Marcus Bell - Zen Golf

[zacgolf]

Some of you may find this of interest, some not.

As least worth a look as we are all holed up. ZEN Golf Mechanic

[scc13]

I've seen the videos and am fascinated by his lessons. Would love to see more specific instruction to the audience (as opposed to watching him give a lesson to another player). Really interesting stuff.

[sshadow2]

He has collab vids on Robin Matthews-William's Youtube channel. Some of them on the longer side. Robin is a student of Bell's who started his own teaching career based off the natural swing. After a single lesson with Bell by his own admission! (He has a vid where he talks about this in an interview with Bell.) Completely nonconventional way of teaching but these students walk out completely changed after one 2hr lesson with either of them.

I for one am completely flabbergasted by what I'm seeing. And completely interested as well...because, personally, what I'm doing isn't working.

One note: Don't judge a book by its cover, Robin Matthews-Williams gets it done for his students.

[David69]

I enjoy both of their videos and even built myself a rocker board to warm up Swinging with. I wonder if it adds too much sway, but it certainly helps in getting that footwork weight shift feel down with great tempo. The first few days I felt it in my glutes and thighs big time.

[Zen_Golfer]

Dr Joseph Parent might take exception to him using the term, "Zen Golf" though, especially since Dr Parent wrote a book of the same title quite a few years ago.

[sirvinim]

I am intrigued as well. Would definitely appreciate some sort of overview of his methodology. I plan on watching the videos multiple times and perhaps his philosophy can sink in a little bit more. The video with the guy increasing his 7-iron carry yardage was impressive.

[newbsauce]

This one is my favorite. Around the 10 minute mark of this video, he does a silly but effective little drill to help reduce tension in the arms. The first thing I thought of when I saw the drill was the legendary drum scene from the end of Karate Kid 2 ... OMG, I can feel the zen flowing through me.

[zacgolf]

This is another very good one on the short game.

[Harrington77]

I've tried everything in golf to improve my swing from local coaches to online Bradley Hughes and George Gankas its amazing the contrast. I mean Manipulating your body hands and wrists into positions that may be unnatural to your body type is ultimately going to lead to heart ache.

Zen golf mechanics is so natural and easy to learn even from youtube a lesson in person must take you to another level. If not for the lock down I would be over there for a lesson. 

[airjammer]

It all seems like a huge sales pitch. You basically got a hype guy “robin williams” yapping all the time about the person taking the lesson “smashing” it. 
 

All they seems to be talking about is hitting draws but every time they show the flightscope on screen it a big push or push fade??‍♂️
 

Also you never see a guy who comes back for another lesson. That seems strange to me as pretty much all they show is the golfer working on ground force reaction. So basically they are working on a feel that you can lose and you can’t see it on video in order to try to get it back without him because he has all the equipment. 
 

I wish someone would post a video of a golfer that took a lesson a few months back to see their handicap progress. 

[AndersUK]

I too am very interested as he is getting good results with the "feet" control the swing idea.  My only concern is that some of the students now look like they sway way off the ball, leave the club behind them and then flip at impact to make contact?

[Millbrook]

Checked out some videos and then went and tried this on my back lawn with impressive results;

 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CgjAcoPFfOg

Not sure with the new layout how to post the video rather than the link.

Edited September 3, 2020 by Millbrook

[SHAFUA]

I'm a convert 

 

Think his teaching is gold for people in the 10-30 handicap range....

 

his 3 key steps seem to be 

 

1 Remove tension

2 Footwork 

3 Learn the draw and fade path space 

 

 

[SHAFUA]

On 9/1/2020 at 12:59 AM, airjammer said:

It all seems like a huge sales pitch. You basically got a hype guy “robin williams” yapping all the time about the person taking the lesson “smashing” it. 
 

All they seems to be talking about is hitting draws but every time they show the flightscope on screen it a big push or push fade??‍♂️
 

Also you never see a guy who comes back for another lesson. That seems strange to me as pretty much all they show is the golfer working on ground force reaction. So basically they are working on a feel that you can lose and you can’t see it on video in order to try to get it back without him because he has all the equipment. 
 

I wish someone would post a video of a golfer that took a lesson a few months back to see their handicap progress. 

 

Think that's unfair me.... you can clearly see massive leaps of improvement in the lessons just by looking at the swing and hearing the strike... never hear the people in the lessons complaining about the ball flight they describe either. 

 

There's been a lesson with a tour pro client he has and also a golfer who has returned to him as well 

 

all the equipment? the equipment he uses for drills could be purchased for the price of a swing speed stick or a lot of them martin chuck tour striker stuff 

[airjammer]

Maybe I’m missing what other people see but their swings aren’t getting much better in my opinion. Also seems like the students are multiple day lesson students so it’s even more underwhelming to me. They may use the ground better and in turn release the club better but their overall motion is still the same. I’m assuming that is his intent because none of the regular joes are going to be pros or scratch players most likely. 

force plates are not cheap, the other stuff yeah it’s pretty cheap to make but without the force plates you can’t tell if you are overdoing it or under doing it. 
 

