Replace a 60 w/50 degree wedge: feasible or overthinking this?

[RoyalMustang]

I am trying to dial in my bag so that it is one less thing to worry about.  I have finally settled on a set of clubs: MP20 MMC w/DG 120 X100.  I really like them; they are tight, controlled, and mishits are manageable. I bought them at the suggestion of my instructor after a fitting.  I am back playing after 25 years away: I just turned 40 and hope to be back consistently in the 70's again when I work off all of the rust.  

 

What I am struggling with is the distance of my set irons: the PW stops at 46 degrees.  Basically, my well-struck MMC carry distances are as follows: 8-iron 170-175, 9-iron 150-155, PW 135-140.   I have a set of wedges I picked up here: Callaway Jaws MD5 52/56/60.  My 52 is a solid 115, 56 is 105, 60 I don't take many full swings with. I would rather hit the 56 75-yards with an easy swing: the 60 is easy to get under and hit a short, fat shot.  Around the green, I will grab the 56 if I have any doubt about what club to hit; this probably comes from playing as a junior when the least lofted club in my bag was a PW at 50.5 (eventually I picked up a 57 degree SW: I never needed anything bigger and I can certainly open the face up and radially deviate at the wrist to create a lob with a 56).  

Is it worth throwing in a 50 degree to hit that 120-125 number and dropping the 60?  Or am I overthinking things? Being a set wedge, the PW tends to go pretty far even on a easy swing and I have a bit more trouble dialing it down compared to a forged wedge. My biggest loft gap is currently 9.5-16.5 for driver but second is 46-52 PW-GW.  

 

In an ideal world, I would just re-buy my wedges at 50/54/58, but that is a bit more work and I am hoping to work around the problem by adding to what I have instead of selling everything and starting anew.  

 

[titleist26]

wedges tend not to go as far as iron equivalents so I personally go 49 in my gap wedge. If you did that and bent your 52 and 56 1 degree weak then I think it will suit your needs nicely. 

[Vater]

I think you're asking because it's going to bother you and you'd like some solutions to rationalize going 50/52/56.

 

I went through the same thing when I switched iron sets. I knew I wanted to keep my 60, but now I was jumping off a 48. So I scrapped my 50 and 56 and picked up a 54. So now I'm playing with 48/54/60.

 

If you're going to stick with those irons for a while - and if your next set can have a PW at 46 anyway - I'd go ahead and do the work now to get into a 50/54/58 setup.

[Myherobobhope]

Seems like you have plenty of distance, so maybe clear something out of the top of your bag and add another wedge?

 

you could go 50 degree mizuno gap wedge, more forgiving and long, should fill the gap between your pitching wedge and you 52.

 

i have similar carry distances and could easily drop my five iron, 4 utility, hybrid or 3 wood without significant problems... not all four at once, but they tend to overlap in utility more than distance. I’m not worried about having big gaps at 220 yards.

[Jeff58]

At least to start, just changeout your 52 for a 50, and practice hitting 3/4 shots with it. As you correctly state, hitting partial shots is generally more effective with a blade-type club, in this case with a heavier swing weight.

To me, this type of shot is something that I naturally do as part of warm-up, and find them at least as easy as a full shot with a gap wedge.

[larryd3]

as a cheap alternative or test, maybe have the 52 bent to 50 and see how it works?  it'll change the bounce by 2* but might not be a bother to you.   I'm playing 48, 54(bent to 53) and a 58.  

[driveandputtmachine]

More than likely with the newer irons all of the lofts are strong.  You very well might have a club at the top end now that goes farther than your old equivalent iron.  Think of it as the set you just ordered goes from X iron to 9 or 9.5 iron.  You don't have a PW.  So you either adjust your bottom end with what you have, or you could take one from the top end and add another at the bottom. 

 

140 to 115 is a larger than standard gap most people like, and if that is the only place you have that large of a gap, how often will you practice a swing that will make the 140 club go reliably 125?  If not very often, then you have your answer, you need to fix your gappings.  If you plan on practicing that swing and will use it for other clubs in your bag(which will make you practice more to groove the swing feeling) then a 140 to 115 isn't overly large.

 

Each person is different.  I have a buddy that has a 54 and then a 62 wedge.  Not sure how far of a distance gap it is(I think it is right around a 40 yard gap), but he is one of the best wedge players I have ever seen inside of 120 or so yards.  He also has a 5 wood, 3 hybrid and a 4 hybrid and is thinking of adding a 5 hybrid.

Edited September 14, 2020 by driveandputtmachine

[Popeye64]

12 hours ago, titleist26 said:

wedges tend not to go as far as iron equivalents so I personally go 49 in my gap wedge. If you did that and bent your 52 and 56 1 degree weak then I think it will suit your needs nicely. 

This right here.. if you can adjust your lofts easily is an easy solution. 

