Hogan Swing Puzzle Pieces

[powerfade66]

3 hours ago, virtuoso said:

Well, I think powerfade66 is swag. I got a kick out of watching him create a tag team in some of the other posts.

This forum needs a psychiatrist. Why the conspiracy theories? I joined in 2008. Same year you did. Keep going with those powder puffs. 

[farmer]

Al Barkow and Herbert Warren Wind wrote about Hogan as contemporaries.  Dan Jenkins knew him, played casual rounds with him, had some interesting observations, although nothing about his swing.

[Divot License]

While I'm genuinely interesting in listening to anything anyone says about the swing, especially Hogans I don't understand the drama around it. 

 

While I genuinely believe you have something to say, I think it's better to just say it rather than build some intrigue about it. It just ends up making it look cheap and whatever is eventually said will instantly be dismissed due to the drama people endure to hear it. 

 

We're all here as we love golf, and specifically have a fascination with Hogan so why not just start the discussion with your thoughts and see where it takes us?

[powerfade66]

1 hour ago, Jedaigeki said:

While I'm genuinely interesting in listening to anything anyone says about the swing, especially Hogans I don't understand the drama around it. 

 

While I genuinely believe you have something to say, I think it's better to just say it rather than build some intrigue about it. It just ends up making it look cheap and whatever is eventually said will instantly be dismissed due to the drama people endure to hear it. 

 

We're all here as we love golf, and specifically have a fascination with Hogan so why not just start the discussion with your thoughts and see where it takes us?

If you read what I have said several times I was saying to keep an eye out for something very valuable that someone else will be posting on social media from a particular Estate. Not as a commercial release. With all the negativity and accusations I’ve lost all faith in this forum so won’t be contributing anything. 

[virtuoso]

11 hours ago, powerfade66 said:

This forum needs a psychiatrist. Why the conspiracy theories? I joined in 2008. Same year you did. Keep going with those powder puffs. 

 Here's my theory. You're bummed that this forum is pretty dead these days, so you introduce Swag to rant about Christo and liven up the place. You tag team on Christo and post at the same time. You also both like to post about new uncovered Hogan mysteries.

 

Swag announces his disapearance, which real people don't do that often. He also won't post his swing, which is typical of someone who has a true identity he wants to keep hidden. Obviously, you couldnt post your own swing because I've already seen it. How am I doing?

[Gsea]

On 1/18/2021 at 12:10 AM, powerfade66 said:

I don’t know the guy. Exactly what BS have I put out? I’ve been a genuine contributor for years. I just said it won’t be for sale. I’m out.

Guess he's not out

[Gsea]

On 1/23/2021 at 5:22 AM, powerfade66 said:

Speaking of digging dirt. What if it was largely because of the dirt as opposed to in the dirt. Gosh darn it I gave some away. 

More of his attention getting cryptic bs

[powerfade66]

24 minutes ago, Gsea said:

Guess he's not out

You just keep pretending you can make bold statements about what people have or haven’t been posting forever when you haven’t even been here for a year. It’s losers like you that have ruined this place. I’m more than happy to defend myself, pal. 
 

You should be busy watching Christo’s latest $50 download. He has revealed Hogan’s 8 fundamentals apparently. $50 for something that costs nothing to reproduce and again leech off Hogan’s reputation. But you’ll come to his defense again no doubt. 

Edited January 26, 2021 by powerfade66

[powerfade66]

25 minutes ago, Gsea said:

More of his attention getting cryptic bs

Why would I want attention? On a faceless forum full of people like you who offer far less than nothing to conversations. 

[Gsea]

16 minutes ago, powerfade66 said:

You just keep pretending you can make bold statements about what people have or haven’t been posting forever when you haven’t even been here for a year. It’s losers like you that have ruined this place. I’m more than happy to defend myself, pal. 
 

You should be busy watching Christo’s latest $50 download. He has revealed Hogan’s 8 fundamentals apparently. $50 for something that costs nothing to reproduce and again leech off Hogan’s reputation. But you’ll come to his defense again no doubt. 

