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Thorbjorn Olsen Arrested on Flight


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> @bigdane said:

> I'm a PROUD DANE, and I feel ashamed that one of my countrymen cannot behave himself.

> What newspapers write, and what is the truth, we all know are often two totally different things, but I cannot condone such behaviour, nor can I understand it - Thorbjorn normally behaves very well, and is well liked by both players and the public.

> Maybe there is something, we do not know? In spite of the "wet" facts, this is totally out of his normal behaviour.

> If everything is, as written in the press, he must, of course, be treated like any other citizen.> @"Oz Max" said:

> > Wow I thought Danes were good drinkers! He must have been quite intoxicated, in any case, he'll regret that bitterly

>

> We Danes are good drinkers, but I think that we generally know our limits, and behave accordingly. Thorbjorn apperantly did not!

 

How was the news percieved in Denmark?

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> @ray9898 said:

> > @Ole3wiggle said:

>

> > Ok, I'm not even going to get into or argue about the interpretation of the UK sexual assault law.

> >

> > But from the article: "Professional golfer Thorbjorn Olesen has been arrested on**_ suspicion _**of sexually assaulting a female passenger"

> >

> > Suspicion. He wasn't charged with anything. You know, because Police have to actually look into something and find out the facts before they just charge someone with something.

>

> LOL....that is standard terminology for an arrest since it not based on indictment. The police arrest based on suspicion of criminal activity based on probable cause.

 

Ok?... thats not the point of my argument. I'm arguing that we shouldn't cast this guy as a rapist because of what was said in the article. The article is very off putting for not having any facts about what happened on the flight. Half the people in this thread want him to the guillotine without even knowing what happened. If the truth comes out that he did molest this person, fair enough. All I'm saying is that if this is all blown out of proportion, this guys career and reputation has been seriously tainted.

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> @Ole3wiggle said:

> > @ray9898 said:

> > > @Ole3wiggle said:

> >

> > > Ok, I'm not even going to get into or argue about the interpretation of the UK sexual assault law.

> > >

> > > But from the article: "Professional golfer Thorbjorn Olesen has been arrested on**_ suspicion _**of sexually assaulting a female passenger"

> > >

> > > Suspicion. He wasn't charged with anything. You know, because Police have to actually look into something and find out the facts before they just charge someone with something.

> >

> > LOL....that is standard terminology for an arrest since it not based on indictment. The police arrest based on suspicion of criminal activity based on probable cause.

>

> Ok?... thats not the point of my argument. I'm arguing that we shouldn't cast this guy as a rapist because of what was said in the article. The article is very off putting for not having any facts about what happened on the flight. Half the people in this thread want him to the guillotine without even knowing what happened. If the truth comes out that he did molest this person, fair enough. All I'm saying is that if this is all blown out of proportion, this guys career and reputation has been seriously tainted.

 

the "fact" reported is that he was arrested for alleged acts. that's all. an arrest does not mean he's guilty. if someone wants to assume otherwise and say arrest means guilt, well, thats on the person making the assumption not the writer. nothing unfair about the article, all its doing is presenting the fact of the arrest. maybe there's sthg unfair about the assumptions we as readers make.

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Look on Twitter and the consensus is he's stone cold guilty plus his career is over. People even trying to get his sponsors to drop him. It's totally insane.

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> @cdnglf said:

> > @OldTomMorris said:

> > Look on Twitter and the consensus is he's stone cold guilty plus his career is over. People even trying to get his sponsors to drop him. It's totally insane.

>

> His sponsors haven’t already dropped him?

 

I don't think so. I observe only on Twitter so not 100% sure how it works but I notice that lots of people are tagging Nike in their comments about Thorbjorn, seemingly trying to shame or harass Nike to drop him. Maybe you think they should?

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> @OldTomMorris said:

> > @cdnglf said:

> > > @OldTomMorris said:

> > > Look on Twitter and the consensus is he's stone cold guilty plus his career is over. People even trying to get his sponsors to drop him. It's totally insane.

> >

> > His sponsors haven’t already dropped him?

>

> I don't think so. I observe only on Twitter so not 100% sure how it works but I notice that lots of people are tagging Nike in their comments about Thorbjorn, seemingly trying to shame or harass Nike to drop him. Maybe you think they should?

 

Sure, why keep him? This is the most publicity he's ever generated, and likely outweighs anything positive he'll ever do. Why would a company want to be associated with this?

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> @Ole3wiggle said:

> > @TheMoneyShot said:

> > Sounds like the PGA Tour may kick him off their tour if this info is true. Sad.

>

> Don't think he has a card at the moment. So nothing they can really do but ban him from ever getting one or maybe prohibit him from attaining one next season.

 

No No No, his biggest problem will be if found guilty will be getting a visa to enter the US.

