2020 US Open

[TheIncelGolfer]

1 hour ago, Hawkeye77 said:

 

A couple of anecdotes from 4 years ago and pretty much nothing of an article. Click bait and superficial. 
 

If “they” don’t like it (and seems to be exaggerated) then I like it more!

I agree. The "these greens suck" comment I took to mean that he wasn't putting as well as he wanted or that the greens were getting the better of him. Kinda like when you say "squats suck" after your last set.

[cxx]

1 hour ago, Greg_B said:

According to this story in Golf Digest at least, the members at Winged Foot are less than enthralled with their new champion golfer.

 

Any members US open winners? If not, then who cares. I'm sure they all benefited from the fees for hosting the tournament. I assume it's an equity club?

[Hawkeye77]

19 minutes ago, cxx said:

 

Any members US open winners? If not, then who cares. I'm sure they all benefited from the fees for hosting the tournament. I assume it's an equity club?

They got paid a bundle!

[Jackhammer993]

Humorous to see the veiled dislike for Bryson by some. They won’t come out directly and say anything because Bryson kicked everyone’s behind but they will bring up anchored putting or slow play or members dislike. Peter Kostis who is a respected teacher was a prime example. A few on this forum the same. Saw this with Morikawa winning the PGA also with some saying it was boring. Not sure who you guys like but your in for many unhappy years where these two along with Wolff and Hovland will be dominating golf. There was a lot of this when Tiger first came out. Just as then acceptance will prevail in the end and greatness will be recognized. 

[One Putter]

Bryson suffers from the not so rare condition of having a crappy personality.

[HackDaddy360]

4 hours ago, Hawkeye77 said:

LOL, single length irons aren’t getting banned. Not even a reasonable take. 

Thoughtful. 
 

Think of it this way.... IF the USGA decides it “has to do something” because someone just bomb/gouged around a US Open track and won by a mile... what can they “do” that wouldn’t impact the majority of players, jack up the US Open rotation/force “adjustments” to those venues, make the courses so hard it’s laughable or that could reinforce the “traditions of the game” and “level the playing field” all at once?

 

Ban single length irons.  
 

It’s the low hanging fruit.  
 

I didn’t say they are going to do this.  In fact, I doubt they’ll do this. I’m saying that if I’m the USGA and wanted to uphold the “traditions of the game” or however else they spun it - while also not impacting other players/club manufacturers/sponsor deals/etc. - Id ban single length irons.  

 

99.999999% of players - in general - wouldn’t be impacted at all.  
 

Maybe you think governing/regulatory bodies are smart - but all are not (though I would say the USGA and PGA are generally quite on point).  And if they feel they are threatened in some way, or if the players blow back on this open too hard, I could absolutely see them going after single length clubs just to say they did something about the “problem”.  
 

Lots of “ifs” there - however - which is why I say I doubt anything changes. 
 

 

[TCWhite]

If anchoring offers an advantage, isn't everyone free to do it?

Edited September 23, 2020 by TCWhite

[Hawkeye77]

1 hour ago, HackDaddy360 said:

Thoughtful. 
 

Think of it this way.... IF the USGA decides it “has to do something” because someone just bomb/gouged around a US Open track and won by a mile... what can they “do” that wouldn’t impact the majority of players, jack up the US Open rotation/force “adjustments” to those venues, make the courses so hard it’s laughable or that could reinforce the “traditions of the game” and “level the playing field” all at once?

 

Ban single length irons.  
 

It’s the low hanging fruit.  
 

I didn’t say they are going to do this.  In fact, I doubt they’ll do this. I’m saying that if I’m the USGA and wanted to uphold the “traditions of the game” or however else they spun it - while also not impacting other players/club manufacturers/sponsor deals/etc. - Id ban single length irons.  

 

99.999999% of players - in general - wouldn’t be impacted at all.  
 

Maybe you think governing/regulatory bodies are smart - but all are not (though I would say the USGA and PGA are generally quite on point).  And if they feel they are threatened in some way, or if the players blow back on this open too hard, I could absolutely see them going after single length clubs just to say they did something about the “problem”.  
 

Lots of “ifs” there - however - which is why I say I doubt anything changes. 
 

 

 

Windy.

 

Again, not even a reasonable suggestion or concern.  A couple hundred words doesn't change that, lol.

[TCWhite]

1 hour ago, HackDaddy360 said:

Thoughtful. 
 

