El Tucan Speaks..... (NO POLITICS)

[Togatown22]

I wouldn't say he's being heckled out there, but I've heard a few things lobbed his way out there today watching on PGATour Live. Commentators just said "some unnecessary comments there...."

[Forged4ever]

Would this even be a story if the caddie were white and at a course in the US? I doubt it. Would it be a story if Kuchar were a different race? I doubt it. Seems like the narrative that is driving the controversy is "rich white guy stiffs poor Latino guy" or " rich white guy fails to take opportunity to do something special to change the life of poor Latino guy".

 

At the end of the day, both parties are adults and contracted for something. The logic behind criticizing the amount paid to the caddie would be akin to going to a car lot and berating someone who you felt got too good of a deal or didn't pay enough to allow the salesman enough of a commission.

 

Kuch never would have lowballed a white guy at a course in the US. That's something nobody is talking about. Michael Wilbon from Pardon The Interruption just said he talked to two PGA players who were outraged by Kuchar's actions. They're right. Personally, it shocks me that anybody could back Kuchar.

 

 

great points you have there. funny how people skip over some of the details. would love to see some PGA stars speak out , it is the least they should do.

 

Their silence says all I need to know..... I.e. no one supports Kuch, but he's one of their own.

 

 

I agree that pro golfers do not seem to be supporting the actions. just wish somebody would comment the way Brooks called out Sergio.

 

All you need to say is something like hey I think Matt should do the right thing and make ammends.

 

Everybody makes mistakes and most can be fixed , as long as you make a valid attempt to do so.

I agree with everything that you say Mike, and its a great post however I think part of the problem is that before a mistake can be fixed and amended, first it must be acknowledged that a mistake was in fact made.

 

I do not believe that Kuchar feels that he is in the wrong here, much less that he made a mistake in how he handled this, from the first day that they met through his most recent chirpings in the press.

 

It’s a damn shame cuz as you have stated, he could most definitely right this and unlike on the course, he could make good use of a mulligan, IF he admits that how he handled this was a mistake.

 

Very nicely Played Brother?

 

Stay Well,

RP

[gunmetal]

i'd be curious what the reaction from those defending kuchar because "a contract is a contract" would be saying had this been patrick reed, bubba, sergio, or any other player that gets so much flak.

 

I think it's the same ol' same ol'.

 

Some guys have halos. Phil, Freddie, and Koucher come to mind. Whether deserved or not, once a halo is given, it is near impossible to take it away. The fact that this thread is now in the "Heated Topics" section is proof of that.

 

 

Collins also made a point to mention Mickelson too. However, unlike Kuchar, he said Mickelson isn't phony. Like or dislike him, he's not pretending to be something he's not. Personally I value authenticity, even the lame and annoying moments. Makes sense why I really like Sergio...though his recent actions have me scratching my head.

[Forged4ever]

https://amp.businessinsider.com/matt-kuchar-caddie-cheap-tip-el-tucan-2019-2

 

Fairways & Greens 4ever My Friends⛳️

RP

[gunmetal]

I know people that have been substitute caddies at tournaments near me. While neither were on winning bags, but the amount they got for the week were well below the amount that Matt set up for his guy before it even started. He won, he could have given more, sure, but he didn't have to. For the people saying a sub should have gotten x amount for it because of precedent when I know people that didn't just makes me laugh. And I am walking away liking Matt more. Right or wrong, he is sticking to his guns, and I respect that.

 

You respect people who stick to their guns when they are wrong?

[vanya]

Rob Lee on Sky Sports Riviera UK commentary calling Kuchar out as a tight arse.

[rangersgoalie]

shockingly, other tour pros were so disgusted they outed him and good for them.

Other than the amount given the caddie, this is actually what has disappointed me the most in this whole debacle, and that is, other than the Pro who initially tweeted this, there hasn’t been a peep.

 

A prior post mentioned that apparently two pros voiced their disgust privately to one of the media guys though nothing publicly and with a name behind it.

 

Typical, lmao~

 

The other thing is, where are all of the American caddies????

 

I hear these guys chirpin about other matters however you haven’t even heard a peep outa one of em, anonymous or not, lol!!!

 

If this was an American caddie that had gotten stiffed, do you really believe that there would have been this silence???

 

Nah, that’s the other thing about sheep~

 

When the heat gets turned up, they’re invisible!!

 

? BOOM?

 

NO ONE!!

 

NOTHING!!

 

NO WHERE!!

 

? ?Sheep are an amazing species, lol?

 

Their ability to become invisible and sink into the heard is something to behold ;)

 

Great points Soap?

 

All the Best?

RP

 

A couple of thoughts

Where are the regular caddies? Staying quiet.....there is no way they really want numbers they earn getting out :)

 

I asked a pretty in the know guy that works with the caddies.

