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Club Championship - Day 1


andrue

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Scored 92 for 72 (two over). The front was poor at 51 but I pulled it back with 41 on the back. So not only kept my head in a competition but actually able to stage a recovery. Round 2 is tomorrow and the current leader is on net 64. So I'm still in with a chance. If I hadn't had a poor front I could have been on top.

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There’s a net club championship?

I apologize for sounding judgmental. In my opinion, the title “club champion” should be awarded to the player with the lowest gross score in medal competition or if your club chooses match play, the winner of the competition played by all from scratch. 
 

I have never heard of a net club champion. 

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16 minutes ago, Moonlightgrm said:

There’s a net club championship?

I apologize for sounding judgmental. In my opinion, the title “club champion” should be awarded to the player with the lowest gross score in medal competition or if your club chooses match play, the winner of the competition played by all from scratch. 
 

I have never heard of a net club champion. 

 

It may be that his club has multiple flights in its championship to keep more players interested. My club's championship is straight scratch. We have over 1500 members and only filled 42 of 56 spots because everyone knows only 10 players have any chance at winning and otherwise there isn't a lot of point.

 

I agree the title of club champion should belong to the best scratch golfer, but the club can try to create an enjoyable event up and down the skill level of the membership 

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2 minutes ago, James the Hogan Fan said:

 

It may be that his club has multiple flights in its championship to keep more players interested. My club's championship is straight scratch. We have over 1500 members and only filled 42 of 56 spots because everyone knows only 10 players have any chance at winning and otherwise there isn't a lot of point.

 

I agree the title of club champion should belong to the best scratch golfer, but the club can try to create an enjoyable event up and down the skill level of the membership 

I have been a member at four different clubs in my 50-years of play. Each club created an event for others to participate in during club championship week. Maybe a 2-ball or a flighted stroke play event that carried some other title. But I have never witnessed a net club championship. 

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There are two winners: Net and Gross:

 

  • Championship shield Lowest Gross Score over two days
  • Net shield for lowest net score across the two days. (Full Handicap)

 

Seems to me like a good idea. It means all members have a chance of winning something.

Edited by andrue
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As far as I’m aware, nearly every golf club in the U.K. has gross and net winners for their club championships. We had around 110 in ours last weekend and of those, realistically only maybe 10 had much of a chance of winning the gross, (36 holes strokeplay, over 2 days) and although the greater honours go to the gross winner, the more prize money actually goes to net.

 

Everybody pays £5 to enter the net, plus another £5 if we wish to enter the gross as well and a further £2 to enter the 2’s pot. so therefore the bigger share goes to the net winner because everyone enters that. (No one can win more than one prize, so you can’t win money for both gross and net scores).


 

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20 hours ago, Moonlightgrm said:

There’s a net club championship?

I apologize for sounding judgmental. In my opinion, the title “club champion” should be awarded to the player with the lowest gross score in medal competition or if your club chooses match play, the winner of the competition played by all from scratch. 
 

I have never heard of a net club champion. 

My club does this. As much as the event is about identifying the best player in the Club, there's an inclusive element that's important as well.

 

We do stroke play qualifying to make match play for the Championship flight. Alternatively, there is a Net flight that plays out the same way, but the winner's name doesn't go up on the Club's wall or anything. 

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I think that's cool. Anything that brings in more participants is a good thing. Wish our club would do it. 

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Good Job !

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On 8/22/2020 at 10:07 AM, Moonlightgrm said:

There’s a net club championship?

I apologize for sounding judgmental. In my opinion, the title “club champion” should be awarded to the player with the lowest gross score in medal competition or if your club chooses match play, the winner of the competition played by all from scratch. 
 

I have never heard of a net club champion. 

 

LOL, you should get out more!

 

Gross and net club champs are pretty common - if we didn't have the opportunity for net, we'd have few, if any, entrants and probably no competition at all.  Gets a fair number out to play and wider variety of results over the years with the net that many enjoy.

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7 hours ago, toypor said:


And there in lies the problem...

Yes, how dare a club try to operate on inclusive principals and encourage broad member participation in major events? Any members incapable of maintaining a low single digit handicap should be told that they are inferior and discouraged from attending something as important as a club championship. Obviously the elite few should be allowed exclusive access to the course so that they can parade their brilliance alone without the riff-faff.

 

That pretty much how you see it?

 

?

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13 hours ago, toypor said:


And there in lies the problem...

There is only one club champion and that is based off of gross.  If you did not have a net option the field would probably be less than 20 golfers for most clubs.  The gross leaders tee off last at our club and everyone stays on 18 after they finish to watch them come through.

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7 hours ago, andrue said:

Yes, how dare a club try to operate on inclusive principals and encourage broad member participation in major events? Any members incapable of maintaining a low single digit handicap should be told that they are inferior and discouraged from attending something as important as a club championship. Obviously the elite few should be allowed exclusive access to the course so that they can parade their brilliance alone without the riff-faff.

