Callaway epic flash? is this legit? (New Pics added Pg 1)

[chris975d]

Same here...older head....maybe I haven't come across a newer head...but you would think someone would have leaked a change in sound fix....or maybe not..wish I had a newer head then...

 

I think OEM's are very hesitant to publicly announce any potential short comings they may find. Add to that, Callaway has been very guarded on any info coming out. They want to control the story behind the club. If it is indeed a change to the head to address perceived shortcomings, then kudos to them for addressing it based on customer feedback. If I ended up on the good side of acoustic variance from head to head, I can live with that.

 

Agree...but I wish they would have done it as sooner... if they indeed have developed a fix...I feel like I turned off some buyers by playing this thing. Good numbers...terrible sound they said

 

The sound from my driver most definitely turned some buyers off. Told me such to my face, as I allowed many of my most avid customers to hit/play rounds with mine way before release date. Only one said he liked the sound, all others mentioned it as a negative to some degree. It's why chose not to stock the Flash this year. So it is potentially off putting, and the sound (at least of some/mine/older heads ?) is not something that could ever be described as a "thud" or "solid". Seeing these words used with some personal reviews on here has puzzled me until I heard the first one on course last week.

 

I have a few questions.

 

Did the sound they didn't like override the numbers ? Or was is just 1 of many reasons ? i.e. did the sound make the difference ?

 

And, am I reading that right ? You're not stocking the EF because of the sound ? What kind of shop are your working at/own ? How can you not stock the current Callaway driver ?

 

Or does that simply mean you'll have the demos but just won't keep any "in stock" for immediate purchase ?

 

When roughly 10 of my best/highest spending customers tell me they will not buy the Flash based off the sound of mine, and these guys are the ones that move the needle, so to speak, as far as my shop sales go, it's a pretty easy decision to make. And no, not stocking or demoing Callaway this year. I'll sell balls, etc, but not going with Callaway hard goods in the shop this year. Mostly due to that feedback of the Flash, but also due to some issues I have with the company itself. Sucks, because I have been a staffer and retailer for several years, but TaylorMade has outsold Callaway at my shop the past two years and I haven't had a single piece of TaylorMade gear in my shop during that time...those sales were just off the fitting days I've hosted for them. I have previously hated TM and how they operate, and basically boycotted stocking anything of theirs, but that's changed and are now a very good company to deal with. And how much demand I'm seeing for the M5 and especially the M6 already, it shouldn't affect us at all not to have a Callaway clubpresence in the shop. We aren't a huge volume (on equipment, I sell a LOAD of golf balls) shop anyway, but the TaylorMade sales have been shockingly impressive over the last few years, especially considering I've not done anything to help or encourage that. With me behind TM now, the interest built up for this year has me the most excited I've been for equipment sales in a long time.

[nsxguy]

 

Agree...but I wish they would have done it as sooner... if they indeed have developed a fix...I feel like I turned off some buyers by playing this thing. Good numbers...terrible sound they said

 

The sound from my driver most definitely turned some buyers off. Told me such to my face, as I allowed many of my most avid customers to hit/play rounds with mine way before release date. Only one said he liked the sound, all others mentioned it as a negative to some degree. It's why chose not to stock the Flash this year. So it is potentially off putting, and the sound (at least of some/mine/older heads ?) is not something that could ever be described as a "thud" or "solid". Seeing these words used with some personal reviews on here has puzzled me until I heard the first one on course last week.

 

I have a few questions.

 

Did the sound they didn't like override the numbers ? Or was is just 1 of many reasons ? i.e. did the sound make the difference ?

 

And, am I reading that right ? You're not stocking the EF because of the sound ? What kind of shop are your working at/own ? How can you not stock the current Callaway driver ?

 

Or does that simply mean you'll have the demos but just won't keep any "in stock" for immediate purchase ?

 

When roughly 10 of my best/highest spending customers tell me they will not buy the Flash based off the sound of mine, and these guys are the ones that move the needle, so to speak, as far as my shop sales go, it's a pretty easy decision to make.

