Best career with the worst putting?

[Sonoronsis]

Hey Hey... Had my first round of golf in a long time (yay shoulder injuries) and it was an interesting experience. Struck the ball way better than I expected and putted waaaayyyyy worse. One of those, "I may as well use the back of this thing" type rounds. Anyway, it got me thinking about pro golfers and their careers especially come majors time. 

 

Who would you say has had the best career being a "sub-standard" putter. Immediately Vijay comes to mind, great ball striker, obsessive grinder on the course and range but always heard his putting held him back.

 

Any others? 

[msd71]

Hogan? 

[manku]

Adam Scott...not sure if there is anyone close in the past two decades. 

[Dr. Block]

Any player whose had a career worth mentioning is a good putter - I would venture to say there is no such thing as a "sub-standard putter" in the show.  You don't get to their level unless you can roll your rock.

 

 

[King_Slender]

Phil Mickelson - nobody has missed more 4 footers.

[Dave230]

My picks would be Rory McIlroy, Lee Westwood, Adam Scott and Sergio Garcia. All would have won more tournament if their putting was as good as their ball-striking.

 

Rory McIlroy gets hot the odd time and usually ends up winning tournaments then by 5 or 6 shots. But week to week he's generally poor and worse than his contemporary rivals and nearly all other great players. When he's off with his putting he's really off.

 

Westwood it's not just putting, it's chipping as well but tee to green an exceptional ball-striker and if he putted better he'd have 3 or 4 majors no doubt.

 

Garcia and Scott also absolute stripers but poor putters. Scott actually started off a decent putter when he was younger but lost it somewhere along the way.

 

Since Rory has had the best career of them, I'd pick him.

Edited September 17, 2020 by Dave230

[Christosterone]

Sam Snead and it’s not even close...

80+ wins and couldnt make em inside the leather

 

-Chris

[Sonoronsis]

19 minutes ago, Dr. Block said:

Any player whose had a career worth mentioning is a good putter - I would venture to say there is no such thing as a "sub-standard putter" in the show.  You don't get to their level unless you can roll your rock.

 

 

Agreed that all these guys on tv are premier players and definitely not disparaging anyone getting paid to play golf. I was just thinking about in comparison to their peers, guys that even other players think could/should have won more if their putting matched their ball striking

[ChrisL52188]

Fred Couples would be a good example.  Fred had the ability to win 30-40 tournaments. 

Edited September 17, 2020 by ChrisL52188

[Sonoronsis]

10 minutes ago, Christosterone said:

Sam Snead and it’s not even close...

80+ wins and couldnt make em inside the leather

 

-Chris

Was this a career long issue or just towards the end? I know about the move to sidesaddle later on but was the thinking he could have won even more than 80+ times with a better stroke?

[Christosterone]

16 minutes ago, Sonoronsis said:

Was this a career long issue or just towards the end? I know about the move to sidesaddle later on but was the thinking he could have won even more than 80+ times with a better stroke?

imho he had the greatest potential career in history...he threw darts and never made anything

its astonishing he won so much....speaks to how close he hit his drivers and irons....

He once missed a 30” putt to lose the US Open...

 

-Chris

[J Bez]

Bernhard Langer??

[Pent08]

I believe Rory's average SG putting rank is outside the top 100. No other player on Tour has a bigger discrepancy in talent between ball striking and putting.

[MaineMariner]

Dustin Johnson. He won 4 times in 2017, was the number 1 ranked golfer in the world, and was still somehow ranked 96th on the tour in SG putting! Looks like he worst year was 2011, where he was 174th in SG putting.

Edited September 17, 2020 by MaineMariner

[Rory4Pres]

Rory.  next question? 

[Shilgy]

50 minutes ago, Rory4Pres said:

Rory.  next question? 

Would you rather be a good ball striker or good putter?  Look at the numbers...Rory gained over 2.00 strokes per round tee to green in 2019. The same year he was 24th in SG putting. Most years he has been beyond 100th putting as you noted.  The putting list though is way more volatile year to year with who gained as the margins for putting stats are closer top to bottom.  For instance in 2019 he gained “just” .425 in putting versus #100 on the list .  Tee to green he averages about 1.3 SG per round over the field.  That part of the game is less fickle to annual aberrations.

 

 

 

[gentles]

Responses to this thread are quite illuminating - goes to show how important ball striking is to being a consistently great player. 

