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G400 Irons for Better Players


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Hey, guys (and gals). I’m in the process of evaluating my game and retooling my bag. I’m a single digit player that has been as low as scratch. Swingspeed with the driver is 100-105, and mid to high 80s with a six iron. I have traditionally been a very strong iron player with a weakness off the tee and on the greens. I’ve worked hard in retooling my swing and have become a very good driver of the golf ball. (I still suck on the greens). What I have noticed is that my iron game has become inconsistent, and I’m looking at the issue from an equipment perspective.

 

I’ve never made the iron game “easy” in my bag. My current set of MP18 blades. I recently picked up a set of iBlades in an effort to give myself a little help, but they’re really not that much more forgiving. I’m thinking of taking the plunge into more of a “tweener” CB, or perhaps even a GI iron while I continue to work through my swing changes and find consistency with my game. I’m considering the “usual suspects,” including the z785s, i210s, AP2s, etc.

 

The one iron, however, that has really caught my attention based on its forgiveness, looks, etc. is the g400. The Rick Shiels review was really eye opening since I’ve never seen him hit an iron straighter. That’s what I ultimately want!!

 

My ultimate question is for the better players who have chosen the G400. Why did you pick them? What do they do for your game? And, perhaps most importantly, are you missing out on anything with these irons in comparison to the other options?

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G400s are great sticks. Also look at the Hot Metals. Maybe wait for the new G410s too? All are high and straight, if that is what you are looking for!?

 

It sort of is at this point. I’m not struggling with my irons, but I’m not scoring either. Point and shoot may be the answer, and a couple extra yards at the high end of the bag wouldn’t hurt..

 

I’ve always been very picky about look, feel, and sound, so I’m concerned these may be too big a leap from my forged players irons.

 

Are these THAT much more user friendly than something like a Srixon z765?

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I have a buddy who is a +2.5. He put a full bag of G700 in play this year. He was a +1.1 when he put them in the bag.

 

Simple enough. They are higher and straighter than his previous irons.

 

He directly attributes them for the gain in that one stroke which is really hard to find at his level.

 

 

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I went to a set of G irons. The biggest adjustment for me has been go further and higher. No compaints at all, just had to adjust the yardages a bit. Definitely hitting more greens than before. I think they feel great but I wouldn't say it's the same as the feel of a forged. Not necessarily worse, just different. Love them.

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That's just it. I'm not sure I want more distance. It certainly wouldn't hurt, but I am mainly looking for straight and easy. I have played players irons for so long that part of me feels I ought to switch things up to see if I have been holding myself back. The g400 irons are really the only game improvement clubs that catch my eye.

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The G400's are a great iron but if you're fussy about feel (sound) you might not like them. Once Ping went to the thin hot faces I think it hurt the feel of the irons. No one made cast irons feel any better than Ping but I think they kind of screwed the pooch with the G's and G400's and I owned both. Just my opinion.

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The Hot Metal's look, feel, and sound better than the G400's. I'd give them a look for sure but with the new G410 (or whatever they are calling it) coming out soon, I'd wait for a while until more information is released about them before deciding.

Ping G400 Max driver w/Aldila Rogue 125 Silver 60S
Cobra (Lexi blue) F7 5 wood w/Aldila Rogue Black 70S
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Ping G410 irons w/Recoil 95S
Ping Glide 55/60 wedges w/Recoil 110S
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My last iron purchase came down to the G400s and the P790s. The deciding factor for me was looks as they both performed nicely. The G400s probably have a bit more forgiveness but I don’t hit the ball that bad to begin with just like a little help on the few that are less than perfect. I’m sure I would’ve been happy if I had went with the G400s but so far the P790s have been the total package.

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The Hot Metal's look, feel, and sound better than the G400's. I'd give them a look for sure but with the new G410 (or whatever they are calling it) coming out soon, I'd wait for a while until more information is released about them before deciding.

 

It really is preference but having looked at both before I settled on the i200’s, I thought if I jumped to a bigger head the Mizuno 900 Hot Metal suited me better than the G400. Very different clubs to me. Mizzys have much lower bounce but most likely play with more bounce than the number due to sole width, but still way less than the Pings. Both are really long. Hot Metal at address had a better look to me. G400 very easy to hit and slightly more offset, which I do not mind.

 

It is a close call. If I am out semi-regularly, I would say Hot Metals were a little more player’s leaning than the G400. If I am taking 3 months off and hitting balls for 20 minutes before I play, I’m thinking the G400 would give me more confidence. I do think both are really strong in terms of what you are thinking about, and maybe the Srixon 565 as well. I might also put the Cobra Forged Tec in this competition.

