Daly gets cart at PGA

[Ferguson]

Daly is treating this event as he's treated everything in life - with blatant disregard for what is right and just. This is about him.

[Joker91]

Ironic

[gvogel]

> @Ferguson said:

> I do not agree with carts at pro events. Walk or give your spot to someone who can walk.

 

I agree with Ferguson on this issue.

 

Besides, they don't allow carts on the Black course in the first place.

[gvogel]

> @2bGood said:

> > @tbowles411 said:

> > So the provision for a cart shouldn't exist? The waiver request process in there for a reason. An otherwise competitive golfer shouldn't use every tool at their disposal to play? It's also a potentially legal issue with with ADA rules with access to courses, a la Casey Martin. If he can hit shots, he can play. To me it's very simple.

>

> I am not sure it is "Very Simple". Is walking part of the game/competition? if you yes then you have an issue.

>

> Some say putting yips is neurological issue - a physical disability. Should golfers with yips be accommodated in some way?

>

 

Ha Ha, yes golfers with a neurological issue should be allowed to use a belly putter!

[tbowles411]

> @gvogel said:

> > @Ferguson said:

> > I do not agree with carts at pro events. Walk or give your spot to someone who can walk.

>

> I agree with Ferguson on this issue.

>

> Besides, they don't allow carts on the Black course in the first place.

Not true. Every course must be accessible with a handicapped flag and at least a Dr.'s note stating the condition to allow it's use. Streamsong is the same way. They can't turn anyone away or they'll end up owning the course in a lawsuit.

 

[DrCRHop]

> @dlygrisse said:

> > @bandrz said:

> > I love going to PGA Tour events. These guys are amazing walkers. Rory is probably the best. Tiger was great until he hurt his back. I don't think he walks as well in soft spikes either. When I got to the match play this year I went straight to the tour van and asked if i could watch Paul Casey warm up on a treadmill. Was disappointed this wasn't open to the public. Had to settle for the driving range.

>

> I get the sarcasm...but technically yes, many of these guys really ARE amazing walkers compared to the average human on earth. It's no small task to walk as much as they do during the course of a week of practice, play and pro ams for many people. I remember when Michael Jordan was playing in some pro AM right after he retired and had to walk, he said it wore him out way more than he was used to, as he always rode.

> I have no issue with carts on the "Champions Tour" as it's more of a nostalgic exhibition than world class competition. Playing with carts is recreation (which I do almost every time I play now, mostly because you have to at most courses and I have a bad back) , ......not world class competition.

 

Maybe they are amazing walkers. But, just don't ask them to run.

https://www.golfdigest.com/story/this-video-of-pga-tour-stars-running-doesnt-help-the-golfers-are-athletes-argument

 

[jimb6golf]

Daly just needs to go away at this point. He's just hanging on at this point for sponsorship money as he can't be making any money playing these days. When's the last time he was in contention or won a tournament? Can't believe anyone actually wants to see him now as there are so many better players out there. Oh well to each his own I guess.

[gvogel]

My understanding is that Casey Martin had a genetic condition which caused a problem, alleviated by a cart.

 

John Daley has a sports injury, exacerbated by his weight and lifestyle. He should be denied a cart because he is injured; injured players take time off to recover - in John's case that may be never, but that's on him.

If Tiger is having some back issues, should he be allowed a cart?

[tbowles411]

> @gvogel said:

> My understanding is that Casey Martin had a genetic condition which caused a problem, alleviated by a cart.

>

> John Daley has a sports injury, exacerbated by his weight and lifestyle. He should be denied a cart because he is injured; injured players take time off to recover - in John's case that may be never, but that's on him.

> If Tiger is having some back issues, should he be allowed a cart?

The law doesn't stipulate how any physical conditions happened, just that people have something wrong. If a diabetic loses a limb, they're still disabled and are afforded accessibility provisions. It doesn't matter if the issue is temporary or not. Full disclosure: I've been in HR for 31 years...

