Should rabbits get the first tee times? Yes a rant

[Zac1321]

haha yeah thats what i figured. i know i dont know anything about your club but if i was a member anywhere i would be more open to a solution like that then the club introducing a new system like they did then giving preferential treatment to a few particular members (totally understand and agree to just let faster golfers out first under normal circumstances because its beneficial, but at the end of the day it is preferential treatment). i think dave explained this pretty well

[CDM]

Interesting read (yes read the whole thing) I see both points but I am on the side that is seems a bit selfish.

I see the point as the "rabbit" group as we all know if the first group off is behind it hoses every group from then on...but only IF if is not meeting the club requirements on time. Yes your group plays faster but that is on you. Heck I like to as fast as everyone, but I acknowledge there are many others that are playing and as long as they are meeting the club requirements for time limits for 18 holes I really should not be b*tching.

In a perfect world would love to be done in 3hrs every time but we all know that is not going to happen, reason I NEVER play after 11am locally...if you do you can expect 4.5 hr rounds min... most hte time .

As far as the club lottery for tee times / increased tee time spacing. Ie: Less available time... ** knowing it has changed now That happen here at a lot of the top clubs. At CHCC on certain days of the week there are some groups that had what they called "Preset times" for years on specific days. Once the lottery kicked in so everyone had a chance on tee times that changed the pre set tee times and man did they get p*ssed. It was a "me first" thought process and those groups could care less about any other members that pay the same Dues/Fees to be at the club, What I thought was good is the pro stood his ground. He was very poignant in stating the situation at hand was NOT caused by the other members and they had to be fair too all members.......apparently as I know it those "groups" are still mad and some are looking to move clubs.... I am sure as long they get what they want.

On a different note.... a local public course are only letting 3 carts per group but letting players book tee times as 4 singles. So there is one person if all wanted carts that is not getting a cart.... that has caused some very interesting issues to say the least in groups of 4 random people =)

[Under2hours]

Again I asked if we do get the second or third tee time, whether they should move us up (forth or later was not an option). COVID-19 rules mean you can't pass a group that waves you to play through (though Friday they did & got the okay from the clubhouse & finished in under 3 hours).

As stated they have often played with the tee times as usually come 6:30 tee times only 3-4 groups will ever request and we have always been let through. I am pretty sure they don't give us 6:30 every time, because there is some people who'll stick their nose in (who never tee off that early) who would question why the same group is teeing off first.

That is what happens at private clubs.

[smashdn]

Weird the no playing through rule. If you can maintain 6 feet playing as a group there should be no reason you can't maintain 6 feet letting another group play through. Usually you either let them tee off on a par three at the same time as you and let them putt out ahead of you or you let them pass on a tee box with your group parked off to the side watching.

[BNGL]

 

 

[cristphoto]

What state has a "no wave through" rule? That doesn't make good sense.

[smashdn]

I think from a practical standpoint you are correct. The folks setting up the tee sheet should and could move groups to where they know there will not be or at minimum reduce/limit conflicts. I think your best bet is to arrange this with the groups ahead of you and think from reading you have done or attempted this.

 

However, from the optics side they simply cannot week in and week out have the same 3-4 groups in the same order if there is supposedly a random draw/lottery. That won't pass the smell test and someone will cry foul, likely someone who didn't even put in for those spots/timeslots but you have those type of people out there who would be inclined to stick their nose into it.

 

Bad situation. A crap sandwich if you will and everyone has to take a small bite until we get back to normal.

[Under2hours]

I think most courses (at least Private ones) implemented this to start and ensure "physical distancing" protocols.

[davep043]

I don't know what other courses have done. My home club (in Northern Virginia) has not prohibited playing through. Yours has. Right now we're 50%, I wonder if some of the rest of the folks can chime in. It may be a State or Regional thing, I don't know.

Oh, thank you for saying "physical distancing". I know social distancing is the term of the day, but what they really want is for us all to maintain actual physical distance from one another.

[david.c.w]

We dont have any wave through restrictions. Right now we are tee times from 7:30 to 6:00 and it is packed. Can't share carts unless living together but you can put 2 bags on a cart and have 1 person walk. Rules/guidelines have been mostly followed but it is not uncommon to ride up a big hill with your playing partner.

My issue with your premise (as many have pointed out), is why do you get to go out first and have the "best" time? What if someone else wants to play early? I assume you pay the same monthly dues as everyone else. I have never been a fan of preset times just because "they have been playing at that time for years".

In the end it makes logistical sense for you to go off first. But a club is not striving for efficiency. It is striving to ensure the greatest benefit to the greatest number of members while keeping everyone safe. I bet you have been on the good side of a lot of decisions/favors. Now it might be your time to be a "regular member".

[cristphoto]

I'm in Maryland and we still allow wave through's. I don't recall our Governor going into detail about course procedures other than saying proper distancing needed to be applied per Fed guidelines. We're slowly getting back to normal at my club. First week course opened the range was closed. Then it opened in the second week. I just got an email yesterday saying our outdoor deck will open for lunch and dinner starting this Saturday. I played today and saw that every other table was removed to allow adequate spacing. Indoor everything is still closed.

[tiderider]

no restrictions on 'wave throughs' here in bama ... that's exceptionally odd ...

[Mudguard]

Having a read through, and as a rabbit I can understand the pain. My problem is, if everyone pays the same, then they get treated the same. The way our tee sheet works here is that it opens two weeks and one hour (online) in advance. So if I want to book 7.30 for the Saturday a fortnight later, I need to be on the computer or phone at 6.30am. It works well. At my old course, if you tried to book at 6.35am, the morning field was gone.

What it did do was establish an unofficial hierarchy, if you were slow and booked 7.30, you were hounded by the groups behind that would bank up, and you'd be told to hurry up. So it worked itself out. At my current course there are only two rabbit groups in the morning, so it doesn't bother me if they go first or we do.