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Ping G400? I think you've gone too far. Try the i210 with stronger lofts or the Mizuno 919Forged

[color=#474747][font=Arial][size=4][b][size=3]"My swing is so bad, I look like a caveman killing his lunch" - Lee Trevino[/size][/b][/size][/font][/color]

Bag: Ping G400 Max 9/TPT Red 17 ● Exotics EXS 220 16.5 wd, 19 Hy, PXG 22 Hy ● Mizuno HotMetalPro 5i/Accra i70 ● Mizuno 919F 6-PW/Accra i80 ● Mizuno MP T20 48, 53, 58 Nippon Pro Modus 3 Wedge 115 ● SeeMore Nashville

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Ping G400? I think you've gone too far. Try the i210 with stronger lofts or the Mizuno 919Forged

 

Agree with this.

 

The G series can get a bit "too hot off the face". Noone wants their 8 iron clearing the green when they intended to land front edge. Believe me, it happens.

 

i200s/210s just as easy to hit, almost as forgiving and dispersion infinitely tighter. Plus, they're a damn fine looking iron

 

Speaking from personal experience, having played Gs for a year before switching to i200s (18 months and definitely keeping them!)

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The G series can get a bit "too hot off the face". Noone wants their 8 iron clearing the green when they intended to land front edge. Believe me, it happens.

 

Played a set of G irons for 50+ rounds and never had that happen once.

Ping G410 Plus 10.5°/Alta CB55 r flex
Ping G400 7w/Alta CB r flex
Ping G400 4h/Xcaliber r flex
Ping G400 5h/Xcaliber r flex
Ping G400 6-U/Xcaliber r flex
Ping Glide 2.0 ES 58°/Xcaliber r flex
Mizuno Bettinardi C06

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Lucky you!

 

I had an 8 iron (admittedly out the rough) 140 out to a front pin so just thought I'd put an easy swing on.

 

It didn't even touch the green, carrying almost 180.

 

There's fliers and there's fliers plus hot face.

 

And pretty sure every review I've ever seen for any GI irons say one of the cons of that iron type is dispersion front to back.

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I got paired with a very tall and very good ball striker for a round this September. He was gaming G400 irons and hitting them a mile in the air. With how good his swing was and how clean he hit the ball I would have put him in irons with lower lofts and less forgiveness. High ball flight is great sometimes but on windy days his ball flight would be a huge issue. The I200s would have been a better fit imo. He said he like the I200s better but they were going to be over the budget his wife gave him after they were customized etc.

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Lucky you!

 

I had an 8 iron (admittedly out the rough) 140 out to a front pin so just thought I'd put an easy swing on.

 

It didn't even touch the green, carrying almost 180.

 

There's fliers and there's fliers plus hot face.

 

And pretty sure every review I've ever seen for any GI irons say one of the cons of that iron type is dispersion front to back.

 

I think the notion of 'hot spots' is a confirmation bias by better players, at least in the modern iteration of variable thickness face design a la PING/Mizuno/TM.

 

A well designed variable thickness face in an iron of less than 40* or so will make it MORE consistent, distance-wise, than a club with a uniform thickness face. While hot spots may have happened in the distant past with uniform thickness high COR iron faces, club design engineers figured out long ago that VFT can erase those inconsistencies.

 

Hot spots on an iron like the G400 are a myth.

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The G series can get a bit "too hot off the face". Noone wants their 8 iron clearing the green when they intended to land front edge. Believe me, it happens.

 

Played a set of G irons for 50+ rounds and never had that happen once.

Lucky you!

 

I had an 8 iron (admittedly out the rough) 140 out to a front pin so just thought I'd put an easy swing on.

 

It didn't even touch the green, carrying almost 180.

 

There's fliers and there's fliers plus hot face.

 

And pretty sure every review I've ever seen for any GI irons say one of the cons of that iron type is dispersion front to back.

 

I think the notion of 'hot spots' is a confirmation bias by better players, at least in the modern iteration of variable thickness face design a la PING/Mizuno/TM.

 

A well designed variable thickness face in an iron of less than 40* or so will make it MORE consistent, distance-wise, than a club with a uniform thickness face. While hot spots may have happened in the distant past with uniform thickness high COR iron faces, club design engineers figured out long ago that VFT can erase those inconsistencies.

 

Hot spots on an iron like the G400 are a myth.

 

You're perfectly entitled to that opinion. Having played both Gs and i200s I categorically stand by my experience that front to back dispersion with the i200s is vastly improved.

