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Blade user considering "more forgiving irons"... recommendations?


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So I recently made the mistake (or shall I say financial mistake) of going to Club Champion for an iron fitting. I had recently done a driver fitting, and after seeing dramatic on course improvements with the new big stick I figured I would go check out potential improvements for my iron shafts. Although I couldn't hit my own heads with any other shafts (Adams MB2s, which I have come back to time after time after flirtations with other irons, iBlades most recently), I did use the Miura 501 for the fitting and ended up with PX LZs. Although I shouldn't have let him, the fitter then had me hit a few "more forgiving players irons," Srixon 785s and Callaway Apex Pros. And the data didn't lie, my consistency was better with the 785s and Apex Pros. So I already reshafted my MB2s with the LZs, but I want to experiment with a "more forgiving players iron" that might unseat my MB2s. Ideal club would be one with minimal offset, thinner topline and shorter blade lengths, and forgiveness worth making the jump for. The Apex Pro Dots seem like the front runner, but in an effort to try something less expensive, I want to consider other current and definitely prior model irons. Any other recommendations? Should I just give in and finally try a set of AP2s, and if so, which number model?

PING G410 Plus 9* Fujikura Ventus Blue 6
Callaway Epic Flash 15* Atmos Red Tour Spec 7
TEE CBX 18* and CB Pro U 21* Matrix Altus 
Bridgestone J40 CB or Adams MB2 Raw 4-P PX LZ 6.0
Cleveland RTX4 50, 54, 58 Nippon Modus 125
Byron Morgan 612 or Odyssey Double Wide Flow
Shapland stand bag or PING Moonlite
Snell MTB X

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Iron forgiveness is probably the most overblown discussion point on golf forums. It doesn't come into play (per Tom Wishon) from the 7 iron down. If you're relatively good at hitting a golfball, it

Macgregor 1025M... Ralph Maltby rates them as 'game improvement' - pretty amazing for blades. I am playing Mizuno MP4... they are also easy to play. Better looking, better feeling than 1025M, but the

You should definitely try the the Cobra King MB/CB

Titleist CB

Wilson Staff V6

I found the Srixon 7 series a little too large

Driver = Taylormade SIM 8* Hzrdus green 6.0

1 iron = Titleist U501 Hzrdus smoke 6.0
3 iron = Titleist U500 Hzrdus smoke 6.0
Irons = Wilson Staff tour blade,  4-PW
Wedges = Titleist 52* SM6

                   Taylormade 56* and 60* MG2

Putter =Ping ZB3

Ball = Bridgestone Tour B RXS

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> @craz-e said:

> Titleist CB

> Wilson Staff V6

> I found the Srixon 7 series a little too large

 

Do you find the CBs competitive with the AP2s in the forgiveness department? They certainly win in the looks department...

PING G410 Plus 9* Fujikura Ventus Blue 6
Callaway Epic Flash 15* Atmos Red Tour Spec 7
TEE CBX 18* and CB Pro U 21* Matrix Altus 
Bridgestone J40 CB or Adams MB2 Raw 4-P PX LZ 6.0
Cleveland RTX4 50, 54, 58 Nippon Modus 125
Byron Morgan 612 or Odyssey Double Wide Flow
Shapland stand bag or PING Moonlite
Snell MTB X

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> @rtraudt said:

> So I recently made the mistake (or shall I say financial mistake) of going to Club Champion for an iron fitting. I had recently done a driver fitting, and after seeing dramatic on course improvements with the new big stick I figured I would go check out potential improvements for my iron shafts. Although I couldn't hit my own heads with any other shafts (Adams MB2s, which I have come back to time after time after flirtations with other irons, iBlades most recently), I did use the Miura 501 for the fitting and ended up with PX LZs. Although I shouldn't have let him, the fitter then had me hit a few "more forgiving players irons," Srixon 785s and Callaway Apex Pros. And the data didn't lie, my consistency was better with the 785s and Apex Pros. So I already reshafted my MB2s with the LZs, but I want to experiment with a "more forgiving players iron" that might unseat my MB2s. Ideal club would be one with minimal offset, thinner topline and shorter blade lengths, and forgiveness worth making the jump for. The Apex Pro Dots seem like the front runner, but in an effort to try something less expensive, I want to consider other current and definitely prior model irons. Any other recommendations? Should I just give in and finally try a set of AP2s, and if so, which number model?

 

I have the LZ shafts in my MP18MBs and they are a great feeling and releasing shafts for my swing.

 

You may have to look at the TM 730 if you want a short heel to toe length and thin top line. I was close to pulling the triggers in those.

 

If you can find used MP4s, they have a fairly thin top line if you don’t mind a more curves.

