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Covid, RoG, (lack of) Rakes, and Posting


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Where I play, we didn't have rakes all season long this year but they made up for it as there was no sand in the bunkers either... just dirt and gravel.

We’ve just been allowed back today on to golf courses after a one month lockdown here in England, so it’s a joy just to be in a bunker!

Even when raked a bunker is rarely “ perfectly manicured”.  In my view  golf is a test and a well played bunker shot is a different question than is asked anywhere else on the course. Meaning it is a

Here is a link to a comprehensive list of bunker options: https://www.usga.org/content/usga/home-page/rules-hub/rulesarticles/covid-19-rules-and-handicapping-faqs.html

 

Bottom line there, if any of the described relief is adopted by a committee:

 

  • If a committee takes any of the above actions, it is at the discretion of the committee whether scores would be acceptable for handicap purposes.
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Dave, CGA covid protocols say this about bunker play:

 

If a ball comes to rest in a bunker, the player may lift the ball, smooth the area they intend to place the ball, and place the ball in that area. This area must be in the bunker and within one club-length of the original lie of the ball. The ball may be cleaned when lifted.

 

https://www.carolinasgolf.org/Covid-Protocols-for-CGA-Tournaments

 

No mention is made of score posting, thus it's a safe assumption that for CGA events, scores made iaw covid protocols should be posted.

Knowledge of the Rules is part of the applied skill set which a player must use to play a round of competitive golf.

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32 minutes ago, pktaske said:

Raking bunkers is a joke anyway. Haz is a haz. Use your feet. A great way to speed up the game.

 

The first couple months of covid golf was a dream. 15 min spaced tee times, almost an entire month in March where the turf hardly saw a footprint or golf cart ... and no raking!

I believe in days gone by, there were no rakes in bunkers as they were deemed a hazard, you simply played the ball as it lied. 

 

On another note, I haven't seen a rake in a bunker all season. The local rule is lifting your ball, smoothing it out if necessary. Courses have been pretty good about keeping the bunkers "playable". 

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1 hour ago, pktaske said:

Raking bunkers is a joke anyway. Haz is a haz. Use your feet. A great way to speed up the game.

 

The first couple months of covid golf was a dream. 15 min spaced tee times, almost an entire month in March where the turf hardly saw a footprint or golf cart ... and no raking!

 

The problem is, is it really a hazard when another player has caused it?  I've played out of deer hoof prints.  Cursed my luck, but didn't complain otherwise, lay of the land, nature, whatever.  But to be playing a ball in deep hole because a guy didn't sweep/rake, or wanted to be a d-bag and screw things up for later players is a different thing.  Remember, the first group out didn't have to deal with people's footprints.  Someone playing later shouldn't have to deal with a different course simply due to other players' incompetence/dereliction.  Rain, animals, fine.  But things other players do is where I draw the line.

 

 

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1 hour ago, Bluefan75 said:

 

The problem is, is it really a hazard when another player has caused it?  I've played out of deer hoof prints.  Cursed my luck, but didn't complain otherwise, lay of the land, nature, whatever.  But to be playing a ball in deep hole because a guy didn't sweep/rake, or wanted to be a d-bag and screw things up for later players is a different thing.  Remember, the first group out didn't have to deal with people's footprints.  Someone playing later shouldn't have to deal with a different course simply due to other players' incompetence/dereliction.  Rain, animals, fine.  But things other players do is where I draw the line.

 

 

I think its supposed to be just that - a malleable surface that causes a variety and varying amount of difficulties. Other players walking through and hitting from the rough will always be the primary reason that its disturbed. When I hear people hoping for the sand vs the rough, somethings gone wrong. The sand should be a crapshoot. The only real unfairness is the first groups out will have an advantage.

 

One of the pitfalls in this day and age where everyone's feelings must be considered important. 🙂

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2 hours ago, Sean2 said:

I believe in days gone by, there were no rakes in bunkers as they were deemed a hazard, you simply played the ball as it lied. 

