Jump to content

Titleist EXP-01


Recommended Posts

> @dalehead said:

 

>

> You’re kidding, right? Most people do not “have the equipment necessary or be able to hit the volume of consistent shots to draw any real conclusions” about any golf equipment. That doesn’t stop them from expressing their opinions in places like GolfWrx.

 

That's why it's good marketing and not really worthwhile to R&D. The R&D people care about the dimple pattern effecting flight, the ball speed, the spin off different lofted clubs and at different speeds. They're trying to make a ball with specific certain characteristics. The feedback they're going to get isn't going to tell them they couldn't figure out better from in house testing.

 

Now the feedback they get is going to help them market the ball. How the ball feels to people and how it is perceived by people will let them know which aspects of the ball to focus on when selling the ball. Does it feel soft? Do people like it in the wind? Do they feel like it's longer? This feedback combined with the the numbers that R&D have given them will let them know how to sell it.

 

 

  • Like 2
Link to post
Share on other sites
  • Replies 199
  • Created
  • Last Reply

Top Posters In This Topic

Top Posters In This Topic

Popular Posts

> @dalehead said:   > > You’re kidding, right? Most people do not “have the equipment necessary or be able to hit the volume of consistent shots to draw any real conclusions” about any gol

Love the TS, but too much money for a surlyn ball?! Going cheaper urethane to compete with QST and P(a) would be a smart/good move!

I heard a rumor it's just a rebadged version of the new KIRKLAND 4pc ball.   NOT!!!

> @GoGoErky said:

> Wouldn't it be telling all brands that since tour level balls outside of the sales time are within the $45-48 range

 

I think it's squarely directed at Costco. The K3 appears to have a consistent structure (and is a tour-level ball). The original KSig and this limited reincarnation suggest Costco may attempt to have a second "seasonal" line using cores and compounds from various sources. I can't think of another manufacturer with a line like this except Costco, and now Titleist.

Link to post
Share on other sites

> @dalehead said:

> > @jschwarb said:

> > > @dalehead said:

> > > From what I gleaned from another popular equipment website this is Titleist’s strategy with the ball. EXP stands for experimental. 01 is model 1. Titleist is not talking much about how the ball performs. They want to hear from everyday players how the ball performs for them. Based on that feedback the ball may become a permanent addition to the Titleist line up, or it may disappear and be replaced by a tweaked EXP 02. I think it’s a brilliant strategy. They will get the ball in the hands of thousands (millions?) of beta testers who will provide mountains of data, and they’ll make a profit to boot.

> >

> > Would you be more likely to provide feedback for a product you bought rather than one that was mailed for free to you, like Titleist has done for years with their prototype sleeves? That answer may shape how many more of these releases will exist. But like you said, it's a profit this way no matter what.

>

> The prototype sleeves were pretty much a finished product. They were coming to market barring some kind of disastrous reception. The EXP balls are at a much earlier stage in their development. Provide feedback? You mean like write them a letter? Send them an email? How 20th century. Today they will get feedback from sites like this and social media. You won’t think your providing them feedback, you’ll just think your sharing info with your real and on line friends.

>

 

They're including a card in each dozen that includes a link to an online survey plus social media accounts. Not every golfer runs to message boards and instagram to share feedback.

Link to post
Share on other sites

> @jschwarb said:

> > @dalehead said:

> > > @jschwarb said:

> > > > @dalehead said:

> > > > From what I gleaned from another popular equipment website this is Titleist’s strategy with the ball. EXP stands for experimental. 01 is model 1. Titleist is not talking much about how the ball performs. They want to hear from everyday players how the ball performs for them. Based on that feedback the ball may become a permanent addition to the Titleist line up, or it may disappear and be replaced by a tweaked EXP 02. I think it’s a brilliant strategy. They will get the ball in the hands of thousands (millions?) of beta testers who will provide mountains of data, and they’ll make a profit to boot.

> > >

> > > Would you be more likely to provide feedback for a product you bought rather than one that was mailed for free to you, like Titleist has done for years with their prototype sleeves? That answer may shape how many more of these releases will exist. But like you said, it's a profit this way no matter what.

