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Mizuno MP20 or 785 for sub 90s shooter with strong iron game

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Hi all,

A quick note on my game, 100 mph off the tee but a total disaster. Otherwise, I am strong in my irons but I feel I have to baby the iron shots with an unnatural tempo or else I will hook/snap hook. I found a lighter shaft helped this out a lot and I want to now going into a lighter shaft.

I have been going between Srixon Z745 with PX LZ 6.0 shafts and Srixon Z965 with X100 shafts over the last year. I never scored any worse with the Z965s, but I just didn't enjoy hitting them. I liked the Z745s until this past weekend I tried my hands at some MP20s with NS Pro Tour 105 Stiff shafts. I was in love, and before I drop $1100 on them I started doing some research. I saw that the MP20s are geared towards sub 4 handicaps and they won't be forgiving enough for a less skilled ball striker. Of course now I am concerned I am biting off more than I can chew.

I tend to think the improved ball striking was more due to the lighter shaft, and I am wondering if I'd be better off in 785s with the lighter shafts ultimately than I would be in the MP20s. I also don't mind saving the $100 and the better secondary market on the 785s.

Any advice is helpful.



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You will be happy to know I decided on the Z785s 4 to PW. The local shop did have one for me to demo and I hit it better than the MP20.

I'll offer some contrarian advice. There's no such thing as an acceptable handicap range for irons. If you like the feel of the MP20s and they give you confidence over the ball, go for it. I played my

I am a firm believer in everyone playing whatever clubs they want. I've played with guys who have blades and shoot 115 and I've played with guys who game super game improvement irons who shoot under p

I'll offer some contrarian advice. There's no such thing as an acceptable handicap range for irons.

If you like the feel of the MP20s and they give you confidence over the ball, go for it. I played my first set of blades as a 15 or so index and used them to get into the single digits.

That said, the 785s are also great irons (disclaimer, I play them) and you won't go wrong with those either. I haven't hit the MP20s but the sole design of the 785s is fantastic.

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Cobra SZ 9* : Ventus Blue 6-S

Cobra F9 Tour 4W : Tour AD TP 8-S

Cobra ForgedTec 3-iron : Nippon Modus3 105-S

Srixon Z785 4-PW : Nippon Modus3 120-S

Cleveland RTX3 50, 54, 58 : Nippon 115-S Wedge

Piretti Potenza 370g : Breakthrough Technology Stability Shaft - 34"

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Go demo the z585s, at least for the Nippon 105s. If it is truly the shaft you like, put them into the head that feels the best to you. maybe a combo set of 585 and 785s if you need some help in the longer irons but prefer a narrower sole in the short irons.

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Adams XTD 17* Fubuki 

Callaway Apex 20* AD DI 85s

Callaway Apex 23* OBAN Kiyoshi Purple

5-6 Srixon Z585 Modus 120S

7-PW Srixon Z785 Modus 120S

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I’ve been playing blades since I started the game 35 years ago starting with Haig Ultras, Tommy Armour Silver Scotts, several sets of Wilson Staffs, Spalding Tour Editions, McGregor VIPs, Golden Rams and a dozen different Mizuno blades. With that said, the MP-20’s are the most solid, longest, smoothest and most forgiving I’ve played. My only complaint is, with a steeper angle of attack, the turf interaction is a bit compromising for me.

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Hey dudes, I swung by the local shop and look at that, they didn't have the Z785. The guy told me they stopped carrying Srixon because it didn't sell. This does not make sense to me because they do mostly custom order stuff, so why not carry a couple heads you can hit with shafts, and then place orders. I'm sure the Z785 would be amazing in the shaft I want, but for this amount of money, I just need to be certain.

Something about the MP20s that just feels right. I'll probably take it down to the 4 iron and call it a day.

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Shallow AoA = MP20

Steep(er) = Z785

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Cobra Speedzone - Accra FX 2.0 380 M5 (Testing SIM Max 19* - HZRDUS SMOKE BLACK 95 6.5)

Titleist 818H1 - Ventus Blue 10x

Cobra Forged Tec Black 6i, Forged CB 6-GW - AMT X100 Onyx

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I am a firm believer in everyone playing whatever clubs they want. I've played with guys who have blades and shoot 115 and I've played with guys who game super game improvement irons who shoot under par. You already are well aware of the forgiveness differences between a blade and a cavity back so that's not an issue. My advice if I fit somebody for clubs is to play the most forgiving club that you still have confidence looking down at. If you're in the fairway with a 4 iron in your hand and that's what gives you confidence, then I would never tell you to not play them. You're on a long par 3 and have to carry it all the way over water or a bunker and your butthole doesn't clench staring down at a blade, then play the blades. BUT there are a ton of great options out there that I would steer you towards that will give you a feel and look very similar to blades that offer more forgiveness on mishits. Why make the game harder than it already is? The Mizuno MP 20 MMC, Srixon z785, Titleist T100, Apex Pro, P760's, the list goes on and on. Let's face it golf clubs are expensive, so why not hit everything before purchasing so you have confidence when you get to the course that you are playing the right sticks for you?

