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Putting in 2019 - Flagstick in or out?


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I’ll probably take it out anytime I bring a wedge to the green. I’m in the habit of laying my wedge across the stick so my dumbWord not allowed doesn’t walk off without it.

 

I hate when people lay clubs on the flagstick, almost never are they the first to finish the hole so you have to toss their clubs off it all day long.

 

Why wouldn’t you just hand them to them rather than toss them off? Most everyone I play with will, at least a couple of times a round, pick up others clubs. Both to be polite and help assure none are left behind.

 

Because I'm not their personal caddy, and I don't really want other people touching my stuff. I live by the same rules in golf as in life, don't touch another man's balls or shaft. Works well in all situations.

 

Lol. Seriously, if walking off a green and I get there first I typically grab a wedge if it’s laying there, especially if I have one laying there, too. Seems like common courtesy to me... which I do realize is disappearing quickly.

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While I always leave it in for chips, my putting speed is much better so any advantage of having it in will be negated.

 

That said, I do recall on one hole today where of the three of us, the closest was maybe 30 feet. I needed the pin tended, and I would have putted with it in if there was no chance of penalty. It took an extra minute or two with all the tended puns, but overall mattered zero.

 

I can't wait for the first tourney I play and there will be one guy who always wants it in. It will happen... That will be fun...

 

Not sure why it's a big deal. And it's really only going to ever help. A putt should never have enough speed to bounce off flag and not go in hole.

 

funny you say this, I was playing a foursomes match the other day, we were 2 up through 10, and on 11 one of the opponents had a par putt on a shot hole, putting from the fringe he left the flag in, now this putt had some heat on it and was easily going 6 foot by, hits the flag dead centre but pops back towards him. He can't believe it, starts damning his bad luck, blaming the flagstick etc. "it hit the flag dead centre" he proclaims. My partner then rolls our birdie putt from the fringe perfect weight that it kissed the centre of the flag as it dropped in. "how is that fair" he exclaimed. Clearly oblivious to the fact he was lucky they had a 1 inch bogey putt rather than 6 foot, from then on his head was gone and we thrashed them

 

I fear people may actually start putting worse if they just try and hit the flag firmly

 

Would have definitely hit the back lip and kept going. Anything with enough speed to bounce off flag out of hole will not stay in a hole without a flag. I think literally only time a flag can hurt you is if it's crooked or you hit it on fly with approach.

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Because I'm not their personal caddy, and I don't really want other people touching my stuff. I live by the same rules in golf as in life, don't touch another man's balls or shaft. Works well in all situations.

 

Lol. Seriously, if walking off a green and I get there first I typically grab a wedge if it’s laying there, especially if I have one laying there, too. Seems like common courtesy to me... which I do realize is disappearing quickly.

 

I'm not doing that 10 times a round. Seems that some guys who leave their clubs on the stick never pick up the stick.

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While I always leave it in for chips, my putting speed is much better so any advantage of having it in will be negated.

 

That said, I do recall on one hole today where of the three of us, the closest was maybe 30 feet. I needed the pin tended, and I would have putted with it in if there was no chance of penalty. It took an extra minute or two with all the tended puns, but overall mattered zero.

 

I can't wait for the first tourney I play and there will be one guy who always wants it in. It will happen... That will be fun...

 

Not sure why it's a big deal. And it's really only going to ever help. A putt should never have enough speed to bounce off flag and not go in hole.

 

funny you say this, I was playing a foursomes match the other day, we were 2 up through 10, and on 11 one of the opponents had a par putt on a shot hole, putting from the fringe he left the flag in, now this putt had some heat on it and was easily going 6 foot by, hits the flag dead centre but pops back towards him. He can't believe it, starts damning his bad luck, blaming the flagstick etc. "it hit the flag dead centre" he proclaims. My partner then rolls our birdie putt from the fringe perfect weight that it kissed the centre of the flag as it dropped in. "how is that fair" he exclaimed. Clearly oblivious to the fact he was lucky they had a 1 inch bogey putt rather than 6 foot, from then on his head was gone and we thrashed them

 

I fear people may actually start putting worse if they just try and hit the flag firmly

 

Would have definitely hit the back lip and kept going. Anything with enough speed to bounce off flag out of hole will not stay in a hole without a flag. I think literally only time a flag can hurt you is if it's crooked or you hit it on fly with approach.