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> @OldTomMorris said:

> > @cdnglf said:

> > > @OldTomMorris said:

> > > Look on Twitter and the consensus is he's stone cold guilty plus his career is over. People even trying to get his sponsors to drop him. It's totally insane.

> >

> > His sponsors haven’t already dropped him?

>

> I don't think so. I observe only on Twitter so not 100% sure how it works but I notice that lots of people are tagging Nike in their comments about Thorbjorn, seemingly trying to shame or harass Nike to drop him. Maybe you think they should?

 

I hate to see the twitter lynch mob at work. Even though he may be guilty, due process should be followed before he's dropped.

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> @BlackDiamondPar5 said:

> > @OldTomMorris said:

> > > @cdnglf said:

> > > > @OldTomMorris said:

> > > > Look on Twitter and the consensus is he's stone cold guilty plus his career is over. People even trying to get his sponsors to drop him. It's totally insane.

> > >

> > > His sponsors haven’t already dropped him?

> >

> > I don't think so. I observe only on Twitter so not 100% sure how it works but I notice that lots of people are tagging Nike in their comments about Thorbjorn, seemingly trying to shame or harass Nike to drop him. Maybe you think they should?

>

> I hate to see the twitter lynch mob at work. Even though he may be guilty, due process should be followed before he's dropped.

 

100% agree.

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> @BlackDiamondPar5 said:

> > @OldTomMorris said:

> > > @cdnglf said:

> > > > @OldTomMorris said:

> > > > Look on Twitter and the consensus is he's stone cold guilty plus his career is over. People even trying to get his sponsors to drop him. It's totally insane.

> > >

> > > His sponsors haven’t already dropped him?

> >

> > I don't think so. I observe only on Twitter so not 100% sure how it works but I notice that lots of people are tagging Nike in their comments about Thorbjorn, seemingly trying to shame or harass Nike to drop him. Maybe you think they should?

>

> I hate to see the twitter lynch mob at work. Even though he may be guilty, due process should be followed before he's dropped.

 

What due process should be followed?

Sponsorship deals are about the public image of the athlete. He failed to take care of his public image.

What else is there?

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My instinct is to agree with this, but due process is for the courts. His sponsors are business decisions, due process doesn’t have a place there if something can impact their bottom line.

 

Also want to add that “due process” may not find him guilty or even bring charges. However, that does not mean he did not commit the acts described. A good attorney can start him clear of legal trouble, but that does not mean he didn’t pee in the aisle, fail to follow orders from the FA or grope a woman. It simply means the courts will not seek criminal punishment.

 

> @BlackDiamondPar5 said:

> > @OldTomMorris said:

> > > @cdnglf said:

> > > > @OldTomMorris said:

> > > > Look on Twitter and the consensus is he's stone cold guilty plus his career is over. People even trying to get his sponsors to drop him. It's totally insane.

> > >

> > > His sponsors haven’t already dropped him?

> >

> > I don't think so. I observe only on Twitter so not 100% sure how it works but I notice that lots of people are tagging Nike in their comments about Thorbjorn, seemingly trying to shame or harass Nike to drop him. Maybe you think they should?

>

> I hate to see the twitter lynch mob at work. Even though he may be guilty, due process should be followed before he's dropped.

 

 

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> @golfandfishing said:

> My instinct is to agree with this, but due process is for the courts. His sponsors are business decisions, due process doesn’t have a place there if something can impact their bottom line.

>

> Also want to add that “due process” may not find him guilty or even bring charges. However, that does not mean he did not commit the acts described. A good attorney can start him clear of legal trouble, but that does not mean he didn’t pee in the aisle, fail to follow orders from the FA or grope a woman. It simply means the courts will not seek criminal punishment.

>

> > @BlackDiamondPar5 said:

> > > @OldTomMorris said:

> > > > @cdnglf said:

> > > > > @OldTomMorris said:

> > > > > Look on Twitter and the consensus is he's stone cold guilty plus his career is over. People even trying to get his sponsors to drop him. It's totally insane.

> > > >

> > > > His sponsors haven’t already dropped him?

> > >

> > > I don't think so. I observe only on Twitter so not 100% sure how it works but I notice that lots of people are tagging Nike in their comments about Thorbjorn, seemingly trying to shame or harass Nike to drop him. Maybe you think they should?

> >

> > I hate to see the twitter lynch mob at work. Even though he may be guilty, due process should be followed before he's dropped.

>

>

 

Because those on Twitter all too often spout off with outrage and usually without facts. Again not saying he's not guilty, just saying the twitter SJWs should be ignored.

 

On the bright side I'm sure Nike would sign him :)

 

 

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> @BlackDiamondPar5 said:

> > @golfandfishing said:

> > My instinct is to agree with this, but due process is for the courts. His sponsors are business decisions, due process doesn’t have a place there if something can impact their bottom line.