 

And no, not stocking or demoing Callaway this year. I'll sell balls, etc, but not going with Callaway hard goods in the shop this year. Mostly due to that feedback of the Flash, but also due to some issues I have with the company itself. Sucks, because I have been a staffer and retailer for several years, but TaylorMade has outsold Callaway at my shop the past two years and I haven't had a single piece of TaylorMade gear in my shop during that time...

 

those sales were just off the fitting days I've hosted for them. I have previously hated TM and how they operate, and basically boycotted stocking anything of theirs, but that's changed and are now a very good company to deal with.

 

And how much demand I'm seeing for the M5 and especially the M6 already, it shouldn't affect us at all not to have a Callaway clubpresence in the shop. We aren't a huge volume (on equipment, I sell a LOAD of golf balls) shop anyway, but the TaylorMade sales have been shockingly impressive over the last few years, especially considering I've not done anything to help or encourage that.

 

With me behind TM now, the interest built up for this year has me the most excited I've been for equipment sales in a long time.

 

Thank you for the explanation. :hi:

[SirHoselRocket]

Hmmmm do you work for CNN part time?? Maybe change your screen name to Jim Acosta...

[nsxguy]

Hmmmm do you work for CNN part time?? Maybe change your screen name to Jim Acosta...

 

Less than 300 posts in 11 years and you feel the need to show snark over this ?

 

chris made some observations, I asked him about it, he explained and I thanked him.

 

This is a discussion board. This bothers you why ?

[Mob]

It is a loud driver. I mentioned this to a friend who works at Callaway, and he agreed. I ordered mine at 44.5 inches, but asked them to add back hotmelt to get it back to a D2 swingweight, knowing that will also help the sound issue.

[nsxguy]

It is a loud driver. I mentioned this to a friend who works at Callaway, and he agreed. I ordered mine at 44.5 inches, but asked them to add back hotmelt to get it back to a D2 swingweight, knowing that will also help the sound issue.

 

I tried it when the demo heads first came out (about 3 weeks ago ?) and don't remember it as being objectionable; certainly not Cobra L4V or Nike Sumo loud.

 

But enough people seem turned off by the sound & since I can't often remember what I had for dinner last night,,,,,,,,I guess it's loud. :lol:

 

I expect to give it another go before buying a new driver. This time I'll (try to) pay attention. ;)

[chris975d]

 

Agree...but I wish they would have done it as sooner... if they indeed have developed a fix...I feel like I turned off some buyers by playing this thing. Good numbers...terrible sound they said

 

The sound from my driver most definitely turned some buyers off. Told me such to my face, as I allowed many of my most avid customers to hit/play rounds with mine way before release date. Only one said he liked the sound, all others mentioned it as a negative to some degree. It's why chose not to stock the Flash this year. So it is potentially off putting, and the sound (at least of some/mine/older heads ?) is not something that could ever be described as a "thud" or "solid". Seeing these words used with some personal reviews on here has puzzled me until I heard the first one on course last week.

 

I have a few questions.

 

Did the sound they didn't like override the numbers ? Or was is just 1 of many reasons ? i.e. did the sound make the difference ?

 

And, am I reading that right ? You're not stocking the EF because of the sound ? What kind of shop are your working at/own ? How can you not stock the current Callaway driver ?

 

Or does that simply mean you'll have the demos but just won't keep any "in stock" for immediate purchase ?

 

When roughly 10 of my best/highest spending customers tell me they will not buy the Flash based off the sound of mine, and these guys are the ones that move the needle, so to speak, as far as my shop sales go, it's a pretty easy decision to make.

 

And no, not stocking or demoing Callaway this year. I'll sell balls, etc, but not going with Callaway hard goods in the shop this year. Mostly due to that feedback of the Flash, but also due to some issues I have with the company itself. Sucks, because I have been a staffer and retailer for several years, but TaylorMade has outsold Callaway at my shop the past two years and I haven't had a single piece of TaylorMade gear in my shop during that time...

 

those sales were just off the fitting days I've hosted for them. I have previously hated TM and how they operate, and basically boycotted stocking anything of theirs, but that's changed and are now a very good company to deal with.