 

That pretty much how you see it?

 

?


Club Championships are for the “elite” players at a club. Those that have put in the hard work to become really good players and are able to compete at a high level. I don’t compete in our club championship...  Because I am not good enough and haven’t spent hours on end at the range and practice green to earn my way into this event. There are plenty of events offered (virtually all of them) that are handicapped where I have an opportunity to participate. And yes I have no issue giving our elite players exclusive access to the course a few hours out of the entire year to compete for a club championship. 

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5 minutes ago, toypor said:


Club Championships are for the “elite” players at a club. Those that have put in the hard work to become really good players and are able to compete at a high level. I don’t compete in our club championship...  Because I am not good enough and haven’t spent hours on end at the range and practice green to earn my way into this event. There are plenty of events offered (virtually all of them) that are handicapped where I have an opportunity to participate. And yes I have no issue giving our elite players exclusive access to the course a few hours out of the entire year to compete for a club championship. 

Wow. Our club is open to everyone regardless of ability and whilst we like to acknowledge the few who are very good at the sport we also acknowledge that most members are just 'having fun'. Tying the course and facilities up for a handful of players is harmful to the club and to the sport. If it wasn't for 'the great unwashed' there would be no golf. We're only a small golf club and none of our members would consider themselves elite. They enjoy playing alongside others regardless of their ability.

 

Golf is not currently in a position where elitism can be tolerated and as a matter of survival it should acknowledge the debt it owes to those of us who can never aspire to single digit handicaps.

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FYI - as it happens I played alongside the third placed gross player on the first day. He was polite, friendly and offered encouragement. Commiserated where appropriate. A +3 playing in the same foursome as a +21. I enjoyed the experience and felt part of the group. That is what this sport needs. Not some stuck-up prima donna who thinks they own the course and should be given exclusive access to strut their stuff.

 

From the sound of it I would never want to join @toypor's club. But I love the club I am a member of and would happily play alongside the +3 who almost won again. I'm pretty sure he'd have no complaints either.

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1 hour ago, andrue said:

Wow. Our club is open to everyone regardless of ability and whilst we like to acknowledge the few who are very good at the sport we also acknowledge that most members are just 'having fun'. Tying the course and facilities up for a handful of players is harmful to the club and to the sport. If it wasn't for 'the great unwashed' there would be no golf. We're only a small golf club and none of our members would consider themselves elite. They enjoy playing alongside others regardless of their ability.

 

Golf is not currently in a position where elitism can be tolerated and as a matter of survival it should acknowledge the debt it owes to those of us who can never aspire to single digit handicaps.

 

Goodness Andrue, now you're just getting yourself in a snit for no reason.

 

HIS club is open to everyone as well and it's usually about 16 players or so who are good enough, or who qualify, for the Club Championship flight/comp. They aren't tying up the course AT ALL.

 

The parking spot closest to the Clubhouse reserved for the Club Champion would be laughable if he was a 20 handicapper. The Club Champ should be the BEST player in the Club.

 

Try to relax a bit. :classic_smile:

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Having a gross club champion and net club champion doesn’t diminish the gross winner's achievement at all. In the same way as having winners in other categories such as ladies, seniors and juniors doesn’t either.


a club championship here is about showing who performs the best over (usually) 2 days and 36 holes when the pressure is on. Believe it or not, players of a higher handicap can celebrate playing well in those conditions too.

 

If all we cared about was who “the best player” in the club is. We might as well just give a trophy (Or a parking spot) to the guy with the lowest handicap on a certain date each year. 


Out of Interest, what name are we allowed to call a competition if it has a net winner too? 

 

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16 minutes ago, nsxguy said:

 

Goodness Andrue, now you're just getting yourself in a snit for no reason.

 

HIS club is open to everyone as well and it's usually about 16 players or so who are good enough, or who qualify, for the Club Championship flight/comp. They aren't tying up the course AT ALL.

 

The parking spot closest to the Clubhouse reserved for the Club Champion would be laughable if he was a 20 handicapper. The Club Champ should be the BEST player in the Club.

 

Try to relax a bit. :classic_smile:

We don't have a parking space reserved for the champion. I don't believe they've ever asked for such a privilege. They are after all just a gifted/talented amateur. They have won their accolade in exactly the same way as other clubs. We just chose to encourage other members to participate in the event by running a net competition alongside. Exactly as it seems most UK clubs do. A very sensible arrangement.

 

I'm not the one in a snit. I think we have a very sensible arrangement that I think operates for the benefit of the entire membership. The only people here who are upset are those who seem to favour segregation and feel that the better players are entitled to special treatment. That's golf as it was in the 1970s. Not what it aspires to today.

