My Swing Evolution is a Charlatan!

[Starched]

You may want to be careful posting people’s names but anyway I looked them all up on GHIN 😆

Winner is a 1.8. All others on list ranged from 5.6 thru 14.4. And can’t find an index for C. Garcia at Eaton Canyon but that course is easy…. I’ve always said Cristo is like every other 12 that works hard to be a 5 index. No better though. How he has managed such an awesome grift is pretty impressive in my opinion. He’s harmless. 

[powerfade66]

2 hours ago, Starched said:

You may want to be careful posting people’s names but anyway I looked them all up on GHIN 😆

Winner is a 1.8. All others on list ranged from 5.6 thru 14.4. And can’t find an index for C. Garcia at Eaton Canyon but that course is easy…. I’ve always said Cristo is like every other 12 that works hard to be a 5 index. No better though. How he has managed such an awesome grift is pretty impressive in my opinion. He’s harmless. 

14.4 in the A flight! I thought his description of the level of competition would be exaggerated. 

[virtuoso]

They probably don’t care for the men’s club stuff, but if he tries to play any slightly more serious local amateur tournaments, he won’t be able to because he is technically a golf professional. So, his choices are men’s club or mini tour. I assume he knows this but maybe not. He talks about wanting to be a great player which would entail going beyond the club championship, but the next step would be a big one. Really, one day mini tour events are pretty meaningless also but it’s a different group of players. It’s a bunch of 25 year olds trying to at least break 70 to make their entry fee back. If you are a 50 something and show up and shoot 78, everyone will wonder what you are even doing there.

Edited November 20, 2022 by virtuoso

[Ghost of Snead]

10 hours ago, virtuoso said:

They probably don’t care for the men’s club stuff, but if he tries to play any slightly more serious local amateur tournaments, he won’t be able to because he is technically a golf professional. So, his choices are men’s club or mini tour. I assume he knows this but maybe not. He talks about wanting to be a great player which would entail going beyond the club championship, but the next step would be a big one. Really, one day mini tour events are pretty meaningless also but it’s a different group of players. It’s a bunch of 25 year olds trying to at least break 70 to make their entry fee back. If you are a 50 something and show up and shoot 78, everyone will wonder what you are even doing there.

 

Is Eaton Canyon really only 5700 from the back playing the same 9 twice ? Wouldn't imagine too many mini-tour events are played less than 6800. 

[Starched]

Yes it’s a local muni goat ranch. Great facility and people, old throwback but not a hard or even “real” course to me. An index there is meaningless since the rating is 66.8 and 113 slope. I look at Cristo and I see a 5 index at a normal course. His game is dime a dozen at a normal club. His fame is legendary…😝

[powerfade66]

On 11/21/2022 at 12:40 AM, virtuoso said:

They probably don’t care for the men’s club stuff, but if he tries to play any slightly more serious local amateur tournaments, he won’t be able to because he is technically a golf professional. So, his choices are men’s club or mini tour. I assume he knows this but maybe not. He talks about wanting to be a great player which would entail going beyond the club championship, but the next step would be a big one. Really, one day mini tour events are pretty meaningless also but it’s a different group of players. It’s a bunch of 25 year olds trying to at least break 70 to make their entry fee back. If you are a 50 something and show up and shoot 78, everyone will wonder what you are even doing there.

I agree. If it is a long walk from the driving range to the first tee, you can 5-10x that when going from local club competition to open competition away from home against good players. It is often said that it feels like playing with a different body. For many it’s what makes them give up on a lot of their swing thoughts all the way up to quitting the game altogether. The ones who stick it out come to learn that it is just a kind of rite of passage and in time feel nearly as comfortable playing open competition as playing at their home club. 
 

All of that is another thing entirely if you have been taking cash on the basis of having The Hogan Code and … Miracle Swing etc. 

[virtuoso]

2 hours ago, powerfade66 said:

I agree. If it is a long walk from the driving range to the first tee, you can 5-10x that when going from local club competition to open competition away from home against good players. It is often said that it feels like playing with a different body. For many it’s what makes them give up on a lot of their swing thoughts all the way up to quitting the game altogether. The ones who stick it out come to learn that it is just a kind of rite of passage and in time feel nearly as comfortable playing open competition as playing at their home club. 
 

All of that is another thing entirely if you have been taking cash on the basis of having The Hogan Code and … Miracle Swing etc. 

Yeah, playing in a different body is a good way to put it, and you're right: you just keep entering tournaments, and at some point you become more comfortable. But, if you turn pro, it forces you to skip some steps and makes it more difficult. He has played in tournaments before when he was younger, so it's not that foreign, but mini tours are just not that fun. It would have been much better to play in Pasadena city am, LA city am, qual for SoCal am, Cal am, etc. But, if he kept his amateur status, he wouldn't be able to do his golf instruction business, and he has to pay his mortgage like the rest of us.