> >

> > The prototype sleeves were pretty much a finished product. They were coming to market barring some kind of disastrous reception. The EXP balls are at a much earlier stage in their development. Provide feedback? You mean like write them a letter? Send them an email? How 20th century. Today they will get feedback from sites like this and social media. You won’t think your providing them feedback, you’ll just think your sharing info with your real and on line friends.

> >

>

> They're including a card in each dozen that includes a link to an online survey plus social media accounts. Not every golfer runs to message boards and instagram to share feedback.

 

Not every golfer will respond to the online survey, that’s why Titleist, like every company ,takes a multi pronged approach. The point is still the same. Gathering customer data is no longer dependent on customers sending emails or responding to surveys. It is mined from sites like this and myriad other media.

Link to post
Share on other sites

> @arbeck said:

> > @dalehead said:

>

> >

> > You’re kidding, right? Most people do not “have the equipment necessary or be able to hit the volume of consistent shots to draw any real conclusions” about any golf equipment. That doesn’t stop them from expressing their opinions in places like GolfWrx.

>

> That's why it's good marketing and not really worthwhile to R&D. The R&D people care about the dimple pattern effecting flight, the ball speed, the spin off different lofted clubs and at different speeds. They're trying to make a ball with specific certain characteristics. The feedback they're going to get isn't going to tell them they couldn't figure out better from in house testing.

>

> Now the feedback they get is going to help them market the ball. How the ball feels to people and how it is perceived by people will let them know which aspects of the ball to focus on when selling the ball. Does it feel soft? Do people like it in the wind? Do they feel like it's longer? This feedback combined with the the numbers that R&D have given them will let them know how to sell it.

>

>

 

 

Exactly! Marketing data is what they want. They’ve done the R&D. They’re not looking for responders to tell them they need to change their dimple pattern. They want to hear how the ball performs in the hands of their customers. That data will tell them if they should go ahead with the ball as is, or if it needs to be tweaked.

Link to post
Share on other sites

> @GoGoErky said:

> Only place to but the exp that I know of w> @games said:

> > I'm surprised those of you who participate in the Costco / Kirkland thread don't see this for the "corporate middle finger" that it is.

> >

> > This is Titleist telling Costco "We can sell a dozen urethane balls, overtly tell customers we are going to change core and mantle combinations, and still charge the same price for one dozen that you charge for four dozen."

>

> Wouldn't it be telling all brands that since tour level balls outside of the sales time are within the $45-48 range

 

I don’t think the pricing of the EXP 01 has anything to do with Costco. It fits with the rest of the marketing of this ball, which is to provide as little information as possible and ask users to react to it with their impressions. If they priced it the same as the Pro V1 customers would assume it was a Pro V1 or AVX replacement and react accordingly. Same if they priced it the same as the Tour Soft. So they priced it in the middle.

Link to post
Share on other sites

$43 a dozen to not know anything about launch or spin properties of the ball seems like a stretch. For $5 more a dozen, you can pick up Pro V1 or V1x -- and currently for $8 less you can get any of the Bridgestone Tour B line. I think the price is steep to be part of a Titleist experiment. I thought the "patient" usually gets paid to be the guinea pig.

Link to post
Share on other sites

> @crushingr said:

> $43 a dozen to not know anything about launch or spin properties of the ball seems like a stretch. For $5 more a dozen, you can pick up Pro V1 or V1x -- and currently for $8 less you can get any of the Bridgestone Tour B line. I think the price is steep to be part of a Titleist experiment. I thought the "patient" usually gets paid to be the guinea pig.

 

 

Come on crushingr. You like vanilla ice cream and the crust cut off your white bread? Golf should be fun, take a flyer, you might love them or hate them but fun to try something different once in a while. DM me your address I’ll send you a sleeve, I bought 3 dozen to save $10 on shipping. :D

Link to post
Share on other sites

Unless the majority of golfers realize after the test that they don't need a Pro V.

 

> @noodle3872 said:

> > @agolf1 said:

> > It will be interesting if it is a cheaper urethane model. I'm sure they'd love to regain some share, but I wonder whether they'd actually make more or less money going this route. So far, they've just stuck with the premium ball / premium price point, and those that want it pay for it. They can obviously run the actual numbers (vs. us all guessing/speculating), but it would seem like they risk cannibalizing some ProV sales to the die hard Titleist fans here. So far, the losses may be to the more value conscious people. Of course, it could also just be that the market has moved, and if they don't eat their own lunch (ProV) someone else will.

