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1 hour ago, Sef said:

Speed injection is not special either. Look at the recent TXG comparison with TSi3, all 4 drivers had similar ball speed. The little sticker even says some clubs do not require foam, meaning they are at or below max ct from the beginning, which goes directly against TM marketing.

What exactly do you mean it goes against their marketing?? The speed injection is all about getting tighter  tolerences near ct limits, not gain ball speed...titleist is apparently ct testing their heads too and making sure they are near limits as well. Not sure what they do with the lower ct heads,  or the ones above ct- scrap them? With taylormade, they can err on the high side and have a process to bring it down. At least thats my understanding for it. For these new heads, i would like to hear why they went away from it, maybe a new manufacturing process that eliminates the varying tolerances.

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It would be awesome if going forwards the original forum on a club release was limited to discussion of testing results and specs of the club ordered by members, and a second forum was created for peo

Given that the average WRXer swings at 135mph with a 1.52 smash factor I would say their swings generate more heat than any carbon jet is capable of making. With that said Taylormade probably had to d

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5 hours ago, geesecougar2 said:

 

Not asking for something too deep, just deeper than SIM. Something like the earlier M series.....anyway thanks for the info!

I’ll try to snap some pics next time and get more info.  I’m sure there will be 3 models like the current SIM line with a draw model that will have a deeper face.  

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7 hours ago, Red4282 said:

What exactly do you mean it goes against their marketing?? The speed injection is all about getting tighter  tolerences near ct limits, not gain ball speed...titleist is apparently ct testing their heads too and making sure they are near limits as well. Not sure what they do with the lower ct heads,  or the ones above ct- scrap them? With taylormade, they can err on the high side and have a process to bring it down. At least thats my understanding for it. For these new heads, i would like to hear why they went away from it, maybe a new manufacturing process that eliminates the varying tolerances.

Just moving from 2 ports on the face to 1 injection port off of the face (in the toe area). Not going away from speed injection, just a refinement (and an improvement visually IMO).

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8 hours ago, Red4282 said:

What exactly do you mean it goes against their marketing?? The speed injection is all about getting tighter  tolerences near ct limits, not gain ball speed...titleist is apparently ct testing their heads too and making sure they are near limits as well. Not sure what they do with the lower ct heads,  or the ones above ct- scrap them? With taylormade, they can err on the high side and have a process to bring it down. At least thats my understanding for it. For these new heads, i would like to hear why they went away from it, maybe a new manufacturing process that eliminates the varying tolerances.


That is my understanding of it too. It was really just a fancy way to tighten manufacturing tolerance and maybe even "save" what may have been non-conforming heads that would otherwise be scrapped. It doesn't surprise that they are "refining" it though to take up less discretionary weight given that the bracket inside the head plus the resin it held was likely a bit of forward weight they might otherwise want back. 

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8 hours ago, Red4282 said:

What exactly do you mean it goes against their marketing?? The speed injection is all about getting tighter  tolerences near ct limits, not gain ball speed...titleist is apparently ct testing their heads too and making sure they are near limits as well. Not sure what they do with the lower ct heads,  or the ones above ct- scrap them? With taylormade, they can err on the high side and have a process to bring it down. At least thats my understanding for it. For these new heads, i would like to hear why they went away from it, maybe a new manufacturing process that eliminates the varying tolerances.

I mean their marketing states all heads are made above the CT limit and then injected with foam to bring the club back to the limit, but the sticker says not all clubs require speed injection meaning they were not above the limit to begin with which contradicts the marketing.
 

SiM is an awesome driver, but we’ve all seen enough reviews to know it’s no faster than anything else.

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1 hour ago, JMO TO said:

Just moving from 2 ports on the face to 1 injection port off of the face (in the toe area). Not going away from speed injection, just a refinement (and an improvement visually IMO).

I like this, I always hated seeing the ports in the face. Mental thing.

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8 hours ago, Red4282 said:

What exactly do you mean it goes against their marketing?? The speed injection is all about getting tighter  tolerences near ct limits, not gain ball speed...titleist is apparently ct testing their heads too and making sure they are near limits as well. Not sure what they do with the lower ct heads,  or the ones above ct- scrap them? With taylormade, they can err on the high side and have a process to bring it down. At least thats my understanding for it. For these new heads, i would like to hear why they went away from it, maybe a new manufacturing process that eliminates the varying tolerances.

 

This is exactly correct. The idea behind speed injection was to narrow the distribution curve so that more of the drivers TaylorMade manufactured would be near CT limits. The benefit to consumers was consistency and knowing they weren't going to be buying a "slow" head.

 

Your understanding of the process is also correct. TM targeted making the heads just a little above the limit, tested each head, and then injected a varying amount resin to bring each back down below the limit. Some needed more resin, some needed less, and some didn't need any at all.


Speed injection has been around for two generations of drivers now, so it's probably time for a new process to replace it. I'm very interested to hear what this might be because producing heads near CT limits has become table stakes, in my opinion.

