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Reed caught improving lie again


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46 minutes ago, Shilgy said:

I was referring to these two incidents. The grounding the club one was allowed by the rules. The bunker one was a post not knowing the rule. 

 

 

But Kostis was talking about him constantly putting down his wood behind the ball, to the point you go from not seeing the ball at all to seeing it clearly.  Goes far beyond "lightly setting it down behind the ball."

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It doesn't appear to me that he's pressing the club down, from the close-up view it looks pretty gentle.  And its not like he was setting a 3-wood down to pave a runway, he was using the club he event

Good grief people.  We’ve covered this 300 times.  No rule against grounding your club in the rough.  Every player who’s ever played has done this.  You can step on the grass behind the ball if you wa

If the ball didn't move then what he did wasn't cheating.  You're allowed to set your club in the grass behind the ball.  This wasn't so egregious that he improved his lie.  He set the club down a cou

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3 minutes ago, Bluefan75 said:

 

But Kostis was talking about him constantly putting down his wood behind the ball, to the point you go from not seeing the ball at all to seeing it clearly.  Goes far beyond "lightly setting it down behind the ball."

The video I saw was a wedge. If he pushed down a wood repeatedly and then played wedge it is a different issue.

 

edited to add...this thread is about a green side ship from the fringe with heavier grass behind the ball. Anyone but Reed this would not be an issue at all. See the first post for video.

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15 minutes ago, Shilgy said:

The video I saw was a wedge. If he pushed down a wood repeatedly and then played wedge it is a different issue.

 

edited to add...this thread is about a green side ship from the fringe with heavier grass behind the ball. Anyone but Reed this would not be an issue at all. See the first post for video.

 

Yeah, kind of like Lexi Thompson though.  Once you have a reputation, everything is watched like a hawk.

 

(The Thompson reference is to the ANA incident a few years ago.  More than one person was quoted as saying it was watched because it has happened before.)  Probably not right, and as you say, Anyone but Reed and no one checks.

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1 minute ago, Bluefan75 said:

 

Yeah, kind of like Lexi Thompson though.  Once you have a reputation, everything is watched like a hawk.

 

(The Thompson reference is to the ANA incident a few years ago.  More than one person was quoted as saying it was watched because it has happened before.)  Probably not right, and as you say, Anyone but Reed and no one checks.

The one you refer to with Lexi was way more blatant than this one. I do agree completely with you on the reputation part.

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1 hour ago, Bluefan75 said:

 

But Kostis was talking about him constantly putting down his wood behind the ball, to the point you go from not seeing the ball at all to seeing it clearly.  Goes far beyond "lightly setting it down behind the ball."

 

No, he said repeatedly putting an iron behind the ball then commenting on Reed hitting a wood that the original lie wouldn't allow for.

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On 9/22/2020 at 1:39 PM, jt2gt said:

Ever since the original Reed incident, this is something I have noticed a bunch doing -- grounding the club behind the ball to pretend they are trying to figure out which club to use, when in fact they are just improving the lie by pushing the grass behind the ball down.  I've seen it on LPGA telecast, PGA and Korn Ferry.  Thinking to my own play, I never do this until I set up to actually hit the shot.  But the pros have found an end around and constantly push down the grass behind the ball pretending to be thinking about their setup.

Anyone who hasn’t seen pro golfers do this in the last 25yrs hasn’t been watching very closely. I won’t say they all do it but virtually all do to the point it’s SOP

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1 hour ago, Bad9 said:

Anyone who hasn’t seen pro golfers do this in the last 25yrs hasn’t been watching very closely. I won’t say they all do it but virtually all do to the point it’s SOP

Rough is nasty at my home course and I am doing this more and more just to see what happens.  News flash -- it works!!!

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My guess is PR cares about as much about public opinion as Bill Belichick.

 

If anything, it feeds him.  

 

I wouldn't want to face the Astros right now either.  

 

PS.  Has any pro golfer in the USA ever been banned or suspended for cheating?   Or is a tournament DQ as harsh as it gets.  A proverbial red card.  

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On 10/3/2020 at 9:55 AM, manku said:

My guess is PR cares about as much about public opinion as Bill Belichick.

 

If anything, it feeds him.  

 

I wouldn't want to face the Astros right now either.  

 

PS.  Has any pro golfer in the USA ever been banned or suspended for cheating?   Or is a tournament DQ as harsh as it gets.  A proverbial red card.  

Jane Blalock. 

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2 hours ago, Hawkeye77 said:

Toski “voluntarily” quit the Senior Tour. 
 

Both of them were doing the Lexi Thompson version of mismarking their ball. 

