Actual secret

[N0rs3man]

Skip a stone and actively rip the ball with right hand/wrist not to be mistaken for arm or elbow but hand. The snapping of the hand actively at impact completes the whip chain and will add 25 yards of carry. Be sure to keep left wrist pronating

[alansmithdc]

Hogan actually said "Hit hard with both hands." 

[ebk]

I thought he said left wrist supination

[alansmithdc]

he did but he also wanted the left hand driving so the right hand doesn't take over.  I think just supinating the left wrist doesn't get the job done

[golfsticks]

Agree, left hand-arm need to pony up and beat, or at least keep up with,   the right hand-arm's pacing up to the strike or else the club circles outside the hands instead of staying inside the hands.  Am I giving away too much?

[SwagGolf6112]

Nope to all. Hogan didn't "think" of doing anything with his hands or wrist on the downswing. He just thought about how he wanna shape the shot and let it happen. The so called "secret" was already in full effect way before impact.

Edited September 8, 2020 by SwagGolf6112

[golfsticks]

Correct, both hands and arms equally delivering is common to all fine swings, so is not a secret, but was initially mentioned to offset the suggestion that skipping stones was Hogan's magic formula.    

[SwagGolf6112]

Agreed. And the most misunderstood element of the Hogan swing is the relationship of the trail elbow to the trail hip both on the backswing and downswing. Well to be fair, what Hogan said was "his secret" in Life Magazine did most of the damaged to average golfers. He didn't lie, mind you. Hogan was an honorable man. But he is tricky with his words. For only the true observers will know what he meant. Watch Hogan's footage closely and it's as clear as day. So the skipping stones method is merely an effect not a cause.

[chipa]

I learned to hit very hard with my right hand it's not difficult - as Mike Malaska shows us in his videos

 

However, if you want to hit the ball straight that's another issue altogether. The problem is the left hand and arm. Some tell us it's easy but Hogan struggled with it so honestly I take those commentaries with a very little bit of salt.

 

I have finally figured out that my best swings are a pull movement down first then come through with the right hand - although right before swinging all I can think about is getting in the right position at the top to smack the ball with my right hand and side - which had led me on a dead end path of thinking I could just get my right hand up in a good position in the backswing and voila. Now I know I've got to first reach across my right side first with my left hand and arm so my right hand is "trapped" and can't do anything really until the left side turns out of the way.

[SwagGolf6112]

On 9/9/2020 at 8:16 AM, chipa said:

The problem is the left hand and arm. Some tell us it's easy but Hogan struggled with it...

 

Exactly, and how he managed to get that troublesome left unit from wrecking his swing to allowed the right unit freedom to smash away with no fear of hooking is very interesting indeed. 

Edited September 18, 2020 by SwagGolf6112

[golfsticks]

The lead hand-arm works with the trail hand-arm to bend the shaft on the ball if the hands work as they should. 

[SwagGolf6112]

11 hours ago, golfsticks said:

The lead hand-arm works with the trail hand-arm to bend the shaft on the ball if the hands work as they should. 

 

So by "bend the shaft" do you mean having the hands always leading the clubhead while having the crease in the "reversed v" formed by the trail thumb and trail index finger acting as the focal point and regulator of the exerted force?

 

Edited September 11, 2020 by SwagGolf6112

[chipa]

On 9/2/2020 at 5:14 PM, alansmithdc said:

Hogan actually said "Hit hard with both hands." 

 

I think Hogan's secret was that he mechanically tied his hand and arm swing to his right leg which enabled him to hit very hard with the hands.

[golfsticks]

On 9/11/2020 at 12:13 AM, SwagGolf6112 said:

 

So by "bend the shaft" do you mean having the hands always leading the clubhead while having the crease in the "reversed v" formed by the trail thumb and trail index finger acting as the focal point and regulator of the exerted force?

 

Yes, with an addition the lead hand being a fulcrum for the trail hand exerted force.

A steel age demonstration from Jackie Burke Jr. above demonstrates his point in calling it springing the shaft, but the dynamic goes further back in time to lineage from Scotland's twa Dunns.