 

The golf etiquette has always required players to smooth the sand in a bunker.

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5 hours ago, pktaske said:

Raking bunkers is a joke anyway. Haz is a haz. Use your feet. A great way to speed up the game.

 

The first couple months of covid golf was a dream. 15 min spaced tee times, almost an entire month in March where the turf hardly saw a footprint or golf cart ... and no raking!

So far we have learned you do not mark your ball on the green and do not believe you should need to rake a bunker. Just use your feet. 
 

Considering this is the rules of golf AND etiquette forum you seem to be failing. 
 

In your most recent post above you noted...as an excuse to NOT rake.....

“One of the pitfalls in this day and age where everyone's feelings must be considered important. “
 

Most everyone that takes the game seriously will rake bunkers, fix pitch marks on the green, and replace or fill divots. 
 

Are you too entitled to not need to do so as well?

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4 hours ago, pktaske said:

I think its supposed to be just that - a malleable surface that causes a variety and varying amount of difficulties. Other players walking through and hitting from the rough will always be the primary reason that its disturbed. When I hear people hoping for the sand vs the rough, somethings gone wrong. The sand should be a crapshoot. The only real unfairness is the first groups out will have an advantage.

 

One of the pitfalls in this day and age where everyone's feelings must be considered important. 🙂

 

Not about my feelings.  It's about my handicap.  The sand is penal enough, and if I plug, or stay up on a downslope, whatever,  I'll take that.  Having to basically take a penalty stroke because a guy had to dig himself halfway to Asia and couldn't be bothered to smooth is beyond rub of the green.  Just don't dislocate your shoulder patting yourself on the back for being the tough guy.

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6 hours ago, Bluefan75 said:

 

Not about my feelings.  It's about my handicap.  The sand is penal enough, and if I plug, or stay up on a downslope, whatever,  I'll take that.  Having to basically take a penalty stroke because a guy had to dig himself halfway to Asia and couldn't be bothered to smooth is beyond rub of the green.  Just don't dislocate your shoulder patting yourself on the back for being the tough guy.

I'll respond in a manner that 50% of the people do here: Learn to hit it out of the sand.

 

Boy, that sounds snarky. I just wanted to test it.

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6 hours ago, Shilgy said:

So far we have learned you do not mark your ball on the green and do not believe you should need to rake a bunker. Just use your feet. 
 

Considering this is the rules of golf AND etiquette forum you seem to be failing. 
 

In your most recent post above you noted...as an excuse to NOT rake.....

“One of the pitfalls in this day and age where everyone's feelings must be considered important. “
 

Most everyone that takes the game seriously will rake bunkers, fix pitch marks on the green, and replace or fill divots. 
 

Are you too entitled to not need to do so as well?

I'm glad you're following me. Please hit the Subscribe button below.

 

Sand is penal. Its supposed to be penal. If we never had to pick up another rake, I'd be ecstatic. During covid hands off raking, it was heaven.

 

That being said, how did you read 'entitlement' into any of my previous posts? Its my likes and dislikes and this is free discourse (at least it is in the USA). Until its changes, I'll continue to rake when expected...and won't like doing it every time.

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10 minutes ago, pktaske said:

I'll respond in a manner that 50% of the people do here: Learn to hit it out of the sand.

 

Boy, that sounds snarky. I just wanted to test it.

I don't understand how that addresses the issue. It will still be harder to hit the ball out of a footprint vs out of a pre-Covid typical bunker lie. Doesn't matter if you are a skilled bunker player or not. 

 

dave

 

ps. My preference would be those rakes that kind of furrow the sand (once the Covid concerns are behind us, anyway). But I would not put that high on my list. 

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7 minutes ago, DaveLeeNC said:

I don't understand how that addresses the issue. It will still be harder to hit the ball out of a footprint vs out of a pre-Covid typical bunker lie. Doesn't matter if you are a skilled bunker player or not. 

