Gankas Attempt and I'm a Bit Steep

[Arnsybill]

Question for the Gankas experts. I've watched a lot of his online stuff (dumb I know, but unlikely I'll get to see him in person). 

 

I was attempting to employ his set up and downswing move... trying to eliminate the early extension and the arm flip, throw. 

 

I hit a number of shots fat. 

 

Did anyone trying his methods find that? What am I doing wrong... Likely still pulling the arms down and not shallowing enough?

 

From what I can see and hear online... His stuff looks really good.

 

Cheers, 

[naj959]

Not an expert but was a member of his first sight. It's really impossible to tell without a video but I'd venture a guess that you're not pivoting correctly. Most likely moving off the ball too much and then not getting back to where you were at address. All the pieces have to fit/matchup (backswing, setup, transition) for the downswing move to put the club in the right delivery position. If you have the pivot right but the club is not in an acceptable position you can still come down steep. Post a vid so those more knowledgeable then me can help. Try the shadow drill where you pivot and keep your shadow within two ball on the outsides of your hips. If you can stay relatively centered the number of fat shots will be dramatically reduced.

[chigolfer1]

What is a Gankes attempt exactly, in your mind?   

[golfarb1]

The centerpiece of his transition, external hip rotation of BOTH hips resulting in an obvious increase in distance between the knees(San Snead squat) is a move that our friends at Athletic Motion Golf not only do NOT teach , but consider a 

swing error( reference their must recent video “ 3 popular drills that can harm your swing”- 3rd drill)

So throw the dice and pick your swing methodology

[ferrispgm]

GG's swing model is good but it's not for everyone and can be difficult for some....he has a lot of good info on things that need to match up but just trying his swing model without actually working with him or his staff in person could prove very difficult.  I would suggest you work with someone like Monte or Dan and do online lessons if travel is difficult.

[glk]

see conversation on dual external between Tyler and a Chris in this video.    In short Tyler hasn’t seen it in 3D and has questions on what would rotate the pelvis if one where to actually get both hip/ femurs in external  Not just amg.   

 

https://golfsmartacademy.com/golf-instruction/trail-leg-push-vs-upper-body-fall/
 

Edited September 15, 2020 by glk

[RichieHunt]

Nobody is going to be able to tell with any certainty here unless they look at your swing on video.

 

For me, I can get a little fat and still be shallow if I move off the ball too much in the backswing.  You can move off the ball in the backswing using GG's pivot, but you have to re-center yourself either by more upper spine extension and/or drifting towards the target right around p4 and then turning.  But I can't do either of those things and when I move off the ball with no left lateral bend at p4 I'll hit it fat.

 

If you're actually steep in the downswing, could be a lot of things.  Posture could be throwing you off balance, not getting the hands deep enough at p4, not keeping the arms up in transition long enough, poor dowinswing pivot, out of sequence, etc.

 

 

 

RH

[RobertBaron]

3 hours ago, Arnsybill said:

Question for the Gankas experts. I've watched a lot of his online stuff (dumb I know, but unlikely I'll get to see him in person). 

 

I was attempting to employ his set up and downswing move... trying to eliminate the early extension and the arm flip, throw. 

 

I hit a number of shots fat. 

 

I don’t remember which video it was but GG says hitting it fat in the beginning is common because when you early extend you also early release the club which is what most are used to doing so when you swing the GG way you still release your old way which causes the club to hit behind the ball. I’m paraphrasing and probably messing up some of the details but basically you have to adapt the release to new swing. 

[chigolfer1]

20 minutes ago, RobertBaron said:

I don’t remember which video it was but GG says hitting it fat in the beginning is common because when you early extend you also early release the club which is what most are used to doing so when you swing the GG way you still release your old way which causes the club to hit behind the ball. I’m paraphrasing and probably messing up some of the details but basically you have to adapt the release to new swing. 

 

Not sure if that has anything to do with swinging the GG way, so to speak, vs. just having a more shallow swing, however that's achieved.

[RobertBaron]

43 minutes ago, chigolfer1 said:

 

Not sure if that has anything to do with swinging the GG way, so to speak, vs. just having a more shallow swing, however that's achieved.