 

And how much demand I'm seeing for the M5 and especially the M6 already, it shouldn't affect us at all not to have a Callaway clubpresence in the shop. We aren't a huge volume (on equipment, I sell a LOAD of golf balls) shop anyway, but the TaylorMade sales have been shockingly impressive over the last few years, especially considering I've not done anything to help or encourage that.

 

With me behind TM now, the interest built up for this year has me the most excited I've been for equipment sales in a long time.

 

Thank you for the explanation. :hi:

 

No problem! The Flash and Callaway certainly won't miss my sales, that I'm sure of. As I stated I'm a relatively small volume equipment sales proshop, so I have to make sure that what I do stock is what my customers want. And for me to bring in and stand behind a company that is going to make the vast majority of the stock in my shop, I have to believe in and also play the product in question, or it makes it really hard to sell. Customers at the daily fee level put so much stock into what we as course operators play, that sales just won't happen when they ask "if it's so good, why don't you play it?" I couldn't play the Flash as it was presented to me with that sound. And based off of that sound, my biggest customers spoke and said they didn't want the Flash this year, and sales over the past few years have shown me my customer base wants TM. So, I started opening up that possibly. And in doing so and meeting the newer (for me) TM guys in my region, I realized the TM I grew to dispise for so many years isn't there anymore. A fantastic group of guys to work with now. So it's a win-win-win for me, them, and apparently my customers.

 

But, back to the Flash. If the sound has indeed been altered, that's a great change for the club. Will only help sales for them.

[SirHoselRocket]

Because he bashed the product without reaching out to the OEM with concerns. And continued to push the narrative to his customers and people here on the message board without Callaway responding or offering an explanation. Real good staffer there. And personally. This statement right here says it all “but also due to some issues I have with the company itself. Sucks, because I have been a staffer and retailer for several years” sounds bitter and he used an initial sales sample to justify dropping Callaway and pushing Taylormade more because they probably gave him a better staff deal......so that bothers me...and yes my post count is low. Quality over quantity lol....I work for a living and can’t post 4,000 plus times in a little less than 3 years period... like yourself.....and it is a discussion board. It’s also the internet. So don’t get caught in your feelings....

[UnderPar18]

I caved today and ordered an Epic Flash SZ after testing a bunch of heads this past weekend.

 

Epic Flash SZ 10.5

Graphite Design Tour AD IZ 6x

44.75” @ D4 SW

Lamkin Crossline Cord +1/32

 

I didn’t think the Epic SZ was the best sounding driver but it didn’t sound bad and I got good results from it.

[chris975d]

Because he bashed the product without reaching out to the OEM with concerns. And continued to push the narrative to his customers and people here on the message board without Callaway responding or offering an explanation. Real good staffer there. And personally. This statement right here says it all but also due to some issues I have with the company itself. Sucks, because I have been a staffer and retailer for several years sounds bitter and he used an initial sales sample to justify dropping Callaway and pushing Taylormade more because they probably gave him a better staff deal......so that bothers me...and yes my post count is low. Quality over quantity lol....I work for a living and cant post 4,000 plus times in a little less than 3 years period... like yourself.....and it is a discussion board. Its also the internet. So dont get caught in your feelings....

 

Not bitter at all. Not to get into detail, but I did immediately bring the sound up to company reps I think the first week that I received the head. Again, this isn't a discussion for this thread. But bottom line, I have to stock what sells the most in the proshop. None of us (me, the course, or the manufacturers) benefit if the product doesn't move. And as far as "better staff deal", that's the least of my concerns when I bring product in. But if you must know, callaway "staff deals" are full deals... It's the most you can get. Not much way to "top" them, as all staff deals are essentially the same.

[SirHoselRocket]

I think the sound is a discussion for the thread. Mainly because you talked about it here and in other threads. While be it your right.....Your opinion/ posts may have created a false narrative for people who take what is said on here for granted and as fact. So your rush to judgement and to offer your opinion so quickly without finding the story of what was happening Is something I don’t vibe with...... I hope bringing Taylormade into your shop works out for you. But by not stocking EF you removed a possible revenue stream for yourself. Just my opinion. But what do I know. I’m just here typing things on the internet.....

[Mob]

It is a loud driver. I mentioned this to a friend who works at Callaway, and he agreed. I ordered mine at 44.5 inches, but asked them to add back hotmelt to get it back to a D2 swingweight, knowing that will also help the sound issue.