 

More unsupported absolutes.

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Here's a scenario:

Joe golfer strokes the ball a bit firmer from 12 ft to take the break out of the line, it hits the stick and bounces off. Joe counts it as holed and says 'it would have gone in if it weren't for the flag stick', and then cards his par.

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While I always leave it in for chips, my putting speed is much better so any advantage of having it in will be negated.

 

That said, I do recall on one hole today where of the three of us, the closest was maybe 30 feet. I needed the pin tended, and I would have putted with it in if there was no chance of penalty. It took an extra minute or two with all the tended puns, but overall mattered zero.

 

I can't wait for the first tourney I play and there will be one guy who always wants it in. It will happen... That will be fun...

 

Not sure why it's a big deal. And it's really only going to ever help. A putt should never have enough speed to bounce off flag and not go in hole.

 

funny you say this, I was playing a foursomes match the other day, we were 2 up through 10, and on 11 one of the opponents had a par putt on a shot hole, putting from the fringe he left the flag in, now this putt had some heat on it and was easily going 6 foot by, hits the flag dead centre but pops back towards him. He can't believe it, starts damning his bad luck, blaming the flagstick etc. "it hit the flag dead centre" he proclaims. My partner then rolls our birdie putt from the fringe perfect weight that it kissed the centre of the flag as it dropped in. "how is that fair" he exclaimed. Clearly oblivious to the fact he was lucky they had a 1 inch bogey putt rather than 6 foot, from then on his head was gone and we thrashed them

 

I fear people may actually start putting worse if they just try and hit the flag firmly

 

Would have definitely hit the back lip and kept going. Anything with enough speed to bounce off flag out of hole will not stay in a hole without a flag. I think literally only time a flag can hurt you is if it's crooked or you hit it on fly with approach.

 

This may be true. This is what I was asking in the OP. I think it will interesting to see what happens when they get to Hawaii. I’ll probably do whatever Bryson does as I am sure he will have all done the statical analysis.

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Here's a scenario:

Joe golfer strokes the ball a bit firmer from 12 ft to take the break out of the line, it hits the stick and bounces off. Joe counts it as holed and says 'it would have gone in if it weren't for the flag stick', and then cards his par.

 

Well, if he isn’t playing for anything who cares. But he won’t be doing that if we are competing.

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I’ll probably take it out anytime I bring a wedge to the green. I’m in the habit of laying my wedge across the stick so my dumbWord not allowed doesn’t walk off without it.

 

I hate when people lay clubs on the flagstick, almost never are they the first to finish the hole so you have to toss their clubs off it all day long.

 

Why wouldn’t you just hand them to them rather than toss them off? Most everyone I play with will, at least a couple of times a round, pick up others clubs. Both to be polite and help assure none are left behind.

 

Because I'm not their personal caddy, and I don't really want other people touching my stuff. I live by the same rules in golf as in life, don't touch another man's balls or shaft. Works well in all situations.

 

Lol. Seriously, if walking off a green and I get there first I typically grab a wedge if it’s laying there, especially if I have one laying there, too. Seems like common courtesy to me... which I do realize is disappearing quickly.

I can see both sides of the story, it is common courtesy to pick up the clubs and hand them 2 your partner, but it also is a pain in the rear as well. I always put my wedge by my putter cover which I never forget.
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While I always leave it in for chips, my putting speed is much better so any advantage of having it in will be negated.

 

That said, I do recall on one hole today where of the three of us, the closest was maybe 30 feet. I needed the pin tended, and I would have putted with it in if there was no chance of penalty. It took an extra minute or two with all the tended puns, but overall mattered zero.

 

I can't wait for the first tourney I play and there will be one guy who always wants it in. It will happen... That will be fun...

 

Not sure why it's a big deal. And it's really only going to ever help. A putt should never have enough speed to bounce off flag and not go in hole.