 

If these things were myths, that GI clubs are just as controllable left to right, front to back as "better players" CB irons, MBs and blades, then the G400, Hot Metals and clubs of that ilk would be all over the Tour.

 

Sure, engineers may have quietened down the hot spots and made GI clubs more playable but facts speak for themselves. "Pure" GI irons can - and do - fly sometimes

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Agree, hot spot is myth.

 

What IS real though is that irons with the CG set deep into the head will flight higher and with less spin. Such an iron, along with grass on the face reducing spin, can result in some flier shots.

 

Pro's don't play GI irons for different reasons, one of which is they strike the ball in the center of the face and don't need high MOI.

 

And for the record, I usually shoot somewhere in the vicinity of 80 and have been using full on GI irons for several years now. And during that time I can only count on one hand the number of fliers I've experienced. Honestly, fliers are the least of my worries on the course.

Ping G400 Max driver w/Aldila Rogue 125 Silver 60S
Cobra (Lexi blue) F7 5 wood w/Aldila Rogue Black 70S
Cobra (Lexi blue) F7 Hybrid w/Aldila Kuro Kage 80S
Ping G410 irons w/Recoil 95S
Ping Glide 55/60 wedges w/Recoil 110S
Ping Anser/Arna putter - the "real deal!"

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Agree, hot spot is myth.

 

What IS real though is that irons with the CG set deep into the head will flight higher and with less spin. Such an iron, along with grass on the face reducing spin, can result in some flier shots.

 

Pro's don't play GI irons for different reasons, one of which is they strike the ball in the center of the face and don't need high MOI.

 

And for the record, I usually shoot somewhere in the vicinity of 80 and have been using full on GI irons for several years now. And during that time I can only count on one hand the number of fliers I've experienced. Honestly, fliers are the least of my worries on the course.

 

I never said it happens every time, just that it can.

 

Maybe the times when mine flew an extra 20 or 30 yards than expected were actually my "good" shots, out the sweet spot and the rest of my shots were all off centre, it's entirely possible, though I'd like to think that out of the thousands of shots i hit with them, I hit more than a handful of those "good" shots. I hit quite a few mid 80s with my Gs but most rounds were up to 10 shots more.

 

My strike has improved a lot since then so it is probably that, just as much if not more, that has improved my distance control. Maybe if I was still hitting Gs now, my 8 iron would be 160 yards rather than the 135-140 it was then.

 

I'm not going to argue with you. I'm a big fan of the i200s and was a big fan of the Gs but I had what I considered random bullets with the latter that I don't get with the former. Not many.... but enough to remember.

 

BUT.... (hehe)

 

What you say about tour pros is interesting though. You say they don't NEED the higher MOI which technically is true in the main. But why don't they WANT it? The truth is they kind of do want some help. Lee Westwood carries a full bag of i210s rather than iBlades. He doesn't even combo them. I might be wrong but I believe the i210 is the mainstay of Ping staffers, not the iBlade which suggests that even tour pros want/need/whatever the very MOI you say they don't need. So on that basis, why not go the whole hog and play G400s? Possibly because they know that they won't get the level of control they get with the i210s. Which leads us back to dispersion which with tour pros is mainly a front to back concern, rather than left to right. Which I guess brings us back to hot spots.....

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The G series can get a bit "too hot off the face". Noone wants their 8 iron clearing the green when they intended to land front edge. Believe me, it happens.

 

Played a set of G irons for 50+ rounds and never had that happen once.

Lucky you!

 

I had an 8 iron (admittedly out the rough) 140 out to a front pin so just thought I'd put an easy swing on.

 

It didn't even touch the green, carrying almost 180.

 

There's fliers and there's fliers plus hot face.

 

And pretty sure every review I've ever seen for any GI irons say one of the cons of that iron type is dispersion front to back.

 

I think the notion of 'hot spots' is a confirmation bias by better players, at least in the modern iteration of variable thickness face design a la PING/Mizuno/TM.

 

A well designed variable thickness face in an iron of less than 40* or so will make it MORE consistent, distance-wise, than a club with a uniform thickness face. While hot spots may have happened in the distant past with uniform thickness high COR iron faces, club design engineers figured out long ago that VFT can erase those inconsistencies.

 

Hot spots on an iron like the G400 are a myth.

 

You're perfectly entitled to that opinion. Having played both Gs and i200s I categorically stand by my experience that front to back dispersion with the i200s is vastly improved.

