Weightlifting vs Flexibilty

[Jtalberda]

Question for everybody. Does weightlifting help with swing speed and distance? In high school I was always told that putting too much muscle on slows up swing speed or that being able to stretch and be more flexible will increase swing speed more than anything else. What are you thoughts on weightlifting/strength versus flexibility?

[BB28403]

It depends on the school of thought you subscribe to. Olympic body building probably will not transfer much to the golf swing. If you start as a weakling, then yeah I don’t see how it would hurt.

the new thoughts of some are that Dynamic exercise with weights works. So you have golf like movements while bearing weight in certain directions. Combined with types of yoga.

joey D seems like a good program , he has years of stuff on his instagram.

[scott_Donald]

I always find posts like this interesting.

If you lift for a sport - Must be specific, focus on your strengths and weaknesses in order to meet specific goals. How you organise your training year should be very well set up for the time of your playing season.

A good sport specific program is not just weights its so many factors to making you a better golfer in this case!

[nitram]

Seems to be working for DeChambeau.

[Jtalberda]

Exactly my thinking. Dechambeau lifts a little and he puts on 30 yards (exaggeration I know)

[xmanhockey7]

Look at long drive guys. Seriously just look at them. They’re not swinging over 140mph because they stretch.

[BB28403]

@nitram Reddit posts today had dechambeau’s face on butter bean the boxer’s body. Hah!
cuz he’s looking a little pudgy, like a fat popeye.
but they go on to say, “I don’t care what he looks like, I’d be fat like butter bean for that kind of power at the tee”

[Fuscinator]

Most of them have long swings, though. John Daly and Bubba don't lift, but they both have long swings. If lifting equaled speed, just imagine how fast defensive tackles would be. Being very flexible gives one a longer swing arc, which means more speed, even for people who are inherently fast. But, you can't be a wet noodle out there, so developing strength at the end of your ROM is key.

[xmanhockey7]

I see people all the time who can’t break 90 and their swings are equally as long as Bubba and Daly, but ball doesn’t go near the same distance. A huge amount of people have more than enough flexibility to swing a golf club correctly. I cant say the same for strength or having an understanding of how to apply force to the club.

[JonP]

I spent the winter ( Canada so 6 months worth) focused on lifting heavy. Deadlift, squats, bench, overhead press. I gained 20 yards on my driver. 41 years old. Then I herniated a disk and haven't played in a month. Given that hindsight I should have focused on yoga. Haha.

But lifting heavy and explosive did help me. There was an obvious increase. I was taking a smooth 7 iron in early spring to greens I was hitting 6 iron in the summer months.

At the same time I was protecting my back so I was consciously swinging very smooth and with good rhythm and balance. Maybe I was just hitting the sweet spot for a change.

 

[juststeve]

Light weights lots of reps can make you stronger without bulking up.

Steve

[Fuscinator]

And I've seen extremely strong men completely miss the ball. Obviously, skill trumps everything.

I don't think I was clear enough. The point I was trying to make about flexibility is that an extreme ROM is useless if you don't have strength to control it at that range. For example, if you practice a martial art that involves kicking, and you work up to a full front split in order to improve the range of your high kick, you won't be able to take advantage of that improved range unless you have the strength and coordination to kick your leg that high. That's a fairly specific action that is not going to get much carryover from the 'big three' lifts.

 

[hurley999s]

It’s because most people don’t understand physiology and think you can just put on muscle. When you’re adding mass/bulking, you add a combination of fat and muscle. It’s the anabolic phase.

Now if Bryson wanted to get shredded, after he was done bulking, you’d then have to transition to cutting. This is a catabolic, so there would be muscle loss along with fat loss, but that’s why when bulking you add as much as you can knowing some will be lost during the cut.

Not saying Bryson will do this, but from a bodybuilding standpoint, that’s how the body works. You don’t go from skinny to ripped. There’s a bloated and pudgy stage in between.

[hurley999s]

That’s an old myth from the 70s and 80s that hasn’t died. It started when people saw bodybuilders prepping shortly before contests when they were cutting hard. When a bodybuilder is on stage, they are at their weakest. And leading up to it, you’re significantly weaker than when you’re bulking. So anyway, people/journalists would see bodybuilders doing low weight/high rep, and the myth started - “that’s how you build ‘lean muscle’” - and it’s because those guys were so weak in that phase, they can’t lift the heavy weights they did while bulking, but are still trying to exhaust the muscle to preserve as much as they can in the catabolic cutting phase.