> >

> > Also want to add that “due process” may not find him guilty or even bring charges. However, that does not mean he did not commit the acts described. A good attorney can start him clear of legal trouble, but that does not mean he didn’t pee in the aisle, fail to follow orders from the FA or grope a woman. It simply means the courts will not seek criminal punishment.

> >

> > > @BlackDiamondPar5 said:

> > > > @OldTomMorris said:

> > > > > @cdnglf said:

> > > > > > @OldTomMorris said:

> > > > > > Look on Twitter and the consensus is he's stone cold guilty plus his career is over. People even trying to get his sponsors to drop him. It's totally insane.

> > > > >

> > > > > His sponsors haven’t already dropped him?

> > > >

> > > > I don't think so. I observe only on Twitter so not 100% sure how it works but I notice that lots of people are tagging Nike in their comments about Thorbjorn, seemingly trying to shame or harass Nike to drop him. Maybe you think they should?

> > >

> > > I hate to see the twitter lynch mob at work. Even though he may be guilty, due process should be followed before he's dropped.

> >

> >

>

> Because those on Twitter all too often spout off with outrage and usually without facts. Again not saying he's not guilty, just saying the twitter SJWs should be ignored.

>

> On the bright side I'm sure Nike would sign him :)

>

>

 

Great points by both of you.

 

Twitter cuts both ways. People can be skewered by a building "outraged" mob in minutes even if the accusations are not fully founded. But, then again, others can be caught "dead to rights", especially if there is video, when in the past, simple denials would have got them off completely. And it's a very good thing there does not seem to be video of this whatever he did.

 

He may not be toast. Athletes have been accused and come back from much worse. It depends on if anything comes of the assault. The charge of urinating on a plane is brutal but a heartfelt apology and rehab should get him another chance and maybe even keep sponsors. The assault charge is different so I do hope it was an exaggeration.

 

 

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> @OldTomMorris said:

> Look on Twitter and the consensus is he's stone cold guilty plus his career is over. People even trying to get his sponsors to drop him. It's totally insane.

 

Sounds exactly like Twitter. Certain groups use bots to target sponsors of those they want to take down. Usually it is for no real reason, but if Olsen is guilty then it would be justified. That's the problem with twitter though. Everything is a knee jerk reaction and no one waits to find out what is true or false.

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> @bigdane said:

> I'm a PROUD DANE, and I feel ashamed that one of my countrymen cannot behave himself.

> What newspapers write, and what is the truth, we all know are often two totally different things, but I cannot condone such behaviour, nor can I understand it - Thorbjorn normally behaves very well, and is well liked by both players and the public.

> Maybe there is something, we do not know? In spite of the "wet" facts, this is totally out of his normal behaviour.

> If everything is, as written in the press, he must, of course, be treated like any other citizen.> @"Oz Max" said:

> > Wow I thought Danes were good drinkers! He must have been quite intoxicated, in any case, he'll regret that bitterly

>

> We Danes are good drinkers, but I think that we generally know our limits, and behave accordingly. Thorbjorn apperantly did not!

Normally, I can read Danish fairly fluently, I tried to translate the word ØV that seems to have been mentioned around the Thorbjörn escapades in Denmark. But failed. What does that mean in English?

 

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> @irvnasty said:

> > @Krt22 said:

> > > @golfandfishing said:

> > > The folks saying it’s a mix of meds and booze that made him act out of character are dead wrong. The personality one excludes when intoxicated is their true personality- they do and say things that they feel deep down. Once the drugs turn off any social filters their true personality shines through. Some folks get super happy, laugh and love when hammered. Some spout racial slurs. Others grab women and **** in the aisle. The Thunder Bear, without a filter, has zero respect for anyone else, thinks women exist for his personal pleasure and knows that being rich will be his escape from acting any way he would like. Ambien and booze didn’t make him act out of character, it made him act to his true character.

> >

> > I can't say I disagree.

>

> A person is 100% responsible for how they behave in any state that they willingly put themselves into. If it was Ambien, the drug info will tell him, as will his physician, that he shouldn't ingest alcohol with it. Choosing to do so makes him responsible for how he behaves, as does drinking generally or any number of other drugs.

>

> That said, it's not the case that "how one behaves under the influence is one's true personality". Alcohol triggers a variety of neurotransmitters that effect different structures within the brain in different ways at different doses. The psychological effects of those can be complicated, but alcohol inhibits the prefrontal cortex, which would be where what one might call the "superego" or "conscience" would be located. Self-control, self-awareness, risk assessment, the evaluation of probability and consequences... these things are big parts of personality.

>

> There may be times when I see someone behaving obnoxiously and I think "someone should slap that guy". But then a different part of my brain remembers that I generally don't wish to be violent or aggressive or confrontational if there's not a really really good reason, and so I behave courteously. I'm a courteous and patient person.

