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Trackman Fitting Today -- Questions!


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Hi all-- I went in for a Trackman fitting today, and I'm still trying to get my head around the results-- I'm hoping some of you experts can point me in the right direction. I was a decent player as a junior/young adult, but work/kids/etc. over the years dwindled my playing time down to a few scrambles annually (and my scoring suffered accordingly). Now in my mid-40's, I'm looking to play a bit more and get my game and back into the low single digit handicap range. As part of that effort, I want to make sure my equipment is suitable to my current game and goals-- hence today's fitting.

 

I'm currently gaming Mizuno MP-5's with KBS Tour X-Stiff shafts. I love how they look and feel, but I have trouble controlling distance due to inconsistent ballstriking. I went into the fitting completely open minded. A few general takeaways:

 

* None of the player's cavity backs were appreciably better than my MP-5's, and I hit EVERYTHING

* I had expected to need to drop down to a stiff shaft flex as my swingspeed has slowed over time, but I am still getting the best dispersion and plenty of distance with the X-stiffs

* I tried the TaylorMade P790's, and was absolutely blown away. They felt great, were very forgiving, and went a club or two longer than anything else I hit (but with a similar dispersion). I have to get a set ASAP.

* The Oban CT 115 X shaft also performed significantly better than anything else I tried. I can't justify the expense though, and I'm thinking the Modus 120 X was a close enough second that I should go that direction.

 

My questions for you:

* Are the Oban shaft #'s better enough such that I should realistically consider them despite their MUCH higher cost?

* Are the P790 numbers with either shaft enough better than my MP-5's to justify a change?

* Anything else I should be taking away from these Trackman numbers in general? (other than I need to spend more time on the range!)

 

Thanks all-- Trackman results below (all with 6-irons):

**My current gamers, Mizuno Mp-5's with KBS Tour X-Stiff**

![](https://i.imgur.com/gIoYHJz.jpg "")

 

**TaylorMade P790's with Oban CT 115 X**

![](https://i.imgur.com/B2xh0h8.jpg "")

 

**TaylorMade P790's with Modus 120 X**

![](https://i.imgur.com/vtMpF7K.jpg "")

 

 

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Given the difference in loft I would say there is no appreciable difference in performance to warrant the investment.

> @Davethegolfer said: > Given the difference in loft I would say there is no appreciable difference in performance to warrant the investment.   This is IRONS, we are NOT talking DISTANCE clu

Yes, you might have been fancy about the feel of those OBANs, but if they cant handle when you give them the little extra....move on, irons is about dispersion, and sometimes we have to make a choice,

> @Davethegolfer said:

> Given the difference in loft I would say there is no appreciable difference in performance to warrant the investment.

 

This is IRONS, we are NOT talking DISTANCE clubs, so the #1 factor to look at is DISPERSION.

 

His own set, has a dispersion on carry of 4.8 yards plus minus from the average, the set with OBAN has 8.3 yards plus or minus from average = NO GOOD, while Modus has only 4 strokes and dispersion is equal to, or a tad better than his gamers or down at 4.1, so if a change was wanted or needed, and this was the only candidates, Modus is the shaft with those heads.

 

Based on this, OBAN is NOT the right shaft, irons is about constant GAPS, and as constant as we can get them, we dont want to hit it over and beyond the green when we pure it, so dispersion on carry as plus minus, here named as CONSISTENCY is what we shall look at at the most important of them all.

 

And LOFTs is distance, so if its more distance thats wanted, bend loft stronger, your angle of attack is so shallow there is NO Worries for bounce or anything, its ONLY a question of what distance gaps you have to fill in your bag.

 

At this club speed you will get a bit more than 3 yards for each degree of loft you go stronger, but you loose some stopping power, but at about 1.25* stronger your #6 would be a 190 yard carry club, and if we stretch it ad go 2.5* stronger, your #6 would be out at 194-195 like the others, but when both launch, apex, descent and spin goes down, we get way more roll out.

 

Those 790 with MODUS seems to works just fine with both good dispersion, long distance, AND good stopping power.

 

A few other factors to be noticed is SIDE WAYS dispersion.