 

funny you say this, I was playing a foursomes match the other day, we were 2 up through 10, and on 11 one of the opponents had a par putt on a shot hole, putting from the fringe he left the flag in, now this putt had some heat on it and was easily going 6 foot by, hits the flag dead centre but pops back towards him. He can't believe it, starts damning his bad luck, blaming the flagstick etc. "it hit the flag dead centre" he proclaims. My partner then rolls our birdie putt from the fringe perfect weight that it kissed the centre of the flag as it dropped in. "how is that fair" he exclaimed. Clearly oblivious to the fact he was lucky they had a 1 inch bogey putt rather than 6 foot, from then on his head was gone and we thrashed them

 

I fear people may actually start putting worse if they just try and hit the flag firmly

 

Would have definitely hit the back lip and kept going. Anything with enough speed to bounce off flag out of hole will not stay in a hole without a flag. I think literally only time a flag can hurt you is if it's crooked or you hit it on fly with approach.

 

Just don’t agree. I have my own putting green at home. Has a regulation fat style pin in the center hole for decoration I guess. I putt to it plenty and nearly every practice session one will bounce out off the pin. But plenty of balls traveling faster from pitches or chips rattle around and fall. A ball has to hit the back of the cup dead center to jump out. Or power lip. Other wise it will fall. But not if the pins in.

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While I always leave it in for chips, my putting speed is much better so any advantage of having it in will be negated.

 

That said, I do recall on one hole today where of the three of us, the closest was maybe 30 feet. I needed the pin tended, and I would have putted with it in if there was no chance of penalty. It took an extra minute or two with all the tended puns, but overall mattered zero.

 

I can't wait for the first tourney I play and there will be one guy who always wants it in. It will happen... That will be fun...

 

Not sure why it's a big deal. And it's really only going to ever help. A putt should never have enough speed to bounce off flag and not go in hole.

 

funny you say this, I was playing a foursomes match the other day, we were 2 up through 10, and on 11 one of the opponents had a par putt on a shot hole, putting from the fringe he left the flag in, now this putt had some heat on it and was easily going 6 foot by, hits the flag dead centre but pops back towards him. He can't believe it, starts damning his bad luck, blaming the flagstick etc. "it hit the flag dead centre" he proclaims. My partner then rolls our birdie putt from the fringe perfect weight that it kissed the centre of the flag as it dropped in. "how is that fair" he exclaimed. Clearly oblivious to the fact he was lucky they had a 1 inch bogey putt rather than 6 foot, from then on his head was gone and we thrashed them

 

I fear people may actually start putting worse if they just try and hit the flag firmly

 

Would have definitely hit the back lip and kept going. Anything with enough speed to bounce off flag out of hole will not stay in a hole without a flag. I think literally only time a flag can hurt you is if it's crooked or you hit it on fly with approach.

 

Just dont agree. I have my own putting green at home. Has a regulation fat style pin in the center hole for decoration I guess. I putt to it plenty and nearly every practice session one will bounce out off the pin. But plenty of balls traveling faster from pitches or chips rattle around and fall. A ball has to hit the back of the cup dead center to jump out. Or power lip. Other wise it will fall. But not if the pins in.

 

This is not what Pelz says in his research. I’m not saying he is right, but passing on his opinion.

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Ping eye-

 

 

Big fan of Phil and Pelz mostly. But that one defies common sense. Most any flagstick where I’ve ever played will not let a ball drop all the way to the bottom of the cup with it in. How is it more likely to stay in with an obstruction like that in the hole ? We leave it in for chips ect down hill as a backstop. Not to help it go in.

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While I always leave it in for chips, my putting speed is much better so any advantage of having it in will be negated.

 

That said, I do recall on one hole today where of the three of us, the closest was maybe 30 feet. I needed the pin tended, and I would have putted with it in if there was no chance of penalty. It took an extra minute or two with all the tended puns, but overall mattered zero.

 

I can't wait for the first tourney I play and there will be one guy who always wants it in. It will happen... That will be fun...

 

Not sure why it's a big deal. And it's really only going to ever help. A putt should never have enough speed to bounce off flag and not go in hole.