 

[playar32]

> @jimb6golf said:

> Daly just needs to go away at this point. He's just hanging on at this point for sponsorship money as he can't be making any money playing these days. When's the last time he was in contention or won a tournament? Can't believe anyone actually wants to see him now as there are so many better players out there. Oh well to each his own I guess.

 

I always think how much money/tournaments he would have won if he kept himself in half (or quarter) way decent shape. I understand having a good time and doing what you enjoy, but it always baffles me when pro athletes/celebrities whose lively hood is tied to their bodies can't keep it check.

[LyinEye]

Ridiculous, no carts allowed.

[RobS14526]

A lifetime exemption for past champions is a nice novelty for an invitational like The Masters. A 10 year exemption for winning the PGA seems like plenty and I would even prefer five. Regardless of the legality, you would think common sense would tell someone that if you need a cart at Bethpage, you might want to stick to selling autographs in the parking lot.

[HitEmTrue]

> @tbowles411 said:

> > @gvogel said:

> > My understanding is that Casey Martin had a genetic condition which caused a problem, alleviated by a cart.

> >

> > John Daley has a sports injury, exacerbated by his weight and lifestyle. He should be denied a cart because he is injured; injured players take time off to recover - in John's case that may be never, but that's on him.

> > If Tiger is having some back issues, should he be allowed a cart?

> The law doesn't stipulate how any physical conditions happened, just that people have something wrong. If a diabetic loses a limb, they're still disabled and are afforded accessibility provisions. It doesn't matter if the issue is temporary or not. Full disclosure: I've been in HR for 31 years...

>

 

I agree with both you and @Ferguson at the same time. How can that be? I have no idea...

 

[bscinstnct]

What's the difference if they use a cart? Just let them use them. Nearly no one would so who cares?

Are they trying to establish some kind of baseline of athleticism required to play? Wow, making 20 and 30 year old "athletes" walk, that's brutal. If a guy needs a cart, just let him use one.

 

They basically have a butler now who carries their luggage, cleans their clubs, holds an umbrella over them when it rains. Not like they are doing gassers and up-downs between holes ; )

 

[Titleist99]

> @QuigleyDU said:

> I heard from a reliable source that this will be the cart he uses, and she will be his caddy.

>

>

>

I'm now for the cart and I think Big John should get more camera time.....LOL!

 

[cdnglf]

How many holes will he play before withdrawing? I put the over/under at 3.5.

[legitimategolf]

Long as it's cart path-only I'm cool with it.

[Titleist99]

Soooo, the PGA is saying that stamina is not part of the game and that a cart is not an advantage. Advertising stickers will be on that golf cart.....

[BeerPerHole]

I "liked" all the comments here that made me LOL. And, there are a few.

Big John and I are about the same age. I work like crazy to try to be able to walk 18...lots of damage to the gams from years ago. John seems to practice some serious self-abuse with his habits. I'm amazed he could walk 18 as long as he has been. If I had his habits I'd be dead by now. I say no to the carts. Not fair. Love John, but this is silly.

[Barfolomew]

Let them wear carts....and shorts too. Cause who gives a fluck...

 

Ive got foot neuropathy and never walk....can't. Speeds game up and lets disabled people beat the crap outta healthy mofos for once... to make it fair let everyone who wants ride.

 

You think it would have any effect on ratings if all were driving? Hell no...cause were watching shots not driving carts lol

[Hawkeye77]

> @"15th Club" said:

> As a public service, I submit (as I do on a sort of rough biennial schedule) Justice Scalia's brilliant dissent in PGA Tour, Inc., v. Martin:

> https://www.law.cornell.edu/supct/html/00-24.ZD.html

>

You can see him in Pulp Fiction - "Check out the big brain on Antonin!"

 

Seriously, it is brilliant and frankly, genius in how succinctly he cuts to the heart of the matter and past the obfuscations.