 

 

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Whats the problem with the Srixon or the Apex Pros? Either of those are fine options for you, especially if you have the data to back them up as being good fits for you. Personally I'd go with the Apex Pro dot version as they'll be more consistent in ball speed over the standard apex pro. I have only hit the standard APros a few times but I've heard from a few people complaints of getting the odd flier the goes way farther.

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> @"Josh L." said:

> Whats the problem with the Srixon or the Apex Pros? Either of those are fine options for you, especially if you have the data to back them up as being good fits for you. Personally I'd go with the Apex Pro dot version as they'll be more consistent in ball speed over the standard apex pro. I have only hit the standard APros a few times but I've heard from a few people complaints of getting the odd flier the goes way farther.

 

 

I think there’s a good chance that ultimately I will pick up the Dots, but I was trying to have some fun experimenting with prior model heads that can be had for less than the Dots. And the Z785s were honestly a little thick at address for my liking.

PING G410 Plus 9* Fujikura Ventus Blue 6
Callaway Epic Flash 15* Atmos Red Tour Spec 7
TEE CBX 18* and CB Pro U 21* Matrix Altus 
Bridgestone J40 CB or Adams MB2 Raw 4-P PX LZ 6.0
Cleveland RTX4 50, 54, 58 Nippon Modus 125
Byron Morgan 612 or Odyssey Double Wide Flow
Shapland stand bag or PING Moonlite
Snell MTB X

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> @rtraudt said:

> I think there’s a good chance that ultimately I will pick up the Dots, but I was trying to have some fun experimenting with prior model heads that can be had for less than the Dots. And the Z785s were honestly a little thick at address for my liking.

 

Ahh yeah, makes sense, you could pair them with the blades and run a combo to get a little more on the long irons since you're used to butter knives anyways. I've been using the Miura CB-1008 for a while and am working on building up a set of CB-301 3-4-5 and MC-501 6-7-8-9. Get the best of both worlds I think.

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Macgregor 1025M... Ralph Maltby rates them as 'game improvement' - pretty amazing for blades. I am playing Mizuno MP4... they are also easy to play. Better looking, better feeling than 1025M, but the Macs are the easiest blades I ever played. I was just looking around for MB2 in BST (not that I am in a buying mood, just curious.)

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> @rtraudt said:

> > @craz-e said:

> > Titleist CB

> > Wilson Staff V6

> > I found the Srixon 7 series a little too large

>

> Do you find the CBs competitive with the AP2s in the forgiveness department? They certainly win in the looks department...

 

The CB’s are surprisingly forgiving for the small package, I have never hit any 4 iron better than the CB 4 iron

 

 

Driver = Taylormade SIM 8* Hzrdus green 6.0

1 iron = Titleist U501 Hzrdus smoke 6.0
3 iron = Titleist U500 Hzrdus smoke 6.0
Irons = Wilson Staff tour blade,  4-PW
Wedges = Titleist 52* SM6

                   Taylormade 56* and 60* MG2

Putter =Ping ZB3

Ball = Bridgestone Tour B RXS

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> @rtraudt said:

> Do you find the CBs competitive with the AP2s in the forgiveness department?

 

I was in the 716 MB last year but felt it might be good to change. Earlier this year I bought a used set of 714 AP2 irons. They were definitely more forgiving based on my experience--certainly easier to launch. However, I still liked the look, feel and workability of the MB. So when I found a nearly-new set of 716 CB irons on the rack at a local store, I jumped on them.

 

They don't quite feel like the MB but these CB irons are fantastic. To me, they are perfect. While the AP2 had some bulk and more offset than I wanted, the CB was much more sleek. That said, I found the CB to be quite easy to get along with.

 

The only thing I can say is that the 716 CB did mark a slight departure from tradition in the CB. Titleist has always put forth a single-piece, forged head in the CB which had a relatively flat sole. The 716 & 718 both feature a tungsten weight in the toe as well as a more rounded sole with their "pre-worn" leading edge.

 

These play like my old Mizuno MP-64 irons but are a bit easier to launch in my experience.

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I love my MP-4s, but I found a great deal on a set of 716 CBs with Aerotech Steelfiber shafts, so I have those coming in. When I did iron testing, the CBs were much better than the AP2 in my hands—great feel, nice topline, and easy height. I also prefer a smaller head and thinner sole, so those also count in the CB’s favor.

 

The Apex Pro 16s are also a nice player’s cavity club. Very small head and topline—hard to distinguish from the Callaway Apex MB.