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It was the confidence that got to me. I was hitting, albeit just the 7 iron on Sunday, and I loved it. I felt like there wasn't anything I could do to actually mishit the MP20s. I took a break in between practice shots, to see how I hit the ball with a clear mind, and no warm up tempo checks or anything. I hit it well. The turf interaction felt amazing. Another thing that was super weird is I couldn't even tell you what the club looked like at address. It was totally out of my mind. Smooth tempo at the top of my swing, intentionally rushing my tempo at the top of my swing (my fatal flaw) and the hits were still good.

Like I said, it may have been the shaft, but at this point who cares. I stumbled into what felt like a perfect combination for me.

They were, without a doubt, easier to hit and more forgiving than the Z745s.

It sounds like I have made up my mind.

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I went from TM R7 shovels to Mizuno MP-57 (not the most demanding MP ever, but an MP none the less) after playing only 2 or 3 years of golf. I wasn't regularly breaking 90 at the time and my scores didn't suffer a bit.

Not sure I'd recommend a muscle back, but if you have enough swing speed and the confidence, why not?. Recommended handicaps are generalizations; I've had rounds where I've hit 9 GIR and shot ~88 because I couldn't putt or chip.

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The MP20s are way more forgiving than I would have expected. And really at the end of the day, mis hits are mis hits, every club will punish you in some way. If you like them game them.

I actually own both sets you mention and I agree with an earlier post about your AoA. If you tend to get steep I would stick with the 785s, but if you are more shallow the MP20s would probably suit you better.

I am ended up splitting the MBs and HMBs at 6 iron in the MP20s. (6-P in MB and 3-5 in HMB). This I would say is one big diff in the two sets, is I am quite comfortable right up to the 3 iron in the 785s. Definitely more help in the longer irons, hence the HMB in the mizuno set.

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Coming from my own experience, I game a mixed set of Mizuno MP-4 blades, from 5-PW. I'm similar, in that my iron game is much stronger than my driving. My driving is mostly what costs me strokes, off the tee. I hover between mid 80's and low 90's, depending on how I feel on the day.

I've tested the MP-20's MB's, and they are almost identical to my own MP-4's. On a good day, I am able to hit my irons close to pin high with my MP-4 irons, up to about 6 or 5 iron. I feel comfortable hitting either one. I can object and disprove that the MP-20's are limited to sub 4 or 5 handicap, because they still have some forgiveness in them, like a groove low on the face. I myself hover between 10 and 12 for handicap, and I'm comfortable using blades from 6 or 7 iron down with no problems.

They still fly relatively true to what you would put into it. You just have to be consistent enough to hit blades solidly, and have enough speed in them to get the ball up effectively. Contrary to you thinking that the MP-20 is punishing, I'd say surprisingly, there is some forgiveness packed in there, like the MP-4, because of the muscle design and distribution, to give you some forgiveness, from what I have observed.

Long story short, don't be afraid to go with the MP-20's, there isn't that much difference between a MB and player's CB, until you get to 5 iron and above.

Ping G410 Plus driver 10.5* - Fujikura Motore Speeder VC 7.2 stiff
Ping G410 fairway wood 14.5* - Fujikura Motore Speeder VC 8.2 stiff
Mizuno MP-64 irons - 3 & 4 iron - Project X LZ 5.5
Mizuno MP-4 irons - 5-PW - Project X LZ 5.5
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They are good irons but they aren't super forgiving in the long end of the bag. I realize you like them, but I'm sure your perception that they are more forgiving than the 745 is based on shaft and sole because there is a fair bit more help in the 745. I play and love blades but saying this aren't detrimental on miss hits is misguided IMO.

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Taylormade Sim UDI 2i Hzrdus Handcrafted Black 105x

Callaway Tour Issue Apex 2019 Hybrid @ 19* Veylix Rome 988X

Miura Tour Issue MC-501 (Low Offset) DG Pro X100

Taylormade MG2 51* SB Dynamic Gold Tour Issue S400

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Mb wouldn’t be my recommendation either. But, Like your story, I did witness a guy hit 17 greens on a very difficult golf course, in the club championship, and shoot 82. He was a former pro, as well. I think he almost cried, and I understood!

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I personally think that tour handicap is not relevant with your index.

It is more like your swing; offset, bounce, proper loft and so on.

I agree that we all need some help from "forgiveness" but it should not be the first and only factor imo.



Cobra                      F9 Driver w/HZRDUS Smoke 60 6.5
Titleist                     TS2 16.5 Wood w/HZRDUS Smoke 70 6.5
Ping                         G410 19 Hybrid w/KBS Proto 95 X
Titleist                     818 H2 23 Hybrid w/Accra M5 95 X

Honma                     TW-U 4 Iron w/Steelfiber i110cw X
Honma                     Rose Proto TW MB Iron set 4-10 w/Modus3 120X
Honma                     TW W4 Wedge 52/58 w/Modus 125
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