[powerfade66]

His swing mirrors Ben Hogan. His content is worth $1,000. The guy is getting worse. I’d love to see an independent valuation on his products. It may come out in the negative if you weigh the value of your time against the value gained. 
 

[virtuoso]

Its pretty ingenious actually. He can keep rolling out new products with every new epiphany. He has learned how to monetize his swing journey--even though its the same journey that everyone goes on. Now he's trying to figure out why his divots are a foot deep. Miracle OTT w/ Shallow Bacon Strips 2.0 coming soon. I love it. God Bless America.

 

(But, his swing looks worse now--he's stacking too much and spinning back behind himself again. Looks gross.)

[Starched]

His swing has never been technically sound, especially his footwork. 

[powerfade66]

1 hour ago, virtuoso said:

Its pretty ingenious actually. He can keep rolling out new products with every new epiphany. He has learned how to monetize his swing journey--even though its the same journey that everyone goes on. Now he's trying to figure out why his divots are a foot deep. Miracle OTT w/ Shallow Bacon Strips 2.0 coming soon. I love it. God Bless America.

 

(But, his swing looks worse now--he's stacking too much and spinning back behind himself again. Looks gross.)

But it’s a winning swing apparently. 
 

[SwagGolf6112]

On 11/29/2022 at 4:23 PM, powerfade66 said:

His swing mirrors Ben Hogan. His content is worth $1,000. The guy is getting worse. I’d love to see an independent valuation on his products. It may come out in the negative if you weigh the value of your time against the value gained. 
 

 

 

Does his hubris knows no offense?! SMH😠😠😠

[Ifelloffladder]

On 11/29/2022 at 3:23 AM, powerfade66 said:

His swing mirrors Ben Hogan. His content is worth $1,000. The guy is getting worse. I’d love to see an independent valuation on his products. It may come out in the negative if you weigh the value of your time against the value gained. 
 

For $79 he better have a "secret swing" that copies Hogan's to a T that he doesn't show on his Youtube videos.

[KimmerBH]

First off, his swing looks NOTHING like Hogan's and never has. It's insulting that he keeps claiming this nonsense to make a quick buck. Also does this guy have any kind of golf teaching certification? People actually pay him for lessons and I think he even holds clinics. Guess it's true that a sucker is born every minute lol. His YouTube seems to be nothing more than a commercial for his membership scam with almost no actual content too.

[tthomasgolfer605]

On 12/9/2022 at 1:26 PM, KimmerBH said:

First off, his swing looks NOTHING like Hogan's and never has. It's insulting that he keeps claiming this nonsense to make a quick buck. Also does this guy have any kind of golf teaching certification? People actually pay him for lessons and I think he even holds clinics. Guess it's true that a sucker is born every minute lol. His YouTube seems to be nothing more than a commercial for his membership scam with almost no actual content too.

You don't need to be certified to teach golf.  You'll never get a job at a club but can make good money spewing BS like Christo does.

[polski]

I have a few questions. Not trying to cause trouble just want some truth please. I'm happy to change my mind on all of this if I can get some answers.

 

1. I truly believe I'm one of the best teachers of regular golfers in the world

 

Can I please see some testimonials from perhaps 5-10 of your students (students that have been getting lessons from you for an extended period of time around 2-5 years not just 1 or 2 lessons or online lessons)? Could you show how your students have improved using handicap improvements or any statistical data. Or even better testimonials from other coaches (other than ones you know) that could back this claim up that you are one of the best? Also can you provide examples as to why you think you are the best.

 

2. Golf game has improved

 

What was your handicap before and after? Do you hold a handicap currently and if not why? Do you have any long term data to show your improvement (other than videos or pictures) like strokes gained or any golf statistical data? Launch monitor data before and after? Golf score trends for the last 5 years or so?

 

3. Is a great golfer

 

How many golf tournaments run by an offical golf association have you played (please provide name of tournament, year you played, score you shot and where you finished). How many have you won? Whats your best finish in one of these tournaments? What was your best golf score in a golf tournament? What is your worst score in a tournament? What golf course do you regularly play at? Whats the slope and rating of the course? How long is the course? Do you think your home course is challenging?

 

4. How much do you charge for clinics and lessons and how do you justify this cost? And why should I attend your clinics or lessons rather than other golf coaches?

 

5. You said in a video you have studied under some coaches like David Leadbetter and other great coaches. If this is the case could you get them to make an official statement that you have indeed STUDIED under them and for how long you have STUDIED under them, and that they are happy for you to make this claim of association.

 

6. Could you discuss your golf swing understandings? How did you come to these understandings and could you provide factual proof to these claims (such as 3d data, scientific research papers, etc)

 

7. Do you have a background in teaching golf or sports? Have you worked in the golf industry before and if so for how long and what golf places have you worked at?

