Has Anyone Played All 18 Aiming for the Center of the Green?

[xmanhockey7]

34 minutes ago, me05501 said:

Not sure about aiming for the middle of greens, but we’d probably all be better off aiming for the center of fairways (versus flirting with inside corner for a “better angle into the green” or similar). 

Aiming for center of green is definitely better than what most people try to do. And without question chasing angles into the green is a losing proposition. Depending on where trouble is center of fairway is usually good. 

[me05501]

1 hour ago, xmanhockey7 said:

Aiming for center of green is definitely better than what most people try to do. And without question chasing angles into the green is a losing proposition. Depending on where trouble is center of fairway is usually good. 

I’m super curious about the success rates of strategies like flying over corners, driving short par fours or trying to draw/fade the tee ball around a dogleg.

 

I’m thinking they’re probably low % strategies even for guys who

have the game to execute them once in a while.
 

Obviously it depends on the hole. 

[xmanhockey7]

5 minutes ago, me05501 said:

I’m super curious about the success rates of strategies like flying over corners, driving short par fours or trying to draw/fade the tee ball around a dogleg.

 

I’m thinking they’re probably low % strategies even for guys who

have the game to execute them once in a while.
 

Obviously it depends on the hole. 

Get the ball as close to the hole as possible without taking on unnecessary risk. It is not the same as trying to put the ball in the left side of the fairway to have a better angle. If you can cut the corner cut it. If you can drive the green or be close to it do it. The main reason to drop to a shorter club is if a pinch hazard or other hazard comes into play. Most people do this correctly. 

[ThinkingPlus]

I have never done it nor would I ever do it.  I only play away from the pin if I have a longish club in my hands or there are penalty/cost a shot areas near a tucked pin.  Otherwise I'm firing at every pin.

[moptop]

Aiming at the center of the green for an entire round has really hurt my putting.  

[hanfrac]

I have thought about trying this, but haven't.  I'm a 4 index and am not bad, but not the best with my iron approaches.  I suspect if I did this for a bunch of rounds, it might help my brain relax when I'm aiming away from the flag.  I've spent my whole life hitting toward the flag or trying to get it near the flag that when I aim away from the flag, I'm not sure my brain commits to that spot.  I'm still at some level thinking about where the flag is.

 

So I may give it a try and see if I can play 18 holes thinking about hitting the center of the green.  I believe the caveat is that maybe I do this with any club 8 iron or longer.  with 9 iron and in, maybe I start trying to split the difference between the center of the green and the flag.  With anything under 80 yards, I'll fire toward the flag unless there's a reason not to.

[Noodler]

I didn't mention in my previous post in this thread that I did try this approach for a few rounds a few years ago.  If you have fantastic lag putting skills then I guess it could work, but back then my long dx putting was crap.  So I modified the approach to use a draw shot started at the green center if the flag was on the left and a fade started at the center if the flag was on the right.  Unfortunately I just was not very good at controlling the amount of draw or fade with my irons back then.  These days I hit a fairly straight shot most of the time, so I shoot at the pins and just modify my club selection based on the front/middle/back approach mentioned previously in this thread.

[jdl]

I've started out a few rounds intending to try this but rarely make it more than a few holes before abandoning it. ?

 

But I really don't aim to the middle very often unless the hole is in the middle. On longer irons I'm usually trying for the fat part and/or away from trouble. On short irons/wedges I'm usually pretty aggressive because the courses I play most often just aren't that penal on misses. I do try and avoid short siding myself, though.

[Noodler]

It's a risk/reward proposition.  The risk is significantly reduced if you have a reliable short game.  If your ability to scramble for an up&down is strong, then firing at the pins, as long as you're keeping the ball in play, is actually the lower scoring approach.  Firing at the pins is going to significantly increase your probability of picking up some birdies.

[me05501]

On 9/5/2020 at 10:35 PM, xmanhockey7 said:

Get the ball as close to the hole as possible without taking on unnecessary risk. It is not the same as trying to put the ball in the left side of the fairway to have a better angle. If you can cut the corner cut it. If you can drive the green or be close to it do it. The main reason to drop to a shorter club is if a pinch hazard or other hazard comes into play. Most people do this correctly. 

 

 

Seems obvious though that going for the green puts greenside bunkers in play, when they might not be in play with a fairway wood. Do greenside bunkers not count? Seems like most people would have a better chance coming from 30-40 yards back in the fairway. Just my way of thinking. 

[goaliedad30]

23 minutes ago, me05501 said:

 

 

Seems obvious though that going for the green puts greenside bunkers in play, when they might not be in play with a fairway wood. Do greenside bunkers not count? Seems like most people would have a better chance coming from 30-40 yards back in the fairway. Just my way of thinking. 

I'd much prefer a greenside bunker shot to a 35 yard pitch over that same bunker. My up & down from bunkers is just a shade under 50%; from 35 yards, that's a tricky shot for me to get close.

