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p770? or keep the apex19?


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Here we go again. lets start by saying JEBUS those 770 are gorgeous minus my carry on them.

 

Really want them but here is my dilemma, CF19 167ish carry on my 7 iron it's my go to 175 out. demoed a 7 iron and i got 150/152 every time. Distance dispersion on them are great but i don't think it's going to help my handicap having to hit 6/5 irons 185 out. 

 

if i picked up the TM and power lofted them by a degree or two is that going to change playability of the club? Man i keep thinking about these irons and i want them bad i just can't sacrifice that yardage... 

 

some other details 

TM 7 iron had stock kbs 120 s set at 2* flat i'm typically 2 up but been hitting solid with the lie change. 

 

WHAT DO I DO?!?!?! thanks agains Gents.

 

 

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Seems like theyre too much club for you. I have the Apex 19 as well and wouldnt think about playing the 770's as a 12 cap.

If you feel that the Apex 19 are a compact head...stick with the Apex 19. If you care about the absolute distance that a numbered iron is carrying, and don't ignore that completely and instead fo

TM was at my local store on Saturday. Got to hit the p770 with $-taper lites. Had the Apex 19s with the C-taper lites. Currently play the Forged Tecs (FTs) with $-taper lites.   I found that

I'm assuming you're playing the non-pro's in the apex?  7i is 30.5 vs 33 for the TM.  I would expect approx. an 8 yd difference in distance between the two irons.....definitely not a 15-17 yard difference.  Also, a 4* lie difference is HUGE, I would suspect that would have some effects on performance (I know it would for me and I play 2 up).  What shafts do you play in your apex's?  Are they the same length as the TM's you demoed?

 

As for the playability with loft changes, I've strengthened and weakened lofts in the past and did not see any noticeable difference in playability.  Others may have different experiences though. 

Edited by JDMRN81
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1 hour ago, JDMRN81 said:

I'm assuming you're playing the non-pro's in the apex?  7i is 30.5 vs 33 for the TM.  I would expect approx. an 8 yd difference in distance between the two irons.....definitely not a 15-17 yard difference.  Also, a 4* lie difference is HUGE, I would suspect that would have some effects on performance (I know it would for me and I play 2 up).  What shafts do you play in your apex's?  Are they the same length as the TM's you demoed?

 

As for the playability with loft changes, I've strengthened and weakened lofts in the past and did not see any noticeable difference in playability.  Others may have different experiences though. 

playing off 13 with nippon modus 105 stiff non pro apex 19. driver was the issue and now short game gotta love golf hence the Handicap.

 

maybe it was a bad day? maybe some wind? i don't know lol i was testing my buddies muira blades averaging 145 8 iron carry with c taper 120 2 degree flat. 

 

i've always been on the fence with a heavier shaft even though i feel it helps my tempo a little more. 

 

maybe i should just wait it out. i just get caught up in equipment hype and these irons are exactly what i wanted visually. I had the p790 for one round before i sold them because if just horrible lateral ball dispersion. experienced the notorious drop in spin and extra carry more often than not and the head just looked a little to clunky for me. Apex 19 fit the bill with a compact head but missing the chrome from the pro type irons. 

 

I'm a industrial designer so visuals like that is what i generally get attracted to haha

 

Edited by dayvei214
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1 hour ago, dayvei214 said:

playing off 13 with nippon modus 105 stiff non pro apex 19. driver was the issue and now short game gotta love golf hence the Handicap.

 

maybe it was a bad day? maybe some wind? i don't know lol i was testing my buddies muira blades averaging 145 8 iron carry with c taper 120 2 degree flat. 

 

i've always been on the fence with a heavier shaft even though i feel it helps my tempo a little more. 

 

maybe i should just wait it out. i just get caught up in equipment hype and these irons are exactly what i wanted visually. I had the p790 for one round before i sold them because if just horrible lateral ball dispersion. experienced the notorious drop in spin and extra carry more often than not and the head just looked a little to clunky for me. Apex 19 fit the bill with a compact head but missing the chrome from the pro type irons. 