Think of it this way.... IF the USGA decides it “has to do something” because someone just bomb/gouged around a US Open track and won by a mile... what can they “do” that wouldn’t impact the majority of players, jack up the US Open rotation/force “adjustments” to those venues, make the courses so hard it’s laughable or that could reinforce the “traditions of the game” and “level the playing field” all at once?

 

Ban single length irons.  
 

It’s the low hanging fruit.  
 

I didn’t say they are going to do this.  In fact, I doubt they’ll do this. I’m saying that if I’m the USGA and wanted to uphold the “traditions of the game” or however else they spun it - while also not impacting other players/club manufacturers/sponsor deals/etc. - Id ban single length irons.  

 

99.999999% of players - in general - wouldn’t be impacted at all.  
 

Maybe you think governing/regulatory bodies are smart - but all are not (though I would say the USGA and PGA are generally quite on point).  And if they feel they are threatened in some way, or if the players blow back on this open too hard, I could absolutely see them going after single length clubs just to say they did something about the “problem”.  
 

Lots of “ifs” there - however - which is why I say I doubt anything changes. 
 

 

I personally don't have a problem with folks swinging whatever length club they want.  Why not just do away with metal woods and composite shafts and go back to real wood and steel, the traditional clubs?

[HackDaddy360]

10 minutes ago, TCWhite said:

I personally don't have a problem with folks swinging whatever length club they want.  Why not just do away with metal woods and composite shafts and go back to real wood and steel, the traditional clubs?

I could care less what length of clubs people want to play.  I also couldn’t care less if they anchor. 

[HackDaddy360]

23 minutes ago, Hawkeye77 said:

 

Windy.

 

Again, not even a reasonable suggestion or concern.  A couple hundred words doesn't change that, lol.

Why isn’t it?  You’re pretty good at drive by comments but pretty weak on substance. 

[Hawkeye77]

8 minutes ago, HackDaddy360 said:

Why isn’t it?  You’re pretty good at drive by comments but pretty weak on substance. 

 

Don't need to say much when the answer is obvious. 

 

USGA won't be banning single length irons. 

 

 

Edited September 23, 2020 by Hawkeye77

[Ferguson]

9 hours ago, One Putter said:

Bryson suffers from the not so rare condition of having a crappy personality.

 

He's focused and driven, an ever rarer condition in this modern society.   

 

It's refreshing to see a guy set lofty goals, create a path; then stay on the path and do the hard work to get there.  

He makes me want to watch golf. 

 

Bryson, the brand, is now a proven concept.   

I hope he wins 10 more majors.   

 

 

[BlackDiamondPar5]

10 hours ago, One Putter said:

Bryson suffers from the not so rare condition of having a crappy personality.

LOL... yeah okay. 

 

Bryson chatting with a wrx hater... 

 

[Jackhammer993]

Actually agreeing With Ferguson and Hawkeye77 on this. Outside of some personality quirks Bryson is the real deal. Also happy to be moving ahead with a strong group of upcoming golfers. The future looks bright.

[Ferguson]

1 minute ago, Jackhammer993 said:

Actually agreeing With Ferguson and Hawkeye77 on this. Outside of some personality quirks Bryson is the real deal. Also happy to be moving ahead with a strong group of upcoming golfers. The future looks bright.

 

Now he's got something that's repeatable.   Otherwise know as the "holy grail" of golf. 

 

 

He must avoid marriage.  

[mocokid]

2 hours ago, Ferguson said:

 

He's focused and driven, an ever rarer condition in this modern society.   

 

It's refreshing to see a guy set lofty goals, create a path; then stay on the path and do the hard work to get there.  

He makes me want to watch golf. 

 

Bryson, the brand, is now a proven concept.   

I hope he wins 10 more majors.   

 

 

The only thing stopping him and others are injuries, today's all out players going to have more and at younger age than previously.

[torbill]

I clearly remember people hating Jack when he was beating Arnie, and they claimed that he had a bad personality.  A lot of people hated Bill Gates for the tactics he used to get Microsoft up and going, and said he was a jerk.  They hated Steve Jobs and said the same thing about his personality.  Now a lot of them hate Elon Musk.  And along comes young Bryson de Chambeau, into the fray, re-thinking old ideas.  People who forge change, who rock the boat, who innovate, have strong ideas and personalities, and they take a lot of folks out of their zone of comfort and familiarity.  Agents of change are seldom popular in their time.

