HOGAN PC irons

[Bogeygolfer55]

A buddy of mine gave me a set of these 2-9 just missing 8 iron and equalizer

[Foozle]

These are amongst my favourite Hogan blades. The only issue I have is that the percussion centre is more like a nitrous button than a sweet spot. On the rare occasion I find the middle of the club, they slingshot about 20% further. Fabulous sensation and feel when it happens but can land you in alot of trouble beyond the green!

[Bigarch]

The PC's were a beautiful club. From my experience, they were also the most difficult to hit well. They were a true set of "butter knives".

 

[rgk5]

They were very tough to hit. Most of the Hogan Staff club pro's could not hit them. Gorgeous heads, as I had a set in 1984 but they quickly beat me into the ground. I found another set about 17 years ago and hit them pretty well. Could never figure out why.

[BIG STU]

I had a set when we had the golf shop--- Like you said beautiful clubs. Took them out and tried them and I could not hit them worth 2 hoots. I did check the lofts and lies to my specs and they were close enough not to affect me. Ended up selling them to my bud in Florida who incidentally has my set of FC-4000s that I built with Rifle 6.5 shafts. Looking back I think those PCs had #5 shafts in them. And that would make sense because my bud in Fla is an animal and one heck of a ball striker and really hits anything rebar shaft wise good.

[pymmdcp]

Good for you, man! These might be my favorite Hogan Irons as far as looks are concerned. I can’t hit them to save my life Hope you can find the 8 and E. I will keep an eye out when stores actually open up. What shafts are in them?

[Bogeygolfer55]

Apex shaft

[pymmdcp]

What number? Can you tell?

[Bogeygolfer55]

Apex 4

[pymmdcp]

Perfect. I’ll keep an eye out when the apocalypse is over.

[Jiggered]

I've read quite often that the PCs are hard to hit, but what is it that makes them so?

They don't look anything out of the ordinary in terms of shape or weight distribution.

I'm curious, are they hard to hit or is it one of those myths that has built up and everyone just repeats, "PCs are hard to hit".

[Foozle]

Jiggered, i refer to my opening comment. To clarify, I actually find them quite forgiving and consistent. I have commented elsewhere that I like to use " all the face"! Not the greatest ball striker by any means but I do find PC's perfectly playable.

The anomaly I have found is that in the 1 in 20 I get out of the middle, they launch much further. Same is true of most blades but exaggerated in the PC's.

My understanding is that the "percussion centres" have a hollow or similar behind the sweet spot. My guess is that this reduces the sweet spot to a micro dot in the middle of the club rather than a more graduated sweet spot. Hence my reference to nitrous button!

My theory is possibly total twaddle but that certainly is my experience. Better ball strikers than me who don't use all the face but hit consistently out of the middle are probably noticing a big difference between "on the button" and just a fraction off which might explain the reputation?

[NRJyzr]

 

I have a theory on the Apex PC set, but it's not based on any science or data (no CG or MOI data in MPF), just a SWAG...

If you look at the muscle, there's a bit of cutaway at the sole. I'm assuming the CG is a bit higher due to that. Also, it's a Hogan blade, many of which have a CG a bit closer to the hosel. Both of those aspects, if accurate, don't lend themselves to use by average players, or even the typical above average player. Hitting it in the middle of the clubface may well be missing the sweetspot.

As I said, total speculation.

I remember a story from a fellow golf forumite from many years ago. He told of his using the PC's with success for a fair amount of time, never caused a problem for him. After some time, he learned of their reputation as a difficult to hit club, and it was all over for him and the Apex PC's. Funny how this game can be.

[Breiman]

Gamed a set in the 80's. Well struck shots we rewarded, but I had to have my best game on. Later 80's versions of the Apex were easier to hit.

[Tin Whistle]

I was visiting relatives in Chicago in the mid 80s as a high schooler. Went to a golf warehouse store. A guy brought a set in and said ‘I won these, took them to the range once and can’t hit them.’ The store offered him $125. I walked over to the store rep and said I’d give him $175 and he wouldn’t even have to enter them into inventory. 1-E with Apex 4 Extra shafts. Keep them in Pinehurst and play my first round of the year, every year, with them, a persimmon driver and a balata ball.

[Joe S]

I haven't found the PC's to be more difficult to hit that most most traditional blades that I've tried. They're no tougher than the Apex II's, but not quite as playable as the Redline's or 99's for me. I do understand why some people think they look tough to hit. They essentially have the opposite of perimeter weighting. Mass is moved away from the edges and concentrated at the center of the back in a solid muscle pad. This is the exact opposite of what people would expect to see in a forgiving iron. Muscle on muscle design has been used in a lot of Hogan irons, but it is most dramatic here.