 

 

Edited December 28, 2022 by polski

[SwagGolf6112]

1 hour ago, polski said:

I have a few questions. Not trying to cause trouble just want some truth please. I'm happy to change my mind on all of this if I can get some answers.

 

1. I truly believe I'm one of the best teachers of regular golfers in the world

 

Can I please see some testimonials from perhaps 5-10 of your students (students that have been getting lessons from you for an extended period of time around 2-5 years not just 1 or 2 lessons or online lessons)? Could you show how your students have improved using handicap improvements or any statistical data. Or even better testimonials from other coaches (other than ones you know) that could back this claim up that you are one of the best?

 

2. Golf game has improved

 

What was your handicap before and after? Do you hold a handicap currently and if not why? Do you have any long term data to show your improvement (other than videos or pictures) like strokes gained or any golf statistical data? Launch monitor data before and after? 

 

3. Is a great golfer

 

How many golf tournaments run by an offical golf association have you played (please provide year you played, score you shot and where you finished). How many have you won? Whats your best finish in one of these tournaments? What was your best golf score in a golf tournament? What is your worst score in a tournament? What golf course do you regularly play at? Whats the slope and rating of the course? How long is the course? 

 

4. How much do you charge for clinics and lessons and how do you justify this cost? And why should I attend your clinics or lessons rather than other golf coaches?

 

5. You said in a video you have studied under some coaches like David Leadbetter and other great coaches. If this is the case could you get them to make an official statement that you have indeed STUDIED under them and for how long you have STUDIED under them, and that they are happy for you to make this claim of association.

 

6. Could you discuss your golf swing understandings? How did you come to these understandings and could you provide factual proof to these claims (such as 3d data, scientific research papers, etc)

 

7. Do you have a background in teaching golf or sports? Have you worked in the golf industry before and if so for how long and what golf places have you worked at?

 

 

 

 

All valid questions which MSE will never respond to. Heck, even to this day not a single one of his students are here to say one nice thing about this con artist.

[polski]

I think Mr MSE is a good person at heart, but all these lessons and clinics is very questionable. 

Edited December 26, 2022 by polski

[Ifelloffladder]

On 12/25/2022 at 11:56 PM, polski said:

I think Mr MSE is a good person at heart, but all these lessons and clinics is very questionable. 

 

A good heart to scam people.

[SwagGolf6112]

On 12/26/2022 at 12:56 PM, polski said:

I think Mr MSE is a good person at heart...

 

Used to think that as well.. not anymore.

[Chainlinks]

Hogan could shoot 67 in US Open’s, MSE maybe and that’s a big maybe might crack 127

[Jeselnik]

I dont know if its still available but MSE and BEBETTERGOLF  

****edit. Here it is.  At that time he was already trying to extract money from people.  Judge for yourself.

JNIK

Edited March 4 by Jeselnik
Found video.

[tthomasgolfer605]

... 

 

Edited March 5 by tthomasgolfer605

[powerfade66]

Does anyone know what he charges for the “MSE Intensives”?

[Sabzor]

I can't deal with this guy. I legitimately feel bad for anyone who subscribes to any of his nonsense.

[powerfade66]

On 3/27/2023 at 11:23 AM, Sabzor said:

I can't deal with this guy. I legitimately feel bad for anyone who subscribes to any of his nonsense.

You won’t be taking up his offer of all his crap for $367. According to him it is worth thousands of dollars. 🤦‍♂️ 

 

He valued his Gary Player interview at $500 even though in that video Gary tells him I’m not going to tell you what Hogan told me about the swing. 
 

 

He makes used car salesmen look good. 

[Kliczdc]

In a desperate attempt to steal money from naive amateur golfers by promoting his ridiculous Over-The-Top Miracle Swing we then get this nonsense…….

“This was the original golf swing, the way it was taught, decade after decade, up until about the 1970’s.”— Christo Garcia.

Hey CHRISTO, show me one scintilla of historic proof, from a newspaper, magazine, book, pamphlet, film or any other type of vintage media that backs up what you are saying.

I say, “YOU CAN NOT”!!!
Because you are 100% completely full of sheet.  That’s right Christo, I’m calling you out as a gigantic lier!  Prove me wrong—YOU LIER!

Guys, stay away from this charlatan Christo Garcia.  He is as conman on the same level as the Graves Brothers, both Toddie and Timmie….you can take that directly to the bank.

 

Spoiler

 

 

Edited April 8 by Kliczdc

[iBanesto]

He has rebranded to Miracle Swing Experience.

 

https://www.youtube.com/@MiracleSwingExperience/about

[polski]

.

Edited April 15 by polski

[powerfade66]

23 hours ago, iBanesto said:

He has rebranded to Miracle Swing Experience.

 

https://www.youtube.com/@MiracleSwingExperience/about

If it’s a miracle why would you not take it on the road and try it out against the thousands of golfers playing professional golf tours? Because he is full of S.