 

 

It's so baffling that someone would "cheat" like this when there is no real advantage gained, right?  I mean, if I have a 10+ foot putt, how is marking it an inch or two on any side (even towards the hole) going to help my score?   I guess maybe these people just feel a need to game the system?

 

As a side note, I'd like to see the rules changed so that balls can't be lifted unless you in the opponents line of play or there is a clear piece of dirt on the ball...yeah, I know sometimes the dirt is on the bottom and hidden, but that really uncommon in my experience...the rub of the green, as one might say.  It would speed up play, and avoid all this ball marking garbage.

 

 

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13 minutes ago, manku said:

As a side note, I'd like to see the rules changed so that balls can't be lifted unless you in the opponents line of play or there is a clear piece of dirt on the ball...yeah, I know sometimes the dirt is on the bottom and hidden, but that really uncommon in my experience...the rub of the green, as one might say.  It would speed up play, and avoid all this ball marking garbage.

Its hard to turn back "progress".  Lifting of the ball on the putting green, without specific cause, was first allowed in 1960.  That's the same time that cleaning of a (lifted) ball on the green was first allowed.  Also in 1960, repair of ball marks was first permitted.  My guess is that all these became "appropriate" due to the popularity of irrigation systems, which produced softer conditions, improved turf quality, and heightened expectations of a really true roll.  We're never going to see these rules reversed.

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53 minutes ago, manku said:

 

 

It's so baffling that someone would "cheat" like this when there is no real advantage gained, right?  I mean, if I have a 10+ foot putt, how is marking it an inch or two on any side (even towards the hole) going to help my score?   I guess maybe these people just feel a need to game the system?

 

As a side note, I'd like to see the rules changed so that balls can't be lifted unless you in the opponents line of play or there is a clear piece of dirt on the ball...yeah, I know sometimes the dirt is on the bottom and hidden, but that really uncommon in my experience...the rub of the green, as one might say.  It would speed up play, and avoid all this ball marking garbage.

 

 


I don’t have any info that it’s really a huge problem. Jack’s oft told story about telling the guy who was having an issue that he’d be seeing Jack’s white shoes every time the guy bent over to mark his ball the rest of the round has always been a favorite.  I like to think overall there is a high level of integrity in pro golf and these very few published exceptions over decades seems to bear that out. 

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28 minutes ago, Kilo1545 said:

Serious question since I'm not in the loop on the Lexi Thompson thing other than seeing the video that was posted.  Was she cheating her Word not allowed off or was it an honest mistake?  Has there been a pattern with her like there is with Reed?

I've read lots of people saying it was an honest mistake, others claiming she was intentionally moving the ball to the side to avoid a spike mark or something.  What seems clear to me is that she put the ball back down something like 3/4 inch away from its original location, far enough to be clearly visible to the naked eye if she had  been paying attention.  Her word didn't enter into it, her intentions don't matter when she played from the wrong place.  She had a little rules brush early this year, but it was determined she hadn't broken and rules.  I don't remember other incidents.

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Not trying to stir up old arguments but in reference to Lexi, it was clear she didn't replace her golf ball from where she picked it up.  Problem was, it was called in the next day by a viewer, then she's notified during the round about the consequences (again, not trying to stir up, but the call in and her finding out mid-round on the last day - which was better than not knowing, IMO - got folks fired up the most).  So, she wasn't asked about it because they apparently felt it was a pretty obvious violation.  IMO, it was and she was intentionally avoiding a spike mark or something like it.  She's had some other rules issues that were more social media fodder as many are these days and haven't seemed to suggest any intentional violations.  

 

I'd put her mismarking up there with what Reed appeared to be doing in the bunker.  Not suggesting either are serial rules violators, no idea really, but in each incident, more so with Lexi, it sure looked pretty intentional, not that it mattered in her case, as pointed out above.  I was disappointed she played the victim more than the situation seemed to call for, but she eventually got some help and a dog to deal with all the stress (I just found that odd, given the outcry was more about her being wronged than being outed for than particular incident of apparent cheating).  

 

Similar thing cost Simon Dyson pretty dearly on Euro Tour - put his ball back down and quickly tamped down a spike mark right in front of it, IIRC.

 

Again, isolated incidents, no place to hide these days - but some rules changes have been the result.

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1 minute ago, bscinstnct said:

Show me a pro who never cheated

 

And I’ll show you Joel Vandalay

 

Never heard of him?

 

Thats cause he never cheated! 😂

 

 

Aint no Bobby Jones’s out there, don’t kid yourself ; )

I heard his brother Art was a monster in the annual importer/exporter golf outing

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5 hours ago, Dr. Block said:

I heard his brother Art was a monster in the annual importer/exporter golf outing

 

Oh nooooooo,,,,, you didn't !!! :classic_laugh:

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