 

If these things were myths, that GI clubs are just as controllable left to right, front to back as "better players" CB irons, MBs and blades, then the G400, Hot Metals and clubs of that ilk would be all over the Tour.

 

Sure, engineers may have quietened down the hot spots and made GI clubs more playable but facts speak for themselves. "Pure" GI irons can - and do - fly sometimes

 

No problem. We can agree to disagree.

 

I stand by my point that hot spots in irons with a well-designed variable thickness face is a myth. (Maybe Tom Wishon will see this discussion and back me up! haha) From a purely numbers/scientific/robotic testing/empirical perspective I don't feel that this is debatable.

 

Now, when we introduce the human element into that equation things will invariably get wacky.

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Hey, guys (and gals). I'm in the process of evaluating my game and retooling my bag. I'm a single digit player that has been as low as scratch. Swingspeed with the driver is 100-105, and mid to high 80s with a six iron. I have traditionally been a very strong iron player with a weakness off the tee and on the greens. I've worked hard in retooling my swing and have become a very good driver of the golf ball. (I still suck on the greens). What I have noticed is that my iron game has become inconsistent, and I'm looking at the issue from an equipment perspective.

 

I've never made the iron game "easy" in my bag. My current set of MP18 blades. I recently picked up a set of iBlades in an effort to give myself a little help, but they're really not that much more forgiving. I'm thinking of taking the plunge into more of a "tweener" CB, or perhaps even a GI iron while I continue to work through my swing changes and find consistency with my game. I'm considering the "usual suspects," including the z785s, i210s, AP2s, etc.

 

The one iron, however, that has really caught my attention based on its forgiveness, looks, etc. is the g400. The Rick Shiels review was really eye opening since I've never seen him hit an iron straighter. That's what I ultimately want!!

 

My ultimate question is for the better players who have chosen the G400. Why did you pick them? What do they do for your game? And, perhaps most importantly, are you missing out on anything with these irons in comparison to the other options?

 

Trying to get this back on track,,,,,,,,,,,,,,

 

Firstly, to what do you attribute your handicap going up(?) ? You say you were scratch and now single digits so obviously you're a bit higher than that now and looking for help. So the first question is why ? Age ? Physical issues ? Just not enough time to practice ?

 

In the world of Blades, PCB (Player's Cavity Back), GI (Game Improvement) and SGI (Super GI) one doesn't normally hear about a guy even willing to jump 2 "levels" at once. Very open-minded of you actually. ;)

 

Assuming something like a general lack of time to devote to the game, personally, I would go one step at a time, first to a PCB like the i210, the iBlade or the AP-2 and see if one of those can't get you where you want to go first. You were a strong iron player before with blades so I suspect you will miss at least some of the workability the MP18 blades offered you, no ?

 

Then again, you do mention you'd like to hit it "straight". GIs (as in G400/G410) certainly do that !!!

 

I played the G20s myself for almost 7 seasons before I recently put the 716 AP-1s in my bag. I'd liked the AP-1 since around 2010 when the first(?) iteration, the 710 AP-1, came out but never pulled the trigger on them. And of course, being very content with my G20s never had any real reason to change,,,,,,,,, until,,,,,,,,, well,,,,,,,,, I had a reason to change. :lol:

 

I must say, the main difference between my older G20s and the newer Ap-1 is the narrower soles. I find them clearly superior performers out of the rough. Just about 40% of the time I find myself IN the rough so that is definitely a factor.

 

One other thing, which you probably already know, is to choose the right shaft - for you of course.

 

Good luck in your search. And keep us posted.

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Adams A12 Idea Pro hybrid, 16*, Aldila 85 VS Proto Stiff

Ping G400 hybrid, 19*, 70 gr Stock Stiff

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Ping Glide Forged, 48, 52, DGS300

Vokey SM8 56/08 (Thanks WRX !!!)

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Awesome responses all the way around, guys.

 

My scores have trickled up since moving from Virginia to Florida about four months ago. What I am finding is that a combination of higher winds, firmer soil, and tighter turf Have a caused me a lot of issues with turf interaction. I am manipulating the club a lot during my swing to fight against it, and I have seen a ton of shots that have way too much unintended curvature. The narrow soles on my irons are taking a lot, and I am really struggling with it.

 

I look at a club like the G 400 and all I see is a big, wide, forgiving soul with enough balance to keep me out of the dirt. After having so many shots straight off-line recently, the idea of having a set of point and shoot irons is really appealing.

 

The funny thing is that the rest of my game is rock solid right now. I am even putting well, which rarely happens.