[jmck]

Guys, it's one tournament.  Yes, it was an impressive win, but not that long ago the same dude was making a 10, missing a cut, looking like a total fool.  In that very same tournament, Rahm put up an impressive win and on here there was some guy INSISTING that it was the beginning of a new era of TOTAL domination by Rahm.  While Rahm didn't make a 10 and miss the cut like a total fool in the US Open he never sniffed being in contention.  Golf is hard.  Let's not get too far ahead of ourselves with talk of a new, Bryson dominated era, a game revolutionized by protein shakes and arm lock putting, played only by linebackers.

[disco111]

Just a general observation on or what the USGA might/could do regarding the single length position.

1. The long putter was in use for well over 20 years on the tour, until someone started winning with it and the USGA caved to apease some big names.

2. Ping and the groove fiasco, again USGA caved to appease the big names who were crying foul.

3. Sam Sneed putting and winning with a contrived style of facing the hole with the ball between his feet. The USGA caved to appease the big names and banned it.

4. Even though hardly anyone on tour, at least to my knowledge, used a driver over 48", the USGA placed a limit of 48" on it........Why?

I don't put anything past what the USGA might/could do if again the so-called big names start to moan and groan. History has shown what happens......

 

Just as a what the heck, Bobby Jones played same length irons way back when and it's said that's where Bryson got his epiphany when he got the chance to view those clubs. Now lets say the SL's due get banned, would that mean that now all of Jones's records would now either be taken away or would they just have an asterisk added? 

[smashdn]

14 hours ago, HackDaddy360 said:

Thoughtful. 
 

Think of it this way.... IF the USGA decides it “has to do something” because someone just bomb/gouged around a US Open track and won by a mile... what can they “do” that wouldn’t impact the majority of players, jack up the US Open rotation/force “adjustments” to those venues, make the courses so hard it’s laughable or that could reinforce the “traditions of the game” and “level the playing field” all at once?

 

Ban single length irons.  
 

It’s the low hanging fruit.  
 

I didn’t say they are going to do this.  In fact, I doubt they’ll do this. I’m saying that if I’m the USGA and wanted to uphold the “traditions of the game” or however else they spun it - while also not impacting other players/club manufacturers/sponsor deals/etc. - Id ban single length irons.  

 

99.999999% of players - in general - wouldn’t be impacted at all.  
 

Maybe you think governing/regulatory bodies are smart - but all are not (though I would say the USGA and PGA are generally quite on point).  And if they feel they are threatened in some way, or if the players blow back on this open too hard, I could absolutely see them going after single length clubs just to say they did something about the “problem”.  
 

Lots of “ifs” there - however - which is why I say I doubt anything changes. 
 

 

 

I draw a lot of similarities to MLB's approach to how the game is currently being played (and how it reacted to several instances over the years).

 

 

Batters gain the upper hand, they raise the mounds, or deaden the ball.

Not enough offense, they lower the mound.

Game too slow, they make the new intentional walk rule and runner on second in extras and no first to third move, etc.

 

I foresee something coming regarding "the shift" as well.

 

 

HOWEVER - single length irons aren't why BDC won.  I don't think it was all bomb and gouge either.  It certainly was bomb but he wasn't terribly far off the field driving accuracy number was he?

 

The absolute best thing a governing body could do is look the other way when it comes to the pro game (IMO) and let the various tours handle that.  It is just different and on a different plane than the amateur game and done for a different purpose (money, sponsors, etc.).  Maybe professional golf is just late to mature?  We have had professional basketball for a good long while.  Baseball and football the same.  Maybe the "accepted" divergence in the pro and amateur forms of those sports is just more ingrained than with golf?  For the longest time part of the charm of golf is that you and I (well maybe not me) could play the game "as the pros do" on the courses that the pros do at the length the pros do.  30-40 years ago that might have been true (to an extent).  Your pro might have had a fighting chance to make the cut in an event, especially if it was at his course or one he was really familiar with.  

 

The NFL changes their rules all the time to impact how the game is played to draw more eyes to its product.  Same for MLB, NBA etc.  But I don't see FIBA and USA Baseball, etc. making changes to make the game more entertaining to watch.  Those entities make changes to make the game better to play and more equitable and safer.

 

That's a long-winded way to say that my opinion is birfurcation to a greater extent than it exists (both practical application and an acceptance of such) is probably the answer.

[munichop]

BD is like a lot of bombers. His finishes are determined by how he chips and putts. In both of his wins this year he putted very well and his short game was above average.  He is driven to get better and has through hard work and finding solutions that are outliers in the pro world.  His off putting personality happens to distract from what should be the best win of his pro career.  The fact he hit so few fairways to do it is more about the usga failing than anything he did.