 

funny you say this, I was playing a foursomes match the other day, we were 2 up through 10, and on 11 one of the opponents had a par putt on a shot hole, putting from the fringe he left the flag in, now this putt had some heat on it and was easily going 6 foot by, hits the flag dead centre but pops back towards him. He can't believe it, starts damning his bad luck, blaming the flagstick etc. "it hit the flag dead centre" he proclaims. My partner then rolls our birdie putt from the fringe perfect weight that it kissed the centre of the flag as it dropped in. "how is that fair" he exclaimed. Clearly oblivious to the fact he was lucky they had a 1 inch bogey putt rather than 6 foot, from then on his head was gone and we thrashed them

 

I fear people may actually start putting worse if they just try and hit the flag firmly

 

Would have definitely hit the back lip and kept going. Anything with enough speed to bounce off flag out of hole will not stay in a hole without a flag. I think literally only time a flag can hurt you is if it's crooked or you hit it on fly with approach.

 

Just don’t agree. I have my own putting green at home. Has a regulation fat style pin in the center hole for decoration I guess. I putt to it plenty and nearly every practice session one will bounce out off the pin. But plenty of balls traveling faster from pitches or chips rattle around and fall. A ball has to hit the back of the cup dead center to jump out. Or power lip. Other wise it will fall. But not if the pins in.

 

Do you understand the physics of what is going on. You're telling me it hitting the cup dead center is what you don't want? That's where it has the highest chance of going in. It is the largest diameter for it to slow down enough to stay in hole.

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Please do give the physics lesson Mr wizard.

 

 

Hit it 10 ft by dead center and it will hit the back and pop over or spit back out at you. If you hit it on the lip it will power off in the opposite direction. But there’s a chance of hitting it slightly off center and it staying in.

 

Now add a flagstick there. It has almost zero shot at going in. If it hits the pin its coming out. Maybe won’t go by as far. But thats a poor lag putt strategy.

 

I’m telling you that no good player who’s learned this game flag out is going to rewire his brain to putt flag in. Might as wel get used to putting your own pin back in. Because most arent going to do it for you.

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I'm gonna leave it in at every opportunity I can (That won't slow down play or disturb playing partners)

 

I remember reading Pelz analysis when I was little in a golf book and my personal experience has show the flag helps a TON on helping balls stay in the hole.

 

I like the visual aid of a straight vertical line too when eyeballing a long putt.

 

Matter of fact, I was trying to get all in depth and decide if It would be poor etiquette to put the flag in on short downhill putts and leave it out for uphill etc. I'm working on figuring out how to make the rule help me the most haha.

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Because I'm not their personal caddy, and I don't really want other people touching my stuff. I live by the same rules in golf as in life, don't touch another man's balls or shaft. Works well in all situations.

 

Lol. Seriously, if walking off a green and I get there first I typically grab a wedge if it’s laying there, especially if I have one laying there, too. Seems like common courtesy to me... which I do realize is disappearing quickly.

 

I'm not doing that 10 times a round. Seems that some guys who leave their clubs on the stick never pick up the stick.

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Because I'm not their personal caddy, and I don't really want other people touching my stuff. I live by the same rules in golf as in life, don't touch another man's balls or shaft. Works well in all situations.

 

Lol. Seriously, if walking off a green and I get there first I typically grab a wedge if it’s laying there, especially if I have one laying there, too. Seems like common courtesy to me... which I do realize is disappearing quickly.

 

I'm not doing that 10 times a round. Seems that some guys who leave their clubs on the stick never pick up the stick.

What The Hell Is Going On In MICHIGAN ?

Very simple, the guy just doesn't want to grab the other guy's stick. Doesn't seem difficult to me.
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Definitely going to slow things, the flags going to be in and out like crazy in the wrong 4 ball.

 

A couple of questions.

 

If left, does the flag have to be free standing with no one touching it?

 

On long putts, if you elect to have the flag tended, when do you have to elect it being removed or left?

 

In the above, what if the person tending the flag leaves it in (or removes it) against your wishes?

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Definitely going to slow things, the flags going to be in and out like crazy in the wrong 4 ball.

