Golden Goose Bullseye

[Foozle]

Does anyone know which came first, Reuters Bullseye or Letters Golden Goose?

John Letters Golden Goose is listed as 1946 or 1947 whereas the best I have found for Reuters Bullseye is mid '40's?

I have always regarded them as virtually identical but perhaps the more learned here can point to differences?

I recently acquired the Golden Goose below. It is the only one I have seen with a pyratone shaft, ferrule and Letters Swilken Bridge clerk mark and so assume it to be a very early example. Shaft is very slender! Any thoughts on age welcomed.

[Jiggered]

I've heard it said that the Letters version came first but haven't seen any definitive proof for either.

 

Nice club by the way!

[Foozle]

Thanks Jiggered.

I have been looking for a Golden Goose for a while - there are plenty about but I wanted one I felt confident was an early one and this ticked the boxes.

It still has it's original (very thin) grip too.

Should sit well with my '48 Fred Daly's!

[Jiggered]

Ferrules are only found on the older ones too, later models were shaft over as I'm sure you know.

 

Looks in good condition too, a few light dings here and there to add character. 

And you're lucky someone hasn't polished it up.

[Foozle]

On 10/2/2020 at 8:19 AM, Jiggered said:

Ferrules are only found on the older ones too, later models were shaft over as I'm sure you know.

 

Looks in good condition too, a few light dings here and there to add character. 

And you're lucky someone hasn't polished it up.

Jiggered, yes, lots have been ruined by polishing. I like to see patina and some gentle wear to show history.

[Fairway14]

On 9/30/2020 at 3:04 PM, Foozle said:

 

I have always regarded them as virtually identical but perhaps the more learned here can point to differences?

I

Your Letters photo are of a boxy shape, which is comparable to Reuter's Bullseye model named "Original"

Reuter's best work, I think, was in rounding the top and bottom of the Bullseye, a model which he named "Standard".

In more recent years Scotty Cameron's Bullseye putters have had the rounded (Standard) shape.

[Foozle]

7 hours ago, Fairway14 said:

Your Letters photo are of a boxy shape, which is comparable to Reuter's Bullseye model named "Original"

Reuter's best work, I think, was in rounding the top and bottom of the Bullseye, a model which he named "Standard".

In more recent years Scotty Cameron's Bullseye putters have had the rounded (Standard) shape.

A couple of later Goose's. Is this the rounding you refer to in Reuters Standard shape?

[Fairway14]

3 hours ago, Foozle said:

A couple of later Goose's. Is this the rounding you refer to in Reuters Standard shape?

Yes, rounded edges everywhere I find makes for a more graceful looking Bullseye shape. Below left is a photo of the "Standard Model" Bullseye which Scotty Cameron created for Titleist when he signed on with that company, 25 years ago. The shape/profile is the same as the older Reuter Bullseyes, but Scotty added weight by making the head a bit longer from head to toe. Below right is a comparison photo, the Reuter Bullseye head weighs about 310 grams, the SC Bullseye head weighs 330 grams.

[Foozle]

33 minutes ago, Fairway14 said:

Yes, rounded edges everywhere I find makes for a more graceful looking Bullseye shape. Below left is a photo of the "Standard Model" Bullseye which Scotty Cameron created for Titleist when he signed on with that company, 25 years ago. The shape/profile is the same as the older Reuter Bullseyes, but Scotty added weight by making the head a bit longer from head to toe. Below right is a comparison photo, the Reuter Bullseye head weighs about 310 grams, the SC Bullseye head weighs 330 grams.

Nice!

These Bullseye's have a more refined, engineered look than the Goose's. Possibly a harder less maluable material too? Goose's are soft brass and pick up bag clatter just looking at them! Nice feel in use though. Simple but effective. Classic design.

To go back to my original question, do you have a date for the first Reuter's Bullseye?

[Fairway14]

17 minutes ago, Foozle said:

Nice!

These Bullseye's have a more refined, engineered look than the Goose's. Possibly a harder less maluable material too? Goose's are soft brass and pick up bag clatter just looking at them! Nice feel in use though. Simple but effective. Classic design.

To go back to my original question, do you have a date for the first Reuter's Bullseye?

 

I believe John Reuter Jr. first produced and started selling his brass Bullseye models about 1947. He ran the company for the next 15 years or so until 1962, when he sold his company to Acushnet/Titleist . Throughout the 1960's and 70's the Titleist Bullseye was a dominant putter model, played by amateurs and Touring pros.