 

I tried it when the demo heads first came out (about 3 weeks ago ?) and don't remember it as being objectionable; certainly not Cobra L4V or Nike Sumo loud.

 

But enough people seem turned off by the sound & since I can't often remember what I had for dinner last night,,,,,,,,I guess it's loud. :lol:

 

I expect to give it another go before buying a new driver. This time I'll (try to) pay attention. ;)

 

It's a personal preference thing. I really like muted drivers with a thwack at impact. Going to a loud metallic sound would be a big change for me.

[chris975d]

I think the sound is a discussion for the thread. Mainly because you talked about it here and in other threads. While be it your right.....Your opinion/ posts may have created a false narrative for people who take what is said on here for granted and as fact. So your rush to judgement and to offer your opinion so quickly without finding the story of what was happening Is something I don't vibe with...... I hope bringing Taylormade into your shop works out for you. But by not stocking EF you removed a possible revenue stream for yourself. Just my opinion. But what do I know. I'm just here typing things on the internet.....

 

Not sure what I've said that could be taken as "fact"...I've even stated that there is clearly some variation in the sound of the SZ from club to club, and I'm not the only one that has said such. I only have room for one manufacturer to be stocked at a premium level (this is not uncommon at any green grass facility...most partner with only one to carry the full line), and I made the choice based off of direct customer feedback and sales trends the past several years. TM plain and simple outsold Cally for me, and that's without a single TM stick in the building to even hit. So it was a simple business decision this year, and it's looking like it won't be a terrible one. We sold/presold more M6 wood sticks this past launch weekend than I did Rogue total for last year, and that's even before my first TM fitting day, which has been booked solid for a month now.

 

But as far as sound, I think that's also been beat to death. People will either love or hate the sound. And if Cally has in fact tweaked the sound based on early reviewer/staff feedback, that would be a plus for them. Because as has been said, almost every early internet or YouTube influencer reviewer has negatively mentioned the sound of the SZ. Nothing I could say or do could influence more potential customers than those reviews.

[UnderPar18]

Guys enough. I posted my specs that I just ordered and it’s getting overseen with your bickering LOL!

 

 

[nsxguy]

Because he bashed the product without reaching out to the OEM with concerns. And continued to push the narrative to his customers and people here on the message board without Callaway responding or offering an explanation. Real good staffer there. And personally. This statement right here says it all "but also due to some issues I have with the company itself. Sucks, because I have been a staffer and retailer for several years" sounds bitter and he used an initial sales sample to justify dropping Callaway and pushing Taylormade more because they probably gave him a better staff deal......so that bothers me...and yes my post count is low. Quality over quantity lol....I work for a living and can't post 4,000 plus times in a little less than 3 years period... like yourself.....and it is a discussion board. It's also the internet. So don't get caught in your feelings....

 

Well, at least THIS time I know you're talking to ME. :lol:

 

4,000 posts in my time here works out to roughly 4 per day. Not a whole lot of time spent. Of course I read more than I post but,,,,,,,,,,,,,

 

And even though you "work for a living" and don't have the time,,,,,,,, you might take a minute or 2 to investigate the "Reply" and "Quote" functions in the lower right (on a computer, not sure about your phone). You know, so others might at least know WHO you are talking to. (cool)

[chris975d]

I caved today and ordered an Epic Flash SZ after testing a bunch of heads this past weekend.

 

Epic Flash SZ 10.5

Graphite Design Tour AD IZ 6x

44.75" @ D4 SW

Lamkin Crossline Cord +1/32

 

I didn't think the Epic SZ was the best sounding driver but it didn't sound bad and I got good results from it.

Guys enough. I posted my specs that I just ordered and it's getting overseen with your bickering LOL!

 

Lol! Glad you got to hit it and experience it for yourself! You like it and got better performance with it, and ultimately are the one that will be playing it. Congrats on the pickup! Sounds (pardon the pun) like it will work well for you.

[UnderPar18]

I caved today and ordered an Epic Flash SZ after testing a bunch of heads this past weekend.