So to clear it up, there’s 2 phases the body can be in - anabolic of catabolic. There’s no such thing as adding lean mass. You’re either bulking or cutting - both involve addition or removal of fat and muscle. And your diet is THE biggest contributor to this - nothing to do with low weight/high rep, “toning” etc.

[BiggErn]

Nothing funnier than the guy saying he doesn’t lift heavy because he doesn’t want to get too big. If you’re lifting for a specific sport build a workout around that. If you’re just an average guy wanting to put on muscle and look bigger lift and eat a lot. If you’re the guy who just wants to be “fit” lift and do a lot of cardio with a more specific diet.

[scott_Donald]

no.

Adding or loosing weight has all to do with calories - surplus or deficit.

Different rep ranges give you different emphasis.

Strength is directly proportional to the cross sectional area of the muscle + Neural adaption!

[bluedot]

There is no one answer to the question of whether or not "weightlifting" helps a golf swing. It depends on the individual, and it depends on the workout.

I don't think it's likely that weightlifting of any sort is going to hurt your golf swing unless you get injured lifting. But how much it helps depends on what you do. A workout designed by a golf fitness expert isn't going to look very much like a standard weigh room session at all, though it will include some stuff like squats and deadlifts. But lots of medicine/slam ball work, lots of anti-rotational stuff, lots of core stuff, and so on. Golf training has come a long way in the last few years, and golf specific workouts now don't look anything like either the golf swing or a standard weightlifting session. Track athletes have been working out this way for a long, long time, and golf is catching on.

I think the key word in golf fitness training is "mobility" rather than either strength or flexibility, unless you are talking about a specific deficiency in a particular golfer. Speed thru the entire range of motion is a very different thing, and that's where most golfers make the biggest gains. So a set of deadlifts or squats, followed immediately by medicine ball throws/slams to use the "ground force" strength would be a good example.

Conversely, a ton of weight room stuff that involves both arms moving in the same direction at the same time just don't have much to do with swinging a golf club fast. Doesn't mean they aren't good for you, or that there aren't benefits, but not golf swing speed. Flexibility is the same; you have to be flexible enough, just like you have to be strong enough, but there's a point at which you can't gain swing speed that way.

Almost any fitness program is better than none, of course. I love to run, but I don't confuse going for a distance run with helping my body swing a golf club faster. Same with a standard weight workout.

[Myherobobhope]

Check out fit for golf, I’m about to sign up for the program.

 

you want to build explosive strength to increase club head speed. Flexibility and balance will help as well...

I have never heard someone complain that they lost their golf swing because they were too flexible... I think flexibility is always good, but in my experience it only helped control my swing, it didn’t improve distance because I wasn’t losing club head speed due to lack of flexibility... it defiantly helped my accuracy.

I haven’t done a golf specific lifting routine, but I’m hoping to start this week.

[oikos1]

I have a strange feeling another thread like this one will be started next week, next month, next year...

[chigolfer1]

Not really

[RobertBaron]

Flexibility and technique/skill are probably more important for most players than strength. Most players aren’t maximizing their swings so adding strength won’t really do much. Most players I see on the range also seem either subconsciously afraid to make a real full turn or lack the flexibility to do so (which usually correlates to age). So some combination of improved technique and flexibility would do much more to improve their swings and add distance than lifting weights would

Players at a high to elite level have generally maximized the efficiency of their swings and can use any edge they can get even if a slight one so increasing strength would be beneficial to the [much] better player.

[FusedSpineScratch]

Why does it have to be one or the other? You can pursue both. For mobility focus on hips and thoracic spine and shoulders and traps. For strength focus on slow, controlled movements, at a moderately difficult weight. Compound lifts with good form. Form is first priority, which goes in hand with the mobility part.

Both are important not just in golf but in life.

Lots of people stay away from strength training out of fear of being "too bulky" Believe me... lifting moderate weights 2 times a week isn't going to make you huge. Besides... you can always tone it back if you think you're getting too bulky. To me that is just a cop-out for many people who just don't want to strength train.

Long story short.... do a bit of both.

[braveheart]

Avoid overuse of the bench press. Overdeveloped pecs, tightness and shoulder injuries can occur. Don't adopt bodybuilding routines that emphasize isolation exercises. Unless you have a specific weak or an undeveloped area to buildup that has been professionally pointed out to you. Focus on compound exercises. Doing everything slow will make you stronger but not explosive. It's good to do have some cleans, snatches, medicine ball work, done in good form to develop explosive power.