 

A couple of questions.

 

If left, does the flag have to be free standing with no one touching it?

 

On long putts, if you elect to have the flag tended, when do you have to elect it being removed or left?

 

In the above, what if the person tending the flag leaves it in (or removes it) against your wishes?

I think you are over complicating the issue. What if, what if, what if...
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Definitely going to slow things, the flags going to be in and out like crazy in the wrong 4 ball. A couple of questions. If left, does the flag have to be free standing with no one touching it? On long putts, if you elect to have the flag tended, when do you have to elect it being removed or left? In the above, what if the person tending the flag leaves it in (or removes it) against your wishes?
I think you are over complicating the issue. What if, what if, what if...

 

Its OK if you dont know.

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Definitely going to slow things, the flags going to be in and out like crazy in the wrong 4 ball.

 

A couple of questions.

 

If left, does the flag have to be free standing with no one touching it?

 

On long putts, if you elect to have the flag tended, when do you have to elect it being removed or left?

 

In the above, what if the person tending the flag leaves it in (or removes it) against your wishes?

I think you are over complicating the issue. What if, what if, what if...

 

 

How so ? I think each of those questions are relative .

 

I know a regular playing partner right now who is the “ speed demon “ player who prefers to give 5 footers vs finishing a hole etc . He will lobby till he’s blue in the face to have the pin in to “ save time “. I dread the argument already. But it’s unavoidable.

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Definitely going to slow things, the flags going to be in and out like crazy in the wrong 4 ball.

 

A couple of questions.

 

If left, does the flag have to be free standing with no one touching it?

 

On long putts, if you elect to have the flag tended, when do you have to elect it being removed or left?

 

In the above, what if the person tending the flag leaves it in (or removes it) against your wishes?

 

If you ask me to tend it then I am going to assume you wanted it removed after striking the putt. Otherwise, why tend it?

 

If the question is can you have it tended and then decide, while the putt is rolling, what you want done then I don’t know the answer to that. I’d hope tending it means obligated to remove it. I don’t think you should be able to decide once you realize you’ve hit it way too hard to leave it in.

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Definitely going to slow things, the flags going to be in and out like crazy in the wrong 4 ball.

 

A couple of questions.

 

If left, does the flag have to be free standing with no one touching it?

 

On long putts, if you elect to have the flag tended, when do you have to elect it being removed or left?

 

In the above, what if the person tending the flag leaves it in (or removes it) against your wishes?

 

If you ask me to tend it then I am going to assume you wanted it removed after striking the putt. Otherwise, why tend it?

 

If the question is can you have it tended and then decide, while the putt is rolling, what you want done then I don’t know the answer to that. I’d hope tending it means obligated to remove it. I don’t think you should be able to decide once you realize you’ve hit it way too hard to leave it in.

I agree on both points but I think it needs clarifying.

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Definitely going to slow things, the flags going to be in and out like crazy in the wrong 4 ball.

 

A couple of questions.

 

If left, does the flag have to be free standing with no one touching it?

 

On long putts, if you elect to have the flag tended, when do you have to elect it being removed or left?

 

In the above, what if the person tending the flag leaves it in (or removes it) against your wishes?

 

If you ask me to tend it then I am going to assume you wanted it removed after striking the putt. Otherwise, why tend it?

 

If the question is can you have it tended and then decide, while the putt is rolling, what you want done then I don’t know the answer to that. I’d hope tending it means obligated to remove it. I don’t think you should be able to decide once you realize you’ve hit it way too hard to leave it in.

I agree on both points but I think it needs clarifying.

 

I agree with you. I’m not sure they thought this one through. Why doesn’t that surprise me?

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Definitely going to slow things, the flags going to be in and out like crazy in the wrong 4 ball.

 

A couple of questions.

 

If left, does the flag have to be free standing with no one touching it?

 

On long putts, if you elect to have the flag tended, when do you have to elect it being removed or left?

 

In the above, what if the person tending the flag leaves it in (or removes it) against your wishes?

 

If you ask me to tend it then I am going to assume you wanted it removed after striking the putt. Otherwise, why tend it?