 

With a few exceptions being a premier ball striker is what gets you in the conversation 

 

Flip the question on its head - if you try to name players have the best careers with the worst ball striking it's hard to think of many truly great players who would fit that category

[Dr. Block]

12 minutes ago, Shilgy said:

Would you rather be a good ball striker or good putter?  Look at the numbers...Rory gained over 2.00 strokes per round tee to green in 2019. The same year he was 24th in SG putting. Most years he has been beyond 100th putting as you noted.  The putting list though is way more volatile year to year with who gained as the margins for putting stats are closer top to bottom.  For instance in 2019 he gained “just” .425 in putting versus #100 on the list .  Tee to green he averages about 1.3 SG per round over the field.  That part of the game is less fickle to annual aberrations.

 

 

 

That proves this discussion is pretty subjective.  Top to bottom of the putting list is separated by half a stroke.  That means the guys who get a hot putter from week to week or for a month long stretch are the ones on TV or the ones having a big season - but they can all putt at a world class level.  It's the biggest reason why they are on the PGA Tour. 

[PJE]

Unfortunately, Rory- although he doesn't seem to let it get him down and he can be streaky good at putting. 

But: Adam Scott, Lee Westwood, and Louis Oosthuizen are all modern era guys who probably would have had more victories if they were better putters.

Of the older guys, Hogan comes to mind as just an average putter. 

[PJE]

14 minutes ago, gentles said:

Responses to this thread are quite illuminating - goes to show how important ball striking is to being a consistently great player. 

 

With a few exceptions being a premier ball striker is what gets you in the conversation 

 

Flip the question on its head - if you try to name players have the best careers with the worst ball striking it's hard to think of many truly great players who would fit that category

I think Seve was one of the top 20 to top 25 players of all time but I think his short game wizardy was renowned partly due to the fact that he hit the ball all over the place?

[Dr. Block]

People keep mentioning Rory.  I think you'll find his proximity stats for approach shots, and especially short irons and wedges would be more to blame then his putting. 

[xxio]

TW

 

Tom Weiskopf

[J Bez]

28 minutes ago, gentles said:

Responses to this thread are quite illuminating - goes to show how important ball striking is to being a consistently great player. 

 

With a few exceptions being a premier ball striker is what gets you in the conversation 

 

Flip the question on its head - if you try to name players have the best careers with the worst ball striking it's hard to think of many truly great players who would fit that category

Brad Faxon, Loren Roberts Aaron Baddely

[Rory4Pres]

The question was best career with worst putting....I think that's why we keep saying Rory.  He's done incredibly well so far.  I'd probably mark him down for another 2 majors by now if he weren't using inferior Taylormade putting technology. tehehe.  

[Dr. Block]

You could mark Rory down for another major or two if he spent more time working on his wedges.  I don't think you could name a single player of his caliber that has done less from the consistently A+ positions he places his drives in.  

[gentles]

10 minutes ago, J Bez said:

Brad Faxon, Loren Roberts Aaron Baddely

Not quite in the same category as others mentioned in this topic (and not a single major among them) which was sort of the point I was trying to make. Not many 2-3 major guys who have a scratchy ball striking careers, but plenty of examples like Rory, Phil, Vijay etc where putting is perceived as being suspect

[Dr. Block]

3 minutes ago, gentles said:

Not quite in the same category as others mentioned in this topic (and not a single major among them) which was sort of the point I was trying to make. Not many 2-3 major guys who have a scratchy ball striking careers, but plenty of examples like Rory, Phil, Vijay etc where putting is perceived as being suspect

Phil a suspect putter?  A fairly short stretch of inconsistency with 4 footers early in his career aside, the guy is a fantastic putter.  I don't think anybody has a higher gear when their putter gets hot then he does. Up until the last few years, he was always ranked right near the top in the putting statistics.  You can't drive it as wild as he does and shoot the scores he does unless you are a locksmith on the greens.  

 

 

[gentles]

1 minute ago, Dr. Block said:

Phil a suspect putter?  A fairly short stretch of inconsistency with 4 footers early in his career aside, the guy is a fantastic putter.  I don't think anybody has a higher gear when their putter gets hot then he does. Up until the last few years, he was always ranked right near the top in the putting statistics.  You can't drive it as wild as he does and shoot the scores he does unless you are a locksmith on the greens.  

 

 

I agree he is better than average - was just looking through the names referenced above. He has certainly been let down more than a few times in majors, particularly at the start of his career by missing short ones. Shinnecock '04 and the '01 PGA come to mind. 

[m d g]

I would say either me or Club Pro Guy...but I didn't have a golf career so it must be CPG.

 

But seriously, Snead is a good pick...

[3whacker]

1 hour ago, J Bez said:

Brad Faxon, Loren Roberts Aaron Baddely

you left out Ben Crenshaw, because IMO he was the worse ball striker but the best putter to ever win Two Green Jackets