 

Or, you can just find yourself a set of MP-4s—they really are great irons, and the topline is razor-thin. : )

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AP2's are rather large and more offset compared to a blade, so I'd go with the CB's as those are great. Apex Pro's are quite small and more blade like with forgiveness so those are a good option I'm sure even though I haven't hit them. Maybe give the Mizuno JPX 919 tours a look. TM P750/760's also both good.

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> @MelloYello said:

> > @rtraudt said:

> > Do you find the CBs competitive with the AP2s in the forgiveness department?

>

> I was in the 716 MB last year but felt it might be good to change. Earlier this year I bought a used set of 714 AP2 irons. They were definitely more forgiving based on my experience--certainly easier to launch. However, I still liked the look, feel and workability of the MB. So when I found a nearly-new set of 716 CB irons on the rack at a local store, I jumped on them.

>

> They don't quite feel like the MB but these CB irons are fantastic. To me, they are perfect. While the AP2 had some bulk and more offset than I wanted, the CB was much more sleek. That said, I found the CB to be quite easy to get along with.

>

> The only thing I can say is that the 716 CB did mark a slight departure from tradition in the CB. Titleist has always put forth a single-piece, forged head in the CB which had a relatively flat sole. The 716 & 718 both feature a tungsten weight in the toe as well as a more rounded sole with their "pre-worn" leading edge.

>

> **These play like my old Mizuno MP-64 irons but are a bit easier to launch in my experience. **

 

Oddly enough, the MP-4 have a marginally higher MPF than the MP-64, for those who put stock in such things (397 vs 393). But totally agree with Mello on the CBs—I found them very easy to launch with great aesthetics.

 

I’ll be able to confirm my initial impressions soon enough. : )

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> @RobS14526 said:

> How about some Adams cavity backs in mid and long irons and keep your MB2’s in the short irons?

 

I was kinda thinking of looking for a set of CMBs for just that purpose!

 

PING G410 Plus 9* Fujikura Ventus Blue 6
Callaway Epic Flash 15* Atmos Red Tour Spec 7
TEE CBX 18* and CB Pro U 21* Matrix Altus 
Bridgestone J40 CB or Adams MB2 Raw 4-P PX LZ 6.0
Cleveland RTX4 50, 54, 58 Nippon Modus 125
Byron Morgan 612 or Odyssey Double Wide Flow
Shapland stand bag or PING Moonlite
Snell MTB X

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> @rtraudt said:

> > @craz-e said:

> > Titleist CB

> > Wilson Staff V6

> > I found the Srixon 7 series a little too large

>

> Do you find the CBs competitive with the AP2s in the forgiveness department? They certainly win in the looks department...

 

I've played both CBs and had the AP2s. In terms of forgiveness, they are pretty equal. CB footprint is considerably smaller but look so good at address. AP2s have a bigger offset that may throw you off. I'd have kept the CBs if I could go back in time.

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Look for a minty used set of Ping S55s. Very forgiving iron in a compact profile

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[b]WITB[/b]:
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Ping G410 LST - Fujikura Pro TourSpec 73 
Kasco K2K 33 - Fujikura Pro TourSpec 73 
Callaway RazrX Tour 4h - Tour 95 shaft
Ping i200 5-UW (2 flat) - Nippon Modus 105X
Taylormade HiToe 54 (bent to 55 & 2 flat)
Taylormade HiToe 64 (Bent to 62 & 2 flat)
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> @rtraudt said:

> > @craz-e said:

> > Titleist CB

> > Wilson Staff V6

> > I found the Srixon 7 series a little too large

>

> Do you find the CBs competitive with the AP2s in the forgiveness department? They certainly win in the looks department...

 

I'd say your best bet would be 718 AP2 fitted with the right shaft as they feel insanely good and have the better sole design. They also like notably smaller than previous versions - more similar to the CB and MB. I'm gaming the 716 CB now and it is a great club. Distance loss is there if you misshit it but overall it's a very forgiving club. 718 AP2 is more forgiving for sure but the CB is acceptable and feels better. Highly recommend checking out the Modus 120x. I was fitted for LZ 6.0 but I much prefer the feel of the Modus.

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Forgiveness is for sinners. Keep the blades.

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Ping G400 @ 10.5° (Ping Tour 65S)

Ping G400 5 wood @ 16.5° (Ping Alta CB 65S)

Ping G410 7 wood @ 20° (Ping Tour 75X)

Titleist 818H2 @ 22° (PX 6.0)

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For me I know I just prefer the feel of a 1 piece forged head. A true muscle back feels great when struck well but can really punish on miss hits. Currently game 19’ Callaway X forged and for me, they feel extremely soft and provide much more forgiveness than say Callaway apex mb, or Mizuno mp18 mb. I loved feel of Mizuno mp18 sc and x forged, and for whatever reason the x forged just felt softer and felt like it had bit more forgiveness than the mp18 sc.