 

Epic Flash SZ 10.5

Graphite Design Tour AD IZ 6x

44.75" @ D4 SW

Lamkin Crossline Cord +1/32

 

I didn't think the Epic SZ was the best sounding driver but it didn't sound bad and I got good results from it.

Guys enough. I posted my specs that I just ordered and it's getting overseen with your bickering LOL!

 

Lol! Glad you got to hit it and experience it for yourself! You like it and got better performance with it, and ultimately are the one that will be playing it. Congrats on the pickup! Sounds (pardon the pun) like it will work well for you.

 

This year is interesting with woods.

Callaway - has done so well with Jailbreak they are in a weird spot where AI isn’t enough to move the needle as much as they want. Other brands will start to catch up.

 

Taylormade - is doing a fine job but speed injected blah blah isn’t really all that cool from a marketing persepctive. The M5 performs no doubt about it but I feel like TM has cooled off so much in the driver category from their glory days. I also wasn’t a fan of the skinny gray strip on the crown.

 

Cobra - everyone loves the F9 this year which is really cool but I wasn’t digging the look. It also did not perform as well as Epic Flash or M5.

 

All these companies have good drives. Right now it’s about what performs and what can you get for the best price assuming that’s a factor for most.

[SirHoselRocket]

Because he bashed the product without reaching out to the OEM with concerns. And continued to push the narrative to his customers and people here on the message board without Callaway responding or offering an explanation. Real good staffer there. And personally. This statement right here says it all "but also due to some issues I have with the company itself. Sucks, because I have been a staffer and retailer for several years" sounds bitter and he used an initial sales sample to justify dropping Callaway and pushing Taylormade more because they probably gave him a better staff deal......so that bothers me...and yes my post count is low. Quality over quantity lol....I work for a living and can't post 4,000 plus times in a little less than 3 years period... like yourself.....and it is a discussion board. It's also the internet. So don't get caught in your feelings....

 

Well, at least THIS time I know you're talking to ME. :lol:

 

4,000 posts in my time here works out to roughly 4 per day. Not a whole lot of time spent. Of course I read more than I post but,,,,,,,,,,,,,

 

And even though you "work for a living" and don't have the time,,,,,,,, you might take a minute or 2 to investigate the "Reply" and "Quote" functions in the lower right (on a computer, not sure about your phone). You know, so others might at least know WHO you are talking to. (cool)

 

Forgive me for not hitting the quote function champ and not utilizing proper message board etiquette....since you do so much time “reading” I figured common sense would’ve taking over...but my question is.....Why did you use the comma instead of the period like most message board gurus such as yourself? Anyways. I’m done here.

 

Chris975D I appreciate you replying back. Good talk...

[golfgirlrobin]

Just a question, can Callaway make a change to the head to deal with early reports of poor sound/feeling without affecting its Conforming status? Would they have to go through part of the process again? If they did, wouldn’t the club show up on the list in both versions?

[chris975d]

Just a question, can Callaway make a change to the head to deal with early reports of poor sound/feeling without affecting its Conforming status? Would they have to go through part of the process again? If they did, wouldn’t the club show up on the list in both versions?

 

I think they can hot melt without having to pass through conforming again. That doesn't mess with anything structurally, and some companies still offer that as a custom option for sound and/or weighting...PING being one that I've utilized that option on for customers. But prior to this year, Callaway would not hot melt clubs per customer requests, so maybe they took the prerelease feedback and did so.

[ThinkingPlus]

Just a question, can Callaway make a change to the head to deal with early reports of poor sound/feeling without affecting its Conforming status? Would they have to go through part of the process again? If they did, wouldn’t the club show up on the list in both versions?

Doubtful. Adding damping material or hot melt would change the mass, but not the head geometry or face technology. It would have to be a real fundamental change to the design impact conformance.

[Mcook929]

Out of curiosity is there a way to tell if it has been hot melted?

 

I ordered my regular EF one inch short. The total head weight with the sliding weight installed is 192g. The swing weight is D2. (done the poor mans way with a tape measure, scale and SW calculator.)

[UnderPar18]

Out of curiosity is there a way to tell if it has been hot melted?

 

I ordered my regular EF one inch short. The total head weight with the sliding weight installed is 192g. The swing weight is D2. (done the poor mans way with a tape measure, scale and SW calculator.)