$1500 salary is low side up to $2000 is basically the normal range of salary (I’m certain there would be outliers). So interesting that cheap Kuchar was paying $3000 for the week. To me that’s a hedging your bets deal for pay, but really, I do not know

 

No other commentary just some info

[Steele47]

Caught the tail end of it but sounds like Kuchar gonna do the right thing and pay the man a decent more fair amount.

[sfiggins]

Apparently someone got in Kuchar’s ear as he has agreed to pay the caddie $50k.

 

https://www.nytimes.com/2019/02/15/sports/golf/matt-kuchar-caddie-check.html

[jmvargas]

he just announced he will give the 45T to complete the the 50T asked...

 

....good for David Ortiz and better late than never but the damage has been done to Matt's reputation..

[beluga99]

I know people that have been substitute caddies at tournaments near me. While neither were on winning bags, but the amount they got for the week were well below the amount that Matt set up for his guy before it even started. He won, he could have given more, sure, but he didn't have to. For the people saying a sub should have gotten x amount for it because of precedent when I know people that didn't just makes me laugh. And I am walking away liking Matt more. Right or wrong, he is sticking to his guns, and I respect that.

 

You respect people who stick to their guns when they are wrong?

 

Kuchar just made a statement saying he was going to ring the caddie, said he (Kuchar) has behaved like a ****** (paraphrasing) and would pay him what he was due. No value given. Does this constitute now not sticking to his guns, given the weight of public opinion has clearly pointed out he's a tight fisted, out of touch, seat sniffer?

[timbo08]

Looks like this is over and Kuch has made it right. http://www.espn.com/golf/story/_/id/26005383/matt-kuchar-apologize-caddie-pay-full-50000

[BottleCap]

Kuchar is going to make things right with Tucan.

 

Good going Matt!

[Railroading13]

Sounds like Kucher issued an apology and plans to rectify the situation (pay the full 50k). I guess kudos to him? At least he recognizes where he went wrong, good on him for that

[Forged4ever]

shockingly, other tour pros were so disgusted they outed him and good for them.

Other than the amount given the caddie, this is actually what has disappointed me the most in this whole debacle, and that is, other than the Pro who initially tweeted this, there hasn’t been a peep.

 

A prior post mentioned that apparently two pros voiced their disgust privately to one of the media guys though nothing publicly and with a name behind it.

 

Typical, lmao~

 

The other thing is, where are all of the American caddies????

 

I hear these guys chirpin about other matters however you haven’t even heard a peep outa one of em, anonymous or not, lol!!!

 

If this was an American caddie that had gotten stiffed, do you really believe that there would have been this silence???

 

Nah, that’s the other thing about sheep~

 

When the heat gets turned up, they’re invisible!!

 

? BOOM?

 

NO ONE!!

 

NOTHING!!

 

NO WHERE!!

 

? ?Sheep are an amazing species, lol?

 

Their ability to become invisible and sink into the heard is something to behold ;)

 

Great points Soap?

 

All the Best?

RP

 

A couple of thoughts

Where are the regular caddies? Staying quiet.....there is no way they really want numbers they earn getting out :)

 

I asked a pretty in the know guy that works with the caddies.

$1500 salary is low side up to $2000 is basically the normal range of salary (I’m certain there would be outliers). So interesting that cheap Kuchar was paying $3000 for the week. To me that’s a hedging your bets deal for pay, but really, I do not know

 

No other commentary just some info

Thanks a lot for the info!!

 

That must be where Oakmont got the numbers for local caddies(Oakmont CC caddies) used for the Open, ie., $1500/week & 5%, 3% & 1%.

 

I hope that your shoulder is ok and you’re back in the saddle Bro?

 

My Best,

Richard

[vietnameeh]

Matt's PR team must of worked some serious overtime LOL

[Holy Moses]

Kuchar ended up giving Ortiz more money, presumably the extra $45,000 Ortiz requested.

 

Nice work, Matt.

[Stonedude]

He is still a dbag in my eyes after this whole greedy mess.

 

 

http://www.espn.com/...-pay-full-50000

 

 

205'd via waiting for mod approval..

[Stonedude]

Here is his statement.... I'm sure written by a publicist. I see he is giving to some local charities as well, at this point i'm sure in the hope it softens his trip there next week... Dbag Kooch, it took the tip of a spear to do what was right all along...

 

 

Full Matt Kuchar Statement

 

This week, I made comments that were out of touch and insensitive, making a bad situation worse. They made it seem like I was marginalizing David Ortiz and his financial situation, which was not my intention.I read them again and cringed. That is not who I am and not what I want to represent.

My entire TOUR career, I have tried to show respect and positivity. In this situation, I have not lived up to those values or to the expectations I've set for myself. I let myself, my family, my partners and those close to me down, but I also let David down. I plan to call David tonight when I'm off the course to apologize for the situation he has been put in, and I have made sure he has received the full total that he has requested.