>

> If this is a lower price point urethane covered ball I don’t see a reason to worry about Pro V1 sales. People may test this ball to see how it stacks up against the Pro V1 models. But I would think this ball will impact the sales of Srixon Q Star Tour and TM Project A more simply because the ball is a Titleist. The Tour Soft competes well against QST and Project A but the 2 piece design and non-urethane cover are detracters.

>

 

 

Link to post
Share on other sites

It is pretty amazing that we as golfers would pay to do their R&D. How could they lose! We buy the balls at a significant mark up, test them, give them real world results while they make money every step of the way. I think the real R&D is their testing of how much a consumer will pay knowing nothing about the ball they are purchasing.

Link to post
Share on other sites

The below is copy and pasted from the Titleist website. About the same amount of information that consumers have about any ball.

 

Straight From The Titleist R&D Lab

MTR Developmental Cover System: The short game spin enhancing urethane prototype cover was developed through our relentless material and process experimentation.

Innovative Core Technology: The high speed core construction and specialized casing layer deliver low spin on long game shots for great distance and tight dispersion.

Proprietary 346 Dimple Design: Through our testing, the propriety aerodynamic package has demonstrated an optimized flight profile for peak performance.

 

 

Link to post
Share on other sites

> @dalehead said:

> > @GoGoErky said:

> > Only place to but the exp that I know of w> @games said:

> > > I'm surprised those of you who participate in the Costco / Kirkland thread don't see this for the "corporate middle finger" that it is.

> > >

> > > This is Titleist telling Costco "We can sell a dozen urethane balls, overtly tell customers we are going to change core and mantle combinations, and still charge the same price for one dozen that you charge for four dozen."

> >

> > Wouldn't it be telling all brands that since tour level balls outside of the sales time are within the $45-48 range

>

> I don’t think the pricing of the EXP 01 has anything to do with Costco. It fits with the rest of the marketing of this ball, which is to provide as little information as possible and ask users to react to it with their impressions. If they priced it the same as the Pro V1 customers would assume it was a Pro V1 or AVX replacement and react accordingly. Same if they priced it the same as the Tour Soft. So they priced it in the middle.

 

I think it's aimed at the lower end urethane balls like the Callaway Chrome Soft, Srixon Q Star, as well as the Kirkland cheapo urethane.

 

They probably think a market has been developed for this over the past few years, I don't see it, most people i play will only buy a Titleist if it's a ProV, else they just look for something cheap.

Taylormade M5 Attas COOOL 7S
Titleist 917 F3 GD TourAD IZ 8S
Mizuno MP 18 3-PW ProjectX 6.0
Vokey SM7 54S and 60M
Cameron Newport 2 CT
Bridgestone Tour B XS

Link to post
Share on other sites

So......Titleist is making you pay to be its lab rat. Marketing genius!

Ping G400LST 8.5 TPT 14 LKP LT LW Proto
Ping G400 14.5 Tensei Pro Orange 80 TX
Mizuno JPX919 Forged 4i SuperPeening Blue X
Mizuno JPX 919 Tours5-PW Super Peening Blue X
Vokey SM7 raw 52, 56, 60 DGTI-s400
Byron Morgan Proto DH89
Pro -V1x
Jones Utility Trouper-Carry
Ogio Silencer Alphard E-wheels

Link to post
Share on other sites

> @BottleCap said:

> > @dalehead said:

> > > @GoGoErky said:

> > > Only place to but the exp that I know of w> @games said:

> > > > I'm surprised those of you who participate in the Costco / Kirkland thread don't see this for the "corporate middle finger" that it is.

> > > >

> > > > This is Titleist telling Costco "We can sell a dozen urethane balls, overtly tell customers we are going to change core and mantle combinations, and still charge the same price for one dozen that you charge for four dozen."

> > >

> > > Wouldn't it be telling all brands that since tour level balls outside of the sales time are within the $45-48 range

> >

> > I don’t think the pricing of the EXP 01 has anything to do with Costco. It fits with the rest of the marketing of this ball, which is to provide as little information as possible and ask users to react to it with their impressions. If they priced it the same as the Pro V1 customers would assume it was a Pro V1 or AVX replacement and react accordingly. Same if they priced it the same as the Tour Soft. So they priced it in the middle.