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Callaway Epic Flash SZ 15 degree w/GD Tour AD TP 7x

Callaway Apex hybrid 18 degree w/GD Tour AD IZ 85x

Callaway X Forged UT 21 degree w/PX 6.0

Callaway X Forged 5-PW w/PX 6.0

Titleist SM7 50F, 54S, Cally MD4 58X w/PX6.0

Toulon Austin w/Stability Tour shaft

Srixon Z Star XV ball

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I have AP2s (716), Miura MBs and was fitted into iBlades today. The AP2 is only a tiny bit bigger than the MBs and iBlades are bigger than AP2. AP2 is a tiny bit more forgiving than MBs, iBlade the most forgiving. OP has already gone down the iBlade road so I can only assume that you've ruled them out. i210 as mentioned is quite a bit bigger than iBlade and wasn't any more forgiving for me. I got better launch with the iBlade as well. Having recently been through the gauntlet of trying to find something more forgiving I decided to just go get more lessons to fix my issues. Of course now I have lots of extra sets of irons hahahaha. I like looking at a small head, thin top line, little offset, there just isn't a forgiving option, that I've found that ticks all of the boxes.

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> @KevCannon said:

> For me I know I just prefer the feel of a 1 piece forged head. A true muscle back feels great when struck well but can really punish on miss hits. Currently game 19’ Callaway X forged and for me, they feel extremely soft and provide much more forgiveness than say Callaway apex mb, or Mizuno mp18 mb. I loved feel of Mizuno mp18 sc and x forged, and for whatever reason the x forged just felt softer and felt like it had bit more forgiveness than the mp18 sc.

 

Agree with Kev, I also have the X Forged 18's. They are a blast to play. Also split time with the apex mb's, and enjoy them too. FWIW, I personally do not find the mb's to be anymore demanding to play.



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> @puttingmatt said:

> > @KevCannon said:

> > For me I know I just prefer the feel of a 1 piece forged head. A true muscle back feels great when struck well but can really punish on miss hits. Currently game 19’ Callaway X forged and for me, they feel extremely soft and provide much more forgiveness than say Callaway apex mb, or Mizuno mp18 mb. I loved feel of Mizuno mp18 sc and x forged, and for whatever reason the x forged just felt softer and felt like it had bit more forgiveness than the mp18 sc.

>

> Agree with Kev, I also have the X Forged 18's. They are a blast to play. Also split time with the apex mb's, and enjoy them too. FWIW, I personally do not find the mb's to be anymore demanding to play.

 

I haven’t had a chance to play Cally mb’s ( a bit nervous to try lol) , but I really didn’t think performance was different than the x forged? I ask because I have been seriously considering putting mb’s In the bag to replace at least pitching wedge and 9 iron as I assume more precise distance control and less offset. Only complaint about the x Forged is shape of 9 iron and pitch wedge, and visually doesn’t look right behind ball.

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Callaway Epic Flash SZ 15 degree w/GD Tour AD TP 7x

Callaway Apex hybrid 18 degree w/GD Tour AD IZ 85x

Callaway X Forged UT 21 degree w/PX 6.0

Callaway X Forged 5-PW w/PX 6.0

Titleist SM7 50F, 54S, Cally MD4 58X w/PX6.0

Toulon Austin w/Stability Tour shaft

Srixon Z Star XV ball

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Sorry the autocorrect and auto fill on iPhone messed up previous post. I was asking if u really did not think there was any performance difference between the 2. I have played a few combo sets, just was asking about comparing the x forged and apex mb in particular.

Callaway Epic Flash SZ 9 degree w/Fujikura Ventus Blue 6x

Callaway Epic Flash SZ 15 degree w/GD Tour AD TP 7x

Callaway Apex hybrid 18 degree w/GD Tour AD IZ 85x

Callaway X Forged UT 21 degree w/PX 6.0

Callaway X Forged 5-PW w/PX 6.0

Titleist SM7 50F, 54S, Cally MD4 58X w/PX6.0

Toulon Austin w/Stability Tour shaft

Srixon Z Star XV ball

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P750 is your answer. Very thin sole, minimal off set and compact Headsize. Some other models I would recommend:

 

2016 Apex pro /2013 Xforged

716/718 CB

Mizuno Mp 15/25/ 18 mmc or Sc

Ping s55

Cobra king forged tour

Haven’t hit the ‘19 apex pro dot but hear they are amazing.

 

If you’re going AP2 you’re taking another step away from the Blade category. Ap2 are incredibly forgiving and provide great distance. The feel isn’t as pure as a blade and the look is noticeably chunkier than any blade

 

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