 

I'm a industrial designer so visuals like that is what i generally get attracted to haha

 

The heavier shaft in the P770's definitely doesn't benefit you when comparing to the lighter shafts in your Apex's.  I'm sure there are other factors (like you mentioned with conditions).  I would try and hit them again, but bring your gamers with you to compare. 

Edited by JDMRN81
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TM was at my local store on Saturday. Got to hit the p770 with $-taper lites. Had the Apex 19s with the C-taper lites. Currently play the Forged Tecs (FTs) with $-taper lites.

 

I found that the dispersion on the p770s to be better than when I had the Apex 19s. As good as the FTs in that regard. Using the same shaft though, I lost about 8-10 yards carry with the 7 iron compared to the FTs. That's due to the p770's 7i is 3* weaker lofted that my FTs. (33* vs 30* respectively -- my clubs are 1/2* weaker than stock).

 

Though they feel very good, I think the p770s don't feel quite as soft as either the FTs or the Apex 19s. Good strikes or otherwise. More feedback I think though on mishits..

 

If I still had the Apex 19s and I thought they were lacking something (and they were for me), I'd seriously consider the p770s. The p770s are gorgeous but they are not replacing my Cobras.

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Been gaming the Apex 19's all season. I have the Forged Tec 20's but Apex 19's have held their ground.

 

 If you are comparing the standard Apex 19's to the P770's it's more of an apples to oranges kind of comparison...Apex 19 Pro's to P770's more of an apples to apples comparison.

 

Personally as much as I love the looks of the P770's I know they are not meant for me. I want forgiveness & yardage compared to feel & slightly better dispersion.

Driver: Cobra F9 @ 11.5 Degrees

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If you feel that the Apex 19 are a compact head...stick with the Apex 19.

If you care about the absolute distance that a numbered iron is carrying, and don't ignore that completely and instead focus on descent angle, spin, launch angle, dispersion, etc...stick with the Apex 19.

If you fit into the Apex 19 over the Apex Pros...stick with the Apex 19.

If you want to buy a set of irons because of looks...get Mizuno MP20 MBs ?

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A fairer comparison might me P770 vs T100/100S.  If comparing Apex 19 why not compare to P790?.   For me I don't care what the number on the sole says as long as I have a club in my bag that can get me where I want to go.   

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2 hours ago, Lobber said:

A fairer comparison might me P770 vs T100/100S.  If comparing Apex 19 why not compare to P790?.   For me I don't care what the number on the sole says as long as I have a club in my bag that can get me where I want to go.   

I took the 790 out of the comparisons because of the length of the club face just didn't suit my eye . I bought a set last season played a couple of rounds with them and everytime I set up they just felt more and more chunky. And because I'm interested in the 770s lol. 

 

Icould argue the importance the club number both ways. Yes I agree as long as it hits the distance, but at the same time I don't want to have pull a 5 iron 175 out. 

 

 

 

 

 

 

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On 9/8/2020 at 9:45 PM, rtraudt said:

If you feel that the Apex 19 are a compact head...stick with the Apex 19.

If you care about the absolute distance that a numbered iron is carrying, and don't ignore that completely and instead focus on descent angle, spin, launch angle, dispersion, etc...stick with the Apex 19.

If you fit into the Apex 19 over the Apex Pros...stick with the Apex 19.

If you want to buy a set of irons because of looks...get Mizuno MP20 MBs ?

 

 

I mean of course I care about those numbers, I like everything about the numbers I'm getting for the 770 except for that carry number. 

 

So I was considering getting them and going 1.5 degree strong. 

 

But not sure if that made sense. 

 

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On 9/6/2020 at 11:46 PM, sshadow2 said:

TM was at my local store on Saturday. Got to hit the p770 with $-taper lites. Had the Apex 19s with the C-taper lites. Currently play the Forged Tecs (FTs) with $-taper lites.