1. Never came to his defense, never seen his videos, and don't keep bringing him up to keep him relevant.

2. Been here since 2015. Had to re-join after the upgrade debacle and didn't remember my password.

3. Put up or shut up with your "Hogan knowledge" Swag

[powerfade66]

16 minutes ago, Gsea said:

1. Never came to his defense, never seen his videos, and don't keep bringing him up to keep him relevant.

2. Been here since 2015. Had to re-join after the upgrade debacle and didn't remember my password.

3. Put up or shut up with your "Hogan knowledge" Swag

*kiss*

[powerfade66]

2 hours ago, Gsea said:

1. Never came to his defense, never seen his videos, and don't keep bringing him up to keep him relevant.

2. Been here since 2015. Had to re-join after the upgrade debacle and didn't remember my password.

3. Put up or shut up with your "Hogan knowledge" Swag

Why do you keep opening that thread and offering your typically useless replies then? Using Hogan’s name to push 80 tips that are the “best tips you’re ever going to find” is highly  relevant to Hogan. If others want to discuss that then what’s it to you?
 

Edited January 26, 2021 by powerfade66

[moefan]

So are we talking about Dan Jenkins estate?

 

moefan

[powerfade66]

12 hours ago, moefan said:

So are we talking about Dan Jenkins estate?

 

moefan

No. A US Open winner. 

[moefan]

Ok. So far we have a journalist who won the US Open and has passed away and was close to Ben Hogan. That narrows it down quite a bit.

 

moefan

[powerfade66]

2 hours ago, moefan said:

Ok. So far we have a journalist who won the US Open and has passed away and was close to Ben Hogan. That narrows it down quite a bit.

 

moefan

No. They are separate paragraphs. One past tense the other future. But it is narrowed down because very few US Open winners were close to Hogan. I’m not trying to be mysterious. The friend who purchased this would probably never trust me again if he read this just for saying what I have. 

Edited February 1, 2021 by powerfade66

[moefan]

My guess would be who I always thought knew Ben Hogan best. Ken Venturi.

[powerfade66]

39 minutes ago, moefan said:

My guess would be who I always thought knew Ben Hogan best. Ken Venturi.

Why do you say that? He was very tight lipped in all his three books. And his VHS tapes. And his interviews. Though if you look into what he says in general terms (without directly referencing Hogan) it is very close to Hogan. 

[moefan]

Ken Venturi was a close friend of Ben Hogan. They played together a lot. Ken was also mentored by Byron Nelson. If anyone had inside knowledge it was Ken Venturi. If Ben Hogan helped you it was always on the condition that you kept it to yourself. Venturi did.

 

moefan

[Jeselnik]

LOL...............The final missing piece is reading comprehension.  Waggle???  Hands move first ???  Elbows to hips ???  That's a hand controlled pivot and maximum radius.  If you're thinking turn the hips or shift at the top................you're not even close.  Honestly, the DS is a piece of cake when you understand what causes the weight shift that Hogan mentions off-handedly.

 

DS don't work w/o the BS.

 

JNIK

[powerfade66]

2 hours ago, Jeselnik said:

LOL...............The final missing piece is reading comprehension.  Waggle???  Hands move first ???  Elbows to hips ???  That's a hand controlled pivot and maximum radius.  If you're thinking turn the hips or shift at the top................you're not even close.  Honestly, the DS is a piece of cake when you understand what causes the weight shift that Hogan mentions off-handedly.

 

DS don't work w/o the BS.

 

JNIK

If you think it’s all a piece of cake why are you here? I’m sure you realise it’s not that straight forward. You can make the clubhead and hands move first using the feet if you really want to. You’ve borrowed TGM terminology so you’d know it can be hands controlled pivot or pivot controlled hands. 

[Gsea]

"Hogan DID have a secret that he took to his grave: the connection of the upper arms through impact, specifially the upper left arm. As the core unwinds around the left pivot point, the arms are pulled tight to the chest, which forces the butt of the shaft to the left thereby squaring the face. To quote Burke, “He always told me, you don't keep this arm (meaning left arm) on your chest long enough in the swing. You gotta' keep it tight to the chest and take it AROUND (unwinding) with your hips and shoulders (core).” He never mentions this in any of the legitimate Hogan sources."

[powerfade66]

1 hour ago, Gsea said:

"Hogan DID have a secret that he took to his grave: the connection of the upper arms through impact, specifially the upper left arm. As the core unwinds around the left pivot point, the arms are pulled tight to the chest, which forces the butt of the shaft to the left thereby squaring the face. To quote Burke, “He always told me, you don't keep this arm (meaning left arm) on your chest long enough in the swing. You gotta' keep it tight to the chest and take it AROUND (unwinding) with your hips and shoulders (core).” He never mentions this in any of the legitimate Hogan sources."

Good quote. Where is it from?