But I absolutely abhor the idea that tee times should be held for long standing members.

[Under2hours]

Update, week 4 & still no change. 8:00 am first tee times & still crowded. 8:30 tee times this weekend and leisurely (i.e. slow 3:45 POP) pace set by the first group. Disappointing.

For Saturday Ballot/Lottery already 15 groups registered 8-9 slot, Sunday 7, so appears 6:30 am tee times still a ways off.

[DonatelloNobodie]

Interesting discussion. Who determines if a group is a "rabbit" group, and how? Pretty much everyone thinks that they play fast and the problem is with others. Designating one group a "rabbit", and therefore deserving of disregard for the time lottery, seems to be likely to lead to disputes.

If you cannot get tee times acceptable to you, then it might be time to look or another club. Availability of suitable times is the reason why people join private clubs.

Aside. An argument could be made that playing exceptionally fast is just as much of a problem for others as is playing exceptionally slow, Chill....

 

 

[jvincent]

Just got the results for next weekends lottery at my club.

I didn't get the tee times I wanted but the tee sheet is full from 7AM to almost 3PM. We went to 10 minute spacings from 9 mins and that 10% reduction in available times has made a big difference.

Not complaining though since at least we are golfing.

[MtlJeff]

I'm guessing this is much less of a problem in the real world then we are making it out to be here, which is normal...at least when it comes to private clubs. I have been at a few of them and i've really never seen more than a handful of groups who want the really early times. Most people don't actually want to play at 6:30 AM which is brutally early. So it usually sorts itself out, at that point if you are playing 1st, second or third group, i mean it doesn't matter that much

I agree with you that if you go out first and play super fast it messes with the groundskeepers and that isn't good either.

Most private clubs tend to have starters who know the members fairly well, so the people who genuinely are faster vs who think they are faster....it's likely not as much of an issue either as many places actually track pace of play.

I enjoy that private clubs do this. I'm not trying to sprint through a round, but it can be frustrating playing at a public course if the 7AM time decides to play in 5:15 and you are stuck behind them

[davep043]

I don't think that the OP had an issue with the way things were done normally. But when his club opened as COVID stuff eased, they have fewer tee times, the first time is an hour later than "normal", and he wasn't happy with the modified lottery system that the club management had chosen to use. I agree, in normal times this generally works itself out at most private clubs. But when the number of tee times decrease, and clubs institute new procedures in attempting to allocate those scarcer tee times "fairly", people are bound to be unhappy.

[MtlJeff]

Yeah, i was referring to normal operations. I know this thread was about a specific scenario but just figured a lot of the comments were just about general stuff now

My club's times are mostly back to normal now. Biggest issue i have now is no beers after the round!

[davep043]

Oy, that's a real problem! We're still running at 12 minute intervals, instead of 10, so we're not far off of normal availability. We never stopped "snack bar" service, so we could always get a beer and hang around (no tables and chairs), and just a week ago we were allowed to resume outside dining with relatively widely spaced seating. Let's all hope that things continue to improve all over.

[MtlJeff]

We have our snack bar open but we arent allowed to stay after rounds. So i can get a Heineken at the turn if i want but we have to leave after our round....You try to hang out and have a beer and someone comes out with a broom and shoos you away like a hobo LOL

[jvincent]

Same situation at my club at @MtlJeff minus the hobo shooing away.

[cristphoto]

The convenience issue I have at my club is settling up bets after the round. Our senior mens group typically has four or five consecutive tee times. Since we have to leave after our round and can't congregate (and thus settle up bets for the days play) we email in photos of our scorecards. So after a month or so our group leader sends out an email with an update on winners and losers. We're told who's who and either bring an envelope in with X cash or pick up an envelope with our winnings. Haven't been through a full cycle yet so we'll see how it works. One of the rules of our club during the virus issue is no handing over cash person to person. Don't know if this is Maryland mandate or just our club.

I know that Congressional just suspended 4 members for breaking distance guidelines so most clubs in my area are taking this seriously and firmly standing by the rules.

 

[davep043]

I'm just south of you in Virginia, and we've been playing all along. I play in a similar group, 3 or 4 tee times most weekends. The "commish" has developed a spreadsheet system, and posted a webpage in Google that shows all results. Payments are made with Paypal or Venmo, no cash trading hands.

[cristphoto]

Is that working out well? Do you settle up soon after each round? We do the spreadsheet too. I know Paypal but am not familiar with Venmo.

[davep043]

I'd say its been pretty good, he gets the stuff up by Monday, and I know I've seen my payments come in by Tuesday when I've won. I just sent in my payment today, it wasn't a good Sunday.

[caniac6]

Mabye this was covered earlier, but why are they starting later? What does the virus have to do with what time the greens staff gets started? I'm retired, but I workein the maintenance end of the golf business, and we usually started in the dark on the weekends. We had lights on the mowers, and started early to keep ahead of play. I don't really understand why the course isn't opening at the usual time. I really think the operation of the club is a bigger issue than the lottery.

[davep043]

I agree, that's a reasonable question, and I haven't read a reason. Opening the tee sheet for 7 AM instead of 8 would certainly relieve some of the "crowding" that they're currently going through. Its not the complete solution, but it would help.

[BNGL]

Some clubs on the maintenance end are doing staggered starts. Some guys come in at 530 regular time, others come in at 600, some more at 630.

another reason for later times is it’s taking longer on average to brings carts out and get then setup etc because they’re following staffing/distance protocols too.

now both of those are fairly easy problems to solve just start bringing them earlier so idk why they don’t do that.

[golfortennis]

$earching for rea$on$ why club$ would not do $o leave$ me $cratching my head.