>

> I think it's aimed at the lower end urethane balls like the Callaway Chrome Soft, Srixon Q Star, as well as the Kirkland cheapo urethane.

>

> They probably think a market has been developed for this over the past few years, I don't see it, most people i play will only buy a Titleist if it's a ProV, else they just look for something cheap.

 

Reading the info on it the tech is something they think can be applied to any of their balls so imo it’s not targeted at any specific brand or model. Plus according to them it’s real early in the development phases it may never even become a real ball or come out in its current design

Link to post
Share on other sites

> @monks66 said:

> i got a dozen because I loved the AVX, and hoping this is has good greenside spin...dont get get caught up in the market Titleist/Costco battle stuff..I just love trying new golf balls

 

 

 

If you like the AVX, you’ll like this ball...if you can get used to the higher flight. It definitely has more green side spin.

 

Taylormade M3 460 - Fujikura Speeder 757 Evo IV
Titleist 917 F2 - Fujikura Speeder 757 Evo IV
Titleist 816 H1 - Fujikura Motore Speeder TS 8.8 HB
Cobra King F9 Speedback One Length - 5-GW - stock KBS
Titleist Vokey SM6 54/58 - DG 115
Scotty Cameron Futura 6M

Link to post
Share on other sites

> @cardia10 said:

> It is pretty amazing that we as golfers would pay to do their R&D. How could they lose! We buy the balls at a significant mark up, test them, give them real world results while they make money every step of the way. I think the real R&D is their testing of how much a consumer will pay knowing nothing about the ball they are purchasing.

 

Good gosh, it’s a dozen golf balls we’re talking about. Its 40 bucks! And you’ll be getting something you can use. Maybe you’ll like them, maybe you won’t, but the same is true any time you try a new ball. Let’s not over analyze (with the accent on anal) things.

 

Link to post
Share on other sites

> @varno said:

> > @crushingr said:

> > $43 a dozen to not know anything about launch or spin properties of the ball seems like a stretch. For $5 more a dozen, you can pick up Pro V1 or V1x -- and currently for $8 less you can get any of the Bridgestone Tour B line. I think the price is steep to be part of a Titleist experiment. I thought the "patient" usually gets paid to be the guinea pig.

>

>

> Come on crushingr. You like vanilla ice cream and the crust cut off your white bread? Golf should be fun, take a flyer, you might love them or hate them but fun to try something different once in a while. DM me your address I’ll send you a sleeve, I bought 3 dozen to save $10 on shipping. :D

 

I appreciate the offer - but I cannot accept. I'm with you that it golf should be fun - and the experimentation to find a new ball or driver settings or whatever it may be is fun. But to do the testing blind with no expectations is pushing the boundaries. Usually those 'TEST' marked balls are free and people are more excited by that. A better Titleist can never hurt though.

Link to post
Share on other sites

> @"Johnny T" said:

> > @monks66 said:

> > i got a dozen because I loved the AVX, and hoping this is has good greenside spin...dont get get caught up in the market Titleist/Costco battle stuff..I just love trying new golf balls

>

>

>

> If you like the AVX, you’ll like this ball...if you can get used to the higher flight. It definitely has more green side spin.

>

 

Thanks Johnny, I am not good enough to notice flight height, i just want straight off the tee and long irons> @"Johnny T" said:

> > @monks66 said:

> > i got a dozen because I loved the AVX, and hoping this is has good greenside spin...dont get get caught up in the market Titleist/Costco battle stuff..I just love trying new golf balls

>

>

>

> If you like the AVX, you’ll like this ball...if you can get used to the higher flight. It definitely has more green side spin.

>

 

have you played it? is it as soft?

Link to post
Share on other sites

> @chippa13 said:

> The below is copy and pasted from the Titleist website. About the same amount of information that consumers have about any ball.

>

> Straight From The Titleist R&D Lab

> MTR Developmental Cover System: The short game spin enhancing urethane prototype cover was developed through our relentless material and process experimentation.

> Innovative Core Technology: The high speed core construction and specialized casing layer deliver low spin on long game shots for great distance and tight dispersion.