I have experience with the guy.  I was just given my opinion on what I saw which was a hype man shooting in very crappy angles, ball flight data that contradicted what they were saying was happening and now they are wanting $15.95 on viemo to watch the full lesson??‍♂️

[David69]

You don’t need to spend a dime to figure out what Marcus is teaching if you pay attention. I made one of those foot see saw practice boards and it instantly helps force feel your weight shift and transition just by swinging a club with no ball like in the vids. Anyone with reverse pivot or who hangs back should try it. The video he posted at Zen yesterday was great, no student just Marcus talking about his basic concepts and how to feel and adjust feels into a natural swing. I dig it. 

[Crookedlong]

As someone who doesn’t do well watching others get lessons, could you post a summary of the basic move he’s teaching?  That could be very helpful and give us an idea of what to look for in his videos. Thanks 

[Nickc]

Check out Flowmotion Golf (formally Triangulaid). Guy called  Bill Owens who mainly taught in France and his ideas taken up by one of his Students Stephane Bachoz to create flowmotion golf method.

It seems a lot of the ideas of RMW & Marcus Bell are similar or looking at the time line possibly originated from these ideas.

 

Interesting video on youtube where Bill Owens teaches a group of 20 plus people how to swing - uses the "no look" and walk on drills especially used by Robin Mathew Williams in his own videos & I presume he RMW got these from Marcus Bell (or perhaps not as there is a coach in Nottingham - where I believe RMW comes from who teaches these flowmotion training methods).

 

 

[garyt]

RMW borrowed (stole) from Flowmotion/Triangulaid awhile back. He was posting videos using all their drills without any mention of them. He got called on it and even posted a teary apology video on

youtube. Now he seems to have glommed on to someone else using a variance of the swing. I'm not a fan of this guy at all.

    The guy who posts video of the "Eureka" swing also seems to have copied Triangulaid. Not sure if he gives them any credit. Nothing in golf is new.

     Actually Brian Sparks "Easiest Swing" also owes a lot (everything) to Triangulaid/Flowmotion.

Edited October 8, 2020 by garyt

[Nickc]

And interesting that I beleive Brian Sparks also spent time in mainland Europe - I think Spain & France at time Bill Owens was quite active coaching .

[zacgolf]

Totally agree 100%, Brian Sparks owes it all to Bill Owens.

 

However, I think Marcus has his own ideas and some of his videos are well worth a look.

Have certainly helped me.

Using the various boards etc, reduced my handicap.

[zacgolf]

fyi, The coach in Nottingham is Danny.

 

A video of him teaching:

 

[Nickc]

Yes he has some valid interpretations - my problem is the videos are too long (and this is the free extracts) simply because there is too much repetetive talking and banter going on - find I have to skip through lots -perhaps just due to bad editing by whoever edits the content.

Edited October 9, 2020 by Nickc

[Nickc]

BTW if you want a simple way to develop a sound balanced swing check out Michael McTeigue the Effortless Golf Swing book plus the video series of his 8 or so chapters has been uploaded on YouTube and available for free.

[zacgolf]

Thanks, I will have a look.

[willbones]

I've been down a similar path many years ago..... Kendal McWade and his 'Instinctive Golf'. Initially I thought it was amazing, and to a degree it did make golf more enjoyable.  But 3 months down the line, I ended up with a massive lateral slide and no turn. A month later, I could barely get round a course. The idea that the golf swing is a natural movement has never washed with me.  There is nothing particularly natural about the golf swing- standing to one side of the target line for one thing makes it pretty unnatural.   

[nlk10010]

On 10/9/2020 at 2:13 PM, Nickc said:

BTW if you want a simple way to develop a sound balanced swing check out Michael McTeigue the Effortless Golf Swing book plus the video series of his 8 or so chapters has been uploaded on YouTube and available for free.

 

Yes, I think I actually bought and downloaded McTeigue's videos (and bought the Nook book) a while ago. Pretty interesting VHS transfer anachronism. Don't get me wrong, I respect the instruction, just delivered in what would be considered now as an "amusing" way.

 

He's a body-swing guy (Paul Wilson before Paul Wilson). Certainly loose arms, I'm not sure I would call it a "Natural" swing in that he does offer drills and detailed instruction. While I liked Brian Sparks, his and Julian Mellor's teachings always struck me as too general. Swing loosely, full turn, there wasn't enough there to actually discern what he was trying to get me to do. Perhaps I simply don't "get" the Zen approach, but things like sway off the ball (or not), lateral shift (or not), roll the wrists (or not), just turning and swinging gets me nothing but a complete miss, top or hosel rocket. To be fair, I don't get much more from following detailed instruction but I'd rather have a more tightly structured model. That's why right now I'm pounding my head against the Todd Graves brick wall, but at least I have a lot to think about. 🙂   

[Nickc]

Here is the link to Bill Owens teaching a group of beginners in Spain 

 

[i*windows]

his videos are really interesting, I like the way he gets everyone to focus on the target and not get fixed on the ball, and get's them shifting weight. But most of all I like the smiles on peoples faces at the end of the videos.  I think golf instruction has gotten so far up it's own backside trying to be psuedo scientific that this comes as a nice change.

[zacgolf]

Maybe of interest, another very good video..