[Foozle]

I now find myself with a Gaggle of Golden Gooses! 

When I set out to find a Golden Goose to add to my collection it was more as recognition of it being an iconic or landmark club rather than as a club I would want to play. To be honest I never really rated them.

However, rolling a ball around the living room carpet I found I liked the feel of the soft brass on ball and also the tactile feel of the head in your hands - feels almost warm to touch. Added to that the colour and bag clatter that create the patina I sensed a growing attraction for the Goose.

The early one I acquired first has a very narrow shaft and grip, too thin for my chubby digits and I am not about to rip off the original leather grip! So I began looking for a gamer.

They are abundant here in the UK. The second one I picked up is very light and very upright. The third heavier and flatter - getting there! I now think I have cracked it with the fourth which has similar weight and lie to No3 and a goose neck which means you can sight and position the ball down the shaft.

Two, three and four all feature shaft over hosel design, fluted shafts and original leather grips. 🙂

 

[Six Pints]

Awesome that you have a bag and ball to go with them. Good stuff, thanks for sharing. 

[No_Catchy_Nickname]

Yes, that John Letters bag is wonderful😍

[Jiggered]

Nice collection!

[Stephen8802]

Mr. Foozle...I remembered this thread when I saw this stray Goose at a thrift store today. You seemed excited, and that was good enough for me, so I gave it a new home. It has a nice fat leather grip, good balance, and puts a good roll on the ball. So, what did I buy?

 

 

[Foozle]

8 hours ago, Stephen8802 said:

Mr. Foozle...I remembered this thread when I saw this stray Goose at a thrift store today. You seemed excited, and that was good enough for me, so I gave it a new home. It has a nice fat leather grip, good balance, and puts a good roll on the ball. So, what did I buy?

 

 

Stephen, I am not claiming any expert status on Golden Gooses and would need more pictures. However the script on the sole is the same as on what I referred to as No3 and No4 above which i would date to circa 1960. The very early ones had the Bridge cleek mark you can see on my pyratone shafted one, I have also seen it on steel shafted versions up to, I am guessing, mid / late '50's. My No2 from above is a MkII which, I am again guessing, would be mid '60's. I think they may have moved onto rubber grips in the early '70's - again guessing.

There are many variations in hosel length, sole width and face length. If I am right and yours is the same or very similar to my No3, it has good "heft" being one of the weightier versions. The face on mine is 104mm at its widest, the sole approx 18mm and the hosel around 20mm. The fluted shaft has red paint fill (which I have also seen on others) a black True Temper Stepdown shaft label and pistol style red leather grip. John Letters Scotland is embossed about the fourth wrap down.

The MkII head by comparison is 95 x 14 but with a 45mm hosel.

As well as the variations in dimensions they also came in flanged, crook ( with a loop from the heel back to the hosel) and the goose neck version.

Given the variations, it took me a bit of trial and error to get one that is right for me. I hope it is first time lucky for you and you enjoy it.

 

[elwhippy]

Hugely popular in the UK. Outsold Acushnet by a mile. 

[Stephen8802]

Here are a few more pictures. It is heavier than I expected, which I like...the light bullseyes don't work for me but my flanged bullseye does. The grip is a really nice shape and the patina/chatter is just right.

 

[Foozle]

34 minutes ago, Stephen8802 said:

Here are a few more pictures. It is heavier than I expected, which I like...the light bullseyes don't work for me but my flanged bullseye does. The grip is a really nice shape and the patina/chatter is just right.

 

I would say this is the same model as my No3 described above. Hosel length is quite short compared to others, presumably as the head itself is quite heavy. The fourth wrap down lacks perforation and is where the John Letters name is embossed on my one, presumably worn away on yours.

The patina and clatter looks good too. I prefer them to show their age and history like that and am not a fan of polishing them.

As you said in your first post, they roll the ball well and have nice feel. All round a nice putter, I hope you enjoy it. 

[Swingingk]

1 hour ago, Stephen8802 said:

Here are a few more pictures. It is heavier than I expected, which I like...the light bullseyes don't work for me but my flanged bullseye does. The grip is a really nice shape and the patina/chatter is just right.

 

Thats just a really nice looking putter.  Love the short hosel.  I really like the idea that these are heavier than a Bullseye too, which are generally too light for me.  I've never seen anything John Letters in my neck o' the woods though so it looks like I'm going to have to go online to find one... 