> Proprietary 346 Dimple Design: Through our testing, the propriety aerodynamic package has demonstrated an optimized flight profile for peak performance.

>

>

 

Nothing a company says publicly about its product comes straight from the R&D Lab. Staright from the marketing dept.

Ping G410 Plus 10.5°/Alta CB55 r flex
Maltby KE4 TC 5w/Xcaliber SL FW r flex

Maltby KE4 ST-H 3h/Xcaliber HY r flex
Maltby KE4 ST-H 4h/Xcaliber HY r flex
Maltby KE4 Tour 5h/Xcaliber Rapid Taper r flex
Maltby KE4 Tour+ 6-G/Xcaliber Rapid Taper r flex
Maltby Tricept 54° and 58°/Xcaliber Rapid Taper r flex
Mizuno Bettinardi C06

Link to post
Share on other sites

> @monks66 said:

> > @"Johnny T" said:

> > > @monks66 said:

> > > i got a dozen because I loved the AVX, and hoping this is has good greenside spin...dont get get caught up in the market Titleist/Costco battle stuff..I just love trying new golf balls

> >

> >

> >

> > If you like the AVX, you’ll like this ball...if you can get used to the higher flight. It definitely has more green side spin.

> >

>

> Thanks Johnny, I am not good enough to notice flight height, i just want straight off the tee and long irons> @"Johnny T" said:

> > > @monks66 said:

> > > i got a dozen because I loved the AVX, and hoping this is has good greenside spin...dont get get caught up in the market Titleist/Costco battle stuff..I just love trying new golf balls

> >

> >

> >

> > If you like the AVX, you’ll like this ball...if you can get used to the higher flight. It definitely has more green side spin.

> >

>

> have you played it? is it as soft?

 

 

 

 

I have...initial thoughts are in post #17.

 

I'm also not that good but the flight difference was enough for me to notice. It wasn't a "oh wow, that flies a lot higher" but more of a conclusion I arrived at over the course of a round watching the flight since I was playing the EXP and AVX on each hole to compare.

 

I thought it was as soft, if not softer, than the AVX. That is one of the things I like about the AVX...the soft feel. I know it's not everybody's thing, but I like it.

Taylormade M3 460 - Fujikura Speeder 757 Evo IV
Titleist 917 F2 - Fujikura Speeder 757 Evo IV
Titleist 816 H1 - Fujikura Motore Speeder TS 8.8 HB
Cobra King F9 Speedback One Length - 5-GW - stock KBS
Titleist Vokey SM6 54/58 - DG 115
Scotty Cameron Futura 6M

Link to post
Share on other sites

I played with them the last 2 days. It's definitely a low spin ball and a firmer ball. What it reminds me of is the Taylormade TP5 line. It has a shine to the finish that's different then the ProVs or the AVX. It's not as soft as AVX, those feel like marshmallows to me. Did a wedge test from 120 and the new ball flew the furthest. It was also further off the tee than the Prov1x but equal to the Prov1 for me. I spin a ton and any ball to knock that down I am going to gravitate to. I like this ball.

Link to post
Share on other sites

> @duff said:

> I would like to find some for $39.95 just to see what they are like off the irons and around the green - other than Titleist, I can't find anyone that has them and direct from Titleist they are asking $43 plus $5 shipping - no thanks.

 

You may just have to be a bit patient. My local off course shop told me their shipment is due to arrive 10/17. On the other hand their sister store, 100 miles away, got theirs 10/1.

 

Link to post
Share on other sites

Wasnt planning on hunting for these balls, but went to the local driving range to hit some balls and they had these on the counter. The range also had a deal that if you bough any dozen they would give you two tokens (medium bucket) for free. I was already planning on hitting a medium bucket so I said why not. Got 18 planned for tomorrow so I'll try them out then.

Link to post
Share on other sites

I played these today, very nice off the driver and full iron shots, IF it is set to be a lower-cost urethane option, then this ball is by far better around the green, no Superball feeling (Q-Star Tour) and great check, no run out I get from Project A.

