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Insufficient Spin with Wedges Playing Ball Up and Using the Bounce


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I have been using the technique from @MonteScheinblum’s Use The Bounce 2.0 video on all wedge shots inside of 75 yards with my 58 degree wedge (Ping Glide 2.0 Stealth ES grind). Ball forward of center, vertical shaft, keep the right arm moving like an underhanded toss.
My carry distance control has been phenomenal. I have never had this good of distance control with my wedges. But my total distance control on these shots it still spotty because the ball just won’t check. Even with the high trajectory, I’m getting a lot of release.
I’m using a ProV1, greens are Bermuda, wedge grooves are still decent. So I don’t think it’s gear/conditions.
I had 5 wedge shots inside of 60 yards yesterday that landed inside 10 feet of the pin, but all of them released another 15 feet or so. While that doesn’t sound so bad in terms of proximity, it kept leaving me on the wrong side of the hole on a tough putting day.
The release was the difference between 5 uphill putts for birdie and 5 downhill putts for birdie.
Is this just part of the technique? You need to plan on 10-20 feet of rollout? Or do I need to try to use my 54 degree instead? Would that create more spin?

Driver: Ping G400 Max w/ Ping Alta CB 55 Stiff (44.5")

Fairway: Ping G410 SFT 3W w/ Ping Alta CB 65 Stiff

Hybrids: Titleist 818 H1 3H/4H w/ Aldila Rogue Black 85 Stiff

Irons: Ping i210 5i-UW w/ Nippon Modus 3 Tour 105 Stiff (+0.5"/1.5* upright)

Wedges: Ping Glide Stealth 2.0 54 SS / 58 ES w/ Ping AWT 2.0 Wedge Flex

Putter: Taylormade Spider X Navy (35")

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The spin diff between a v1 and a v1x is very minimal. Something else is off kilter. Is your impact clean? Are you hitting it high on the face? Are the greens rock hard?

Given the time of year, is it possible that this is as much about the greens as your shots? Are you seeing the same results everywhere you play, including courses with bent grass greens? Speaking for

Haven’t considered the switch, but I might do that. May be a better fit for me, anyways, because I actually just did my first full bag fitting at Club Champion and learned I am a low spin player and need some help with spin.

Thanks for that.

Driver: Ping G400 Max w/ Ping Alta CB 55 Stiff (44.5")

Fairway: Ping G410 SFT 3W w/ Ping Alta CB 65 Stiff

Hybrids: Titleist 818 H1 3H/4H w/ Aldila Rogue Black 85 Stiff

Irons: Ping i210 5i-UW w/ Nippon Modus 3 Tour 105 Stiff (+0.5"/1.5* upright)

Wedges: Ping Glide Stealth 2.0 54 SS / 58 ES w/ Ping AWT 2.0 Wedge Flex

Putter: Taylormade Spider X Navy (35")

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Can’t go wrong trying it. I actually have the opposite problem and was amazed by the difference a ball can make. Played Snell MTB-X and loved the greenside spin but it put too much on my irons. Now with the MTB Black, it’s really obvious how I get more rollout and a more piercing ballflight.

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The spin diff between a v1 and a v1x is very minimal. Something else is off kilter. Is your impact clean? Are you hitting it high on the face? Are the greens rock hard?

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I pick 14 of the following:
Ping G400
Ping G410 3, 5 and 7 wood
Ping G 400 4 hybrid
Ping G 4-U
Ping Glide 2.0 Stealth 54, 58 SS
Grips NDMC +4
Odyssey Pro #1 black
Hoofer
ProV1x-mostly
ECCO Biom Hybrid 3

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Greens probably on the firmer side, because even full swing irons weren’t leaving pitch marks.

Impact feels ok. Maybe catching it a groove or 2 high with the technique due to vertical shaft delivery.

Driver: Ping G400 Max w/ Ping Alta CB 55 Stiff (44.5")

Fairway: Ping G410 SFT 3W w/ Ping Alta CB 65 Stiff

Hybrids: Titleist 818 H1 3H/4H w/ Aldila Rogue Black 85 Stiff

Irons: Ping i210 5i-UW w/ Nippon Modus 3 Tour 105 Stiff (+0.5"/1.5* upright)

Wedges: Ping Glide Stealth 2.0 54 SS / 58 ES w/ Ping AWT 2.0 Wedge Flex

Putter: Taylormade Spider X Navy (35")

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Given the time of year, is it possible that this is as much about the greens as your shots? Are you seeing the same results everywhere you play, including courses with bent grass greens?

Speaking for myself, in the heat of the summer in the South, I play some courses with Champion Bermuda greens where the ONLY distance I really care about it the distance to the front of the green because I know the ball just isn't going to stop, no matter what club I hit. (FWIW, I am NOT a low spin player, and I use a high spin ball.) Think about the ball marks that your irons are NOT making on the greens, and you might have at least some of your answer. And on some holes, you can add in the direction of the grain; if you are hitting a wedge into a firm Bermuda green AND it's down grain, you ain't stopping that ball by the flag on one bounce.