[LeftyMac]

I picked up a set of 1969 Spalding Bird on Balls Saturday and they came with a Golden Goose which is probably worth the $50 I paid for the lot.

[Foozle]

6 hours ago, LeftyMac said:

I picked up a set of 1969 Spalding Bird on Balls Saturday and they came with a Golden Goose which is probably worth the $50 I paid for the lot.

Nice pick up LeftyMac. 

Interestingly it shows another of the many variations in that the heel is more angular than, for example, Stephen's putter. 

[Jiggered]

Just made a couple of ebay purchases, a Golden Goose, which I thought I'd show here, and a Slazenger Lucky 13 which I'll show in the UK Clubs thread.

 

I was attracted to the Goose by the graceful shape of the head.

 

Not sure of the date but it has a distinctive shaft band which I'm sure could be narrowed down with some research, the band gives the length, loft and lie, in this example it's 35", standard loft and standard lie, whatever standard is!  

It also has a ferrule which is unusual but I don't think it's a very early model.

 

The grip is a replacement. 🙁

 

In the group pictures below the new acquisition is the one on the right.

 

 

 

[Foozle]

2 hours ago, Jiggered said:

Just made a couple of ebay purchases, a Golden Goose, which I thought I'd show here, and a Slazenger Lucky 13 which I'll show in the UK Clubs thread.

 

I was attracted to the Goose by the graceful shape of the head.

 

Not sure of the date but it has a distinctive shaft band which I'm sure could be narrowed down with some research, the band gives the length, loft and lie, in this example it's 35", standard loft and standard lie, whatever standard is!  

It also has a ferrule which is unusual but I don't think it's a very early model.

 

The grip is a replacement. 🙁

 

In the group pictures below the new acquisition is the one on the right.

 

 

 

Snap! I have just added a 5th Goose to my gaggle - this time a flange model.

It has the same shaft band as yours (also 35"), same fluted shaft and same ferrule. Grip is a leather wrap "Fairway" grip - i am assuming original but not certain.

Like you, not sure on age but was guessing a bit newer than the others - 70's/'80s?

I am finding these quite addictive but the flock must be complete now.......🤪

 

[Jiggered]

33 minutes ago, Foozle said:

Snap! I have just added a 5th Goose to my gaggle - this time a flange model.

It has the same shaft band as yours (also 35"), same fluted shaft and same ferrule. Grip is a leather wrap "Fairway" grip - i am assuming original but not certain.

Like you, not sure on age but was guessing a bit newer than the others - 70's/'80s?

I am finding these quite addictive but the flock must be complete now.......🤪

 

 

Great!

Looks identical to mine apart from the flange.

I wondered whether the sight-line was an owner addition but yours has the same so must be original.

I think you're right on the date but maybe 60s/70s?

 

Nice that you've got the original grip on yours.

[russad]

I have one Golden Goose, I assume the L on the base means it is a ladies model. Couldn't resist adding the Silver Goose to the pics.

 

 

[Foozle]

2 hours ago, russad said:

I have one Golden Goose, I assume the L on the base means it is a ladies model. Couldn't resist adding the Silver Goose to the pics.

 

 

Never seen the "L" stamp before. There is a "Golden Gander" which i had assumed may be the ladies version? What length is the Golden Goose as that might confirm if it refers to ladies or not? Standard seems to be 34.5" or 35" but they do come both longer and shorter.

If it does indicate ladies I will need to look out for that and avoid as my gaggle of geese is getting a bit out of control and I don't want to risk mixing the sexes and encouraging breeding within the flock! 😁

[russad]

@Foozle it's definitely shorter than the Silver Goose, I'll try and get them measured and back to you this weekend.

[russad]

@Foozle, got the ruler out today. Have the Silver Goose at 35.5 and the Golden at 35 inches from the bottom of the blade to the top of the shaft, so perhaps the 'L' is for a lighter model. I have posted another Letters model putter on the UK Clubs thread.

 

 

 

 

[Foozle]

Crikey! They are mutating! A Goosander has just landed in the gaggle of geese!

Interesting thing about this is that there are traces of paintfill. It looks like "Goosander" was in red and "John Letters" in blue. I had assumed they were just stamped and not filled; there is no trace in the rest of the flock. 

Goosenecked. Original leather grip was taped over but sound underneath albeit the top coat came off with the tape.

Pro Fit shaft with Ferrule so late '50's?