Yea probably. Either way GG expects fat shots to happen initially when the swing gets shallower. I’m assuming it’s worse the more steep/early extended someone is before they shallow more. 

[golfarb1]

GLK

Tyler does not seem to understand the difference between hip movements and pelvis movements.

Hip movements refer to the movement of the head of the femur (thigh bone) within the hip joint  . Because there are hip joints  on either side of the pelvis  and two thigh bones,movements of the right hip can and sometimes do move differently from the left hip. As the head of the femur moves within the hip joint,  the other end of the femur ( which forms the knee joint) will cause the knee to move. So the knee is the marker of any movements of the hip. If a golfer sets up with both feet flared out , the knees will automatically be rotated outwards ,reflecting  small external rotation of the hips .Mr Snead set up with both feet flared out;thus he started the swing with both hips slightly externally rotated.

 

The definition of rotation is movement around a central point . Because the pelvis is basically fused to the lower spine and the two  associated sacroiliac (SI)joints are supported by some of the strongest ligaments in the body, the pelvis is capable of very little movement at the SI joints; for all intent and purposes the pelvis can not move independently on its own.So anyone referring to “rotation “of the pelvis is incorrect anatomically . 

Now obviously the pelvis does move angularly. It does so via positional movement at the hip socket .This translates to the left hip socket moving away from the target line. Because the pelvis is a symmetrically shaped bone, the right hip socket must move towards the target line at the same time. 

GG s TRANSITION involves dual rotation  of the hips and little angular movement of the pelvis . Eventually the right hip moves internally and the pelvis moves angularly.

The question is whether this dual external hip rotation in transition is an effective way to swing . AMG obviously does not think so. Who is correct?I have not seen any studies testing this specific idea. 

 

 

[Arnsybill]

Thanks all for your takes and insights... 

 

Cheers,

[naj959]

On 9/15/2020 at 3:52 PM, RobertBaron said:

I don’t remember which video it was but GG says hitting it fat in the beginning is common because when you early extend you also early release the club which is what most are used to doing so when you swing the GG way you still release your old way which causes the club to hit behind the ball. I’m paraphrasing and probably messing up some of the details but basically you have to adapt the release to new swing. 

I may be misinterpreting what you are saying but it sounds like you're referring to keeping the lead hip and shoulder low in transition. From everything I've seen, all of the instructors that preach shallowing agree that "left tilt"? has to be maintained in transition to get the low point in the correct spot.

[ofortuna]

Early extension and throw gets your upper body further from the ball and you get to impact with a vertical shaft.

 

If you reduce early extension and throw, you will hit it fat.  I will guess that Gankas will want you to get more open at impact with the handle over the lead shoe to get to impact with shaft lean.

 

[RobertBaron]

2 hours ago, naj959 said:

I may be misinterpreting what you are saying but it sounds like you're referring to keeping the lead hip and shoulder low in transition. From everything I've seen, all of the instructors that preach shallowing agree that "left tilt"? has to be maintained in transition to get the low point in the correct spot.

Hmm alot of that terminology is above my pay grade but really simply, if you're steep through impact or an early extender your low point of the club at impact will be different than if you shallow more so you have to adjust when and where the release happens. Gankas says you'll generally hit fatties first until you adjust where and when the release happens. Basically in the old swing your wrists unhinge too much too early so you can actually hit the ball. Like imagine if at impact you're standing straight up. Any amount of shaft lean and you'll completely whiff above the ball. Once your shallower, that same release will hit behind the ball because the whole downswing is lower to the ground aka shallower.

 

I'm trying to find this video, but there's just way too many to go through on GG's instagram and instagram sucks for video so there's that.

 

 

Edited September 17, 2020 by RobertBaron

[magsgolfho]

Trying to ask people on a swing forum for help is a lost cause. If you want to employ his method join his site. It’s got lots of fundamental stuff and swing reviews you can post your swing and get help from his instructors. I would say it’s worth the money. Trying to mix and match his stuff with others it’s square peg round hole. There are so many good guys out there fir online lessons just take the plunge