If you've got access to a course with bent grass, and haven't played it recently, go there and see what happens. The super at a bent grass course is on suicide watch from the 4th of July to Labor Day, and they are watering like crazy now, plus syringing hot spots until the sun goes down, just to keep the greens alive until the heat breaks in September so they don't lose both the greens and their job. Bent greens tend to be soft and receptive to a fault this time of year, and grain isn't an issue either. If you find that your wedge shot are stopping, then you have a course management adjustment to make, not a swing issue.

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Agree with this. I play the V1 and spin is just fine and around the greens honestly can't tell the difference vs. V1x.

Could be hard greens, fairways a little lush, could be technique, who knows. Maybe you are delofting your 58?

Three yards of rollout is hardly a big problem, IMO. I'd guess if you want more spin and expect to have it stop immediately you need to send Monte a video and have him advise.

 

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Pro's launch around 30* and have on average 16* of shaft lean for distance wedges between 30-100 yards.

Don't have a launch monitor then set up a launch gate. Two alignment stick with tape across it. Formula is (distance away from gate) = .58 X (gate height) - so 62 (say 5 feet away) inches away means gate height of 3 feet. Learn to launch under the gate.

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That's what I am guessing based on experience and the comments here. I am thinking that since the goal of the technique is forgiveness and shallowing you out on these partial wedge shots, the sacrifice is spin and release.

Some of that is mitigated by trajectory, but when you pair it with firm bermuda greens in the middle of July in Alabama, it's not going to bite much and I'm going to need to learn to play the roll-out, too, rather than taking dead-aim on the carry yardage.

Driver: Ping G400 Max w/ Ping Alta CB 55 Stiff (44.5")

Fairway: Ping G410 SFT 3W w/ Ping Alta CB 65 Stiff

Hybrids: Titleist 818 H1 3H/4H w/ Aldila Rogue Black 85 Stiff

Irons: Ping i210 5i-UW w/ Nippon Modus 3 Tour 105 Stiff (+0.5"/1.5* upright)

Wedges: Ping Glide Stealth 2.0 54 SS / 58 ES w/ Ping AWT 2.0 Wedge Flex

Putter: Taylormade Spider X Navy (35")

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Green conditions were probably a big part of it. I'm central Alabama, so we are talking about 90+ degrees with bermuda greens that were pretty dry. I think I repaired 2 pitch marks in 18 holes, and one of those was a downhill Par 3 from 140 yards. I last played on bent back in late May, and now that you mention it, the ball was checking pretty well on those with the same technique.

Driver: Ping G400 Max w/ Ping Alta CB 55 Stiff (44.5")

Fairway: Ping G410 SFT 3W w/ Ping Alta CB 65 Stiff

Hybrids: Titleist 818 H1 3H/4H w/ Aldila Rogue Black 85 Stiff

Irons: Ping i210 5i-UW w/ Nippon Modus 3 Tour 105 Stiff (+0.5"/1.5* upright)

Wedges: Ping Glide Stealth 2.0 54 SS / 58 ES w/ Ping AWT 2.0 Wedge Flex

Putter: Taylormade Spider X Navy (35")

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The “Use the bounce” shot is, and should be, a soft shot that’s meant to release a bit. You say you’re 5 feet long on your rollout? I think that’s ok. Don’t chase more spin, just land the ball in a better spot to accommodate the rollout. I would definitely keep working at the technique and improving your distance control and landing spot.

Once you really understand how to engage the bounce, you can start working on all kinds of shots. But I do believe it’s critical to get the foundation down on using the bounce and hitting lots of great shots with good speed control to the pin. It’s a very easy go to shot and for me, created a good foundation to start hitting spinners where I trap the ball with shaft lean, but still release the wedge like normal.

 

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As someone going through the exact same process utilizing bounce more, most of the spin is coming from clean contact. I noticed the bounce definitely makes these shots easier to hit and is more forgiving, but the payoff is less spin and more rollout. The shots that just clip the ball perfectly have a ton of spin and check up quick, but those are not the typical shot for me using bounce.

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You aren’t getting a lot of spin because this technique isn’t meant to be used to generate a lot of spin. It’s typically used for shots that are too close to be able to generate a lot of spin with any technique. I would say usually within 50 yds or less depending on the lie. It floats in from a moderate height and lands softly due to steep angle of descent. Google the term “spin loft” if you want an explanation on why this happens. If conditions are such that you have to use this technique from 75 yds. you’re going to have to play for some release. Especially if the greens are very firm.

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Weird, I use monte’s use the bounce method and actually switched balls recently because I was spinning my chips too much. I like a little roll out, it gives you a chance to make it. I think one hop and stop will be short more often than not, but usually more speed creates more spin, just don’t get long on the backswing

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