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2 hours ago, andrue said:

Wow. Our club is open to everyone regardless of ability and whilst we like to acknowledge the few who are very good at the sport we also acknowledge that most members are just 'having fun'. Tying the course and facilities up for a handful of players is harmful to the club and to the sport. If it wasn't for 'the great unwashed' there would be no golf. We're only a small golf club and none of our members would consider themselves elite. They enjoy playing alongside others regardless of their ability.

 

Golf is not currently in a position where elitism can be tolerated and as a matter of survival it should acknowledge the debt it owes to those of us who can never aspire to single digit handicaps.

 

13 minutes ago, andrue said:

We don't have a parking space reserved for the champion. I don't believe they've ever asked for such a privilege. They are after all just a gifted/talented amateur. They have won their accolade in exactly the same way as other clubs. We just chose to encourage other members to participate in the event by running a net competition alongside. Exactly as it seems most UK clubs do. A very sensible arrangement.

 

I'm not the one in a snit. I think we have a very sensible arrangement that I think operates for the benefit of the entire membership. The only people here who are upset are those who seem to favour segregation and feel that the better players are entitled to special treatment. That's golf as it was in the 1970s. Not what it aspires to today.

 

So you weren't in a snit ? I guess the bolded parts above are what fooled me. My apologies. You know, 2 great countries separated by a common language. :classic_laugh:

 

YOUR course isn't the only one and not what some others, including myself, are referring to anyway.

 

Yes, it's a fine arrangement to run another comp alongside. Who said otherwise ? No worries, it's just that the winner is not the (traditional) Club Champion.

 

And now you're talking about segregation ? Special treatment for the better players ? Good grief man. A parking space ? THAT is "elitist" ? What's the big deal if the CC gets a parking space for goodness sake ? Since your club doesn't have a parking space that means no other do ? Or should ? That's "elitism" ? :classic_rolleyes:

 

The only (real) POINT is the Club Champion, traditionally, is the best player in the club according to his skill level during that tournament. No handicaps. :smilie_ping:

 

 

 

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I haven't been a member of a lot of clubs, but when I've played in the Club Championships (or City Championships or County Championships, etc.) there have been flights.  The lowest handicaps play in the Champion flight (or equivalent name). They are usually index 3.9 and below around here.  That flight is played gross, and the winner is the Club/City/County Champio.  Then they flight the res of the field (usually three or four more flights) and those flights play net.  Net winners are called flight winners.  Seems to have worked out OK over the past 40 years.  But I'm not all that hopped up about that stuff anymore.

 

Golf should provide the most enjoyment to the greatest number of people.

 

As Harvey Penick said, "And if you play golf, you are my friend."

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5 hours ago, andrue said:

FYI - as it happens I played alongside the third placed gross player on the first day. He was polite, friendly and offered encouragement. Commiserated where appropriate. A +3 playing in the same foursome as a +21. I enjoyed the experience and felt part of the group. That is what this sport needs. Not some stuck-up prima donna who thinks they own the course and should be given exclusive access to strut their stuff.

 

From the sound of it I would never want to join @toypor's club. But I love the club I am a member of and would happily play alongside the +3 who almost won again. I'm pretty sure he'd have no complaints either.

A little friendly correction here. A plus handicap is on the “professional side of scratch”. If you’re a 21-handicap Andrue, you’re a -21 not a +21. I will assume that 3-handicap is actually a -3. A +3 is a terrific player. Most club professionals in my neck of the woods are not a +3. That’s golfing your ball at +3. 

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On 8/22/2020 at 8:07 AM, Moonlightgrm said:

There’s a net club championship?

I apologize for sounding judgmental. In my opinion, the title “club champion” should be awarded to the player with the lowest gross score in medal competition or if your club chooses match play, the winner of the competition played by all from scratch. 
 

I have never heard of a net club champion. 

The club ( not a home course) I'm quitting does this. They also do net skins. 2/3rd of the group are 16 handicaps or more, with several in the low-mid 20's. More than 3/4 are over 10 index. They decided this year that the low net winner would be the club champ.....

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12 hours ago, andrue said:

FYI - as it happens I played alongside the third placed gross player on the first day. He was polite, friendly and offered encouragement. Commiserated where appropriate. A +3 playing in the same foursome as a +21. I enjoyed the experience and felt part of the group. That is what this sport needs. Not some stuck-up prima donna who thinks they own the course and should be given exclusive access to strut their stuff.

 

From the sound of it I would never want to join @toypor's club. But I love the club I am a member of and would happily play alongside the +3 who almost won again. I'm pretty sure he'd have no complaints either.


The way you twist things around and make stuff up I can only assume you work in media. We are talking about a once a year competition to identify a true club champion. Absolutely no elitism. My regular group has players ranging from +3 to 30 handicaps. Playing along side each other, having a good time, and enjoying tasty beverages afterward. 

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