Cobra SZ Xtreme @ 10* 
Titleist 917F2 @15.75*
Titleist 816H2 20*
Ping G15 17*
New Level 1126 5-PW/M-Series 49*
Callaway MD5 54*X/MD4 58*X
Ping RW Anser

 

Link to post
Share on other sites

Played 9 this afternoon with this ball and different from Pro V. A little softer, but not bad. Distance wise maybe a few yards longer than Pro V. Mid iron spin was great! About the same for the wedges and short irons. Good feel and durability. Good ball over all and looking forward to playing these over the next few weeks.

Link to post
Share on other sites

> @"Johnny T" said:

> > @monks66 said:

> > i got a dozen because I loved the AVX, and hoping this is has good greenside spin...dont get get caught up in the market Titleist/Costco battle stuff..I just love trying new golf balls

>

>

>

> If you like the AVX, you’ll like this ball...if you can get used to the higher flight. It definitely has more green side spin.

>

 

Maybe an AVX-X. Possible?

Srixon z785 Miyazaki 5544; Taylor Made Original One 11
Taylor Made SIM 3W Titanium Diamana Limited
Taylor Made SIM 5W Titanium Diamana Limited
Taylor Made 4, 5 GAP-HI Hybrids KBS 
Ping i210 6-PW Ping graphite
Cobra Black MIM 50, 54, 58 Nippon Tour 105
Scotty Cameron Futura X 8
Callaway Chrome, Maxfli Tour

Link to post
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.

  • Recently Browsing   0 members

    No registered users viewing this page.

  • Our picks

    • 2021 American Express WITB & Equipment Photos- Links and comments
      We are back on the ground at the American Express PGA event.
       
      Here are links to all the galleries:
       
      Cameron putters - 2021 American Express
      PXG Gen 4 prototype drivers - new putters
      UST Maymiya LinQ shafts - American Express 2021
      Mitsubishi Kaili & MMT shafts - American Express 2021
      Titleist TSi 2 & TSi 3 hybrids - American Express 2021
      TaylorMade putter cover for Palm Springs/Palm Desert - American Express
      New Aldila Synergy, Ascent & prototype shafts - American Express 2021
      Callaway Apex Pro iron, Epic Driver and fairway, Apex iron & hybrid - American Express 2021
      New Perfect Practice training aids - American Express 2021
      New KBS prototype shafts - American Express 2021
       
        • Like
      • 4 replies
    • Kevin Na WITB: 2021 Sony Open Winner (pics and specs)
      Kevin Na's What's In The Bag?
       
      Specs are on the front-page as well-
      https://www.golfwrx.com/645178/kevin-nas-winning-witb-2021-sony-open/
       
      Driver- Callaway GBB Epic (9 degrees) Graphite Design Tour AD GP 6 TX
      3w- Callaway Epic Flash Sub Zero (13.5 degrees) Mitsubishi Diamana RF 70 TX
      5w- Callaway Epic Flash Sub Zero (18 degrees) Mitsubishi Diamana RF 80 TX
      Hybrid- PXG 0317 X Gen 2 (19 degrees) Graphite Design Tour AD DI 95X
      Irons- Callaway Rogue Pro (4), Callaway Apex Pro 16 (5-PW) True Temper Dynamic Gold Tour Issue S400
      Wedges- Callaway Mack Daddy 4 (54), Vokey Design prototype (’18) (60-06K ) True Temper Dynamic Gold Tour Issue S400
      Putter- Odyssey Toulon Madison
      Grips- Golf Pride Tour Velvet Plus4
      Ball- Titleist Pro V1x
       

       
        • Like
      • 32 replies
    • SIM up close
      Here some pictures up close of the SIM only for now.  
       
      Wk
        • Thanks
        • Like
      • 154 replies
    • 2021 EQUIPMENT LAUNCHES (Running thread of all our launch pieces)
      A continually updated table of contents of our front page 2021 equipment launch stories for your reading pleasure. 
       

      Callaway
      Apex irons, Apex Pro irons, Apex DCB irons Apex hybrids, Apex Pro hybrids  
      Mizuno 
      MCraft putters
      Ping
      G425 driver G425 fairway woods, hybrids and crossover G425 irons
       
      PXG 
      PXG 0211 series
        • Thanks
        • Like
      • 44 replies
    • JT with a Ventus in the Tsi3?
      https://www.instagram.com/p/CJo-yEVDcyC/?igshid=1llg9lvv71oco
      • 209 replies

×
×
  • Create New...