 

If the question is can you have it tended and then decide, while the putt is rolling, what you want done then I don⤙t know the answer to that. I⤙d hope tending it means obligated to remove it. I don⤙t think you should be able to decide once you realize you⤙ve hit it way too hard to leave it in.

I agree on both points but I think it needs clarifying.

oh, so it's you who doesn't understand it. Thank you for admitting it.
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Definitely going to slow things, the flags going to be in and out like crazy in the wrong 4 ball. A couple of questions. If left, does the flag have to be free standing with no one touching it? On long putts, if you elect to have the flag tended, when do you have to elect it being removed or left? In the above, what if the person tending the flag leaves it in (or removes it) against your wishes?
I think you are over complicating the issue. What if, what if, what if...

 

Its OK if you dont know.

I think people are quite intelligent and we'll figure things out as needed. Our group often times putt with the flag stick in on the 1st putt but take it out on the 2nd putt. I don't think the situation should be overanalyzed, I think a lot of people look forward to the change.
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Definitely going to slow things, the flags going to be in and out like crazy in the wrong 4 ball.

 

A couple of questions.

 

If left, does the flag have to be free standing with no one touching it?

 

On long putts, if you elect to have the flag tended, when do you have to elect it being removed or left?

 

In the above, what if the person tending the flag leaves it in (or removes it) against your wishes?

 

If you ask me to tend it then I am going to assume you wanted it removed after striking the putt. Otherwise, why tend it?

 

If the question is can you have it tended and then decide, while the putt is rolling, what you want done then I don⤙t know the answer to that. I⤙d hope tending it means obligated to remove it. I don⤙t think you should be able to decide once you realize you⤙ve hit it way too hard to leave it in.

I agree on both points but I think it needs clarifying.

oh, so it's you who doesn't understand it. Thank you for admitting it.

Oh dear, one of those.

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Definitely going to slow things, the flags going to be in and out like crazy in the wrong 4 ball.

 

A couple of questions.

 

If left, does the flag have to be free standing with no one touching it?

 

On long putts, if you elect to have the flag tended, when do you have to elect it being removed or left?

 

In the above, what if the person tending the flag leaves it in (or removes it) against your wishes?

 

If you ask me to tend it then I am going to assume you wanted it removed after striking the putt. Otherwise, why tend it?

 

If the question is can you have it tended and then decide, while the putt is rolling, what you want done then I don⤙t know the answer to that. I⤙d hope tending it means obligated to remove it. I don⤙t think you should be able to decide once you realize you⤙ve hit it way too hard to leave it in.

I agree on both points but I think it needs clarifying.

oh, so it's you who doesn't understand it. Thank you for admitting it.

Oh dear, one of those.

Tee hee!

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I admit to having skipped over most of the discussion. From what I've read, if a putt is going to go 3 feet or more past the hole, the flagstick will generally improve the outcome if you hit it. Not always, but over time you'll leave it closer, and make more. Less than 3 feet past the hole, its a wash, the times it will help you will about even out with the times it will keep a putt out. So for me, any time I have a putt that I might have trouble leaving close to the hole, I'll leave the flagstick in. And I'll ask my companions to put it back in for me if necessary. I think the impact on pace of play, for better or for worse, will be negligible.

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Definitely going to slow things, the flags going to be in and out like crazy in the wrong 4 ball.

 

A couple of questions.

 

If left, does the flag have to be free standing with no one touching it?

 

On long putts, if you elect to have the flag tended, when do you have to elect it being removed or left?

 

In the above, what if the person tending the flag leaves it in (or removes it) against your wishes?

 

If you ask me to tend it then I am going to assume you wanted it removed after striking the putt. Otherwise, why tend it?

 

If the question is can you have it tended and then decide, while the putt is rolling, what you want done then I don⤙t know the answer to that. I⤙d hope tending it means obligated to remove it. I don⤙t think you should be able to decide once you realize you⤙ve hit it way too hard to leave it in.

I agree on both points but I think it needs clarifying.

oh, so it's you who doesn't understand it. Thank you for admitting it.

 

Still you sir.

 

 

If you aren’t providing answers to the questions it’s still you too.

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