 

I spent some time there demoing various ironed last night in an indoor simulator. What I need to decide is whether I am willing to give up the field I would get from a forged iron like a Z765, which I really like, And dive all the way into a game improvement iron like the G 400 or G 700. Reading all of your experiences Definitely has my wheels turning. I may just bite the bullet and buy a couple of six iron demos to take outdoors with me.

 

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Agree, hot spot is myth.

 

What IS real though is that irons with the CG set deep into the head will flight higher and with less spin. Such an iron, along with grass on the face reducing spin, can result in some flier shots.

 

Pro's don't play GI irons for different reasons, one of which is they strike the ball in the center of the face and don't need high MOI.

 

And for the record, I usually shoot somewhere in the vicinity of 80 and have been using full on GI irons for several years now. And during that time I can only count on one hand the number of fliers I've experienced. Honestly, fliers are the least of my worries on the course.

 

I never said it happens every time, just that it can.

 

Maybe the times when mine flew an extra 20 or 30 yards than expected were actually my "good" shots, out the sweet spot and the rest of my shots were all off centre, it's entirely possible, though I'd like to think that out of the thousands of shots i hit with them, I hit more than a handful of those "good" shots. I hit quite a few mid 80s with my Gs but most rounds were up to 10 shots more.

 

My strike has improved a lot since then so it is probably that, just as much if not more, that has improved my distance control. Maybe if I was still hitting Gs now, my 8 iron would be 160 yards rather than the 135-140 it was then.

 

I'm not going to argue with you. I'm a big fan of the i200s and was a big fan of the Gs but I had what I considered random bullets with the latter that I don't get with the former. Not many.... but enough to remember.

 

BUT.... (hehe)

 

What you say about tour pros is interesting though. You say they don't NEED the higher MOI which technically is true in the main. But why don't they WANT it? The truth is they kind of do want some help. Lee Westwood carries a full bag of i210s rather than iBlades. He doesn't even combo them. I might be wrong but I believe the i210 is the mainstay of Ping staffers, not the iBlade which suggests that even tour pros want/need/whatever the very MOI you say they don't need. So on that basis, why not go the whole hog and play G400s? Possibly because they know that they won't get the level of control they get with the i210s. Which leads us back to dispersion which with tour pros is mainly a front to back concern, rather than left to right. Which I guess brings us back to hot spots.....

Maybe they don't play the G line because they aren't comfortable with the look. I suppose lots of those guys have player smaller irons for years and don't feel comfortable with the visual aspect.
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Everyone is different. But for me it was a slippery slope. There is just so much meat down there, comparatively, between an MP18 and a G400. I decided "to make the game easier" and switched from clubs like Hogan blades and MP14s to Big Berthas and Ping G5s etc. I ended up ruining my iron game completely. They do not launch the ball in the same window as what I was used to and I ended up slowing down my rotation and swinging very sloppily. Those bigger clubs are too easy to elevate. I wouldn't necessarily recommend ever going from a G400 to an MP18 if you are comfortable with the G400 and you score well with them. There's no need to. But it was tough for me to hit the same windows with the rotational speed I used to have. I have been fighting trying to get it back ever since. I also am a firm believer that it is hard to find the exact sweet spot on the bigger iron heads, and when I did, they absolutely flew much further than what I wanted at times. I absolutely believe there are hot spots in irons. It doesn't matter to me if people disagree, we don't play the same game!

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Everyone is different. But for me it was a slippery slope. There is just so much meat down there, comparatively, between an MP18 and a G400. I decided "to make the game easier" and switched from clubs like Hogan blades and MP14s to Big Berthas and Ping G5s etc. I ended up ruining my iron game completely. They do not launch the ball in the same window as what I was used to and I ended up slowing down my rotation and swinging very sloppily. Those bigger clubs are too easy to elevate. I wouldn't necessarily recommend ever going from a G400 to an MP18 if you are comfortable with the G400 and you score well with them. There's no need to. But it was tough for me to hit the same windows with the rotational speed I used to have. I have been fighting trying to get it back ever since. I also am a firm believer that it is hard to find the exact sweet spot on the bigger iron heads, and when I did, they absolutely flew much further than what I wanted at times. I absolutely believe there are hot spots in irons. It doesn't matter to me if people disagree, we don't play the same game!

 

You can believe there are hotspots all you want. It's ok to be wrong. :)

Titleist TS2
Titleist 917 F2 3 wood
Ping Anser 20,23,27 Hybrids
Wilson Staff MB's 6-PW
Ping Glide 3.0 50*
Ping Glide 54* WS
, 58*ES

Bettinardi Queen B 6

 

 

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