[mootrail]

14 hours ago, RoyalMustang said:

In an ideal world, I would just re-buy my wedges at 50/54/58, but that is a bit more work and I am hoping to work around the problem by adding to what I have instead of selling everything and starting anew.  

 

You've got it figured out; just get all new wedges.   It will be stuck in the back of your mind every time you pull a wedge if you don't.  If you only want to spend for one, get a 58 and dump the 56 & 60.

 

The other option is to bend your wedges 2° weaker in loft.  I absolutely do not believe in bending irons except for the lie, but wedges are a different story.  Make sure you consider how the 2° lower bounce will interact with the grind, your swing and the ground.  I bent a couple of my PM Grinds and the results were exactly as I expected.  I have to admit though that every time I pull one out, I have to rethink the loft; "no it's not 56°, it's a 53°...".

 

The thing about bending is, it's super cheap and it's easy to undo.

 

[RoyalMustang]

Ah, thanks everyone!  I like these ideas: I will start with bending a wedge and see how it works out.  Today,as a test, I went to the chipping practice area (up to 40 yards from the pin) and practiced open stanced flat faced lob shots with the 56.  I could make each and every shot with that 56: bent to 57 might be the ticket to get an extra bit of loft. Even that 56 with a 1/2 swing and tons of wrist action can be made to go no more than 20 yards and just die at the landing spot.  

 

If I bent 56 to 57 to get that full-swing 100-105 effect, had a 52 to go 53 for a 110-150, and picked up a 49/50, I am right there with the gaps and probably don't need the 60.  The 60 is great if I want a soft, no-wrist-action chip, but I am dialing in my chipping and working on having soft hands, so it may be unnecessary.  Even when practicing around the green, I reach for my 56, not my 60.    

[Chip Duffer]

It seems to me That you could just bend the 46* PW to 47* and the 52* to 51*, you’ll have the option of leaving the 56* as is or bend it 1* strong. Your gaps will be very close then. (5* if you leave the 56* as is)

Edited October 3, 2020 by Twin2L

[jomatty]

Personally if I bought a 50 I’d dump the 52 rather than the 60.  There are shots that are much easier with a 60 than a 56 but other than a few yards on a full shot you can do everything with a 50 that you can with a 52 so both seem redundant.  Even if you don’t want the 60 I’d think an extra hybrid, fairway wood or driving iron would be better than wedges seperated by 2 degrees.

 

or bend them all to 51, 55 and 59.  Personally it would be a hard sell to buy something if I had new wedges that I basically liked.

Edited October 3, 2020 by jomatty

[setter02]

Perfect for the 50/54/58 set up.  For trial, could bend 52 to 50 and roll 50/56/60.

[Titleist_PT23]

I would bend the 52 and 56 to 50 and 54-55 and keep the 60.  I could also play with 50 and 57 (bend 52 2 strong and bend 56 one weak) if you don't want anything more than 57.

[North Butte]

On 9/13/2020 at 11:34 PM, RoyalMustang said:

I am trying to dial in my bag so that it is one less thing to worry about.  I have finally settled on a set of clubs: MP20 MMC w/DG 120 X100.  I really like them; they are tight, controlled, and mishits are manageable. I bought them at the suggestion of my instructor after a fitting.  I am back playing after 25 years away: I just turned 40 and hope to be back consistently in the 70's again when I work off all of the rust.  

 

What I am struggling with is the distance of my set irons: the PW stops at 46 degrees.  Basically, my well-struck MMC carry distances are as follows: 8-iron 170-175, 9-iron 150-155, PW 135-140.   I have a set of wedges I picked up here: Callaway Jaws MD5 52/56/60.  My 52 is a solid 115, 56 is 105, 60 I don't take many full swings with. I would rather hit the 56 75-yards with an easy swing: the 60 is easy to get under and hit a short, fat shot.  Around the green, I will grab the 56 if I have any doubt about what club to hit; this probably comes from playing as a junior when the least lofted club in my bag was a PW at 50.5 (eventually I picked up a 57 degree SW: I never needed anything bigger and I can certainly open the face up and radially deviate at the wrist to create a lob with a 56).  

Is it worth throwing in a 50 degree to hit that 120-125 number and dropping the 60?  Or am I overthinking things? Being a set wedge, the PW tends to go pretty far even on a easy swing and I have a bit more trouble dialing it down compared to a forged wedge. My biggest loft gap is currently 9.5-16.5 for driver but second is 46-52 PW-GW.  

 

In an ideal world, I would just re-buy my wedges at 50/54/58, but that is a bit more work and I am hoping to work around the problem by adding to what I have instead of selling everything and starting anew.  

 

If you really aren't comfortable hitting the PW less than 135 yards then I don't believe you're overthinking it. The range from 115 to 135 yards is one you're bound to face pretty often. 