[harolease]

I been drawing the ball lately. And imaging my  ball flight starting towards the right edge of of the green and moving toward the center.  I do this for fairways too starting at the right side then drawing towards the middle of the fairway 

My “aim” is really 1-2 foot in front of the ball. I do not really “aim “ at the pin.  Though lately I been learning to fade the ball and I do use the as reference  of the pin representing the “goal posts” to curve the ball through 

I “aim” at pins starting with wedges sometimes with 9 or 8 irons.  

[smashdn]

On 9/5/2020 at 9:27 PM, me05501 said:

I’m super curious about the success rates of strategies like flying over corners, driving short par fours or trying to draw/fade the tee ball around a dogleg.

 

I’m thinking they’re probably low % strategies even for guys who

have the game to execute them once in a while.
 

Obviously it depends on the hole. 

 

I think it depends upon how you measure the success of the strategy.  I see this in the stats analyzing in different books and articles.

 

If you say, attempt to cut the corner on a dog leg and you don't make it and you end up with a bogey, the strategy didn't work.  But if you played that course often and employed that strategy 20 times on that hole and you successfully cut the corner say 12 times and failed 8 and had a smattering of birdies, pars and a bogey or two and over those 20 times playing it you were -4 cumulative, did the strategy work out?

 

To your point it depends upon the hole and what the outcome of not pulling the shot off is.  If it is a near-automatic dropped shot then it is probably not worth it.  If it just takes birdie out of the miss and makes the par harder then it probably is worth it, in the long run.

 

Anything that makes your next shot shorter (barring being blocked by trees or a 40 yard bunker shot or something like that) is the better play, over time.  That's the long-term, long game thought.  In any given instance it may not be the correct play but over the long haul it pays off.

Edited September 8, 2020 by smashdn

[me05501]

2 minutes ago, smashdn said:

 

I think it depends upon how you measure the success of the strategy.  I see this in the stats analyzing in different books and articles.

 

If you attempt to cut the corner on a dog leg say and you don't make it and you end up with a bogey.  The strategy didn't work.  But if you played that course and employed that strategy 20 times and you successfully cut the corner say 12 times and failed 8 and had a smattering of birdies, pars and a bogey or two and over those 20 times playing it you were -4 cumulative, did the strategy work out?

 

To your point it depends upon the hole and what the outcome of not pulling the shot off is.  If it is a near-automatic dropped shot then it is probably not worth it.  If it just takes birdie out of the miss and makes the par harder then it probably is worth it, in the long run.

 

Anything that makes your next shot shorter (barring being blocked by trees or a 40 yard bunker shot or something like that) is the better play, over time.

 

Yep, that's exactly what I'm getting at. We all want the lowest average score over time.

 

On tour event coverage they'd show us the stroke average on the hole and break down where the players who made non-par scores hit the ball from the tee. Of course that would include a lot of balls hit by a lot of different players while we're talking about one player playing the hole multiple times. 

 

Taking the bold line would need to result in at least as many birdies as bogeys in order to average out to par. If the conservative approach greatly reduces the number of bogeys, you wouldn't have to get very many birdies to bring the stroke average down below par. 

 

Of course this approach is way too analytical for some. A lot of people LOVE attempting the hero shot and are happy to live with the consequences when they don't execute. I'm not a long ball hitter so I tend to play more of an LPGA-style game. Hit fairways, try to hit greens, hope to make more birdies than bogeys. 

[smashdn]

Correct.  You need to be objective and disciplined enough to identify where and when it makes sense to be aggressive and then commit to the aggressive line or play.  It's not that you wail away all the time, its that when you wail away at it, you have measured the risks.

 

There was a particular hole at Detroit this year where BDC hit like a 400 yard drive.  All the pundits where creaming about how aggressive it was.  It wasn't really.  BDC has the length to fly the bunkers at 290 with his driver.  He cleared all the trouble with ease and ended up in a spot where there were no hazards and few if any trees and had something around 110 left in that par 5.  The dumb play would be for him to take anything but driver and not just bomb it over the trouble.  Even if he pushed or pulled his driver he would have a wedge from light rough.

 

I don't see many average or above average golfers that cannot hit their driver at least serviceably accurate.  It is just too important to scoring that guys have to spend time practicing with it.  Next to my 150 and 100 yard shots I spend more time hitting driver than anything else, just to build comfort with it and develop a shot I know I can trust, even if I have to throttle down.  A throttled down driver is still longer and just as accurate (for me) as driving with a three iron.

 

I've been wild with my driver for a long time before now.  It is a night and day difference when playing when I can drive it in the fairway, decently long, and when I can't and must lay back or when I drive it left and right.  Golf isn't easy by any means but it becomes so much easier and less mentally fatiguing when my driver is behaving.  I can fool around and post some really good scores (for me) when my driver is on versus when it is not.

 

To tie it into this thread, [most of us] can't really expect to hit it anywhere on the green when we are 160+ or hitting from the rough or trees.