[smashdn]

10 minutes ago, munichop said:

 The fact he hit so few fairways to do it is more about the usga failing than anything he did.

 

What could they have done more of?  Next closest score was +5.

 

Quote from Golf Digest Article

"The USGA controlled the rough height and what time the bar opened, two things where it’s impossible to please everybody. Had the rough been mown an inch higher, DeChambeau probably would’ve won by more than six. Tall grass doesn’t bother a wedge like it does the poor sap standing back there with a 7-iron, because even short hitters miss a lot of fairways at Winged Foot."

Edited September 23, 2020 by smashdn
added quote

[tiderider]

12 hours ago, HackDaddy360 said:

Why isn’t it?  You’re pretty good at drive by comments but pretty weak on substance. 

players have been adjusting a club's length since the game's inception ... usga's not going to restrict that unless there's an unethical advantage ... how does changing one's wedge length give an unethical advantage? ... and there's a limit to the driver ... no required length ... so, anything between 0-48 inches (or whatever the driver is) ... 

[Sean2]

6 hours ago, Ferguson said:

 

He's focused and driven, an ever rarer condition in this modern society.   

 

It's refreshing to see a guy set lofty goals, create a path; then stay on the path and do the hard work to get there.  

He makes me want to watch golf. 

 

Bryson, the brand, is now a proven concept.   

I hope he wins 10 more majors.   

 

 

I agree. Sure he's a bit of an iconoclast, and that could explain his personality too. He was on the driving range with the lights on Saturday night working on his game. It was around 8:15 or so. He is certainly driven and dedicated. 

[smashdn]

6 minutes ago, Sean2 said:

I agree. Sure he's a bit of an iconoclast, and that could explain his personality too. He was on the driving range with the lights on Saturday night working on his game. It was around 8:15 or so. He is certainly driven and dedicated. 

 

I've said before I think he needs to think he has impacted a bunch of these variables.  Floating golf balls and scientific this and that.  It keeps his mind busy and keeps him from tinkering with his actual swing.  I'd venture the late night ranges sessions aren't so much about find or tweaking his swing but ensuring he has it to a point it is repeatable and he has the confidence he can rely on a certain shot or feel at a given time.

[Sean2]

Just now, smashdn said:

 

I've said before I think he needs to think he has impacted a bunch of these variables.  Floating golf balls and scientific this and that.  It keeps his mind busy and keeps him from tinkering with his actual swing.  I'd venture the late night ranges sessions aren't so much about find or tweaking his swing but ensuring he has it to a point it is repeatable and he has the confidence he can rely on a certain shot or feel at a given time.

I read in the GolfWRX newsletter, he uses a device that measures his putts in miles per hour. "So, he knows how far to swing his arm-lock putter to produce a particular speed, therefore a precise distance. Then, he takes slope and break into account, using the same device." He sure does think outside the box. 

[gvogel]

2 hours ago, disco111 said:

Just a general observation on or what the USGA might/could do regarding the single length position.

1. The long putter was in use for well over 20 years on the tour, until someone started winning with it and the USGA caved to apease some big names.

2. Ping and the groove fiasco, again USGA caved to appease the big names who were crying foul.

3. Sam Sneed putting and winning with a contrived style of facing the hole with the ball between his feet. The USGA caved to appease the big names and banned it.

4. Even though hardly anyone on tour, at least to my knowledge, used a driver over 48", the USGA placed a limit of 48" on it........Why?

I don't put anything past what the USGA might/could do if again the so-called big names start to moan and groan. History has shown what happens......

 

Just as a what the heck, Bobby Jones played same length irons way back when and it's said that's where Bryson got his epiphany when he got the chance to view those clubs. Now lets say the SL's due get banned, would that mean that now all of Jones's records would now either be taken away or would they just have an asterisk added? 

Bobby Jones did not play single length irons.  His 2 and 3-iron were the same length, his 4 and 5-iron were the same length, 6 and 7-iron were the same length, you get the drift.  But the lengths were graduated.  And that was on only one of his sets.

 

AFter doing some research, it turns out that Jones designed a set of steel shafted clubs for Spaulding in 1930 that had clubs matched in pairs - as I outlined above.  However, Jones was still playing hickory at that time, and his clubs were not single length.

Edited September 23, 2020 by gvogel

[jdl]

 

[Christosterone]

2 minutes ago, jdl said:

 

this comes on page 59

 

-Chris