 

If you liked the 60 I'd say tweak your PW a degree or so weak and/or have the 52 bent strong to 51 or so. One way or another squeezing down that 115-135 gap is probably worth pursuing. 

 

I have played (briefly) a set with a 46deg PW (718 AP2) and a 52deg GW (CBX2). My gap wasn't as wide as your, from 110 for the PW to 90 for the GW. It wasn't a big problem because I found my AP2 PW was pretty reliable for me opening the face slightly (couple degrees) and playing the ball back a little in my stance. That created a 100-yard PW shot with a straight flight and plenty of spin. If you could find a way to take 12-15 yards off your PW without having to get too creative, that would pretty much solve the problem.

[Sub_Roc]

I agree with some of above mentioning adjusting 2 of your MD5 lofts. 

52>>50, 56>>55, keep 60 as is.

Edited October 3, 2020 by simonizer

[pinestreetgolf]

On 9/13/2020 at 10:34 PM, RoyalMustang said:

I am trying to dial in my bag so that it is one less thing to worry about.  I have finally settled on a set of clubs: MP20 MMC w/DG 120 X100.  I really like them; they are tight, controlled, and mishits are manageable. I bought them at the suggestion of my instructor after a fitting.  I am back playing after 25 years away: I just turned 40 and hope to be back consistently in the 70's again when I work off all of the rust.  

 

What I am struggling with is the distance of my set irons: the PW stops at 46 degrees.  Basically, my well-struck MMC carry distances are as follows: 8-iron 170-175, 9-iron 150-155, PW 135-140.   I have a set of wedges I picked up here: Callaway Jaws MD5 52/56/60.  My 52 is a solid 115, 56 is 105, 60 I don't take many full swings with. I would rather hit the 56 75-yards with an easy swing: the 60 is easy to get under and hit a short, fat shot.  Around the green, I will grab the 56 if I have any doubt about what club to hit; this probably comes from playing as a junior when the least lofted club in my bag was a PW at 50.5 (eventually I picked up a 57 degree SW: I never needed anything bigger and I can certainly open the face up and radially deviate at the wrist to create a lob with a 56).  

Is it worth throwing in a 50 degree to hit that 120-125 number and dropping the 60?  Or am I overthinking things? Being a set wedge, the PW tends to go pretty far even on a easy swing and I have a bit more trouble dialing it down compared to a forged wedge. My biggest loft gap is currently 9.5-16.5 for driver but second is 46-52 PW-GW.  

 

In an ideal world, I would just re-buy my wedges at 50/54/58, but that is a bit more work and I am hoping to work around the problem by adding to what I have instead of selling everything and starting anew.  

 

 

1. A lot of people blame a 60* with nonsense like "going under it" but more loft always helps, it never hurts.  What is usually going on is that the closer you are the better you think you should be so you feel the need to rationalize what you feel are catastrophic misses.  Further, a 60* will go way shorter on a fat shot than a pitching wedge because the edge digs into the turf (where a full iron sole slides) but it has nothing to do with the loft.  If you bought a K grind 60* you'd eliminate this.  Its not the loft, its the sole.

 

2. You most likely don't need higher than a 56.  I don't play anything higher.  I play 50-56 and I'm very happy with it.

 

3. The most interesting thing about this post (and the replies) is that it only talks about loft which is basically guaranteed to not fix the problem.  Good wedge play is about three things, one of which has nothing to do with the club:

 

1. good alignment (not club related, although visually might matter)

2. control of speed at impact

3. control of the low point of the swing

 

That's it.  The big problem you're having is not having a "system" to control speed at impact, which bleeds into low point.  Most player when they "step on" a wedge block it and when they try to hold it off pull/hook it.  This is because they are making the same swing and trying to either speed up really quick before the ball (blocking it right) or slow down really quick before the ball (the face shuts down as you stop rotating, and it goes left, or it fats).

 

So job one is being able to articulate to us how you are going to regulate speed in  your distance wedge game.  Are you a Siedeckman/Pelz guy that uses the clock system?  Are you a Rabito disciple who concentrates solely on the speed of the hip pivot but always has the same backswing length?  Are you a "feel" guy who tries to not dial it in but just use feel to hit it certain yardages i.e. Zack Johnson?  

 

You should read your post about around-the-green shots versus distance shots.  Around the green you create loft by ulnar deviation - that is one of three ways to do it, but you know how you do it, so you know you should be in either a X or C grind.  Anyone who is trying to help you (and not just shouting loft combinations at you) needs to know how you approach distances wedges and, most importantly, how you regulate speed.  If you can most up more about that we could probably have some very concrete suggestions not just about loft (which is about 20% of feeling comfy with a wedge) but also about shaft, swing-weight, grind and bounce.  Its not an iron.  An iron really really wants you to be good at controlling face and path.  A wedge really really wants you to be good at controlling speed.  How do you control speed?