rad Speed Tour 5 Wood 16° - Speeder 757 Evo Tour Spec X

Mizuno MP Fli Hi 18° - C Taper 125 S+
Mizuno MP Fli Hi 23° - C Taper 120 S
Srixon z785 5-PW - KBS TourV X
Cleveland Zipcore 50°/54°/58°  - Tour S400
Mack Made Custom - Toulon Memphis - Stability in both
Podcast - "Rough Fairways - A Journey to the PGA Tour" available on Spotify - Pandora - Apple

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Two great hybrids from the past:

 

-Cleveland Halo: the sole reminded me of the Kasco K2K...it cut through the rough like no other club.

 

-Nike VR Pro with the stock PX graphite . Sets up like an iron, and hits it a mile. Still have 2 in the bag.

Callaway Rogue 10.5/UST Helium
Callaway Rogue 5w/PX Even Flow 75
Nike VR Pro 21/PX
Ping i210 4-PW/AWT2.0 
Ping Glide 2.0 54, 58
Odyssey #9 White Ice
Wilson Duo Professional (yellow)

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I have not found a replacement for my Adams Idea Pro A12.

[size=2][font=arial,helvetica,sans-serif]Taylormade M1 10.5* - Fujikura Speeder 661[/font][/size]
[size=2][font=arial,helvetica,sans-serif]Tour Edge Exotics EX9 Tour 13* - Diamana S+ 70S[/font][/size]
[size=2][font=arial,helvetica,sans-serif]Tour Edge Exotics CB Pro 14.5* - Fujikura Speeder 661[/font]
[font=arial,helvetica,sans-serif]Adams Idea Pro A12 23* - Aldila RIPd VS Proto[/font]
[font=arial,helvetica,sans-serif]Bridgestone J36 PC (4-PW) - KBS Tour[/font]
[font=arial,helvetica,sans-serif]Nike Engage 56TS & 60S- DG S200[/font]
[font=arial,helvetica,sans-serif]Mizuno-Bettinardi BC1[/font][/size]

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I have played hybrids for the past 12-13 years. It started with the callaway ft’s. My favorite older hybrid is the Ping i20’s. Still have them and take them to the range. I love them but have to say they don’t compare well with my Titleist 816’s. The 816’s are longer on both dead center strikes and even more so on off center strikes. The newer hybrids are just more forgiving, easier to launch and better at holding greens.

 

+1 on this. I had the hardest time kicking my 17* and 20 i20 hybrids out of the bag. It finally came down to getting a 19* Ping G hybrid that is just as long as the 17* when i need it to be and can launch high enough to fill the 20* gap as well. It didin't hurt that i learned how to properly hit my 4 iron.

Ping G410+ 10.5 GD ADIZ 7TX
TM OO Mini driver 13.5  GD Tour ADDI 7X
Ping Anser 20* GD Tour ADDI 95X
Miura CB57'S Raw 4-9 TT DG TI X100
Titleist TI Raw SM7 Vokey 48/52 TI DG S400 Black

Titleist TI Raw SM6 Vokey 56/61 TI DG S400 Black 
Lajosi LP7 Stability shaft
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I’ve had almost everything from Adams back when they were hybrid kings.

Moved to the Callaway DET & fitted V2 Tour 90 shafts to them.

I’ve tried about 6 others since, including the Apex & none come close to the DET.

This is the only area of my bag that I feel will not even be considered for any sort of upgrade, I’ve backed up with two more from CPO about a year back when I saw a 18 & 24 like new.

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I'm definitely for the old school hybrids. I have two that I don't think anything new can possibly beat out. The Adams Super LS, and Adams XTD ti. Both of these are extremely long. The feel is super solid off of both, with the edge to the XTD ti. Can't see replacing them anytime soon. To go even older, my son inherited my really old Nickent 4 dx. He absolutely bombs this thing. I think I could easily put this one back in the rotation as well.

Nickent was great, for sure!
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I've had almost everything from Adams back when they were hybrid kings.

Moved to the Callaway DET & fitted V2 Tour 90 shafts to them.

I've tried about 6 others since, including the Apex & none come close to the DET.

This is the only area of my bag that I feel will not even be considered for any sort of upgrade, I've backed up with two more from CPO about a year back when I saw a 18 & 24 like new.

Am unfamiliar with "DET"- which Callaway is that? Thx.
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I've had almost everything from Adams back when they were hybrid kings.

Moved to the Callaway DET & fitted V2 Tour 90 shafts to them.

I've tried about 6 others since, including the Apex & none come close to the DET.

This is the only area of my bag that I feel will not even be considered for any sort of upgrade, I've backed up with two more from CPO about a year back when I saw a 18 & 24 like new.

I'm guessing Diablo Edge....

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I currently have 2 hybrids, on is in play and the other is benched for now but not completely out, both have the AD DI 105x shaft...

 

Ok so, old:

 

Adams Super Proto 9031--straight beast!!!!, still have sitting in my Callaway bag, may make an appearance this winter...

 

New:

 

Ping G 19*--great and very forgiving monster!!!!, this one is staying in the bag for a long while...

Ping G400 LS Tec 8.5*, Rogue Silver 125 MSI, Tour S, 44.25"
Ping G410 14.5*, Stock Alta S Flex, 43"
Callaway Apex Hybrid 18*, GD Tour AD-DI 85S
Callaway Apex X Muscleback 4-P, DG Tour Issue shafts
Callaway X Forged 52, 56, 60-DG Tour Issue shafts
Odyssey #7 stroke lab, 34" oversize grip
Bridgestone Tour XS (Tiger Edition) and new Pro V1

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I've got to say the Nike VR_S hybrids are still one of my favorites. While these hybrids aren't what I would call real old they are 5 years plus old. I really like the shape of them. They look like little baby fairways & they're high, long & straight. May not be everyone's cup of tea visually but they hold their own with today's hybrids no question.

Driver: Taylormade Sim2 Max 10.5 Degrees

5 Wood: Cobra RadSpeed @ 17.5 Degrees

Hybrid: Callaway Epic Super Hybrid 21 Degrees

Hybrid: Cobra SpeedZone @ 24 Degrees

Irons: Callaway Apex 19's 6-SW

Wedge: Callaway Sureout 2 @ 60 degrees

Putter: Cobra SuperNova

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I'm a G25 guy. Not new but not really old. I've got a 17* and 20* that rotate in and out of the bag. 20* has been benched while I experiment with a 3 iron.

 

My 17* has the stock "tour stiff" shaft which for me eliminates the hybrid left miss. The 20* has the stock "stiff" shaft for higher launch and spin to hold greens, but the left miss is still a factor.

 

I hit a bunch of the old Adams hybrids a few years back, but just didn't feel as good as the Pings for me.

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I just built a couple of Adams Pro hybrids (from a few years back) to see if they can knock my 909h's out of the bag. I've only played them once, on a very windy day, so no valid comparison yet. The 909h's will be hard to beat.

Taylormade M5 9* w/GD YSQ
Adams Super Pro Hybrid 16* w/NV NxtGen MLT 85
Adams Pro Hybrid 20* w/VS Proto 95
Adams Pro Mini Hybrids 23* and 26* w/VS Proto 95 
Adams CB1 6-PW w/Pro Modus3 105
Vokeys: SM4 TVD 52M, SM8 56D, SM8 60M, all with Pro Modus3 115 Wedge
Odyssey Black Series Tour Design #5
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