 

 

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10 minutes ago, Sef said:

I mean their marketing states all heads are made above the CT limit and then injected with foam to bring the club back to the limit, but the sticker says not all clubs require speed injection meaning they were not above the limit to begin with which contradicts the marketing.
 

SiM is an awesome driver, but we’ve all seen enough reviews to know it’s no faster than anything else.

 

You're getting hung up on the word "all". The marketing with M5 talked about the process, but did TaylorMade really claim that ALL heads were manufactured above the limit? 

 

Everything that is manufactured has tolerances. Their target is to make the heads above the limit and bringing them back below by injecting resin, but there will obviously be a small percentage of heads produced that fall just under the limit. As long as those heads test the same as the heads that needed resin, there is no issue at all.

 

As I stated above, the goal wasn't to put resin in every head. The goal was to narrow the distribution curve so that far more drivers on store shelves would be very close to the CT limit. For most of the heads, that required resin. For some, it didn't.

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7 minutes ago, jll62 said:

 

You're getting hung up on the word "all". The marketing with M5 talked about the process, but did TaylorMade really claim that ALL heads were manufactured above the limit? 

 

Everything that is manufactured has tolerances. Their target is to make the heads above the limit and bringing them back below by injecting resin, but there will obviously be a small percentage of heads produced that fall just under the limit. As long as those heads test the same as the heads that needed resin, there is no issue at all.

 

As I stated above, the goal wasn't to put resin in every head. The goal was to narrow the distribution curve so that far more drivers on store shelves would be very close to the CT limit. For most of the heads, that required resin. For some, it didn't.

I get tolerances, but if you don’t mean all don’t say “every head” in your marketing. And yes they said every head. Also, the SiM is great but the M5 was slow.

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8 hours ago, Trav1989 said:

I just hope they have some new technology in it, I will probably buy it anyway but just to maybe justify it to the lady lol

 

I'm right there with you. Unfortunately with COR(or CT, whatever it is now) being maxed out there is no 'new technology'. Because of this, and me wanting all there new clubs, I wish there was an amateur vs pro segment of clubs. I'd be super interested in what major OEM's would come up with.

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14 hours ago, TheMoneyShot said:

One thing ho’s on this site will like is the customized color option on the SIM2 driver.  TM taking a page from Callys book. 

Well that’s interesting. 

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I just hope they offer a sub 460 model again. 

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12 minutes ago, TheMoneyShot said:

Me too but I don’t think that is going to happen I unfortunately.

Me either 😭 I just like a deep face, shorter front to back driver. It feels easier for me to square up. 

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I’ll be honest-I’ll look at the SIM2, I am excited to see all the new offerings, but I’m not anticipating an upgrade. Drivers are so good the last couple years.

 

I have the SIM Max and my only critique is the deeper face.
So I picked up the SIM and plan on removing the sliding weight then increase the rear weight and add hotmelt. 
My thinking is I could have a shallow faced SIM Max kinda head in standard SIM head. 
 

I think at this point with drivers it’s all about tiny refinements.

 

With Taylormade offering custom paint options, I see it as another way for them to move more drivers in a time where performance increases are very small.

 

The ball is more effective in chasing consistency and the distance gains than the driver and honestly, my Ping G20 with the Tour B XS is as long as my SIM max.

 

Rox

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

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On 11/6/2020 at 11:01 PM, Sef said:

Speed injection is not special either. Look at the recent TXG comparison with TSi3, all 4 drivers had similar ball speed. The little sticker even says some clubs do not require foam, meaning they are at or below max ct from the beginning, which goes directly against TM marketing.

I agree its not special, its just unique tech when needed. Love it or hate it, those little red and blue screws I the face sold some drivers...cause no one else had them. 

 

 

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The ports are one of my most appealing aesthetic things on the SIM. Each to his own. 
 

please make flatter options in the fw and hybrids @taylormade

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Custom color option is a welcomed surprise.  I am a little thrown off by the lack of weight adjustability.  I really enjoy looking at the WITB pictures for the TM guys to see what their weight set-up looks like in their drivers.  Looking forward to putting 2.0 through the paces in the spring. 

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Just now, getair23 said:

Custom color option is a welcomed surprise.  I am a little thrown off by the lack of weight adjustability.  I really enjoy looking at the WITB pictures for the TM guys to see what their weight set-up looks like in their drivers.  Looking forward to putting 2.0 through the paces in the spring. 

Yeah, I feel this driver is a step back in the tech department with the lack of adjustability.  I’m looking forward to hearing the marketing plan for this new club. 

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4 minutes ago, TheMoneyShot said:

Yeah, I feel this driver is a step back in the tech department with the lack of adjustability.  I’m looking forward to hearing the marketing plan for this new club. 

From a manufacturing standpoint TM will have significant savings with this design.  

 

Marketing strategy might be: TM 2021 the year of lead tape!  "Lead Tapeier"

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