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Handicap Ethics - Is everyone being honest


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7 hours ago, Deceptively Short said:

I’m not sure how this will work under WHS but normally anyone, over here, who plays ‘regularly’ to handicap in medal competitions is not necessarily a ‘sandbagger’ but would certainly require watching.

 

Fair point. By regularly - I really meant at the regular intervals you would expect - ie about 25% of the time give or take. 

 

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I would go 35% vanity, 10% sandbagger and 55% accurate.    My rational (as someone that has spent 10+ years on handicap committees)- 1. A very high proportion of women golfers I have en

I’d say 15 percent vanity caps, 35% sandbaggers and 50% are accurate 

Two basic premises underlie the Handicap System, namely that each player will try to make the best score at every hole in every round, regardless of where the round is played, and that the player will

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5 hours ago, rogolf said:

Remember that with WHS, at least in NA, "playing to your handicap" is shooting net par (not course rating).

With CR-Par being part of the course handicap calculation over there doesn’t ‘playing to your handicap’ i.e. shooting net par now mean equalling the course rating net?

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1 hour ago, Deceptively Short said:

With CR-Par being part of the course handicap calculation over there doesn’t ‘playing to your handicap’ i.e. shooting net par now mean equalling the course rating net?

 

Nope, you got it backwards. For us with the CR - Par it's net par but for you shooting your handicap, or target score would be CR + Course Handicap.

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1 hour ago, Halebopp said:

 

Nope, you got it backwards. For us with the CR - Par it's net par but for you shooting your handicap, or target score would be CR + Course Handicap.

I was referring to ‘you’ i.e. not CONGU when I said in my post “over there” meaning the USA (but it, of course, also refers to other jurisdictions). I realise that net par here in CONGU land is relatively meaningless without additionally factoring in CR

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On 12/25/2020 at 12:50 PM, Shupe said:

Haha, trust me, everyone wants to be a +5 till they actually are one.  I've wasted way too much of my life chasing around a little white ball.  The only thing that keeps me going is playing in tourneys at this point.

Please someone pin this. 


to my forehead. 

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On 12/24/2020 at 11:42 PM, Shupe said:

In the last two months of the season this year I had (all) different guys shoot net 60, 63 and two 65s.  That's tough to beat...  Due to the rounds being so low, I think it is people trying for all 18 holes instead of going through the motions and then trying hard the last couple holes when there are a lot of bets out.  Two of the rounds were 18 handicappers shooting in the 70s.  Never seen them shoot under 80 with anyone else.  The handicap system is deeply flawed, so I never play for big money unless it's straight up.  Most semi/pros will only give you 4 or 5 shots max if you are any where around scratch and they don't know you because of this phenomenon.

 

On the flip side, my partners in cart games always play terrible.  Had one guy all year shoot under his handicap.  Golf is a funny mental game.

 

There's a phenomenon that could be explored further. I am a +3, and in all of my member guest events this year, my partners have only birdied 1 hole that I did not birdie. Most rounds they go without making a birdie, or make one birdie on the easy par 5. I know these guys are decent players with handicaps ranging from 3-8, but whenever they play on a team with me, they don't perform as well and I believe it is a mental block due to trying not to disappoint me when in reality I'm just happy to play. 

 

Is there a way for players like us to maximize the playing potential of our partners? Would leaving them alone, or being more involved be more beneficial? Is there a mental approach that we could use to either take the edge off, or focus more, that would produce better scores?

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13 hours ago, rogolf said:

Remember that with WHS, at least in NA, "playing to your handicap" is shooting net par (not course rating).

 

Which will generate a differential right around your current index, i.e. "playing to your handicap". 👍

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1 hour ago, dmecca2 said:

 

There's a phenomenon that could be explored further. I am a +3, and in all of my member guest events this year, my partners have only birdied 1 hole that I did not birdie. Most rounds they go without making a birdie, or make one birdie on the easy par 5. I know these guys are decent players with handicaps ranging from 3-8, but whenever they play on a team with me, they don't perform as well and I believe it is a mental block due to trying not to disappoint me when in reality I'm just happy to play. 

 

Is there a way for players like us to maximize the playing potential of our partners? Would leaving them alone, or being more involved be more beneficial? Is there a mental approach that we could use to either take the edge off, or focus more, that would produce better scores?

 Super interesting question. I think it is all relative so I will jump in. I playoff -4 these days, but pre-covd played in lots of charity scrambles for work with 20+ cappers. I could see they would get nervous/embarrassed playing with me. 

 

I would always joke around allot and keep it light. Compliment good shots and put the focus on having a good time rather than the golf. Magically people played better. 🤨 Of course these are really non-competitive events. Still I think some of this holds true for competitive events, the more help people relax, the better. 

 

 

 

 

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1 hour ago, dmecca2 said:

 

There's a phenomenon that could be explored further. I am a +3, and in all of my member guest events this year, my partners have only birdied 1 hole that I did not birdie. Most rounds they go without making a birdie, or make one birdie on the easy par 5. I know these guys are decent players with handicaps ranging from 3-8, but whenever they play on a team with me, they don't perform as well and I believe it is a mental block due to trying not to disappoint me when in reality I'm just happy to play. 

 

Is there a way for players like us to maximize the playing potential of our partners? Would leaving them alone, or being more involved be more beneficial? Is there a mental approach that we could use to either take the edge off, or focus more, that would produce better scores?

At our club the weekend game pairings are fairly random, so this phenomenon gets tested regularly.  I think it’s all about being comfortable.  Due to all the strokes being given back by me, they have to go alone for many of the holes.  Golf is a lot easier if you are not worried about the consequences and have a partner to lean on. 
 

Many guys don’t get to play in a lot of high pressure situations.  For me personally, overcoming those situations are about being ok with the outcome not going to plan as long as you put a good swing on the ball.  That’s hard to do for a 0-20 handicap.

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Sandbaggers are unethical. Vanity cappers are stupid.

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On 12/23/2020 at 10:46 PM, wkndhckr said:

I even received a PM from someone who saw this post and said something to the effext that flippant putts shouldnt be counted. Again just wanting to have a conversation not be crucified for asking the question 

One of my golf buddies always says that a chalant putt counts the same as a nonchalant putt.

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