 

I found that the dispersion on the p770s to be better than when I had the Apex 19s. As good as the FTs in that regard. Using the same shaft though, I lost about 8-10 yards carry with the 7 iron compared to the FTs. That's due to the p770's 7i is 3* weaker lofted that my FTs. (33* vs 30* respectively -- my clubs are 1/2* weaker than stock).

 

Though they feel very good, I think the p770s don't feel quite as soft as either the FTs or the Apex 19s. Good strikes or otherwise. More feedback I think though on mishits..

 

If I still had the Apex 19s and I thought they were lacking something (and they were for me), I'd seriously consider the p770s. The p770s are gorgeous but they are not replacing my Cobras.

Never tried the FT. maybe I'll give it a test. 

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  • 3 weeks later...

I just hit the P770 with MMT shaft and I bought it after hitting about 10 balls.  Higher launch and spin with about the same distance (maybe 2-3 yards shorter).  I picked up a 1000 RPMs and 1.5 degrees on the launch.

 

It was one of the bast shaft head combos I have ever hit.

 

Cant wait till they come in.

 

 

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3 hours ago, RochesterGuy said:

I just hit the P770 with MMT shaft and I bought it after hitting about 10 balls.  Higher launch and spin with about the same distance (maybe 2-3 yards shorter).  I picked up a 1000 RPMs and 1.5 degrees on the launch.

 

It was one of the bast shaft head combos I have ever hit.

 

Cant wait till they come in.

 

 

Nice what was the up charge on it? 

 

Just saw a recent video of the TXG guys tuning P790 /P770 irons down to the same loft 28* 6 iron results were pretty identical so I'm thinking I'll end up doing that. 

 

770 power lofted to 790. With current nippon modus 105s.  Considering combo 4/5 iron in P790 but haven't decided. 

 

I also tried miz 921 forged. I was leaning towards those also but for whatever reason Im not willing to pull the trigger on them. Something about mizunos that I just don't really care for. 

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I gamed the Apex 19 for over a year. For a 'game improvement' iron the blade lengths are quite short which made my transition into 921 Tours easy. And while I haven't compared side by side I expect the Apex 19 size is comparable to the P770, so your transition should be equally easy.

 

Few things I disliked about the Apex 19: 

 

- Feel is soft but the club does feel very hollow and fast off the face

- A little too much offset for my eye across the set, particularly in the shorter irons. Iron shapes are a little too rounded for my eye.

- Distance dispersion was an issue. Occasionally a flushed shot would carry an additional 10m and miss greens long. Similarly good shots would occasionaly land short for no apparent reason.


I can't comment on whether the P770 would offer any improvements on this front. 

 

Without doing a proper fitting there is no way I would move from a 2* up to a 2* flat lie angle. However, note that the P770 stock lie angle is more upright than the Apex 19. 

Edited by bombs

d: G410+ | f: M3 |  h: Epic | i: 921 Tour | w: Vokey | p: SpiderX

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On 9/5/2020 at 12:06 PM, third-times-a-charm said:

Seems like theyre too much club for you. I have the Apex 19 as well and wouldnt think about playing the 770's as a 12 cap.

 

Handicap is not a measure of ball striking ability. Ball striking ability is also not a measure for which type of clubs someone should play. 


I've seen 18 handicap players use blades and hit them MUCH better than game improvement clubs. On the flipside I play with a +2 handicap who uses P790's. 

 

Some players perform better with more/less offset. Others benefit from thinner/wider soles. Some players will also find that a smaller head requires them to focus more, leading to better results. Then there's spin, launch angle, carry distance etc..

 

There are too many variables to simply assign clubs to golfers based on handicap. 

 

 

 

 

Edited by bombs
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d: G410+ | f: M3 |  h: Epic | i: 921 Tour | w: Vokey | p: SpiderX

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26 minutes ago, bombs said:

 

Handicap is not a measure of ball striking ability. Ball striking ability is also not a measure for which type of clubs someone should play. 


I've seen 18 handicap players use blades and hit them MUCH better than game improvement clubs. On the flipside I play with a +2 handicap who uses P790's. 