Edit: It’s a slicefixer quote from threads in here. 

 

There’s a video where Jackie Burke tells that story to Elk and really emphasises packing it in there tight as though you couldn’t wedge anything between upper left arm and side of chest.
 

 

Edited February 5, 2021 by powerfade66

[Gsea]

1 hour ago, powerfade66 said:

Good quote. Where is it from?

Edit: It’s a slicefixer quote from threads in here. 

 

There’s a video where Jackie Burke tells that story to Elk and really emphasises packing it in there tight as though you couldn’t wedge anything between upper left arm and side of chest.
 

 

Yes it was in Slicefixer's unpublished manuscript.

[powerfade66]

39 minutes ago, Gsea said:

Yes it was in Slicefixer's unpublished manuscript.

The Encyclopaedia Texarkana. A shame he didn’t get around to publishing anything. 

[powerfade66]

I don’t think the left arm pinning back onto the chest was that much of a conscious act. I think that was created largely by his knee action and the firm left hand he told Tommy Bolt about. In one of his biographies there is an anecdote about how he dreamt of swinging on one leg. With the forward ball position, weak and firm left hand grip and flying right knee; if his left arm didn’t get out of the way he would hit it wide right.

[TheDeanAbides]

7 hours ago, Gsea said:

"Hogan DID have a secret that he took to his grave: the connection of the upper arms through impact, specifially the upper left arm. As the core unwinds around the left pivot point, the arms are pulled tight to the chest, which forces the butt of the shaft to the left thereby squaring the face. To quote Burke, “He always told me, you don't keep this arm (meaning left arm) on your chest long enough in the swing. You gotta' keep it tight to the chest and take it AROUND (unwinding) with your hips and shoulders (core).” He never mentions this in any of the legitimate Hogan sources."

That is not what he did. Hogan's left arm comes away from his chest like every great swing. Feel is not real.
 

 

[powerfade66]

50 minutes ago, TheDeanAbides said:

That is not what he did. Hogan's left arm comes away from his chest like every great swing. Feel is not real.
 

 

That video has been used in here to advance both sides several times and there’s no clear winner. When I saw the first words of your comment in notification I immediately thought of this video without seeing you had posted it. It’s a classic. Yes it separates but then reconnects through the strike. I don’t think it’s an end in itself as much as a natural byproduct of such a weak grip and no flicking in the release.
 

Watch it again thinking of the right elbow. The left just gets out of the way. Similar to Vijay you can have the right hand working the back side of the grip but not grabbing the club using the whole right hand. Which is what he demonstrated in the Coleman video and discussed in Modern Fundamentals. I have photos where in the finish the club is as far into the webbing of the right thumb and forefinger as it can go. An inch or two from where it started. Peter Thomson said he noticed the club moved around in Hogan’s right hand. 

[TheDeanAbides]

5 minutes ago, powerfade66 said:

That video has been used in here to advance both sides several times and there’s no clear winner. When I saw the first words of your comment in notification I immediately thought of this video without seeing you had posted it. It’s a classic. Yes it separates but then reconnects through the strike. I don’t think it’s an end in itself as much as a natural byproduct of such a weak grip and no flicking in the release.
 

Watch it again thinking of the right elbow. The left just gets out of the way. Similar to Vijay you can have the right hand working the back side of the grip but not grabbing the club using the whole right hand. Which is what he demonstrated in the Coleman video and discussed in Modern Fundamentals. I have photos where in the finish the club is as far into the webbing of the right thumb and forefinger as it can go. An inch or two from where it started. Peter Thomson said he noticed the club moved around in Hogan’s right hand. 

Interesting what you say about the right hand - I need to look more into that.  Yes, I absolutely agree that the left disconnects because it has to for the right elbow to come back in front of the body like it must in a properly synched up swing. No argument about it reconnecting either. 

The reason I don't like people to think/feel like the left arm stays connected is because if you try to do this consciously it's quite easy to get stuck - especially if you've gone with the other cliché of firing your hips from the top and over rotated your shoulder from the top. Hogan - like all great players - is still closed at left arm parallel on the downswing. The right elbow is in front and the left off the chest because this is the perfect position to be able to rotate as hard as you like through the hitting area. It's poetry. 

[LowAndLeft32]

8 hours ago, Gsea said:

Yes it was in Slicefixer's unpublished manuscript.

Wow!! How did you get to see the unpublished book? 

Edited February 5, 2021 by LowAndLeft32