Kevin Na vs WRX

[RogerinNewZealand]

HOW does the whole bag

work together for you

eg Blending is today's term?

Wedges, Short, Long Irons

Play the combo that's good for you.Im feel oriented and prefer forged irons,ok with cast wedges,and will spend time with lighter 100 gram shafts for 5 and 4 irons soon that will help my game pre Xmas and add a Smile.

I know there are multi material heads with 500 grams of tungsten to sweeten toe hits....

BUT I will focus on Impact in the Centre and become a Better Indian with a Better Arrow.And stay in the Fairway on my reservation!

[Pepperturbo]

@WristySwing When I said Na is selling equipment, it means he's selling Callaways CB line by talking about his club choice and why...to people that buy because a touring pro suggested certain clubs. If you look at all touring players that play MBs, almost none, including most amateurs promote playing blades. If asked we say what we play and maybe why but don't suggest to others that they should play our equipment. We know most people shouldn't play blades. Perception is too often driven by underlying bias. People want to believe their view is correct, though it may only be superficial. Look at the advice you gave out to Golfwrx in general.
What's typically said by true blade users is play what you enjoy and maybe the mentality needed to enjoy blades. What's said by CB uses varies per person, but it's often why they or others should play CBs or SGI. They tend to push their choice in clubs as if it's going to score for the user.
Every time a tour player changes CB clubs to some extent he promotes those clubs and his theory behind his choice, like Na. When Spieth switched from 718 AP2s to T-100 irons he promoted the change, TS3, his driving iron and wedges, but not a great deal about T-100s. When J.T. & Adam Scott, Web Simpson, Tommy Fleetwood and his TM-TW blades, or Gary Woodland and Wilson Blades, etc. promote something, it's their ball or other choice in clubs but say little to nothing about their blades. Rory talks about his driver, ball and some woods but nothing much about his TM730 irons. Even the players enjoying Ping's Blueprint blades say nothing much. However, the guys that play CB's speak out about them like the holy grail. Nobody publicizes how many tour players play blades or play them when home. Just like Porsche seldom promotes GT3 RS and MBZ seldom promotes AMG GT Roadster line because they are not their mainstream cars and average Joe couldn't handle their power, like he doesn't have the time to be effective with blades or can't handle what they demand.

[ChipNRun]

I don't play golf with tour pros. But, on occasion I end up on a scramble team with former small-college scratch golfers.

This is the story I keep hearing: They played scratch golf with blades in college. But, 10 years later they have a job, a wife, kids, a house and a dog. All these take priority over golf.

Thus, they found that they no longer had time to keep their golf swing blade-ready. So, they found they could still break 80 on occasion once they switched to cavity-back irons. Hitting greens in regulation with the CBs paid off way better than an occasional super shot with a blade 2 iron off the fairway.

This meshes with advice I once got from a teaching pro: Get clubs for the swing you have today, not the swing you hope to have next year.

[MK7Golf21]

woah, playing a 2 iron blade is a whole different conversion than playing blades. If I bag a set of blades it is 5-pw and a cb 4 iron, or even do 4-5 cb and 6-pw MB.

[1Mordrid1]

Bottom line is that just because you play blades does not mean you inherently are a better or more skilled golfer. And just because you play cavity backs or game improvement clubs does not inherently make you a less skilled golfer.

 

[mahonie]

I didn’t say that shaping the ball is more important for hacks like us than it is for pros. I’m just saying that there are situations where playing the high and straight game may cost you more shots than if you have the ability to move it. There are a couple of modern courses that I play a couple of times a year where I never have the need to try and work the ball...I take driver off 14 tees trying to smash it into next week knowing that if I’m on the next fairway I will still have a straight shot at the flag. I could try and play high and straight on my home course and indeed I have a 10 handicap friend playing G10s who does just that. He will readily admit that he doesn’t know how to hit anything other than his very slight draw and he doesn’t care. He also hits everything very slightly fat but that’s for another thread. He breaks 80 fairly regularly but most of that is down to his great short game.

