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Bless you Howard. You have more patience than I. This kind of thread is why I don’t post very much anymore.   I Just don’t have the patience To attempt to explain the nuances of the Swingweight

That’s great news !! I’m happy that you were able to achieve what you set out to do.

The SW scale seems to get a lot of flak but I have found it to be extremely beneficial and a way to quantify the “feel” of the club somewhat.

As a Michigan man , where it stays light outside for 20 hours of the day, during the summer.. what is the maximum amount of golf you have gotten in , in a day ?

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I agree with everything you're saying.

But let's say rebuilding the club isn't possible, we can't pull the shafts and remove tip weights that may be in there and we can't adjust lengths. Where else do you go other than counter weighting through a heavier grip or butt weight?

If i were to apply my reasoning to a scenario I encounter every day building clubs using a digital scale: 2 clubs, same head weights, same shaft specs (length & weight) but one has a Lamkin sonar undersize at 47gr and the other has a Crossline oversize at 76gr (which is a pretty common situation) I'm going to see two vastly different numbers appear on the screen.

Just my 0.02

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Very nice !! What day are we going to winged foot for the US Open? I say we go Sunday and witness history !! Or Friday to heckle the players who didn’t make the cut lol.

I told Rahmbo “better luck next year” as he was exiting 17 green on friday @ the 2017 US Open @ Erin Hills and he put holes through my head with his 10second glare, I thought he was about to ask to have me kicked out :/ lol

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But if you can't pull shafts to drill the hosel how else do you adjust? Let's assume someone doesn't have access to tooling or anyone that does or is on a budget that won't allow that work to be completed. They just want their clubs to balance at d2.

I'm not saying that changing out to a heavier grip is the only way to alter swing weight to their preference but a suggestion to achieve their goal swingweight

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Cant? then you cant reduce head weight and thats your issue, not too low Total weight.

Swingweight do NOT represent a certain feel of head weight, and anyone who is tracing a "SW value", for a club they never tried, has misunderstood everything about that instrument, so we never have a target SW for a club we never tried, not even for one we modify, the instrument CANT help us in any of those situations and was not designed to do that either.

We have to tune up the club so it works, THEN we can measure SW for repair reference or to build a set, not the other way, and if feel of head weight is to high, we must deal with it as a head weight issue and reduce head weight, we do nothing to head weight when we add weight in the other end, that only adds total weight and actual MOI goes UP, not down.

No instrument have ever been as misunderstood and misused as the SW scale has, but its not the instruments fault, but the one who use it, so "goal SW" is not something we have at all before we have tuned up a club thats works to be duplicated, and we dont use the SW scale at all during that process because it cant guide or help us with that.

Its simply lack of understanding when you have a SW target for a club you never tried.

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Follow this link, and read post #520, and you will see that we CANT restore "D2", no matter how hard we try, because that value dont represent a scientific measurement, but its a arbitrary value only relevant for clubs thats already built and works as they should. As soon as we change something, forget "D2"...we want be able to restore that feel, balance or relationship between head shaft and grip using the SW scale, and it was not designed for that either.https://forums.golfwrx.com/discussion/comment/19361723/#Comment_19361723

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Bless you Howard. You have more patience than I. This kind of thread is why I don’t post very much anymore.


I Just don’t have the patience To attempt to explain the nuances of the Swingweight scale anymore to people that are utterly convinced Chasing a specific reading on it is an absolute Necessity of making a club “work” for them. I officially throw in the towel. Keep up the good work.

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That explains it, and if the customer asks for it "the Customer is always right", and your job is not to educate them about how a SW scale work, and some OEMs dont even try to meet a target for SW. In the end, its not your fault that they dont understand what they ask for, and most of them was never fitted for a SW value on that club anyway, but they "believe" in SW values, and thats really their own problem.

I come from a different universe with high end fitting and club making only, where no clubs was made before a excessive club fitting was done on ALL club specs, and as example a set of irons 3-PW was minimum 16 hours total (fitting, building, test and tweaking before delivery), so in my shop, the customer got clubs made to the same specs we found during fitting, nobody could place a order for a club without the fitting session first, so this universes cant be directly compared.

Here on WRX, its mostly hobbyists and other professionals i try to help out to make this "right", and i think the SW scale itself is a good instrument if we knows how it actually works, and how to use it right within its limitations.

So, i have no problems with what you are doing to please a Customer order, but now you know that it will not be what they think it will, unless those specs was how that club came out after a fitting session using the same components, the actual grip included.

The last one mentioned, the GRIP, is actually a big problem here. To make this right, the grip itself is the FIRST we shall choose, and from that point, all later fitting tasks has to be done using that grip, but thats hardly ever how its done, and thats why issues like this comes up. The grip is a important part of Total wgt, so if the player knows from the start that he will play MID or Jumbo, we fool our self if the fitting is done using standard, both for size and weight reasons.

Different universes, different approach to it all...Mine is limited by whats found to be right during a deep level fitting, yours is limited to what can be done to meet a specific order from the Customer.


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