Seymour Dunn, in his book,  called it bending the shaft on the ball, with the lead hand bearing back and providing a fulcrum for the trail hand to strike against.     Same discussion, same dynamic, different era, but still a powerful way to apply smash to a ball.    

 

Edited September 13, 2020 by golfsticks

[SwagGolf6112]

Nice. Cheers!

[Gsea]

Right index finger, pronation early and ctrl distance with the right leg. IMO this leads to the cupped left wrist and balance. My guess is that the final piece for him was early pronation that lead to " I've got a secret". Right index finger position and pressure was a game changer for me. Then again could be none of the above lol.

 

[chipa]

22 hours ago, Gsea said:

Right index finger, pronation early and ctrl distance with the right leg. IMO this leads to the cupped left wrist and balance. My guess is that the final piece for him was early pronation that lead to " I've got a secret". Right index finger position and pressure was a game changer for me. Then again could be none of the above lol.

 

 

With all due respect I don't think Hogan manipulated his hands any more than necessary to hit a draw or a fade. The problem is with people that generate a considerable amount of clubhead speed like Hogan was that there is not enough time to do anything. IMO, I think the majority of the instruction that tells people to hold off the release and other such advice is for people with over the top moves where doing such things would actually be a benefit even though these techniques rob a considerable amount of clubhead speed. After all 95 mph with the driver with the clubface open wouldn't be as effective as a drive at 85 mph but with the clubface square.

[SwagGolf6112]

10 hours ago, chipa said:

 

1. I don't think Hogan manipulated his hands any more than necessary to hit a draw or a fade

--> Yep. He did no such thing. 

 

2. The problem is with people that generate a considerable amount of clubhead speed like Hogan was that there is not enough time to do anything

--> Couldn't agree more. The eye-brain-hands unit is unfortunately too slow for that. At full speed, once the downswing starts... it's over.

 

3. IMO, I think the majority of the instruction that tells people to hold off the release and other such advice is for people with over the top moves where doing such things would actually be a benefit even though these techniques rob a considerable amount of clubhead speed

--> Agreed. It's a band-aid at best. And usually won't last.

 

4. After all 95 mph with the driver with the clubface open(depends on the path and "how open" it is) wouldn't be as effective as a drive at 85 mph but with the clubface square(depends on the club-path as well)

 

Hogan did not manipulate his hands to shape shots. He simply put his attention on "feeling" the path and attack angle needed in order to produce different shot types. The stable clubface was well in effect since P6 with him not having to worry about it whatsoever. 

[alansmithdc]

This question may have already been asked.  Let's pretend that you knew Hogan's secret.  100 percent.  With proof being winning local tournaments, invited to play in a PGA event, additional press coverage, (like MSE) etc.  How much money would you charge people to learn it?

[Gsea]

On 9/24/2020 at 10:33 AM, chipa said:

 

With all due respect I don't think Hogan manipulated his hands any more than necessary to hit a draw or a fade. The problem is with people that generate a considerable amount of clubhead speed like Hogan was that there is not enough time to do anything. IMO, I think the majority of the instruction that tells people to hold off the release and other such advice is for people with over the top moves where doing such things would actually be a benefit even though these techniques rob a considerable amount of clubhead speed. After all 95 mph with the driver with the clubface open wouldn't be as effective as a drive at 85 mph but with the clubface square.

I wasn't saying he manipulated his hands to shape shots. Position of right index finger in the grip, early pronation, right leg for distance ctrl thats all I said. How he shaped shots the details I do not know. 

[SwagGolf6112]

4 hours ago, alansmithdc said:

This question may have already been asked.  Let's pretend that you knew Hogan's secret.  100 percent.  With proof being winning local tournaments, invited to play in a PGA event, additional press coverage, (like MSE) etc.  How much money would you charge people to learn it?

 

Hold up.. hold up.. hold up..

 

like MSE...

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like MSE...?

.

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like MSE...??

.

.

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like MSE...???!!!

 

Wow dude... You've just lost all credibility regarding Hogan with that statement alone. 

 

Oh wait... I forgot about your love for "Hogan's Angle".

Sorry, never mind.