[Jtalberda]

By far the best explanation I have heard. Like you said golf is a game of form. Flexibility and strength will both benefit you in my opinion. I typically focus on both, but I was curious to see what everybody thought.

[2bGood]

People do lose 'their swing' from being too flexible. It makes perfect sense as with more flexibility, you have the ability to get your club in new positions without resistance.

[chigolfer1]

Does anyone follow this guy?

[Barfolomew]

Funny how many worry about bulking up too much.... takes a long time to get too bulky for golf lol You're not gonna wake up surprised one day lookin like the Rock.

 

Hit the weights get stronger and enjoy being able to hit farther without an all out effort... lets you relax into the swing when you're strong. And keeps injuries away.

 

Stretching is awesome and should be done by everyone...

[Ri_Redneck]

CHS come from strength, flexibility and timing. Bubba might be slim, but I bet you money he can crush your hand in a handshake. Strength is not always bulk. Strength will also allow you to stay in control as you swing faster. So, like Fused mentioned above, the key is the proper combination of all. Consult your doctor before starting ANY routine though. You can't do anything when your hurt.

BT

[The Pearl]

Some good stuff here, some not so good stuff here. Lots of old "myths" and biases repeated here.

 

What do we know? Obviously, the more clubhead speed generated, the farther the ball will travel. Related is swing efficiency. For a given clubhead speed, the higher the smash factor, hence efficiency, the farther the ball will travel.

As an astute poster mentioned above, unless you are a low hdcp. you probably have more distance in your current swing by improving your swing without one ounce of fitness work. Hitting the gym without working on your swing will only result in a more fit crappy golfer, albeit one that might hit the ball further offline.

If you have a decent swing and find the middle of the club face with some regularity, but have a poor fitness level, you are more than likely going to see some distance gains (perhaps only minimal) by increasing fitness. Even losing 10lbs and nothing else might allow you to stay in balance and make a faster turn. In this case, any type of weight training or stretching routine will likely see improvements.

Starting fitness level matters, A TON. If you are fit and strong, but are not flexible, putting on 10lbs of muscle might not help, but increasing flexibility might. The opposite is true also.

One myth is that weight training makes you bulky and tight. This is obviously absurd. A simple, twice a week routine, will almost certainly increase your flexibility, not hinder it. No specific flexibility work needed.

With that said, you can stretch all day and become supple as can be and likely won't add any significant distance. The modern swing is getting shorter, not longer. One could argue that more flexibility in many cases could be harmful in terms of technique. Again, starting fitness level matters. There are exceptions of course. So the default answer to the OP's question is the common sense baseline answer will almost always be weight training.

I have zero data to make this claim, but I suspect "golf-specific" workouts are largely marketing fluff. If it does work, it works at the highest level, on Tour where you are tweeking elite performance.

Fitness "advice" like many things (diet, financial advice, etc.) nowadays has become overly complicated in order to "sell" you something.

Using tour players as a model to support one viewpoint or another seems absurd.

 

 

 

[bluedot]

I think the next guy I play with who is too strong will be the first. Likewise with the next guy I play with twho is too flexible, or too mobile, or too fit in ANY way. The amount of lifting or stretching or whatever necessary to make you "too much" just isn't likely at all.

I feel VERY strongly that the key thing to remember is that there are significant differences from person to person, and what sort of workout will benefit a particular golfer the most could be very different from another person. I know a lot of people are skeptical about the TPI-type approach to working out and to golf fitness, and I think that, like anything, the quality of a golf specific workout depends heavily on the expertise of the practitioner. But IF he does are really thorough assessment of strength, flexibility, and mobility, and then tailors a workout accordingly, there are big benefits to be made. I'm at least a decent example of this; I'm 68 yrs old, and I've worked out and done yoga and run for decades. I've NEVER not been flexible, or strong, or fit. BUT, and this is big, I had lost a LOT of mobility in my hips, and without going through all the technical stuff, the result was not only a loss ofars distance but soul-crushing inconsistency in my iron play.

Started working with a golf fitness facility about 6 months ago, and the difference is dramatic. TONS of core and glute stuff, and I'm a different player; I've gotten about 15 yards back with the driver, and my iron play is night and day better, not to mention how my body FEELS. I'm fortunate to have access to one of the best guys in the country; I know not everybody has that. But I'll say this again; a good golf specific workout looks very little like a classic weightroom session, and even less like the golf swing. Track athletes have been training for explosiveness this way for decades; golf is just piggybacking on that approach.