However, I know that I would never break 80 playing that way because my short game is nowhere near as good as his and trying to hit every shot straight would mean plenty of missed greens or long putts for me. Using shape to get the ball in the right place works for me whether it is off the tee or into the green. Having said that, if I can play my stock fade I will and will only play a draw when it is the percentage shot to play (and then it is only a maximum 6 times per round). Over a year it’s fractions of difference between playing CBs and MBs...I’ve done extensive testing (within budgetary constraints...I don’t have access to a Tour truck) over many years and I score best with MBs. I’ve just gone to a split set as my son has commandeered my MP4s. It will be interesting to see if CBs in 4-6 will make any difference over this season if we ever get one.

[msses]

Most golfers here should be playing CB wedges. They just can't admit that.

[ChipNRun]

I hope everyone noticed 1M's note above...

As for shaping the ball... anyone who understands the basics of a golf swing should be able to hit a simple draw or fade... That said, failed exotic shape shots can cause more damage to scores than an occasional fancy shot delivers in benefit.

I played blades back in the prior century - that's all we had. The one thing I miss is being able to keep the ball low with long iron on recovery shots. But, that's about the only thing.

[Chuck905]

I don’t chase money either so your argument is invalid.

I wouldn’t take advice from any mentally unstable person. My choice.

[Pepperturbo]

 

Modern or old style course, as long as a hole is setup in a relative straight line, and yardage is right, no trees or obstacles jetting into flight path hitting the ball straight is fine. Straight might be fine if you play the same course all the time too. Unfortunately, I see this as a growing problem with friends and match competitors, and they been playing the game for years.

If Instructors are not teaching golfers the importance of building a well rounded game, doesn't matter if you think you have a well round bag.. Hitting the ball straight is fine as long as conditions accommodates straight. When your ball is in position fine, but when it's out of position, if you don't have a strong short game, not being able to work the ball is likely to add strokes. To that point, improving one's ball striking is one thing, playing the golf course may require other types of skill. Have a good day.

[msses]

Na makes a lot of sense and says what other pros are afraid to say.

[boggyman]

This is turning into a Blades vs CB slowly but surely!!

[longoffthetees]

I play blades because I score better with them. Bottom line. I’ve tried everything under the sun over past few years and my best ball striking results come when I play blades that have shafts that fit my game. Just a short list of irons I’ve tried in the past:

T100, T200, AP2, T-MB, Apex CF16, CF19, Apex Pro, i200, i210, G410, M6, P790, P750, 0311T, 0311P, Z765, Z585, Z785, F9 One Length, Forged Tec, Forged CB and many more that I’ve forgotten and that’s just in the past 2-3 years.

Do I hit my blades as far as other irons, no, but how can I be expected to when my blades are usually 1 club different in loft when compared to others? I don’t have an issue hitting a 6 iron with my blade from a distance that I would have pulled a 7 with another set.

Do I hit my blades perfectly every time? Of course not, but I hit them good enough for me. I’m not a long ball hitter anymore either. I’ve lost significant distance over the past decade, but I’m scoring better because I’m a much better putter and iron player.

I also don’t play a lot of really long courses. My home track is 6500 yards. If I had to play 7200+ yard courses all the time, there would definitely be some changes in the long part of my bag.

[dpb5031]

As far as shaping shots, it obviously depends on skill level, but I actually think it can be a very prudent way to play certain shots.

It also depends on the individual and his/her visualization. I work the ball both ways very effectively with driver, less easily with irons. On my home course I play certain shapes off the tee because they fit the hole and it gives me confidence & comfort to know exactly what's required.

I naturally draw my irons and have more difficulty fading them, but aiming at the center of the green and trying to work it gently toward the hole (whichever side it's on) is a pretty good strategy for a decently skilled player. Most times, even if you don't pull it off perfectly, you'll still hit the green.

[bodhi555]

Never ceases to amuse me just how much some people on this board care what type of irons other people play ?

 

Anyway I've played this game for 30+ years or so, and been mid single figures for over 20 of them, and I can honestly say I get the same results in terms of scores with both blades and Players CBs like the T100. Finding the sweetspot is not something I have ever struggled with if I'm honest, so I don't find blades to be a particular issue out on the course. I find blades to be easier if I have to create something as I've driven it into the bloody trees again as they give me more options, but cavities work better on the very rare occasion I catch one out of the toe.