>

> A large enough dose of alcohol could prevent the restraining functions. If I were dosing testosterone, then maybe the urge to be aggressive would be stronger and the restraining functions wouldn't hold. If I'm on a bunch of stimulants, anxiety and hypervigilance might overcome my restraining functions as well. In either case, that's really not my natural personality. That's the product of a dysfunctional imbalance of my normal operating functions.

>

> Again, though. If I were to decide to gear up on a bunch of testosterone or speed or get myself sloppy drunk, I have to take responsibility for the fact that I'm putting myself in an unbalanced state, and for the fact that my behavior may be unpredictable and potentially harmful to myself or others. The insight into my true personality then would not be that I am actually deep down an aggressive or violent person, because I'm not. It would be that I'm self-centered enough to risk temporarily behaving as such.

 

Well said, couldn't disagree more with- "The personality one [exudes] when intoxicated is their true personality- they do and say things that they feel deep down."

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> @BlackDiamondPar5 said:

> > @golfandfishing said:

> > My instinct is to agree with this, but due process is for the courts. His sponsors are business decisions, due process doesn’t have a place there if something can impact their bottom line.

> >

> > Also want to add that “due process” may not find him guilty or even bring charges. However, that does not mean he did not commit the acts described. A good attorney can start him clear of legal trouble, but that does not mean he didn’t pee in the aisle, fail to follow orders from the FA or grope a woman. It simply means the courts will not seek criminal punishment.

> >

> > > @BlackDiamondPar5 said:

> > > > @OldTomMorris said:

> > > > > @cdnglf said:

> > > > > > @OldTomMorris said:

> > > > > > Look on Twitter and the consensus is he's stone cold guilty plus his career is over. People even trying to get his sponsors to drop him. It's totally insane.

> > > > >

> > > > > His sponsors haven’t already dropped him?

> > > >

> > > > I don't think so. I observe only on Twitter so not 100% sure how it works but I notice that lots of people are tagging Nike in their comments about Thorbjorn, seemingly trying to shame or harass Nike to drop him. Maybe you think they should?

> > >

> > > I hate to see the twitter lynch mob at work. Even though he may be guilty, due process should be followed before he's dropped.

> >

> >

>

> Because those on Twitter all too often spout off with outrage and usually without facts. Again not saying he's not guilty, just saying the twitter SJWs should be ignored.

>

> On the bright side I'm sure Nike would sign him :)

>

>

 

I thought Nike had already signed him?

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> @bscinstnct said:

> > @BlackDiamondPar5 said:

> > > @golfandfishing said:

> > > My instinct is to agree with this, but due process is for the courts. His sponsors are business decisions, due process doesn’t have a place there if something can impact their bottom line.

> > >

> > > Also want to add that “due process” may not find him guilty or even bring charges. However, that does not mean he did not commit the acts described. A good attorney can start him clear of legal trouble, but that does not mean he didn’t pee in the aisle, fail to follow orders from the FA or grope a woman. It simply means the courts will not seek criminal punishment.

> > >

> > > > @BlackDiamondPar5 said:

> > > > > @OldTomMorris said:

> > > > > > @cdnglf said:

> > > > > > > @OldTomMorris said:

> > > > > > > Look on Twitter and the consensus is he's stone cold guilty plus his career is over. People even trying to get his sponsors to drop him. It's totally insane.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > His sponsors haven’t already dropped him?

> > > > >

> > > > > I don't think so. I observe only on Twitter so not 100% sure how it works but I notice that lots of people are tagging Nike in their comments about Thorbjorn, seemingly trying to shame or harass Nike to drop him. Maybe you think they should?

> > > >

> > > > I hate to see the twitter lynch mob at work. Even though he may be guilty, due process should be followed before he's dropped.

> > >

> > >

> >

> > Because those on Twitter all too often spout off with outrage and usually without facts. Again not saying he's not guilty, just saying the twitter SJWs should be ignored.

> >

> > On the bright side I'm sure Nike would sign him :)

> >

> >

>

> Great points by both of you.

>

> Twitter cuts both ways. People can be skewered by a building "outraged" mob in minutes even if the accusations are not fully founded. But, then again, others can be caught "dead to rights", especially if there is video, when in the past, simple denials would have got them off completely. And it's a very good thing there does not seem to be video of this whatever he did.

>

> He may not be toast. Athletes have been accused and come back from much worse. It depends on if anything comes of the assault. The charge of urinating on a plane is brutal but a heartfelt apology and rehab should get him another chance and maybe even keep sponsors. The assault charge is different so I do hope it was an exaggeration.

>

>

No matter how drunk it's hard to imagine peeing in the aisle of an airplane. There has to be some underlying driver such as ambien, other drugs, medical issue or maybe a fugue state?

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