I never wanted to bring any negativity to the Mayakoba Golf Classic. I feel it is my duty to represent the tournament well, so I am making a donation back to the event, to be distributed to the many philanthropic causes working to positively impact the communities of Playa del Carmen and Cancún.

For my fans, as well as fans of the game, I want to apologize to you for not representing the values instilled in this incredible sport. Golf is a game where we call penalties on ourselves. I should have done that long ago and not let this situation escalate.

[Holy Moses]

The other thing is, where are all of the American caddies????

 

Former caddie Michael Collins has made it pretty well know that he disapproved of the amount of money Kuchar paid. But you're right, I don't think any regular Tour caddies have spoken up. Even the caddie website, the caddie network, hasn't written anything on the episode and and they are supposed to the the voice of professional caddies. Maybe it's looked down upon to publicly complain about your pay or someone else's caddie pay.

[larciel]

LOL @ sentence starting with "My entire tour caree I have tried to show respect... "

 

Dude can't remember the last interview he gave few days ago.

 

What a mess.

[lenman73]

I know people that have been substitute caddies at tournaments near me. While neither were on winning bags, but the amount they got for the week were well below the amount that Matt set up for his guy before it even started. He won, he could have given more, sure, but he didn't have to. For the people saying a sub should have gotten x amount for it because of precedent when I know people that didn't just makes me laugh. And I am walking away liking Matt more. Right or wrong, he is sticking to his guns, and I respect that.

 

You respect people who stick to their guns when they are wrong?

 

When I agree with them and don't think they are wrong, then yes. Because a bunch of people hiding behind keyboards say they would have done this or Matt should have done that, does not make them right and Matt wrong. Sitting on a high horse and telling someone else how to spend there money seems to be pretty easy these days and I find that the most troubling from this story.

[lenman73]

I know people that have been substitute caddies at tournaments near me. While neither were on winning bags, but the amount they got for the week were well below the amount that Matt set up for his guy before it even started. He won, he could have given more, sure, but he didn't have to. For the people saying a sub should have gotten x amount for it because of precedent when I know people that didn't just makes me laugh. And I am walking away liking Matt more. Right or wrong, he is sticking to his guns, and I respect that.

 

You respect people who stick to their guns when they are wrong?

 

Kuchar just made a statement saying he was going to ring the caddie, said he (Kuchar) has behaved like a ****** (paraphrasing) and would pay him what he was due. No value given. Does this constitute now not sticking to his guns, given the weight of public opinion has clearly pointed out he's a tight fisted, out of touch, seat sniffer?

 

At the time of my reply I did not know Matt caved. While some of his comments earlier could have been more thought out, that is the only error on his part as far as I'm concerned. He made an agreement, honored it with an extra grand, but now people think a fill in from a resort has deserved the same pay as a regular tour caddy, need to get a grasp on reality. It is not a normal occurrence, if a player decided to do that, then they are extremely generous, not the norm. And those so happy for Dave better hope Matt gives him enough money to retire from caddying because I doubt he will have another pga gig. Otherwise he can continue to enjoy those 100 dollar loops. And before any keyboard cowboys call me cheap, nothing could be father from the truth. And if it was me, I would have gave the caddy more, though I have no idea how much but it would be less than 10 percent. My siding with Matt is more on the fact he made a deal, then ended up sweetening it in the end, but others that have no business knowing or getting involved got him pressured into making this "right" all of a sudden. Right is now set by the standard of people who do not walk in Matt's shoes or have his money, but somehow are now in charge of how he spends it.

[Forged4ever]

I just got off of the tele with my Tour Bud and he was as stunned as anyone when he heard the number and he said agreements don’t matter, at least to him, because he said these guys all live below what we consider the poverty line in the US and would agree to damn near anything proposed. He said he would’ve given him $60k(5%).

 

Like I said, he’s the one that when I caddied for him in the Web.com Mylan Classic(he had a T13, not a “T3,” as I inadvertently left the “1” off as it didn’t take when I hit the character, Madison informed me and I can’t find the post to correct, lol), he had asked me during the 4th round what my Mother’s big breasted cancer charity was(she’s a 3-Time survivor) and I’d forgotten about it when he handed me a an envelope(hahaha, THE infamous envelope, lmao) in the car before I took him to the airport and in it was a check in the amount of $3500, which I don’t remember what he won but if I had been his regular caddie, it was not a $3500 week.

 

Oh, he said that Kuchar is a good guy and that’s why this “stunned” him how he handled this so I really hope that Matt Kuchar does as Bottle Cap above me states, and “makes it right.”