 

 

p.s. For those wondering who MSE is here's proof he knows Hogan's secret a 100 percent according to alansmithdc. Enjoy...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4uRu-sv8hI4  

 

or this...

 

Edited September 29, 2020 by SwagGolf6112

[alansmithdc]

LOL.  You are awesome dude

[dlygrisse]

Hogan gave his secret in the time magazine article.  
 

not sure why everyone feels the need to make stuff up, Hogan is laughing in his grave. 
 

it’s all there. And as Hogan said it will probably do more harm than good to the average golfer.  

[alansmithdc]

True.  I think he said that also

[Shilgy]

Wonder if we’ll get a full century of this discussion. Been 70 years +/- so far. There is no swing secret imo. There might be a move or thought that for his body mind and swing worked best but there is no secret sauce that will be the aha moment for everyone. 
 

Even for Ben he missed occasionally...unless of course you believe he played from the hay intentionally....

 

[chipa]

I think it was indeed the right leg. I've at times been able to get the feeling Hogan describes and honestly it feels like you can't miss and can bomb it away and know it will go straight. Obviously the hands and arms have to be sequenced correctly and use the correct muscles but from what I remember it kind of all worked together interestingly. I do remember the sensation was quite a wide takeaway over the front of my right leg and it seemed to push it back and embed itself in the ground so there was no need to wait before starting the swing with the lower body.

[alansmithdc]

Hogan told Jody Vaquez it was the right leg.  The problem is No one was part of the conversation. What words that were spoken by Hogan may not be verbatium. For example if he added something to the dialogue that either Jody didnt quite understand he may have not been able to put it totally into context.  As proof Golfers now know Hogans secret about the right leg but I dont see very many people swinging like Hogan today.

[SwagGolf6112]

Yay! The Hogan forum finally has some resemblance of life again. With that being said... (bracing for impact LOL)

 

Hogan did have a real secret. But he took it to the grave. And it wasn't any of the things you guys talk about here. Yes yes I know, he told many people "many" secrets. So you're saying we have to combine all of them to get the whole picture?

 

For example...

1. He told John Schlee to "rotate lead elbow towards the target" as the secret.

2. He told Jody that the secret is the right leg.

3. He told Life that it's the cupping and pronation.

 

And that is just only 3 of the so called "secrets" from Hogan to different people...

 

Think about it folks. You can do these things all at once and still hit a big hook or slice right? Try it then... do the right leg, cupping, pronation and elbow rotation. Hell, even add the clockwise "pre-torque" of the right foot for extra juice. That should transform any of you into a somewhat decent striker of the ball right?

 

If that were true wouldn't the majority of people lower their handicaps just by following these Hogan secrets? Sadly, nobody ever does.

 

So does that mean Hogan secret is false or was he simply "lying" to us. I don't think he lied. He simple tell us what happens in his swing. And that is like telling the truth without giving away the "thing" that is the source of all these action. My humble opinion and I will die on this hill regarding this.

 

Have a lovely weekend my fellow Hoganites. Cheers!

 

 

 

P.S. if whatever it is you think is the real Hogan secret can help you completely take out one side of the course whether it be the left or right then maybe you got something... my two cents

 

 

Edited October 2, 2020 by SwagGolf6112

[SwagGolf6112]

4 hours ago, dlygrisse said:

Hogan is laughing in his grave. 

 

This we can agree on. But maybe for not the reason you've mentioned. 

[dlygrisse]

23 hours ago, SwagGolf6112 said:

 

This we can agree on. But maybe for not the reason you've mentioned. 

Not sure why, he emphatically stated in the article what the secret was.  Was he lying then?   
Doesn’t seem like Hogan, he seemed like the type of guy who tell you the honest truth or to buzz off.  My guess is all these other “secrets” were current swing thoughts he was tinkering with or obvious fundamental issues he observed in others. 

 

his secret that took him from being a journeyman pro to legend was something that allowed him to stop snap hooking it and hit a power fade.  That is well documented.  The Time article addresses exactly that.  Try it, it works.  In fact I use it if I need to hit a big slice.  So yes, he is laughing in his grave at you. 

 

correction. Life magazine not Time. 

 

Edited October 3, 2020 by dlygrisse