His gamers is ALL to the left, so its either a lie angle to much upright, or a pull, but when we look at the others, dispersion as a total is the same, but now they go left and right of the pin who is a Face angle issue (grip size and shape might help with face angle timing, but it could also be balance or the feel of head vs shaft weight. We dont get to see "page 2" of the report who tells face angle, but CLUB PATH is TOTALLY DIFFERENT.

 

His gamers ALL have a club path out to in at impact, while the new clubs ALL have a path in to out, so something made the player change his swing and club path who is very constant on his gamers, not bad on the others, but different, and so is Angle of attack who is POSITIVE with his gamers, and slightly Negative on the tested clubs.

 

MODUS is still the best option, but its NOT perfect, here is still more to go on for the club as a whole, but it might be a good start. Tuning of lie angles, grip size and shape and some head weight tune up should be done anyway if it was not part of the test.

 

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Wow Howard, thanks-- that is a lot of awesome info to unpack! A few thoughts based on that:

* I hit my gamers first, so it's possible I wasn't completely loose yet. I can't think of another reason they would have been so different in so many ways vs. the others.

* All the shots to the left definitely have me curious about the lie angle of my gamers-- I'm going to flatten them out a bit and see if it makes a difference

* I definitely got a bit wild with the P790's with the Oban shaft. After the first couple of swings, I was encouraged by the solid feel and probably went after the next few more than normal, negatively affecting the dispersion

* I'm really surprised my angle of attack is shallow-- I've always considered myself a digger/driver (I generally hit down through the ball and take big divots). Could this be an issue of hitting off of a mat?

* Any thoughts on what a KBS Tour XStiff might do based on these numbers? I didn't get to try that combo, but that's a set I see come up for sale pretty regularly.

* You've definitely gotten my attention re: grip size/headweight and the affect on face angle at impact. I'm going to do some research to see what specific tweaks in this area might help me.

 

Also, here are the trajectory and dispersion charts for the above data tables:

zwpcom3a2ltk.jpg

nywt8vhtu86f.jpg

 

Thanks again everyone!

 

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Yes, you might have been fancy about the feel of those OBANs, but if they cant handle when you give them the little extra....move on, irons is about dispersion, and sometimes we have to make a choice, a smooth #6 or a #7 iron at the edge or what we can handle, depending on the need for stopping power at that carry distance....

 

Hitting off mats is...not that good when we deal with irons, and fear of "wrists and elbow shocks" DOES have the potential to change the players angle of attack against positiv to prevent the impact from a hard surface.

Friction is also different, and depending on mat and the turf we compare it to, Spin is always higher from turf, and launch is always lower, how much can vary ALOT. Trackman has on a random test seen close to 2000 rpms and close to 3 as launch angle difference, and since we normally has 4 loft difference and 2 as difference on launch, ball flight is becomes more than 1 club wrong from mats, on both spin and launch, and 1 club is a good estimate, so just add about 1000 on spin level, and reduce launch about 2* from those numbers, thats more like real world.....IF your angle of attack was the same, but if that changed to.....those numbers should not be used at all.

 

For LIE ANGLES on your gamers, use the ball marker test and a strait vertical line in the ball.

If they are too much upright, the line from the ball will point against the toe side.

Be aware of that lie angles has the potential to move impact spot away from the center of face, and impact is expected to be slightly toe side when lie angles is too much upright.

https://s3.amazonaws.com/golfwrxforums/uploads/ipb/monthly_06_2016/post-100881-0-84298400-1467190522.jpg

 

That gives a drop in smash factor, ball speed and distance, so if they are off on both lie angle and center contact, dont be surprised if they go longer after a lie angle tweak, thats not uncommon if it moves impact.

 

Lie is just as important as constant gaps, because what good is it when distance is perfect, but we get a put from the side of the pin, 4 yards off to the side? we could just as well has been "half a iron" long or short....so dispersion both distance and direction is important for scoring.

 

 

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Hi Hobbs-- all shots were slight draws with the exception of a few that I blocked out a bit right that stayed straight. Nothing moved left to right. I really with now that I had gone back and hit more with the MP-5's at the end of the session when I was loose, as I think not being loose at the beginning cause me to not make a full turn on the way back (but I came through them normally, pull hooking them)-- that's a pretty common miss for me early in a round.