 

It’ll be good for the caddie, it’ll be good for Matt Kuchar, it’ll be good for the game, and then we can drive this thread to 200+ pages with the maniacs comin outa the wood work to rip him for too little too late, lmao??

 

Have a great weekend Gents?

RP

[rangersgoalie]

shockingly, other tour pros were so disgusted they outed him and good for them.

Other than the amount given the caddie, this is actually what has disappointed me the most in this whole debacle, and that is, other than the Pro who initially tweeted this, there hasn’t been a peep.

 

A prior post mentioned that apparently two pros voiced their disgust privately to one of the media guys though nothing publicly and with a name behind it.

 

Typical, lmao~

 

The other thing is, where are all of the American caddies????

 

I hear these guys chirpin about other matters however you haven’t even heard a peep outa one of em, anonymous or not, lol!!!

 

If this was an American caddie that had gotten stiffed, do you really believe that there would have been this silence???

 

Nah, that’s the other thing about sheep~

 

When the heat gets turned up, they’re invisible!!

 

? BOOM?

 

NO ONE!!

 

NOTHING!!

 

NO WHERE!!

 

? ?Sheep are an amazing species, lol?

 

Their ability to become invisible and sink into the heard is something to behold ;)

 

Great points Soap?

 

All the Best?

RP

 

A couple of thoughts

Where are the regular caddies? Staying quiet.....there is no way they really want numbers they earn getting out :)

 

I asked a pretty in the know guy that works with the caddies.

$1500 salary is low side up to $2000 is basically the normal range of salary (I’m certain there would be outliers). So interesting that cheap Kuchar was paying $3000 for the week. To me that’s a hedging your bets deal for pay, but really, I do not know

 

No other commentary just some info

Thanks a lot for the info!!

 

That must be where Oakmont got the numbers for local caddies(Oakmont CC caddies) used for the Open, ie., $1500/week & 5%, 3% & 1%.

 

I hope that your shoulder is ok and you’re back in the saddle Bro?

 

My Best,

Richard

 

Spring surgery late April

[norge5]

Kuuuuuuch should be changed to Mooooooch

 

I don't care if Kuchar writes him a check for a million bucks. He showed who he is.

[Holy Moses]

shockingly, other tour pros were so disgusted they outed him and good for them.

Other than the amount given the caddie, this is actually what has disappointed me the most in this whole debacle, and that is, other than the Pro who initially tweeted this, there hasn’t been a peep.

 

A prior post mentioned that apparently two pros voiced their disgust privately to one of the media guys though nothing publicly and with a name behind it.

 

Typical, lmao~

 

The other thing is, where are all of the American caddies????

 

I hear these guys chirpin about other matters however you haven’t even heard a peep outa one of em, anonymous or not, lol!!!

 

If this was an American caddie that had gotten stiffed, do you really believe that there would have been this silence???

 

Nah, that’s the other thing about sheep~

 

When the heat gets turned up, they’re invisible!!

 

? BOOM?

 

NO ONE!!

 

NOTHING!!

 

NO WHERE!!

 

? ?Sheep are an amazing species, lol?

 

Their ability to become invisible and sink into the heard is something to behold ;)

 

Great points Soap?

 

All the Best?

RP

 

Here’s something about what the caddies think https://www.golf.com/news/2019/02/15/little-sympathy-for-matt-kuchar-riviera-caddie-yard/

[puttfordoux]

This is a BIG story...when the ESPN sports shows have this as one of their lead stories especially.

 

Golf as a sport is held to a higher standard. Its a double standard when the PGA Tour stresses generosity through its charitable work and one of its own is not so charitable.

 

Yes the individual player does reflect upon the sport as a whole. In the NFL for example you have suspensions for domestic violence even though in the eyes of the law no crime has been committed.

 

Positive PR especially in this age of social media is vital. Not everyone is a Tiger Woods where seemingly because of their immense talent they can somehow overcome their transgressions. Kuchar is not in that protected class, sorry.

 

There is no double standard. This wasn't charity, this was a business deal. One man contracted another man for a set amount of money, to perform a specific task. The task was performed, the fee was paid, and then the guy performing the task felt he was underpaid. But this isn't charity, so I don't see how this is a double standard. This is Kuchar being cheap, and the moral/pc/social media police turning it into Rich White man stiffs poor mexican man. Nothing charity about this.

 

It is charitable that Kuchar has gone above and beyond what was originally agreed to. You are right, it was a business deal, but without the foreknowledge how much Kuchar was going to make winning the tournament. And that is the charitable part of the deal. Giving out of your abundance, not simply what is required.

[Forged4ever]

https://www.golf.com/news/2019/02/16/matt-kuchars-mea-culpa-long-overdue/

 

All the Best?

RP

[Holy Moses]

I don’t know why people continue to say that Kuchar paid Ortiz what was agreed to. That point is very much disputed by Tucan.