 

Having said that - thems the rules now until something changes. So we can argue the "should" of the matter (and we should, pun intended) but he qualifies and like LWIII's dead skunk in the middle of the road - "and there you are."

 

Scalia is also brutally funny and this isn't the best of his bits in the opinion, but one all, especially I'm thinking folks from California, may enjoy when he was discussing Q School and how pretty much anyone could and did enter, "I hesitate to say that amateur lawyers may enjoy taking the California Bar Exam."

 

[Roadking2003]

> @tbowles411 said:

> Not remotely the same thing. The ADA is there for a reason. There are reasonable accommodations in almost everything. Martin sued because his condition while it caused him pain, he could hit golf shots. He was physically able to walk, but would cripple him faster in the long run. In the NBA he probably wouldn't pass a physical and couldn't perform the basic requirements of playing.

>

I understand why we have the ADA, but in this case they are wrong. Anybody who doesn't think walking the golf course is integral to the game has never played golf in the Texas summer heat.

 

[Roadking2003]

> @bscinstnct said:

> What's the difference if they use a cart? Just let them use them. Nearly no one would so who cares?

 

In some situations, their competitors would care. In 1964 Ken Venturi almost died playing the US Open due to heat exhaustion. If he had a cart, it would have been much easier.

 

> Are they trying to establish some kind of baseline of athleticism required to play? Wow, making 20 and 30 year old "athletes" walk, that's brutal.

Athleticism isn't the issue. A competitive advantage is the issue.

 

 

 

[RobS14526]

One of my favorites from the Scalia dissent:

 

“I am sure that the Framers of the Constitution, aware of the 1457 edict of King James II of Scotland prohibiting golf because it interfered with the practice of archery, fully expected that sooner or later the paths of golf and government, the law and the links, would once again cross, and that the judges of this august Court would some day have to wrestle with that age-old jurisprudential question, for which their years of study in the law have so well prepared them: Is someone riding around a golf course from shot to shot really a golfer? The answer, we learn, is yes. The Court ultimately concludes, and it will henceforth be the Law of the Land, that walking is not a “fundamental” aspect of golf.”

 

He was a tremendously funny guy but as previously stated, that doesn’t change the court’s decision.

[JAMH03]

Trying to understand.

 

What's our justification for telling the PGA how to run their tournament, they seem to have done a great job for a 100+ years?

If we don't like it, don't play, or watch, or consider it as a major.

 

I think walking is part of the deal but can respectfully defer to how they run their event. I was pro Casey Martin, but I fully respect that it's a slippery slope even here with J.D. and other past champions.

 

 

[Ferguson]

Good point. Walking is integral to the game, especially on tour. It's the beginning of the end - this thing with John Daly.

 

"The walk up 18" is a reference that will soon become a thing of the past, just like phone calls.

 

[JAMH03]

@Ferguson what was the justification used or given?

[gvogel]

> @Barfolomew said:

> Let them wear carts....and shorts too. Cause who gives a fluck...

>

> Ive got foot neuropathy and never walk....can't. Speeds game up and lets disabled people beat the **** outta healthy mofos for once... to make it fair let everyone who wants ride.

>

> You think it would have any effect on ratings if all were driving? **** no...cause were watching shots not driving carts lol

 

are you kidding me? If they were all riding, it would look like a circus, and not professional at all. I believe it would be a turn-off for a lot of golf fans.

[Ferguson]

> @JAMH03 said:

> @Ferguson what was the justification used or given?

 

https://www.washingtonpost.com/sports/2019/05/08/john-daly-allowed-use-cart-pga-championship/?noredirect=on&utm_term=.30280b30239e

 

 

 

[JAMH03]

> @QuigleyDU said:

> I heard from a reliable source that this will be the cart he uses, and she will be his caddy.

>

>

>

 

LMAO I remember when they took the top off of Casey's cart that was so funny!