 

Stock weight at 45.5” is D4. When I ordered mine I asked for a heavier weight and they asked me what SW I wanted to achieve. I told them D4. They don’t hotmekt they’ll add weight through the weights

[Digger818]

I just got a EFSZ 10.5 right from callaway. It’s definitely louder than the one my fitter had.

 

It’s LOUD. I’m sure my regular foursome are going to jump the first time I hit it. Lol. It doesn’t bother me because it’s longer straighter and more forgiving than my previous Epic SZ.

[awtryau89]

I was definitely on the side of the complainers about how load that club was. I haven't tried any of the new ones shipping now but I have had 2 Cobra F9 heads and my original was muted almost too much. My new head is much louder by comparison. There are definitely manufacturing variances.

[SwingBlues]

I just tried my EFSZ on the range and compared it to my Epic GBB. Yes, the EFSZ is LOUD, Seriously loud. Little aluminium sound but with a higher pitch tone....but... the results are out these. Just eyeballing it on the range, on the same ATMOS shaft, its longer than my Epic GBB and with the rear weight set to full Draw, its seriously straight.

 

I clipped some low and it out there.

Even over the top, its out there.

 

Impressive improvement but the sound will take a bit of getting used to. I also have a 5gm weight as the front so it's around D4ish. Will measure it tonight as my grip is on the ATMOS is a Grip Master and its lighter than the MCC Align.

 

The Hzrdus 6.0 SMOKE ain't too shabby either. I could easily live with that eventhough its a 6.0. The ATMOS is way lower launch though and right now, I have this set to +1/D setting. The EFSZ is not a high launch head, no freaking way for me, may be it's the higher front weight. Have to play with this some more.... it's gonna be FUN :)

[Benkross]

So, anyone that has the new Flash give any feedback against original Epic?

I hit the Flash SZ 9* and own an Epic Subzero 9* (9.6 actual) and tour issue Epic 9*. I have lofted the Epic down to 8*. The two SZ were played Standard. All using my TP6x and a playing length of 45 inches. Needless to say, I will not be getting the Flash SZ.

 

Avg across 3 drivers.

SS - 112

Ballspeed - 161

Smash - 1.44

 

Epic SZ - D4.5

Epic - D2.5

Flash - D3

 

Spin

Epic SZ - low (2k)

Flash SZ - mid. (2300)

Epic - high (3k)

 

Sound

Epic SZ - Best

Epic - Ok

Epic SZ - Ok

 

Dispersion

Epic - Best

Epic SZ - Good

Flash SZ - Good

 

 

 

[Benkross]

Out of curiosity is there a way to tell if it has been hot melted?

 

I ordered my regular EF one inch short. The total head weight with the sliding weight installed is 192g. The swing weight is D2. (done the poor mans way with a tape measure, scale and SW calculator.)

When a head is hotmelted the sounds is pretty different. Slightly more thunk than tink. 1 inch short do you mean 44.5? If the head weighs that I think it's a touch lighter than D2.

[Lacey Underall]

Disclaimer: I have not hit the Flash outdoors yet......

 

.....but man all of this talk about the sound seems really over-stated to me. I've hit every current driver indoors and I'm just not seeing it at all. Sound of course relates directly to feel. I thought the club felt great. My only problem with the club is cosmetics. I can solve that issue through the Customs program so no biggie. The driver just flat performs man. I think as the year goes on this sound 'problem' will go away once people see the performance.

[jgard320]

Hit this today and my numbers are below. The GC quad was 100% accurate. No monkey business going on.

 

Swing Speed- 102

Ball Speed- 245

Spin Rate- 1900

Launch Angle- 15

Carry Distance- 476

Total- 503

 

Sorry, bud. I have to call BS on this one. With that ball speed it was clear your shot was off center. With the launch spin you got off of that mishit, you should still be getting more than 27 yards roll out unless the surface setting was set to marshland. Here is what my sim predicts:

 

Swing Speed- 102

Ball Speed- Warp

Spin Rate- 1700

Launch Angle- 17

Carry Distance- ∞

Total- ∞ + 57 yards roll out