 

dave

 

ps. My preference would be those rakes that kind of furrow the sand (once the Covid concerns are behind us, anyway). But I would not put that high on my list. 

I get what you're saying. I just think sand should be penal. Now Furrow rakes make the whole bunker penal. Not a bad idea but I think folks worried about their handicap would rather take their chances with the 3% chance they land in a footprint vs 100% chance they will hit out of a wavy bunker. Under no raking, we never have to rake.

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On 12/2/2020 at 1:33 PM, Dpavs said:

Where I play, we didn't have rakes all season long this year but they made up for it as there was no sand in the bunkers either... just dirt and gravel.

Don't forget all the rocks and pebbles.  My poor wedges.  Seems like all the public courses around here are the same.  I literally find myself having to chip/pick the ball clean out of these so called "bunkers" or wedge bounces off the surface and makes things unpredictable.

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On 12/3/2020 at 7:26 AM, Bluefan75 said:

 

The problem is, is it really a hazard when another player has caused it?  I've played out of deer hoof prints.  Cursed my luck, but didn't complain otherwise, lay of the land, nature, whatever.  But to be playing a ball in deep hole because a guy didn't sweep/rake, or wanted to be a d-bag and screw things up for later players is a different thing.  Remember, the first group out didn't have to deal with people's footprints.  Someone playing later shouldn't have to deal with a different course simply due to other players' incompetence/dereliction.  Rain, animals, fine.  But things other players do is where I draw the line.

 

 


This isn’t an issue when the bunkers aren’t raked in the morning. You don’t see foot prints on the beach. Just reduce all bunker maintenance so it becomes a more natural and variable surface. 

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On 12/3/2020 at 9:46 PM, Sean2 said:

On another note, I haven't seen a rake in a bunker all season. The local rule is lifting your ball, smoothing it out if necessary. Courses have been pretty good about keeping the bunkers "playable". 

 

These days, the only rake I see in a bunker is myself

 

Now we'll see who reads Jane Austen novels....

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We have a few courses around here with a sign on the first tee that has COVID rules.

One of them states Bunkers are Ground under repair.

One of the courses the bunkers are maintained just like normal. Best bunkers we have seen this year. 

 

So we can post this score? 



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12 minutes ago, Deceptively Short said:

If a typical course (I realise it is impossible to define typical) had all its bunkers removed, I wonder how that would effect the course rating and slope. This is in fact what you are doing when all bunkers are GUR.

Unrelated to the pandemic, all our bunkers are being converted from sand to grass or being rebuilt.  All are GUR until all work is complete.  We have temporary CR/slope in place for posting.  The CRs dropped about 0.4 - 0.5 strokes.  Slope dropped between 6 and 9 points.  Almost all bunkers were greenside mostly shallow, but some 6' to 7' deep.

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7 minutes ago, ThinkingPlus said:

Unrelated to the pandemic, all our bunkers are being converted from sand to grass or being rebuilt.  All are GUR until all work is complete.  We have temporary CR/slope in place for posting.  The CRs dropped about 0.4 - 0.5 strokes.  Slope dropped between 6 and 9 points.  Almost all bunkers were greenside mostly shallow, but some 6' to 7' deep.

 

Thanks for posting this, @ThinkingPlus. This is the first time that I have ever seen a quantification of the effect of bunkers. But some courses have lots of bunkers and some have few. How would you characterize how typical your course is WRT the effect of bunkers on play? And are there many fairway bunkers? 

 

Thanks.

 

dave

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I saw this once. My playing partner had branches in front of him, an elevated green maybe 40 yards away as his target, and a greenside bunker was in his path (BIG and Deep). But the bunker was being rebuilt so was GUR. He could not hit the ball high enough (and under the branches) to clear the green so he decided to just hit a really hard runner into the bunker (which was mostly done  but no play yet allowed). So he this screamer that landed just short of the bunker expecting a free drop. It hit something, bounced up and over the bunker, down the hill on the far side, and he was still about 40 yards away. It seemed like something that Phil would do. 

 

dave

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