 

Some players perform better with more/less offset. Others benefit from thinner/wider soles. Some players will also find that a smaller head requires them to focus more, leading to better results. Then there's spin, launch angle, carry distance etc..

 

There are too many variables to simply assign clubs to golfers based on handicap. 

 

 

 

 

YES! finally I think that's what is frustrating when people generalize handicaps with the type of irons they should use. I'm playing to 10 now and I can honestly say that the only thing that I generally give up 5 strokes to bad drives and putts.  

 

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11 hours ago, RxGolf1 said:

Visually, the P770's look so much better than the Apex's. As far as performance, they are very similar distance wise at equal lofts, but P770 more easy to shot shape IMO. 

I shape the Apex pretty easy. What are your thoughts on 921 forged or mp20 mmc? 

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11 hours ago, dayvei214 said:

I shape the Apex pretty easy. What are your thoughts on 921 forged or mp20 mmc? 

Actually hit the 921's at a fitting recently. Hit mostly lower spinning straight shots with them. They felt similar to P770's in softness, but less distance and a little less workable.  I tend to overdraw the MMC's. 

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On 10/1/2020 at 9:25 AM, RxGolf1 said:

Actually hit the 921's at a fitting recently. Hit mostly lower spinning straight shots with them. They felt similar to P770's in softness, but less distance and a little less workable.  I tend to overdraw the MMC's. 

That's interesting... Because 770 is at 33* vs 31* for 921. I think im just going play out the season with the Apex and get something next year. All this new gear coming out is giving me buyers anxiety. 

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I think you have to hit the P770's with a shaft comparable to your current irons, Modus 105 S is lighter and quite a bit softer than KBS Tour S.  Apex 19 will be longer with CF and stronger lofts, but difference shouldn't be more than 10 yards.  If you want distance comparable to your Apex maybe look at JPX 921 HMP.

Edited by Tommyj
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On 9/7/2020 at 10:46 AM, sshadow2 said:

TM was at my local store on Saturday. Got to hit the p770 with $-taper lites. Had the Apex 19s with the C-taper lites. Currently play the Forged Tecs (FTs) with $-taper lites.

 

I found that the dispersion on the p770s to be better than when I had the Apex 19s. As good as the FTs in that regard. Using the same shaft though, I lost about 8-10 yards carry with the 7 iron compared to the FTs. That's due to the p770's 7i is 3* weaker lofted that my FTs. (33* vs 30* respectively -- my clubs are 1/2* weaker than stock).

 

Though they feel very good, I think the p770s don't feel quite as soft as either the FTs or the Apex 19s. Good strikes or otherwise. More feedback I think though on mishits..

 

If I still had the Apex 19s and I thought they were lacking something (and they were for me), I'd seriously consider the p770s. The p770s are gorgeous but they are not replacing my Cobras.

Which Cobra Forged Tec are you playing?

Callaway Mavrik 9*, Kuro Kage Black 60gr Stiff..
Callaway Rogue 3 wood.
Titleist U510 3 iron.
Cobra King Forged Tec 2016 5 - PW.
Vokey SM7, 50F, 54S, 58D.
Scotty Cameron Futura X5.

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6 hours ago, garethw said:

Which Cobra Forged Tec are you playing?

2020 standard set.

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8 hours ago, sshadow2 said:

2020 standard set.

Im playing the original 2015/16 Forged Tec and thinking about changing for either P770 or Srixon ZX7.

Callaway Mavrik 9*, Kuro Kage Black 60gr Stiff..
Callaway Rogue 3 wood.
Titleist U510 3 iron.
Cobra King Forged Tec 2016 5 - PW.
Vokey SM7, 50F, 54S, 58D.
Scotty Cameron Futura X5.

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3 hours ago, garethw said:

Im playing the original 2015/16 Forged Tec and thinking about changing for either P770 or Srixon ZX7.

if based on aesthetics zx7 is a no go. almost like Srixon's designers got a little carried away and lost that clean look

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went for a fitting today at CC looks like apex 19 is still the clear winner between all the irons.

 

but i did get a little intel that the apex pros are getting updated and no longer getting produced

 

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