 

Am I bothered that Kevin Na thinks its dumb? Not in the slightest. I think it's quite dumb to try to pick the ball out of the hole before the putts gone in, mostly as you'll look a right spanner if you miss ? but if I was in his position of having to hit iron shots to put food on the table, I'd still use blades - as that what I'm most comfortable with, which in turn means I play better golf.

Simples.

 

[wobgon]

You think?

[boggyman]

No thinking.... it’s derailed??

[mukster]

Most golfers like playing pretty irons. As far as I am concerned, I would sell a digit for a pretty set of bladed irons.

I believe that is the reason why the current bunch of foam filled blade-resembling irons are selling so well. It’s just a sexy shape.

I love Kevin Na! Reminds me of myself, except that I’m far less talented and far less nuts!

[Titleist_PT23]

No doubt being able to move it both ways is an advantage. It can help based on wind and green shape even when a straight shot would also be playable.

I guess I just disagree on how many handicap golfers (until getting down to low single digits if I have to make a blanket/general statement) can really move the ball both ways (on command and in control). There are major champions that are uncomfortable with a certain shot shape but everyone here can apparently do it at ease?

For people that don't have time to practice extensively (not you based on other comments), chosing the shot that gives you the best chance of clean contact and correct face/path is going to result in better outcomes vs the few situations where a draw or fade could get you closer to the hole.

Of course, some will be an exception but far more are giving themselves an A+ when they probably deserve a D.

[mukster]

My bad. That should read “...saxophone shape”.

[dan360]

Kevin Na belongs here. True WRX'r

 

[Haloha]

I got frustrated just watching this video again lol

[Golfjack]

When Na says he can't play blades, that's to his standards. It's just like 18 handicappers won't understand the bad shot of a scratch player. His "not playing well" is the round of our life. Him not being able to game blades still means he hits it better than 99% of us. Pro's have a very fine margin of error. Their game is so refined that they have very narrow misses. Of course, everyone can play blades, but guys who don't practice a lot will probably suffer if their swing is out of sync. GI clubs are much more forgiving in terms of swing flaws. Na, despite what he says, still swings it much faster than 99% of humans on the planet. He also is a better ball striker than 99% of golfers. But for him, he needs all the help he can get because competition is fierce on tour. He's not on Rory/DJ level where he needs blades with higher CG to bring down the ball flight. Heck even Brooks plays CBs.

[granata10]

This is so true!!!! The only players I know that can truly work the ball are scratch golfers and better. However even they have a preferred shot and only choose the opposite when they have to. I have yet to ever see a high single digit handicap and up truly work the ball WITH CONTROL on command

[EddieEdwards]

Na, clearly needs to head out into the woods on a vision quest. Just him and a bladed 5 iron, to work out his punch out game.

[tbonetw]

I'm gonna jump in on this one and I usually avoid these threads lol. But this one is interesting.

I can't and won't speak for others about this topic. I play to a 4.1 index now and have been as low as +2 in my life.

I've played blades, players CBs and GI irons, although the GI experiment is recent and ongoing, but so far successful. I played blades for a few reasons. When I was 'good enough, whatever that means', to play blades I admit there was some vanity involved, or more like arrogance. They look great, nothing feels better, and because I was a very consistent ball striker I didn't see any advantage of moving to a forged CB. While they may be more forgiving, I found it marginal. I didn't see an advantage to playing anything other than blades so that's what I played. Should I have played more forgiving 3-5 irons? Probably, but it never occurred to me.But here's the biggest reason I played blades and maybe this will shed light to some people here who don't understand why some amateurs play blades. I'm a very competitive person and frankly, at that time in my life playing GI clubs just didn't feel right to me. It felt like cheating. Here's the best, and most recent analogy I can offer. (And don't make fun. I'm opening up LOL) My wife and I play Soda Crush. I'm simply better at it than she is lol. I find it to be a good stress reliever at times and other times (like the last 3 weeks) I'm just bored. She walked by yesterday and saw that I was close to passing a level, but I only had 1 move left. And she's like "holy crap" you've got all those things on the bottom you can use. Why don't you just use some of them?" And I'm like "well, because I think I should be able to pass this level without having to use all that junk. That's basically cheating." She rolls her eyes and moves on.