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marronandwhite -

Thanks for the info. Based on your numbers, you swung the MP-5 on an outside to in path (club path avg -3.4). Which explains the dispersion with the MP-5 (either a cut/fade/pull). When you swung the P790s the swing path was an inside out path (club path avg +5.2 and +5.8) which promotes a draw ball flight (or push draw).

In my experience, when I swing with an "inside to out path" (positive swing path) I generally create better speed and contact.

I gamed Mizuno MP-14 for about 20 years and about 2 years made the switch to the MP-18 SC. My game has improved, but what I found out about 4 months ago was that the lie on my irons were 1* flatter then other brands. I increased my lie angle by 1* upright and it was a world of difference. My iron game has never been better. I almost made a switch to the Wilson FG V6 as I hit them at a demo session and crushed everything with great ball flight. But during my research, I noticed the lie angle was 1* upright compared to my standard MP-18 SC. For a few bucks, I had my lie angle adjusted and it saved me $$$.

I'd advise you adjust your lie angle 1* upright (only a few bucks) and practice/game the MP-5 a few times. Also, really work on a consistent inside to out path (or outside to in - whichever you decide works best for you) and I would think your ball striking, distance and dispersion would be tighter.

Might save you some $$$ for now. I like the MP-5 (Tested them before I purchased the MP-18 SC) but the MP-18 SC gave me a tad more forgiveness that I needed at my age (mid 40s).

Best of luck, hope I was somewhat help.

SIM 9.75* - Diamana DF 60X | SIM 15* - Diamana D+ 70X | SIM 19* - Diamana D+ 80X | ZX7 - shafts TBD | Zipcore 50/54/58 S400 | NP2 Button Back

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As some one who was fit into P790s last year I will say I absolutely loved them at first, but the longer I played them the more I hated them. They were long for sure, but I just hated the turf interaction and I would occasionally get one that just flew too far. They are very low spin in my experience. Before you drop that kind of cash I would at least try and play a round or two with a demo if you can and see if you can hit the shots you want (knock downs/ punches were very difficult for me) and how they react from different lies.

I am personally love the new Srixons 785s, they are taylormade long and mizuno soft and very forgiving.(same boat: mid forties, losing a little distance, 5 handicap, Mizuno fan boy, etc..)

Maverik Sub Zero 9* Ventus Black 6X (green dot adapter set to 7*)

Maverik Sub Zero 13.5 Ventus Blue 7X

Tour Issue Apex Pro Hybrid 16* Accra TZ6 

Taylormade P790 4 iron MMT 105 TX

Mizuno MP 20 MMC 5-PW TT Tour Issue X100

Mizuno T-20 50* TT Tour Issue X100

Callaway Jaws 56S & 60X TT Tour Issue Onyx S400

Scotty Cameron 2012 Select Newport

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> @Hobbs said:

> marronandwhite -

> Thanks for the info. Based on your numbers, you swung the MP-5 on an outside to in path (club path avg -3.4). Which explains the dispersion with the MP-5 (either a cut/fade/pull). When you swung the P790s the swing path was an inside out path (club path avg +5.2 and +5.8) which promotes a draw ball flight (or push draw).

 

 

First thing I noticed too. Two completely different swings. Moving path 8 degrees with just an equipment change is a little odd.

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> @SixSixGolf said:

> > @Hobbs said:

> > marronandwhite -

> > Thanks for the info. Based on your numbers, you swung the MP-5 on an outside to in path (club path avg -3.4). Which explains the dispersion with the MP-5 (either a cut/fade/pull). When you swung the P790s the swing path was an inside out path (club path avg +5.2 and +5.8) which promotes a draw ball flight (or push draw).

>

>

> First thing I noticed too. Two completely different swings. Moving path 8 degrees with just an equipment change is a little odd.

 

Very puzzling indeed, two completely different ball flights. During my fitting I saw a distinct FA change at impact depending on the shaft, but path and AoA was very consistent

 

I would also say some of the dispersion issues with the obans might just be the head instead of the shaft. Hard to say the modus/p790 combo is better dispersion wise given its a much smaller data set.

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