[Foozle]

Joe, I think we are saying the same thing although your technical explanation is much better than mine.

For the 19 out of 20 I hit from "somewhere" of the face, I find PC's very consistent with good distance control. It is that random strike that comes out of the sweet spot (where ever that is located?!) that caused my problems with them.

I like and agree with your comparisons as I am currently playing Redlines and played Apex II over the winter so very relevant to me!

[TourneyCustom]

I was fortunate enough in the late eighties to turn Pro, and I got a deal with Hogan. These were the clubs i got. Yes, even for a Club/Teaching Pro they were very hard to hit. I replaced the Hogan shafts with Dynamics, and it made all the difference. I ended up playing Cameos instead, but had to reshaft those as well.

[pymmdcp]

@TourneyCustom That is very interesting. How do the two shafts compare in your opinion?

[TourneyCustom]

I think the Apex 4 shaft feels dead in the tip, very rigid. I have played Dynamic shafts in so many clubs that I have a better feel for the shot. Dynamic Golds are reasonably stiff, but I can feel the tip a little more, especially on partial shots.

I tried soft stepping some Apex 4's, and they felt weird. Apex 3 were too weak. Hogan heads and Dynamic Golds or even TT Lites feel good together. The TT Lites are good if you want a little higher ball flight and a little more feel of the head weight during your swing.

[rgk5]

Apex shafts were a proprietary vesion of the old Dynalite shaft made for Hogan. It was a mid bend point with a softer tip than Dynamic Gold. It was also about 10-12 grams lighter than the DG S-300. Your perception of feel is real but based more on your swing dynamics and impact position.

[James the Hogan Fan]

Im going to be taking a set of these out this weekend. I'm excited to see just how user unfriendly they are. My set is 3-9 in Apex 4. Courses in Finland still open thankfully

[GSDriver]

Wish I never sold my PCs, thanks for the memories.

[twidener]

The original Apex shafts were introduced in 1969. Before that Hogan clubs used the Flash Reaction shaft. The original Apex shafts were very good but they were a pain to put a new grip on due to the larger butt diameter. I remember the collar on some rubber grips would rip when you tried to put them on an Apex shaft. Lots of pros back then would use the Apex shafts in their clubs, especially drivers. I played the original Apex 4 shaft in Hogan irons for years and I still have my '73 Hogan Apex irons that I take out every now and then and they still feel great. I tried to hit the Apex 5 once but no way. It was used mostly by some tour players. True Temper back then had quite a few shafts but the most popular were the Dynamic X, Dynamic S, and the TTW. I used the Dynamic S, which was a great shaft, in drivers until the Dynamic Gold shaft was introduced. The Apex shaft in the '88 Hogan Redline irons, to me, felt nothing like the original Apex shafts.

[James the Hogan Fan]

Does anyone know if the PC stamp on the back of the iron is the percussion center/sweet spot of the club? It seems to be where I'd expect a sweet spot to be, but I don't know if that were the intent.

[BIG STU]

IMHO the Apex shafts are as good as anything made today----- See my signature------ The Apex shaft thing in non Hogan clubs supposedly started in the Carolinas I have always been told but then again it may be golf urban legend. Mitchell and I were discussing it one night and another WRX member chimed in and said he knew of a club builder in Minnesota that was doing the Hogan conversion in those days so the Carolina connection may not be the Holy Grail. I never have had any problems installing grips on Apex shafts even when I did it old school style with solvent and tape.

[Foozle]

James,

I refer to my earlier posts in this thread - I am really not sure where the sweet spot is located on these! That is not an attempt to disrespect PC's or add to the myth about playability. I love PC's and hope I have made a strong defence of them.

As someone who uses "all the face" i find them very consistent other than the random hit out of the sweet spot - I have never found that often enough to really work out exactly where it is! However the effect is spectacular - hence my reference to nitrous button!

My guess is that the "PC" is positioned for aesthetics rather than locating the percussion centre.

[justasgood]

Mine feel good right around here:

 

[EmperorPenguin]

Ha! The PC's (percussion center). These were the clubs that even club pros cannot hit. These are as close to Scotch blades you can get in the Hogan line. I suspect Ben designed these himself and only he could play them. The best Hogan blades, in my opinion, are the 1973 Apex blades.

[James the Hogan Fan]

Played 9 with the PC's. Not impossibly difficult to hit, but not amazing. Or so I thought, until on the last hole I found the button with a 7 iron, felt buttery nothing, and watched the ball square up a highway behind the green, and bounce into a field beyond.

Quite an amazing feel and shot, with an annoying outcome. Definitely below the 03/99/88's for my personal playability.