So the point is, I'm competitive enough (with myself) and stubborn enough to avoid taking the easy route just because I want to win a game. I realize that's irrational, but I also refuse to play a head to head with anyone I would have to take strokes from to be competitive. If I'm a 4 and you're a 2 I'm not taking strokes. Screw that. I'll find a way.

So that's my nature.

A lot of the people on here criticizing people who play blades are playing forged CBs lol. Should they be, if using the same standards they hold blade players to? Probably not! I mean honestly, the additional forgiveness you get in a 718CB over a 718MB is millimeters on each side of the middle. And most golfers miss the center by more than a couple of millimeters. So they're still being penalized harshly for their mishits as a 10 handicapperss mishits are much wider than a 2 handicap in almost every case.

I guess my point is that a LOT of golfers are using clubs that are too penal for their skill set if we're comparing ourselves to Kevin Na. If a 2 handicap shouldn't use a set of minty Mp20 blades, then a 10 handicapper shouldn't use AP2. Not my words, I'm just going by the logic people use to criticize blade players.

I'm at a point in my life that I've opened up to taking advantage of things that make the game easier. I still play for money and more and more people are taking advantage of technology. I don't play or practice as much and the game wasn't fun anymore. The golf ball doesn't curve like it used to so I personally can't use a blade thee way I once did. So I've gone the other direction and it's paying benefits. My entire game now is built around hitting the ball straight and it falling left or right, instead of hitting sweeping draws and fades.I start the ball in the middle of the green and if I've set up to hit a cut it may move 15 feet right. And I like having to work to hit big hooks and cuts. It's comforting to know that I'm not going to overcook one very often. The ball is built to be hit straight now and the golf courses are now designed to hit high straight shots primarily. So that's how I've decided to play golf which is why I got the most forgiving, straightest hitting irons I've ever hit in the bag. Note: I still play DG S300 as I just can't adjust to lightweight shafts. I've tried. And yes I'm hitting more greens. I've never hit the mysterious shooter people suggest happens with GI irons, but I am aware there was a time when that was common. These Pings are just as easy for me to control the distance on as blades would be. They just took an adjustment. Might I have been able to hit a blade 8 irons closer to the whole than these Pings? Probably, maybe. As long as I execute the shot and pure it. But I'd prefer at this point in my life to do what I need to do to hit 12+ greens a round and that wasn't happening with my forged CBs anymore. So if I have to cheat to do it, I will! LOL

All that being said it's not fair to assume everyone playing blades does it because they want to look cool. Because again, I could just as easily look in the bag of a number of guys and ask, "why aren't you playing G410? You don't really hit the ball very good lol." Play the game the way you want to play it. And buy equipment that suits your priorities. If that pure forged feel is what brings you back to the course every weekend there's nothing wrong with that.

[billybaroo]

There are so many delusional golfers on here, this thread has been a feeding frenzy.

:)

 

Justify equipment size ( because that is what this really all about...) all you want, just shut up and play 18 holes in under 4 hours.

[NRJyzr]

 

That's a heck of a post. A good read.

Sparks a thought I don't know if I included in my earlier drivel in this thread, so with apologies for possible repetition....

There have been times I've given serious thought to setting aside my Golden Rams and Mizunos, and going with something like Ping G series (or an equivalent from another non-Titleist company). One of my friends plays G20s, having switched from G5s. He's let me take a few swings with his sticks on the course. The results are interesting, but they also were a little surprising. What was unsurprising was the long iron forgiveness, I tested it both intentionally and unintentionally (LOL). The surprising side, considering my experience with Eye2+, was that it became obvious I wouldn't be able to play them due to the short irons. I was ballooning 8 irons in what was only a slight breeze. They started lower than I was used to and then came the old classic upshoot.

The other interesting aspect was trajectory. I hit my blades higher, loft for loft, than the G20.

Point of all this.... IMHO, these sorts of irons come with tradeoffs. Some are such that may not be able to get past them.

[braincramp52]

I think you just said the magic word that few take into consideration NRJ. There's a Tradeoff.

[msses]